Rate "Star Wars Episode III - Revenge of the Sith"

[Josh500 1,615]

It's funny, just a few years ago, TPM was voted worst of the prequels.

I think most of us agree, TPM the SCORE is the best of the prequels.

As to the movies... well, either they're all equally bad, or people can't make up their minds.

I cannot decide whether I like TPM or ROTS more...

[Datameister 2,042]

I don't hate Josh500, either, although my interest in all the polls is quite limited.

[Josh500 1,615]

I don't hate Josh500, either, although my interest in all the polls is quite limited.

Thank you Datameister. Now should we get a room or... ?

[Datameister 2,042]

Sorry I bothered.

[Josh500 1,615]

Sorry I bothered.

You didn't bother. Never mind.

So which prequel movie do you like best? And why?

[Datameister 2,042]

I think TPM is better at capturing some of the Star Wars "feel," but ROTS has a lot more emotional impact, for all its shortcomings. I'd probably go with ROTS.

[Josh500 1,615]

I think TPM is better at capturing some of the Star Wars "feel," but ROTS has a lot more emotional impact, for all its shortcomings. I'd probably go with ROTS.

Yes. They're very different kinds of movies, that's it... not better or worse, just different.

[Richard Penna 3,686]

Movie: 3.5. The only one of the prequels I can watch, and it was a fun one.

Score: 4. That's as originally written. I think the album sucks.

TPM is easily the most consistent of the three, and for me makes a good album.

For the record I don't mind the polls too much. Just stop rating everything 5 stars!

[Josh500 1,615]

TPM is easily the most consistent of the three, and for me makes a good album.

Yes. But maybe that's something to do with JW's schedule, as well.

1999: Phantom Menace and Angelas's Ashes

2002: Attack of the Clones and Chamber of Secrets and Minority Report and Catch Me If You Can

2005: Revenge of the Sith and War of the Worlds and Memoirs of a Geisha and Munich

JW simply had more time to work on TPM.

[indy4 155]

Film: 4. It has many technical flaws, but for me there's so much to like about it (much like KotCS)

What are some of the flaws, IYO?

Overuse of CGI (I don't mind it in the big space battles, but more for individual characters)

Bad acting (Palpatine and Dooku are the exceptions)

Some bad dialogue (eg Anakin saying "From my point of view...")

That's most of it. Despite this, I feel the film has such strong emotion, a great story, and some of the scenes are incredibly well done (especially the "Anakin's Dark Deeds" scene).

[Henry B 50]

It's funny, just a few years ago, TPM was voted worst of the prequels. AOTC and Sith were seen as consecutive steps in the right direction. Maybe that 1999 Episode 1 anticipation has created nostalgia. Just like I said, eventually, the nostalgia factor will up their ratings. One by one.

Well, nostalgia factor is about the only thing these movies have going for them.

[Ollie 1,059]

No, I think that's been pretty much ruined as well.

[Diego 21]

Some bad dialogue (eg Anakin saying "From my point of view...")

That whole sequence "Palpatine is evil!" "From my point of view the Jedi are evil!" "Well you are lost!" <_< I'm sure little chidren playing with their Episode 3 action figures would come out with more intelligent lines than that.

Anyway, about the polls-thing and the people complaing about them, some Economy 101, the fact that there are replies and votes in each one shows that there is a "demand" for polls. The day when Josh opens up a poll and no one votes or replies it'll be the day when he no longer makes polls. I for one didn't vote on this one since we just had one about ROTS and it is indeed getting repetitive.

Also, try to be tolerant, Josh makes polls, richuk complains about how specialty labels never release somthing from the 90s, KM complains about unreleased music from Williams, I whine about how hard it is to get scores in Mexico. We all have our annoying habits in this board.

[indy4 155]

Some bad dialogue (eg Anakin saying "From my point of view...")

That whole sequence "Palpatine is evil!" "From my point of view the Jedi are evil!" "Well you are lost!" <_< I'm sure little chidren playing with their Episode 3 action figures would come out with more intelligent lines than that.

Indeed. The thing that bothers me is that not only is saying "from my point of view" completely unsith-like, but I have a feeling that Lucas knew that but still used the line because it set up a "clever" come back from Obi-Wan: "Well then you are lost!"

But there is some dialogue that is written and performed quite well..."You were the chosen one!" being one example. It's very simple, much like "I am your father," but it works really really well to express the emotion of the scene.

[John Crichton 4]

There should have been no dialogue during the duel.

[Nick Parker 3,040]

But there is some dialogue that is written and performed quite well..."You were the chosen one!" being one example. It's very simple, much like "I am your father," but it works really really well to express the emotion of the scene.

Not to mention the fact that Ewan McGregor could have been shouting to Anakin about birthday cakes and the scene still would have been emotionally powerful because of John Williams' music.

