Star Wars Episode III: Revenge of the Sith

[Richard Penna 3,687]

I doubt Joey dignifies Pirates with any rating at all.

Certainly I don't hold most of the first two scores in any sort of positive opinion.

[Ollie 1,059]

Well I give them a 1 because that's the rating system.

[Datameister 2,042]

In all fairness you can only go as low as 1 on these rating systems so Pirates couldn't go any lower than that.

I'm rather surprised that even someone like Joe would rate AOTC and Pirates on the same level.

- Datameister, who'd probably rate both with unapologetic 4's, and for completely different reasons, many of which have nothing to do with the composers' technical skills, originality, or freshness, although he would not look down on anyone for rating them lower, and who should probably cut this thing short before he kills it, if you'll excuse the mixed metaphor, even though he probably already has.

[Richard Penna 3,687]

Filmtracks has a frisbee rating for scores considered a waste of CD space. I wouldn't suggest that Pieter has many scores that would get that sort of reaction though.

I had a moment at work today that made my heart sink. I got talking about our musical interests with a colleague and mentioned I liked film music. And can you guess the first composer/score that he mentioned? The Dark Knight... meh. It's always Zimmer. I spent the next few minutes desperately trying to argue why that score is creatively inferior to KotCS, the first technically respectable score that popped into my head.

[JoeinAR 1,949]

for some reason Pirates/Curse of the Black Pearl is a guilty pleasure of mine, I know I'm not supposed to like it but I do, its much better than AOTC, I'd probably go 2.5 or 3. CURSES.

Mark, Marc, Stefan, and Neil have given me hell for liking it.

[Richard Penna 3,687]

Thought I was seeing things when you said that the first time.

Pearl is a guilty pleasure to me too. The third one I do genuinely like because of the lack of synths in the final recording, it's less dark than the other two, and some nice melodies.

This is the difference between us Joey. I consider much of Zimmer's/clones output total crap as do you, but my tastes stretch sufficiently that I can enjoy both ends of the modern/classic scale. Just depends what mood I'm in.

[Taikomochi 1,136]

I had a moment at work today that made my heart sink. I got talking about our musical interests with a colleague and mentioned I liked film music. And can you guess the first composer/score that he mentioned? The Dark Knight... meh. It's always Zimmer. I spent the next few minutes desperately trying to argue why that score is creatively inferior to KotCS, the first technically respectable score that popped into my head.

You people are so whiny!

[Ollie 1,059]

for some reason Pirates/Curse of the Black Pearl is a guilty pleasure of mine, I know I'm not supposed to like it but I do, its much better than AOTC, I'd probably go 2.5 or 3. CURSES.

Mark, Marc, Stefan, and Neil have given me hell for liking it.

No, because I love A.I. and gave AOTC's score 2.5 stars.

[JoeinAR 1,949]

for some reason Pirates/Curse of the Black Pearl is a guilty pleasure of mine, I know I'm not supposed to like it but I do, its much better than AOTC, I'd probably go 2.5 or 3. CURSES.

Mark, Marc, Stefan, and Neil have given me hell for liking it.

No, because I love A.I. and gave AOTC's score 2.5 stars.

well it just goes to prove that I get hell from both sides.

[Richard Penna 3,687]

I had a moment at work today that made my heart sink. I got talking about our musical interests with a colleague and mentioned I liked film music. And can you guess the first composer/score that he mentioned? The Dark Knight... meh. It's always Zimmer. I spent the next few minutes desperately trying to argue why that score is creatively inferior to KotCS, the first technically respectable score that popped into my head.

You people are so whiny!

I'm not whining... just find it disappointing that Zimmer is always the first composer any 'lay' person ever mentions. Other composers just don't get the exposure.

[Taikomochi 1,136]

DATS BCUZ HANS ZIMMER EZ TEH BEST CUMPOZER EVA!!!!1111

[JoeinAR 1,949]

only on opposite day Taik.

