Total Recall vs. Minority Report

[Morlock 11]

No!

Yeah, he really does. Gore generally makes violence cool and harmless, and Verhoven's violence is rarely effective on it's own terms as anything other than a gaudy love for gore.

Luckily for him, he's managed to find some ways to bury it under some deeper satire (although I don't think he's been nearly as successful as it's alledged).

[Quintus 5,399]

Verhoeven also loves nudity and nightclubs.

That scene in "Total Recall" always creeped me out.

That's because it is an 18 rated movie, at least here in the UK. Give it a couple of years and you will LOVE those scenes in TR

Luckily for him, he's managed to find some ways to bury it under some deeper satire (although I don't think he's been nearly as successful as it's alledged).

Hmm I dunno. I'd question that. Maybe he got lucky with his writers, but I view him as one of the satirical greats of modern Hollywood.

[Marian Schedenig 8,176]

No!

Yeah, he really does. Gore generally makes violence cool and harmless, and Verhoven's violence is rarely effective on it's own terms as anything other than a gaudy love for gore.

I agree Verhoeven seems to enjoy filming violence, but I also agree that at the same time, his violence usually is horrific. Not so much in Total Recall, perhaps, but I found bits of Hollow Man quite disgusting, for example (and I'm not talking about the script).

[Quintus 5,399]

The moments where Bacon's (no pun intended) flesh and sinew is visible was the most disgusting part in Hollow Man.

[Charlie Brigden 7]

Watching ROBOCOP today, the violence in the film champions both causes. The opening scene with ED-209 is a great show of excess violence (at least the unrated cut), whilst Murphy's death is one of the most horrific death scenes I've ever seen, especially with the gore. TR and STARSHIP TROOPERS are certainly more comic book-esque, but I think BASIC INSTINCT (at least the post-titles ice pick stabbing) has a pretty shocking and effective, and gory murder scene. Then again, that scene has all the hallmarks of Bava and Argento.

[Koray Savas 2,251]

Minority Report for both, but that is due to the fact that I have not seen Total Recall. I think I saw parts like a long time ago, but all I remember is a 3-boobed chick.

[Morlock 11]

No!

Yeah, he really does. Gore generally makes violence cool and harmless, and Verhoven's violence is rarely effective on it's own terms as anything other than a gaudy love for gore.

I agree Verhoeven seems to enjoy filming violence, but I also agree that at the same time, his violence usually is horrific. Not so much in Total Recall, perhaps, but I found bits of Hollow Man quite disgusting, for example (and I'm not talking about the script).

Hollow Man in general, yes. The movie was repulsive in most things. But I think that in Robocop, Total Recall and Starship Troopers is entirely taking joy in the creating and sight of it. I thought that about Zwortboek, too, but I need to see it again. I didn't see ANY of the positive stuff so many so (excluding Carice Van Houten's terrific performance. And figure.). I think that his love of the mayham and gore undercuts Starship Troopers' satire. The humans are wrong, yes...but aren't those bugs exploding beautifully?! The most troubling bit of violence in that movie is scene in the propoganda video, when the life-sized roaches are being stepped on.

[Red 75]

SPR is pretty gory. But it's never as gratuitous as Verhoeven, who always thoroughly enjoys his bloodsplatters.

He doesn't enjoy it, but he beliefs that making violence look harmless or even cool is immoral.

Violence is a Verhoeven film usually looks horrific.

If there's any director who does that I think it's David Chronenberg.

[phbart 609]

I read somewhere that Goldsmith himself considers TR his favorite score...

Maybe Miss Padmé could confirm that to us...

[Marian Schedenig 8,176]

I think that his love of the mayham and gore undercuts Starship Troopers' satire. The humans are wrong, yes...but aren't those bugs exploding beautifully?! The most troubling bit of violence in that movie is scene in the propoganda video, when the life-sized roaches are being stepped on.

I think that's part of why it works so well. The film is a bit of a paradox; it's not just a satire hidden inside a mainstream action blockbuster, it actually has the action part do all the "bad things" the satire is about. It's actually enjoyable as a dumb but well-made action movie and simultaneously makes you feel bad for enjoying it. I agree the bug stomping scene is among the toughest bits in the film, but the "inappropriate" violence is where most of its impact comes from.

