Indiana Jones trilogy - Cue Titles and fan-made recordings

[airmanjerm 77]

It does seem right--and on top of that, it seems like it should segue into the monkey brains music...but...

5m2a The First Supper (154 bars)

5m2b Exchange Of Glances (7 bars) - Not Used

...this doesn't seem to allow for that to be there. 5m3 is Nocturnal Activities. Is the apparent monkey brains music tracked from "The First Supper" and the segue possibility just a happy coincidence? The only other possibility I can think of is that "Exchange of Glances" was in a different feel and was recorded separately, whereas "The First Supper" was recorded as basically all of the different little cues for the feast in one shot. Can anyone shed some light on this? Jason?

I think "Exchange of Glances" may have been one of those cues that was recorded (or not), but in the end it sounded better to just let that tragic "source music" play in the background instead of a cue that gave away the thoughts of the characters. Notcie how effective it is, in that scene, when ALL of the music stops (even the source music) when the little pre-pubescent maharajah speaks.

In the end, it's probably impossible for any of us to decide why a written cue wasn't included. Perhaps the scene was edited so much that the cue no longer fit, or perhaps the cue just really didn't sound all that great (or appropriate). I think we'd all be "fanboys" if we didn't realize that, sometimes, what JW wrote wasn't exactly what was perfect for the scene. (Even the Indiana Jones TRILOGY's "Bonus" DVD's feature of JW included footage of him discussing changes of things with Spielberg & co.).

Further, the monkey brains part was recorded starting at mm. 136 in 5m2A (The FIRST SUPPER)...I think the "Exchange of Glances" was meant to segue right into this. It sounds correct when added together...of course, only based on a demo!

(All speculation, at least...)

[Jay 32,105]

It does seem right--and on top of that, it seems like it should segue into the monkey brains music...but...

5m2a The First Supper (154 bars)

5m2b Exchange Of Glances (7 bars) - Not Used

...this doesn't seem to allow for that to be there. 5m3 is Nocturnal Activities. Is the apparent monkey brains music tracked from "The First Supper" and the segue possibility just a happy coincidence? The only other possibility I can think of is that "Exchange of Glances" was in a different feel and was recorded separately, whereas "The First Supper" was recorded as basically all of the different little cues for the feast in one shot. Can anyone shed some light on this? Jason?

5m2 is the Pankot Palace source music, so 5m2a and 5m2b are the stuff that play over it. 5m2a was written first, for all the scenes they thought would benefit from additional underscore.... then later they decided one more scene needed it so 5m2b was written.... though in the end that one wasn't used. Did you see this stuff in the post on page 1?:

• 5m2a The First Supper (154 bars)
  

This is the 5 unreleased short cues that we've been calling "The Feast"

Here's how it works. 5m2 is the source music, which wasn't written by Williams. 5m2a are his overlays that play over it. So it isn't really 154 bars of music... the sheet music indicates which bars the cues play over and which bars they rest

Cue1: bars 27-38

Cue2: bars 46-48

Cue3: bars 65-81

Cue4: bars 104-106

Cue5: bars 136-145

plenty of room for 7 bars of 5m2b to play before chilled monkey brains at bar 136

[Delorean90 34]

Ah, gotcha. Cool. So it would seem that "Exchange of Glances" was meant to segue into the monkey brains bit. Interesting.

[Valentinice 20]

This may be too big of a favor to ask, but would anyone be able to make MIDI files of a few of the bigger cues that we have (Short Round helps, On The Tank) as well as some of the small ones (The revised ending fanfare for "birds of Charlemagne" etc.)?

I'd love to listen to even some of the well known cues from this fresh perspective. Hearing how the cues were intended to open and close, being able to take out certain instruments. Play around with it.

I'm already enjoying "Tribute To Vernon" so much - I can't imagine how great it would be to see how some of the other cues are laid out. At the same time, I know it would be a HUGE undertaking - but like I mentioned in a previous post - it would be a historic moment in John Williams and Film Score history!

[Joe Brausam 211]

Here is 10m1 insert 2 - the Nazi fanfare that fits into On the Tank. The instrument samples aren't the greatest, but I can upgrade the samples if anyone would like.

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=HURY4FYQ

[Jay 32,105]

I haven't had a chance to listen to that yet because I'm at work, but we already have that as a clean DVD rip from the film, yes?