[Ollie 1,059]

When it was all said and done, Anakin's fall fom grace just wasn't a compelling story. There were no suprises.

Only a person who had never heard of Star Wars at all would have been suprised by the turn of events.

When a majority of the audience knows the outcome you have to have a strong story and make the audience care about the characters. Lucas failed.

[Delorean90 42]

The thing that bugged me most about the duel is that there is that Obi-Wan's actions make little to no sense from the time he steps up from the ship. First off, the conversation with Anakin and Padme wasn't going well, but Obi-Wan's intrusion on the scene wasn't necessary, and he totally set it off by doing that. When Anakin screams loud enough for him to hear that Padme brought Obi-Wan to kill him? How about, "She didn't know I was on board, Anakin." Nope, no explanation. Anakin starts to choke her, and Obi-Wan says "Let her go" a few times. Great. Okay, so now the two buddies are together, and Obi-Wan has been faced with the knowledge of what Anakin's been doing. So naturally he's a little curious as to why he's doing this, right? Apparently not. Not ONCE does Obi-Wan try to get to the bottom of things. Nah, it's a better idea to talk about the government and throw in little jabs when you're talking to your unstable former best friend. Never mind that none of that REALLY has much to do with what's going on at the moment. Obi-Wan draws his saber first, and the closest thing to any attempt to get to Anakin is a "Don't try it"? What happened to "Obi-Wan once thought as you do"? Ugh. It was exasperating.

I will agree with indy4, though, that as a whole, the "Enter Lord Vader/Anakin's Dark Deeds/It Can't Be" makes a very well executed sequence both musically and cinematically.

Still hate the plastic look compared to TPM and the OT.

[Jacob 0]

But there is some dialogue that is written and performed quite well..."You were the chosen one!" being one example. It's very simple, much like "I am your father," but it works really really well to express the emotion of the scene.

Not to mention the fact that Ewan McGregor could have been shouting to Anakin about birthday cakes and the scene still would have been emotionally powerful because of John Williams' music.

I do like the line: "I have failed you Anakin. I have failed you."

When a majority of the audience knows the outcome you have to have a strong story and make the audience care about the characters. Lucas failed.

At least for this Star Wars fan when I first saw it in theaters it was an awesome experience. Knowing Anakin was going to turn, I think, enhanced it. I found myself almost yelling at the screen "Don't do it!" at one point, sort of hoping beyond hope. I even got a bit misty-eyed at the end when I saw baby Luke handed to Beru. *sniff*

I'm not blind to the Prequels flaws. But for me, Lucas succeeded in a number of areas. I find plenty to enjoy and even a measure of emotional impact, thanks in no small part to John Williams.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

I saw ROTS once, in the cinema. For no other reason then to see it once.

[Josh500 1,615]

I saw ROTS once, in the cinema. For no other reason then to see it once.

You didn't get the DVD? Didn't watch the extras?

[MrScratch 294]

Score - 3

Movie - 2.5

TPM

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

I saw ROTS once, in the cinema. For no other reason then to see it once.

You didn't get the DVD? Didn't watch the extras?

No. The movie did not interest me enough to do either of these things.

I saw the third one for the sole reason that I saw the previous 2.

I knew it was not going to be good, or even competant.

I saw it, just to confirm it's excistance, basically.

[Josh500 1,615]

Hmmmm, I thought RotS was better than AotC. The movie, that is.

[Ollie 1,059]

Star Trek V is better than AOTC....

ducks the shoe John throws at him.......

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

I did that poll, years ago when AOTC was just out.

It definatly cemented the fact that Trek 5 is indeed the better film.

[John Crichton 4]

Star Trek V is better than AOTC....

ducks the shoe John throws at him.......

Heh, that depends if you're talking about the movies or scores. I'll agree with you for the movies, not least because I'm very much in a Star Trek > Star Wars place right now.

But if it's the scores, prepare to eat sole!

[Koray Savas 2,251]

I don't even want to watch Attack Of The Clones and Revenge Of The Sith after I watched The Phantom Menace a couple weeks ago.

[Diego 21]

The thing that bugged me most about the duel is that there is that Obi-Wan's actions make little to no sense from the time he steps up from the ship. First off, the conversation with Anakin and Padme wasn't going well, but Obi-Wan's intrusion on the scene wasn't necessary, and he totally set it off by doing that. When Anakin screams loud enough for him to hear that Padme brought Obi-Wan to kill him? How about, "She didn't know I was on board, Anakin." Nope, no explanation. Anakin starts to choke her, and Obi-Wan says "Let her go" a few times. Great. Okay, so now the two buddies are together, and Obi-Wan has been faced with the knowledge of what Anakin's been doing. So naturally he's a little curious as to why he's doing this, right? Apparently not. Not ONCE does Obi-Wan try to get to the bottom of things. Nah, it's a better idea to talk about the government and throw in little jabs when you're talking to your unstable former best friend. Never mind that none of that REALLY has much to do with what's going on at the moment. Obi-Wan draws his saber first, and the closest thing to any attempt to get to Anakin is a "Don't try it"? What happened to "Obi-Wan once thought as you do"? Ugh. It was exasperating.