[Mr. Breathmask 555]

Curse of the Black Pearl sounds like a demo track. It's quite insane once you realize this is the score to a multi-million dollar pirate movie.

The second one is slightly better, but not to my taste.

I really quite like the third Pirates score.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Mark, Marc, Stefan, and Neil have given me hell for liking it.

I bet you secretly dream of Zimmer at night!

[Williamsfan301 11]

Mark, Marc, Stefan, and Neil have given me hell for liking it.

I bet you secretly dream of Zimmer at night!

You know, the one where you're laying in bed and they fly in through the window?

[Datameister 2,042]

for some reason Pirates/Curse of the Black Pearl is a guilty pleasure of mine, I know I'm not supposed to like it but I do, its much better than AOTC, I'd probably go 2.5 or 3. CURSES.

My respect for you just went up about 14 stars.

Joey, I'm sorry if it seems like I've been pointlessly bringing up stuff you've said in the past, or being bitter, or whatever. I'll try to stop. You just need to understand that some of us are foolish enough to care what others say.

[Hitch 57]

A complete mess from start to finish. Not even his John Adams influenced "Battle of the Heroes" gets any brownie points from me.

[Luke Skywalker 1,795]

well the way some of you treat him for his album selections...

Or his recent output...

I think a more appropriate title might have been Battle Of The Fallen.

It has the same problem, Obi Wan was a modelic Jedi Knight.

for some reason Pirates/Curse of the Black Pearl is a guilty pleasure of mine, I know I'm not supposed to like it but I do, its much better than AOTC, I'd probably go 2.5 or 3. CURSES.

Mark, Marc, Stefan, and Neil have given me hell for liking it.

And with good reason...

I think i'll remember that statement so i dont take into consideration your ratings in the future. Lost every credibility i had in your opinion.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

I think i'll remember that statement so i dont take into consideration your ratings in the future. Lost every credibility i had in your opinion.

Yet you are copying Joe's comments by saying exactly that.

[Luke Skywalker 1,795]

I think i'll remember that statement so i dont take into consideration your ratings in the future. Lost every credibility i had in your opinion.

Yet you are copying Joe's comments by saying exactly that.

Saying Pirates is better than AOTC, goes IMHO further than just personal opinion.

He dislikes so much LC, AI, HOOK. Are they truly bad scores? Should i take into consideration Joe's opinion? After the pirates thingy, i think not.

Come on, it is not even Zimmer best works, its just a derivative synth pastiche.

[Elmo Lewis 6]

for some reason Pirates/Curse of the Black Pearl is a guilty pleasure of mine, I know I'm not supposed to like it but I do, its much better than AOTC, I'd probably go 2.5 or 3. CURSES.

My respect for you just went up about 14 stars.

Actually, mine too.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Joe never said it was a masterpiece, he never even stated it was a particulary good score. It's a guilty pleasure.

[Taikomochi 1,136]

only on opposite day Taik.

But I like Hansy a lot, just not up there with JW and Elliot Goldenthal.

[Wojo 2,453]

I like all 3 Pirates scores. They're not supposed to be serious scores, so I don't take them too seriously. In the right mood, they're fun listens, and when I get tired of them, I listen to something else.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

They're not supposed to be serious scores, so I don't take them too seriously.

According to whom?

They certainly don't have much of a sense of homur or lightness about them.

The biggest problem with the score to Pearl is that it almost totally ignores the comedic tone of the film and goes for the apocalyptic epic angle.

[Taikomochi 1,136]

Rating PotC in a Star Wars thread? BRILLIANT!

[Red 75]

I like At World's End, in fact it's one of Zimmer's best. The others are kind of forgettable.

But um, this thread is about Revenge of the Sith.

[Wojo 2,453]

The biggest problem with the score to Pearl is that it almost totally ignores the comedic tone of the film and goes for the apocalyptic epic angle.

