The dead insulting the dead!

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Another reason for me not to like Rosenman:

I thought the score [by Basil Poledouris] for the first film was so absolutely dreadful. There was no sense of the orchestra, no sense of drama. It was just a dopey, lousy score and it just didn't work.

I'm not a fan of Poledouris. The end credits, which is the best opportunity for any composer, was just pasted together. My end title is a real piece of music, and the middle part is something very different from most film scores.

[MissPadmé 17]

well thats really over the top unprofessional criticism!

allthough I don't like the Robocop Scores atall..

[Richard Penna 3,679]

What a !"£$%^&

Sounds like Horner.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Both Basil's Robocop scores are lightyears beyond that outdated and ill-fitting joke that is the Robocop 2 score!

[MissPadmé 17]

Both Basil's Robocop scores are lightyears beyond that outdated and ill-fitting joke that is the Robocop 2 score!

well maybe you just don't understand Rosemans art then!

[GoldsmithFanatic2000+ 0]

This coming from the guy that wrote Star Trek IV? I always thought the man's head was so far up his own behind it was almost tragic, and now he insults a classic score like RoboCop by a splendid composer like Poledouris when his effort was just as bad as Star Trek IV, If not worse. I honestly have no care left towards Rosenman anymore.

RoboCop

RoboCop 2

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Both Basil's Robocop scores are lightyears beyond that outdated and ill-fitting joke that is the Robocop 2 score!

well maybe you just don't understand Rosemans art then!

i rather like his LOTR score, but his score for Robocop 2 really sticks out badly in the film, it does not fit at all. and the only enjoyment I get from it on CD is by laughing my ass off.

ROOOOBBBOOOO-COOOOOOOOOP!

[Lurker 5]

He is correct though about the end titles for Robocop. They were edited together. Apparently that's the thing Rosenman had an issue with.

Neil

[Richard Penna 3,679]

An amazingly petty thing to have an 'issue' with

[John Crichton 4]

Well they can duke it out wherever they are now. Assuming they're in the same place.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

He is correct though about the end titles for Robocop. They were edited together. Apparently that's the thing Rosenman had an issue with.

Neil

Did you read his comments, Neil?

I put a link in my post.

[scissorhands 16]

As much as I love Poledouris (see my signature) he was basically a pop composer who tried to write for orchestra. Structure-wise everything he wrote was pop-like music. Orchestration-wise, unskillful and very simple. His strong point was never the technique, but the enormous passion put in every note.

I can understand why Rosenman (a great cratsfman, probably one of the 5 or 6 most skilled composers in film history) didn't consider this good music.

I've never been a big fan of Robocop 1, and I actually prefer Rosenman's score. The music is better. I haven't seen the film though, so I can't say if it's good or bad film music.

[Guest macrea]

I no longer care about credits. On effects movies they are interminable because they have to list every last computer geek who makes a backup file at 4 a.m. Lately the movies that precede them are too long already and most people are antsy and in need of bladder relief (which is often a more satisfying experience than the movie). So who can blame producers for saving the expense of recording another 10 minutes of music that very few people are around to hear, especially when they've already got a wall-to-wall score?

As a professional, Rosenman certainly could have been more diplomatic in his remarks.

[Marian Schedenig 8,191]

It's no news that Rosenman had a... rather high opinion of himself. But in reality, I don't find Robocop that great compared to the big Poledouris scores. Rosenman's effort isn't outstanding either, but his Trek is fine. And LOTR is one of the Great Scores.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

He's a c*nt though!

[Romão 2,274]

As much as I love Poledouris (see my signature) he was basically a pop composer who tried to write for orchestra. Structure-wise everything he wrote was pop-like music. Orchestration-wise, unskillful and very simple. His strong point was never the technique, but the enormous passion put in every note.

I can understand why Rosenman (a great cratsfman, probably one of the 5 or 6 most skilled composers in film history) didn't consider this good music.

I've never been a big fan of Robocop 1, and I actually prefer Rosenman's score. The music is better. I haven't seen the film though, so I can't say if it's good or bad film music.

Could not agree more. Great post, Peio

[Ollie 1,059]

To me it's a non issue. And I believe there might be some confusion as to what he was actually referring to.

Bernard Herrmann, Jerry Goldsmith and even Hans Zimmer have said things about other composers that might offend a fan of that composer.

[indy4 155]

Another reason for me not to like Rosenman:

I thought Goldsmith was known for insulting other film composers also?