Is anybody working on some of the stuff we've NEVER heard before, like Willy Into The Fryer or the original opening to The Child Returns?

[Desplat13 1]

So.........much...........work......

[Jay 32,105]

joey, great work on the nazi insert! Keep em coming!

Everybody, I am finally getting around to updating www.indianajonesmusic.com with the Indy3 correct cue names, but I have a couple questions....

How long does 9m3 Palace Source appear to be? It runs for 1:18 in the film, but I don't know if the sheet music continues on for much longer

Approx how long would 10m1 Insert 3 and 10m1 Insert A be?

Approx how long would the original opening of Canyon Of The Crescent Moon have been?

Thanks again for everybody who has helped out in the thread!

[Joe Brausam 211]

I'd do a mockup of Canyon of the Crescent Moon for the original opening, but all the music below the alto sax line is cut off.

I can do 10m1 insert 1 and insert A though and approximate what the proper tempos would be, I'll try to get that done in the next day or 2.

[Jay 32,105]

The previous file you posted, "10m1 Insert 2" was actually the Nazi Fanfare for Vogel's entrance into the tank in "Death Of Kazim", right? Because 10m1 is Death of Kazim and 10m3/11m1 is "On The Tank"

Also, 10m1 Insert 1 we already have in bootleg form, its 10m1 Insert 3 and Insert A that we don't

[Joe Brausam 211]

Yes, I assume that it is from "Death of Kazim", though I can't be sure, I haven't watched the film in some time.

[Jay 32,105]

Yea, it is the Death of Kazim nazi march insert. Just making sure there was no confusion because when you posted it, you said it was for "On The Tank"

[fommes 133]

updating www.indianajonesmusic.com with the Indy3 correct cue names

Just a note, but I don't think New Start, or Alternate Start as you called it ('Alternate' seems to be scratched though), is not the official cue name for Elsa's Betrayal.

Perhaps he wrote an original start to the cue where the cue name is on, but changed that with the new start we hear in the film now, and we don't have the original sheet music? Pure conjecture though.

[Jay 32,105]

updating www.indianajonesmusic.com with the Indy3 correct cue names

Just a note, but I don't think New Start, or Alternate Start as you called it ('Alternate' seems to be scratched though), is not the official cue name for Elsa's Betrayal.

Perhaps he wrote an original start to the cue where the cue name is on, but changed that with the new start we hear in the film now, and we don't have the original sheet music? Pure conjecture though.

You're right! Pages 1-3 of the file are the 12 bar "6m3 Alternate Start", which replaces bars 1-8 of the original 6m3. Pages 1 & 2 of the original 6m3 are simply not included.... and since the bootleg version of the track includes the "Alternate Start" (I assume), they were probably never recorded!

I'd love to know what the original opening would've sounded like...

[Jay 32,105]

I just got a hold of the missing sheet music from Raiders. Williams' original title for "The Basket Game" is "Escape In The Alleys" and is 4m4/5m1. The original title for "The Warehouse" is simply "End Credits Part 1" and is unnumbered.

[DarkLord89 0]

The original title for "The Warehouse" is simply "End Credits Part 1" and is unnumbered.

Well, this explains pretty well why Bouzereau decided to mix "The Warehouse" with the Raiders March...

Matteo

[Jay 32,105]

Yes, as I pointed out here, there is even a note that says "Overlap Part 2" on the final bar

[Jay 32,105]

Since you guys have been better than me at reading this sometimes, what do you think the original cue title of "The Map Room: Dawn" says here?

Discovering The Script?

Discovering The Seriph?

Something else entirely?

[airmanjerm 77]

Since you guys have been better than me at reading this sometimes, what do you think the original cue title of "The Map Room: Dawn" says here?

Discovering The Script?

Discovering The Seriph?

Something else entirely?

I'm going with the obvious "Discovering the Script."

The "T" at the end is the odd-looking one, but the "c" in "script" gives it away.

In all the other lowercase "e" letters, you can see that the pen-man wrote them as, essentially, a small "cursive-style" letter E. They are slanted, and you can see the little curly-part (probably the very first part of the letter written) sticking out on the left side.

The "C" in "script" doesn't look slanted, and there's no hint of anything sticking out on the left, so I'm going with SCRIPT.

I've also put WAY more thought into this than I probably should for a Friday night....perhaps we should all get drunk and just post what we think it could be??? haha j/k!