Comedic tone? An old Aztec curse on stolen gold turns a bunch of pirates into undead zombies that cannot die until they fulfill a blood curse, so they pillage, plunder, and murder to recover the gold, including stealing a virgin woman from her room in her nightgown. All manner of cannon dueling, swordfighting, and double-triple crossing ensue. Oh yes, great comedic fun.

I meant they're not serious scores as in you can't place them, at least the first one, alongside more traditional symphonic scores and draw a fair comparison, as it's all synthesized doom and gloom. I don't take that kind of music seriously.

If you want a great comedic, epic symphonic pirates score, go listen to Cutthroat Island. I just dare you to want to watch that movie as much if not more.

[aj_vader 534]

The Revenge Of The Sith Score (movie version) is great and I give it 5 Stars, but the OST id give 4.5

[Luke Skywalker 1,795]

The biggest problem with the score to Pearl is that it almost totally ignores the comedic tone of the film and goes for the apocalyptic epic angle.

Comedic tone? An old Aztec curse on stolen gold turns a bunch of pirates into undead zombies that cannot die until they fulfill a blood curse, so they pillage, plunder, and murder to recover the gold, including stealing a virgin woman from her room in her nightgown. All manner of cannon dueling, swordfighting, and double-triple crossing ensue. Oh yes, great comedic fun.

What about jack sparrow?*

His very first scene is a joke.

* Just for the record, Jack's flag features a Swallow, not a Sparrow. Ornitologic Knowledge: FAIL

[Wojo 2,453]

Jack's very first scene operates outside the knowledge that the curse is real because he is not part of it.

Teenagers don't get slashed in the very first scenes of horror movies, do they? It takes a while to build up to the scary parts.

[Luke Skywalker 1,795]

light-hearted jaunty fluffy pirate jingle score?

Great definition of Jack Sparrows theme from At world end... ( i dont remember if it was the same in the other two movies)

Wojo, really, these are not serious movies. they are very fun and comical.

[Datameister 2,042]

Wow...I definitely did not mean to start such a derail. Sorry about this, especially considering my initial assumption that Joey prefers AOTC over Pirates turned out to be incorrect anyway! Shall we get back on topic? (Although I must interject that it's partly the comedic approach that kills DMC for me. The doom-and-gloom approach didn't bother me in TCOTBP because it was my first real exposure to MV music, and that film doesn't resort to conventionally stupid humor anyway. The funny moments are so great that they don't need comical scoring to be effective.)

But yes, let's try to get back to ROTS. I will say that if I were judging it purely based on the album, I'd probably have to give it a 4, not a 4.5, because there are a lot of moments I really like that aren't on the album. And if we were judging purely on thematic framework and development, I'd probably give it a 2, because that's where it really drops the ball for me. I love plenty of individual moments, but there are a number of themes that really should have been developed throughout the score. For instance, Grievous's theme is rather underutilized, and it would have been nice to hear hints of Battle of the Heroes throughout the score, particularly as Anakin turned. But I suppose both of these can be partially blamed on the structure of the film.

[Joni Wiljami 1,206]

I was about to give this 4,5 stars but after read all these idiotic posts

I turned to give it 5 stars , which is exactly my opinion of it if I ever am able to hear it completely.

btw kerry koldsmith would've never been able to write anything great as this , even one bar , so it will be.

[Wojo 2,453]

Idiotic posts? Who the EFF is Kerry Koldsmith? Jerry Goldsmith's idiot brother?

Half of Goldsmith's scores are easily better than Revenge of the Sith, and the other half are so much better it's not worth comparing them.

[Charlie Brigden 7]

Wait, so Johnny Depp's mugging/Keith Richards impression isn't supposed to be funny?

[Joni Wiljami 1,206]

Whatever

[Wojo 2,453]

You know what, you're right. I laughed so hard at this guy in the theater, I pissed myself.

[Taikomochi 1,136]

Idiotic posts? Who the EFF is Kerry Koldsmith? Jerry Goldsmith's idiot brother?