[Unlucky Bastard 7,782]

I love it when they get catty.

[publicist 4,643]

I thought Goldsmith was known for insulting other film composers also?

Only through bad interpretation by overzealous film music fans. I can't remember any specific Goldsmith comment comparable to Rosenman, not in the slightest.

[GoldsmithFanatic2000+ 0]

I thought Goldsmith was known for insulting other film composers also?

Only through bad interpretation by overzealous film music fans. I can't remember any specific Goldsmith comment comparable to Rosenman, not in the slightest.

That's because Goldsmith never let himself indulge with his ego long enough to feel comfortable about making such ridiculous statements. Even Horner hasn't ever sunk that low, and he has bragged a fair bit in his career.

[crocodile 7,999]

He's a c*nt though!

Shouldn't you like him then?

Karol

[FattyMcButterpants 1]

Reminds me of Horner's interview about Yared's rejected Troy score.

[Goldsmithfan 6]

Another reason for me not to like Rosenman:

I thought the score [by Basil Poledouris] for the first film was so absolutely dreadful. There was no sense of the orchestra, no sense of drama. It was just a dopey, lousy score and it just didn't work.

I'm not a fan of Poledouris. The end credits, which is the best opportunity for any composer, was just pasted together. My end title is a real piece of music, and the middle part is something very different from most film scores.

I started a thread similar to this on FSM. I was completely thrashed within minutes despite the fact that much of what I wrote was a joke. Glad to see that people here actually react when someone attacks the work of another, much more talented, person.

As much as I love Poledouris (see my signature) he was basically a pop composer who tried to write for orchestra. Structure-wise everything he wrote was pop-like music. Orchestration-wise, unskillful and very simple. His strong point was never the technique, but the enormous passion put in every note.

Even if I agreed with you, would that mean that the music is any less effective? Why should the technique matter when it's the final product that we're worried about? As long as it evokes an emotional response, hasn't it done its job?

Not only that but Poledouris' contribution fit the film like a glove. Rosenman's was a bit... lacking. What with all the "Ro-bo-cop!" thrown in.

[publicist 4,643]

In Rosenman's case, i find the lack of modesty not even a funny irascibility like with Herrmann. He works on a 'Star Trek' score and of course is the film (and music) the absolute highpoint of the series, he works on this or on that and always he comes out of it smelling like roses. Or if not, he's surrounded by illiterates who don't have a clue about nothing.

I wonder how the occassional meetings of him with Goldsmith went. Had Jerry to bow before the master?

[Ollie 1,059]

From what I've heard from those who have actually met Rosenmann was that he was a very pleasant person to talk to. He did have an ego and an opinion, most famous people do. From what been said Poledouris just chuckled at his comments.

Sometimes what ends up in print isn't exactly what was said or was mis-interpreted as being meaner than originally intended.

[Richard Penna 3,679]

Reminds me of Horner's interview about Yared's rejected Troy score.

Yeap, it really was the height of arrogance. I can't remotely imagine Williams saying anything like that.

[Luke Skywalker 1,794]

To me it's a non issue. And I believe there might be some confusion as to what he was actually referring to.

Bernard Herrmann, Jerry Goldsmith and even Hans Zimmer have said things about other composers that might offend a fan of that composer.

That's why i like the correct humility of John Williams

[benefactor 3]

Reminds me of Horner's interview about Yared's rejected Troy score.

Yeap, it really was the height of arrogance. I can't remotely imagine Williams saying anything like that.

Can somebody post a link to this interview, please?

[BLUMENKOHL 1,068]

That's why i like the correct humility of John Williams

I'm sorry what? Humility? John Williams?

The man exudes ego in the most powerful sense of the word. He condescends in almost every interview, but because he adds please and thank you, you call it humility?

[Hitch 57]

Hitch (in a Robocop-esque voice)...."Leonard Rosenman....dead or alive...you're coming with me"

[indy4 155]

That's why i like the correct humility of John Williams

I'm sorry what? Humility? John Williams?

The man exudes ego in the most powerful sense of the word. He condescends in almost every interview, but because he adds please and thank you, you call it humility?

Sarcasm?

[Hitch 57]

Reminds me of Horner's interview about Yared's rejected Troy score.

Yeap, it really was the height of arrogance. I can't remotely imagine Williams saying anything like that.

Can somebody post a link to this interview, please?