[Nick Parker 3,034]

Please do not. And yes, it is obviously "Discovering the Script".

[Jay 32,105]

Then why is the T not crossed, and why is there a "period" at the end?

Could the third letter not be an R?

[Nick Parker 3,034]

No, no, I think it is an "R". And that could just be a mistake about the "T". You could be right, but I doubt it, somehow.... It is hard to analyze the handwriting of a man who spells "Fist" "Pffist". Seriously, does anyone know why? The only thing that I can imagine is that it is an...what does one say for the literary device in which an action is written, such as "BAM!" or "Pow!"?

[Jay 32,105]

Hey guys, I think I made a new discovery tonight

On the Raiders sheet music, in addition to the regular slate numbers, every cue is numbered sequentially as well.... starting with #1 for 1m1, #2 for 1m2, etc. Everything lines up through 8m3, which is #18 (and 8m3 Fix is #18x).... but then all of a sudden, 8m5 Pffist Fight is #20.

Wait, what happened to #19? Also, what happened to 8m4?

Check out this: http://www.theraider.net/films/raiders/deleted_scenes.php

I think a cue was written for the deleted scene of Indy punching out the guard that was outside the Well in the original cut!

It was probably never recorded, or we would have heard it by now I'd guess.... but maybe it exists in manuscript form somewhere! It's possible, right?

[Henry B 49]

Well, that's a very short deleted scene... It's possible that the revision of 8M3 Fix is #19 for some reason.

[Jay 32,105]

OK, then why is the airplane fight 8m5 instead of 8m4?

[Nick Parker 3,034]

Hm, I was wondering how Indiana Jones survived that ride on the U-Boat. And that is an interesting discovery, Jason. The only thing I can think of would be what you said. It could have been a cue that lasted but a few seconds, such as "Exchange of Glances".

[Jay 32,105]

So I was looking at the Raiders sheet music the other day, and noticed something. In the 1m3 pdf, the first page is marked as bars A and B, and then on page 2 it starts over on bar 1 and continues to the end.

Is bars A and B the 1m3 Insert from the bootleg, and bars 1-end the normal cue ("Escape From The Temple" on the Concord)?

Also, the supposed 8m3 Fix Alternate from the bootleg ("Through The Wall Alternate") is just some bars from 8m3 fix repeated over and over,yes?

[DarkLord89 0]

So I was looking at the Raiders sheet music the other day, and noticed something. In the 1m3 pdf, the first page is marked as bars A and B, and then on page 2 it starts over on bar 1 and continues to the end.

Is bars A and B the 1m3 Insert from the bootleg, and bars 1-end the normal cue ("Escape From The Temple" on the Concord)?

Also, the supposed 8m3 Fix Alternate from the bootleg ("Through The Wall Alternate") is just some bars from 8m3 fix repeated over and over,yes?

1) Nope, bars A and B are the first 2 seconds from the Concord track. There is no snare drum stave in those two bars, though it seems odd the bar numbering and the fact that he wrote bars A and B on the first page, then left the rest blank and moved to the next page. This means, IMHO, that the first page of 1M3 was written later and then added to the composition before its recording.

2) It could be, but I think some percussions are different and also there's a crescendo that isn't included in the 8M3 Fix recording.

[Jay 32,105]

Just curious if anybody was still working on MIDI / orchestrated MP3s of any further cues from TOD?

If not, and you're looking for something to do, there's 3 bars from Hook I'd love to hear in this way...

[Desplat13 1]

Sorry Jason, I haven't been working on anything lately. I want to do "Willie Into The Fryer", though it is looking a but daunting at the moment. But who knows, maybe I'll get real inspired sometime...

Anyways, yes I hope to do more, at some point.

[Datameister 1,691]

I started "Willy in the Fryer" in Finale 2009 today; I've got about 12 measures done, though I've mostly skipped some chaotic woodwind effects. We'll see if I can finish it...some of it can be quite difficult to read, and it's so dissonant that my above-average ability to work things about by ear isn't of enormous use. Anyway, thanks so much to everyone for your contributions! I've really enjoyed gaining greater appreciation for TOD's score over the last few weeks.

[airmanjerm 77]

Just curious if anybody was still working on MIDI / orchestrated MP3s of any further cues from TOD?

If not, and you're looking for something to do, there's 3 bars from Hook I'd love to hear in this way...