His retarded clone!

Scientist 1 : We've succeeded in cloning the great Jerry Goldsmith! Now he can continue writing great music! There was possibly a bit of brain damage caused by the cloning process, though...

Scientist 2 : What is your name?

Clone : MY NAME KERRY KOLDSMITH I LIKE PICKLES

Scientist 2 : FAIL

[Datameister 2,042]

Idiotic posts? Who the EFF is Kerry Koldsmith? Jerry Goldsmith's idiot brother?

His retarded clone!

Scientist 1 : We've succeeded in cloning the great Jerry Goldsmith! Now he can continue writing great music! There was possibly a bit of brain damage caused by the cloning process, though...

Scientist 2 : What is your name?

Clone : MY NAME KERRY KOLDSMITH I LIKE PICKLES

Scientist 2 : FAIL

I have to be honest...usually, at times when phrases like LOL seem appropriate, I'm not literally laughing out loud. This time is the exception. You actually elicited a genuinely audible laugh from me with that post, for which I thank and commend you. It's a sadly difficult task.

[King Mark 3,631]

, and it would have been nice to hear hints of Battle of the Heroes throughout the score, particularly as Anakin turned.

You hear it in many cues in the end .You need the cue The Boys Continue to really appreciate it .In TPM Duel of the Fates appears only in the Battle of Naboo.

Lots of 4 ,4,5 and 5 votes. It seems a few vocal members managed to tarnish the reputation of this score by saying it sucks every time they get the chance

[Koray Savas 2,251]

3

[JoeinAR 1,949]

KM, you get to say its great everytime as well. I don't tarnish the scores reputation, its reputation is tarnished by its poor quality.

[Datameister 2,042]

You hear it in many cues in the end .You need the cue The Boys Continue to really appreciate it .

Oh, believe me, I do appreciate it. The edit I put together includes "The Boys Continue" in its entirety - I've even arranged and recorded

of the second part of it! What I'm saying is that it would have been nice to hear whispers of it, hints of it, in earlier cues, when Anakin is in the process of turning to the dark side, particularly in scenes that also involve Obi-Wan. Nothing too overt, obviously, but bits of the main string ostinato, or quiet melodic fragments. Could have been very effective.

In TPM Duel of the Fates appears only in the Battle of Naboo.

I'm aware of that, and I have the same issue with that score, albeit to a somewhat lesser degree, since there's plenty of other thematic material in earlier scenes with the two Sith lords.

[Henry B 50]

I have no problem with leitmotives entering a score at its end. Is there some rule that to be effective every theme has to be referenced x number of times at points such and such in the film?

[Datameister 2,042]

I have no problem with leitmotives entering a score at its end. Is there some rule that to be effective every theme has to be referenced x number of times at points such and such in the film?

Nope, and I have no problem with you not having a problem with it. I was simply stating that I personally would have liked to have heard it used a bit throughout the score. Is that okay?

[King Mark 3,631]

I agree ,like a slow ominous version of it

[JoeinAR 1,949]

H.B. are you suggesting that there is a mathematical formula out there that has to be applied to a film score?

# of Themes/Pi x square root(runningtime)=#times each theme must be played.

I don't know the placement theorem, as its math way above me.

[Henry B 50]

No, Joe, I'm suggesting that there is not such a formula. In my opinion leitmotif is just one approach to scoring. I've been getting away from it in my own writing. Through-composed music is challenging and, I think, really rewarding.

[JoeinAR 1,949]

No, Joe, I'm suggesting that there is not such a formula. In my opinion leitmotif is just one approach to scoring. I've been getting away from it in my own writing. Through-composed music is challenging and, I think, really rewarding.

I think its a great way to score, but its not for every film. John Williams biggest mistake IMHO is he should have never even used the Star Wars theme for the prequels, and later his misuse of themes that had no place. Rots is full of music that belongs to Star Wars, not revenge of the sith. Thats why I think this score is blah.