I read somewhere that Goldsmith himself considers TR his favorite score...

It's one of a handful of scores generally cited as his favourites. Comes with the quote "there's enough notes in it for a Bruckner symphony", which I find rather appropriate, because I always thought there's a similarity between the two composers, and because TR is so packed with counterpoints and polyphony (there's even a little fugue in it, rare for a 90s score) I still keep finding new mindboggling stuff when I listen to it.

[Joni Wiljami 1,206]

One of Goldsmith's best scores and one of Arnie's best films.

That's not much yet. The first guy is ok but the second is just a very big joke.

[Josh500 1,615]

Wow, I'm a little disappointed that MR the score is behind.

Don't get me wrong, Jerry Goldsmith did a superb job on Total Recall, but Minorty Report makes me go WOW everytime... Anderton's Great Escape, Sean's Theme, Everybody Runs, The Spyders, Psychic Truth, the Pre-Crime Motif!

[Hitch 57]

Verhoeven also loves nudity and nightclubs.

That scene in "Total Recall" always creeped me out.

Surely not?

Wow, I'm a little disappointed that MR the score is behind.

I'm not

[Josh500 1,615]

Verhoeven also loves nudity and nightclubs.

That scene in "Total Recall" always creeped me out.

Surely not?

Wow.

[Unlucky Bastard 7,782]

She makes me wish I had three hands.

[Marian Schedenig 8,176]

Wow, I'm a little disappointed that MR the score is behind.

I'm not

Me neither. This is like comparing Star Wars to U.S. Marshals.

[Ollie 1,059]

Yeah I can understand the movies being close but I'm more suprised the scores are as close. Total Recall should be well ahead.

Actually you take this poll outside of JWFAN and Total Recall is well ahead in the score dept.

[JoeinAR 1,949]

Minority Report I believe is a better movie, a lot better movie, but yeah in this instance the Goldsmith score for Total Recall is a better score.

[fommes 153]

Yeah I can understand the movies being close but I'm more suprised the scores are as close. Total Recall should be well ahead.

Actually you take this poll outside of JWFAN and Total Recall is well ahead in the score dept.

You mean to the neutral FSM forum?

[JoeinAR 1,949]

Yeah I can understand the movies being close but I'm more suprised the scores are as close. Total Recall should be well ahead.

Actually you take this poll outside of JWFAN and Total Recall is well ahead in the score dept.

You mean to the neutral FSM forum?

you mean the I'm having Jerry's Baby and I'm naming it the FSM forum.

[David Coscina 3]

i loved Total Recall when I saw it as a 22 year old in 1990. It has not aged that well to me. I did not care for Minority Report when I saw it back in 2002 but have grown to appreciate the filmmaking style as I have gotten older.

Score-wise, I am not surprised there is not a bigger gap between the two. I also do not care for Goldsmith's use of electronics in TR, and much of the action material is actually lifted (and sped up) from Bartok's Concerto for Orchestra with its emphasis on quartal harmonies. It works splendidly as underscore and has some really meaty writing. However, I prefer Williams' MR even if it's for Sean's Theme, Spiders, Everybody Runs, and a couple other tracks.

Personally, I think Total Recall is a joke with respect to its screenplay. The lines are beyond bad and the acting is not much better. It begins well with its set-up but once it moves to its 3rd act, things go downhill faster than an olympic skier.

[MissPadmé 17]

Personally, I think Total Recall is a joke with respect to its screenplay. The lines are beyond bad and the acting is not much better. It begins well with its set-up but once it moves to its 3rd act, things go downhill faster than an olympic skier.

"YOU BLEW MY CAVAAHH!"

[Lurker 5]

Personally, I think Total Recall is a joke with respect to its screenplay. The lines are beyond bad and the acting is not much better. It begins well with its set-up but once it moves to its 3rd act, things go downhill faster than an olympic skier.

The audience was having a good time with the film last week. The dialogue was fine and Arnold even delivered a perfect "Eff you" at one point, which was great.