Here are some interesting quotations by Horner regarding Yared’s score:

“… Gabriel didn’t have the experience to score big action movies …“

“… Gabriel was not familiar with this big action movie thing Wolfgang wanted …”

“… before they put the chorus on, they brought it to California to preview, the studio insisted on a preview …”

“… they played it for an audience in Sacramento, and the usual focus group …”

“... the music is the worst they (test audience) had ever heard… “

“… they all said it’s horrible music, who did this music …”

“… I looked at the film and it was, I don’t even know how to describe it, how atrocious the music was. It was like a 1950’s Hercules movie. “

“… it was not because Gabriel isn’t a gifted writer, it’s because he doesn’t have any knowledge of writing film scores, real film scores like that, and it was like, it was so corny, it was unbelievable, it it and apparently made the audience laugh in places during serious scenes …”

“… they both (W.Petersen and G. Yared) came up with a score that was absolutely dreadful, absolutely dreadful …”

“ ... (Gabriel Yared) going on his website saying he was cheated and short changed and they put his music in the film without the chorus and the chorus made the difference, and you know you say to yourself this guy just doesn’t get it. The chorus would have made it worse …”

Go Jimmy...Go Jimmy

[Nick Parker 3,040]

My opinion of James Horner (which was never truly high) has been lowered, though I have never heard of this "Gabriel Yard".

[Hitch 57]

Gabriel YARED...the Oscar winning composer of THE ENGLISH PATIENT. His other superb scores include BETTY BLUE, THE TALENTED MR RIPLEY, CITY OF ANGELS and COLD MOUNTAIN

[MissPadmé 17]

I say that atleast 8 points of these arguments are correct!

this is good music.. and anytime i listen to it I can't imagine it be in a movie, I can see why they replaced it, Yared was a waste for this moovie anyway.. he certainly deserves better films to work with.

But Horner was right..

[Hitch 57]

3 cheers for MissPadme

[GoldsmithFanatic2000+ 0]

I've heard Yard's score. I think it comes across as being quite cheesy at times, especially when taking the film it was written for into consideration.

I feel the exact same way about Newman's rejected Air Force One score.

[Henry B 50]

Wow.

[Red 75]

That's why i like the correct humility of John Williams

I'm sorry what? Humility? John Williams?

The man exudes ego in the most powerful sense of the word. He condescends in almost every interview, but because he adds please and thank you, you call it humility?

Sarcasm?

Not at all.

Considering I'm a fan of RoboCop Rosenman's comments do sound pretty off-base. Horner however comes off as a bit of a prick (although I haven't heard Yared's score).

[Marian Schedenig 8,191]

Yared's score was like what the movie failed to be. Horner's score is pretty much like what the movie ended up being.

It's not a good movie.

[Ollie 1,059]

Yared's score is fantastic.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

It sounds fairly generic I always thought.

[Marian Schedenig 8,191]

It sounds old-fashioned at times (though not all the way through). The kind of old-fashioned that's not dated but fits the setting of the film. One of the film's problems was that it failed to do that - I'm all for modern techniques in historic films, but Troy seemed to try to "update" its content. Right down to Brad Pitt in full Tyler Durden mode.

[Wesker 0]

Really? I found Pitt to be quite good, actually. More specifically, his form in nearly all the fight scenes was exceptional- miles above and beyond what most actors have done in similar circumstances, in terms of the technical aspects of swordplay and such.

It's one of those flicks that didn't sink in as being anything other than mediocre at first, but the more I watch it, the more i think it was actually well executed. Bana really helped it, but Bloom brought it done a few notches. A respectable film.

[Marian Schedenig 8,191]

I don't really remember the fight scenes, except for the first one, which I thought was too much based on technical effects than choreography. I like Pitt, he's probably one of my favourite actors, but I just found him out of place in Troy, which did have some excellent performances. As little as I liked it, I have to re-watch it again someday for O'Toole.

[Luke Skywalker 1,794]

Are those comments by Horner real or Hitch made them up?

Ironic that some of Horner's score seems to STEAL from Yared.

[TownerFan 4,983]

It's no news that Rosenman had a... rather high opinion of himself.

Indeed, I remember another interview where he said he was able to write better tunes than John Williams.

[Luke Skywalker 1,794]

It's no news that Rosenman had a... rather high opinion of himself.

Indeed, I remember another interview where he said he was able to write better tunes than John Williams.

High opinion of himself?

I dont think so, i think he was just wisecrack.

[Ollie 1,059]

Are those comments by Horner real or Hitch made them up?

Ironic that some of Horner's score seems to STEAL from Yared.

They are real comments.