I just finished my latest work and am now sitting around with nothing to do for a couple of weeks, so doing some of these would be a fun project.

How about this...can you make a "wishlist?" Put it up here and I can work on some of them as I have time.

And which 3 measures from HOOK are you looking for?

[Jay 32,105]

I started "Willy in the Fryer" in Finale 2009 today; I've got about 12 measures done, though I've mostly skipped some chaotic woodwind effects. We'll see if I can finish it...some of it can be quite difficult to read, and it's so dissonant that my above-average ability to work things about by ear isn't of enormous use. Anyway, thanks so much to everyone for your contributions! I've really enjoyed gaining greater appreciation for TOD's score over the last few weeks.

Excellent!

Just curious if anybody was still working on MIDI / orchestrated MP3s of any further cues from TOD?

If not, and you're looking for something to do, there's 3 bars from Hook I'd love to hear in this way...

I just finished my latest work and am now sitting around with nothing to do for a couple of weeks, so doing some of these would be a fun project.

How about this...can you make a "wishlist?" Put it up here and I can work on some of them as I have time.

And which 3 measures from HOOK are you looking for?

Here's what we don't have yet:

INDY 2:

-The beginning of 3m2 that was replaced in the film by 3m2a alternate beginning

-9m2 Willy In The Fryer

INDY 3:

-10m1 Insert 3

-10m1 Insert A

-The beginning of 11m4/12m1 that was replaced in the film (and OST) by 11m4/12m1 overlap

I don't think there's anything in Jurassic Park that's never been heard before...

As for Hook, the only thing in the 452 page PDF that's floating around that can't be heard in the film or OST/Boots is 13m2 Alternate Insert (page 348). I'd love to hear that.

[Datameister 1,691]

Dang...there really isn't a hint of anything melodic in "Willy in the Fryer" so far. It's so dissonant and crazy! Lots of sound effects being played by musical instruments, really. I don't know how well this is going to translate, but I'll keep at it for now.

[Jay 32,105]

Wow, that sounds awesome. We need a complete 2CD set to be released!

[Datameister 1,691]

Not as awesome as one might hope...but then again, it'd probably sound pretty great with a real orchestra. =P (But yes...we do need a full-on complete release!)

[Jay 32,105]

Hey Jeremy, did you ever fix that blip at 1:31 in your wonderful A Tribute To Vernon mp3?

[Datameister 1,691]

I'm also working on the considerably more rewarding "Dance Orchestra" overlay. Obviously, we already know what that one sounds like, but I think it'll be interesting to have a clean version for myself that doesn't include "Once in a Vial" underneath it, and I can upload an audio file when I'm finished if anyone's interested.

[Valentinice 20]

Yes please Datameister!

And that goes for anyone who makes audio versions of the recently discovered sheet music

[airmanjerm 77]

Hey Jeremy, did you ever fix that blip at 1:31 in your wonderful A Tribute To Vernon mp3?

Hey Jason...no, unfortunately I got busy with my latest new work and that just got brushed to the side.

I can try to redo that sometime soon though, perhaps after I do some of the un-recorded ones?

It's too bad all these cues don't have tempo markings in them!

[Wojo 2,450]

Wow, that A Tribute to Vernon MP3 is awesome! That blip's barely noticeable.

[Jay 32,105]

Yea its really great, Jeremy did a great job. I listen to it all the time

[Wojo 2,450]

I'll have to go back into my Indy WIP folder and see if I can fix up your Child Returns music, and then get at least two Indy scores ready to go.

Are there clean versions of the major boot tracks from TLC out there? I tried to get Dad's Study / Inscription / Catacombs / Henry Is Shot from the DVD, but they're either too subdued to be worth it or the SFX would be too much for me to edit out. What's in the editing package is good enough, but sounds a tad too quivery.

[Jay 32,105]

The ones in the editing package are the best anybody has

[Wojo 2,450]

It took me as long as...well, as long as it took to load most of the 36x6 WAV files into Audacity, and listen to them chapter by chapter to come to that same conclusion. It's rough "watching" The Last Crusade without getting to see Allison Doody...

[Jay 32,105]

hehe, you said "doody"

[Wojo 2,450]

Crap, I did.

[Jay 32,105]

lol

[Nick Parker 3,034]

Stop acting like a child!

[Wojo 2,450]

I can't hear you, I've got Green Day's "Dookie" running full blast.