Neil

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

It's a great thrill ride.

[Charlie Brigden 7]

I love it to death. Bonus points for not having Tom Cruise in it.

I will say, I don't remember a note of MINORITY REPORT's score. I guess I should give that a listen again, but I don't really have the motivation to.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

I think it has a C sharp somewere.

[Hitch 57]

Wow, I'm a little disappointed that MR the score is behind.

I'm not

Me neither. This is like comparing Star Wars to U.S. Marshals.

U.S Marshals clearly the better score

[Koray Savas 2,251]

The dialogue was fine and Arnold even delivered a perfect "Eff you" at one point, which was great.

"You are one ugly mother effer."

[Ollie 1,059]

Wrong film......geez.

[Nick Parker 3,040]

You know, I remember being really surprised when I saw that one scene where Aronld fought that guy on the elevator, ultimately ending in the dismemberment of that guy's hands ( or was it arms?). I was really expecting Aronld to say something like, "Thanks for the hand", or some other bound-to-be-infamous one-liner, but he did not. I thought that restraint was impressive. And I love that part where Arnold continually shouts "You blew my cover!" while strangling that one person. Good times abound when Arnold is around....

[Trent B 337]

Total Recall for both.

[Hitch 57]

I knew bribing you with that $40,000 would help

[Nick Parker 3,040]

Hey, I need that to buy the Blue Box! No fair....

[Hitch 57]

Go pimp a ride in a Johnny-Cab for a few hours to earn it

[Quintus 5,399]

Good times abound when Arnold is around....

Yes! Arnie is a legend and he is on top form in Total Recall. The script to that movie is actually one of the most brilliant, hilarious and endlessly quotable works of the 90s'.

[Hitch 57]

Sitting in his big Governor's chair....sorry...seat. That's looks like a cushy number for him.

[Nick Parker 3,040]

Quato!

[Lurker 5]

You know, I remember being really surprised when I saw that one scene where Aronld fought that guy on the elevator, ultimately ending in the dismemberment of that guy's hands ( or was it arms?). I was really expecting Aronld to say something like, "Thanks for the hand", or some other bound-to-be-infamous one-liner, but he did not. I thought that restraint was impressive.

He does say, "See you at the party, Richter!".

Neil

[Nick Parker 3,040]

Oh, really? I guess I do not remember that....

[Charlie Brigden 7]

Michael Ironside is awesome in this flick. Just badass. And props to uber-bad guy Ronny Cox, following on from Dick Jones.

[Josh500 1,615]

Actually you take this poll outside of JWFAN and Total Recall is well ahead in the score dept.

Yeah, but the point is this is inside of JWFAN, and I guess that's why I was a little disappointed...

[Unlucky Bastard 7,782]

Why are you disappointed at statistical opinions? What exactly are you trying to find or prove with these polls?

[Joni Wiljami 1,206]

Personally, I think Total Recall is a joke with respect to its screenplay. The lines are beyond bad and the acting is not much better. It begins well with its set-up but once it moves to its 3rd act, things go downhill faster than an olympic skier.

The audience was having a good time with the film last week. The dialogue was fine and Arnold even delivered a perfect "Eff you" at one point, which was great.

Neil

The audience?

What the eff?

Millions of flies can't be wrong:poo is good.

But seriously , you can't compare these two films , MR is Awesome.

It also have a decent score , TR is a musical joke , so is Arnie.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Please explain, in what way is Total Recall a musical joke?

[Joni Wiljami 1,206]

Ok , too strong expression but I would say it's overrated and dated. As the most of Goldsmith's scores , the time is not very gentle with them.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

What aspects date it, exactly?

[Unlucky Bastard 7,782]

Don't bother, Stefan. He's a psychopath.

[Joni Wiljami 1,206]

Happy New Year to You too but this is a Civilized conversation , not a quote thread.

And if you happen not to like Goldsmith , does it make you a psychopath?

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Ignore him, please.

You are a musically literate person, what exactly dates this score, apart from using 1990 synth?

[A24 4,326]

What is a '90s synth?