I will agree with indy4, though, that as a whole, the "Enter Lord Vader/Anakin's Dark Deeds/It Can't Be" makes a very well executed sequence both musically and cinematically.

Still hate the plastic look compared to TPM and the OT.

I never really thought about that, but you're 100% right. Sadly the prequels seem to get worse each time one stops to think about them.

[Josh500 1,615]

I will agree with indy4, though, that as a whole, the "Enter Lord Vader/Anakin's Dark Deeds/It Can't Be" makes a very well executed sequence both musically and cinematically.

Yes, I love the cue "It Can't Be." One of the best in RotS. Such heartbreaking music...

Hey, I'm just listening to AotC OS album. The music is reaaaaallly good... what is called "Ambush on Coruscant" (right after the Main Title). It's more enjoyable to just listen to the CD than actually watch the movie, I think.

[indy4 155]

The thing that bugged me most about the duel is that there is that Obi-Wan's actions make little to no sense from the time he steps up from the ship. First off, the conversation with Anakin and Padme wasn't going well, but Obi-Wan's intrusion on the scene wasn't necessary, and he totally set it off by doing that. When Anakin screams loud enough for him to hear that Padme brought Obi-Wan to kill him? How about, "She didn't know I was on board, Anakin." Nope, no explanation.

At that point, I don't really think Anakin would've listened to strong logic. He was acting purely through emotion (as proved by the fact that he chokes Padme even though the main purpose of his turning was to protect her). I know the choking happens afterwards, but it still shows that by that time Anakin was nuts.

Anakin starts to choke her, and Obi-Wan says "Let her go" a few times. Great. Okay, so now the two buddies are together, and Obi-Wan has been faced with the knowledge of what Anakin's been doing. So naturally he's a little curious as to why he's doing this, right? Apparently not. Not ONCE does Obi-Wan try to get to the bottom of things. Nah, it's a better idea to talk about the government and throw in little jabs when you're talking to your unstable former best friend.

I think he knows all he needs to. He knows Anakin and Padme are together, he knows Anakin was frusterated with the Jedi Council, he knows Anakin was spending a great deal of time with Palpatine, who was earlier revealed to be the Sith Lord, he knows Anakin was still frusterated about his mother's death...

[Wojo 2,453]

When it was all said and done, Anakin's fall fom grace just wasn't a compelling story. There were no suprises.

Only a person who had never heard of Star Wars at all would have been suprised by the turn of events.

When a majority of the audience knows the outcome you have to have a strong story and make the audience care about the characters. Lucas failed.

I think the biggest surprise of all is how Anakin fell. Sure, he fell to the Dark Side for a number of really bad reasons. "I miss my mom / You guys are mean / Nobody likes me / You guys say I'm the best ever and you're holding me back / I'm a rebellious teenager and I need to rebel." But there was also a really good reason: he wanted to save the woman he loved from certain death. That's noble. But Anakin's sacrifice of his humanity to save Padme only accelerated her alienation, and ultimately caused her death anyways. I don't buy the "broken heart bit" one bit, not after seeing a pregnant woman be Force choked like that, then give birth to twins.

You, like the rest of the world, knew since 1983 that if ever a prequel trilogy were to manifest, it would be this: good guy Anakin Skywalker sires twins and becomes Darth Vader. That's all folks. Anything else along the way is merely icing on a cake or flies on a carcass, depending on your own point of view.

[Ollie 1,059]

I think the biggest surprise of all is how Anakin fell. Sure, he fell to the Dark Side for a number of really bad reasons. "I miss my mom / You guys are mean / Nobody likes me / You guys say I'm the best ever and you're holding me back / I'm a rebellious teenager and I need to rebel." But there was also a really good reason: he wanted to save the woman he loved from certain death. That's noble. But Anakin's sacrifice of his humanity to save Padme only accelerated her alienation, and ultimately caused her death anyways. I don't buy the "broken heart bit" one bit, not after seeing a pregnant woman be Force choked like that, then give birth to twins.

I don't buy it either especially since it was hard to believe they even loved each otherand there was no chemistry between them at all.

You, like the rest of the world, knew since 1983 that if ever a prequel trilogy were to manifest, it would be this: good guy Anakin Skywalker sires twins and becomes Darth Vader. That's all folks. Anything else along the way is merely icing on a cake or flies on a carcass, depending on your own point of view.

I also know how Tora Tora Tora and Apollo 13 end but I'll be damned if they aren't two very good films that blow the prequels away.

[Koray Savas 2,251]

I think the biggest surprise of all is how Anakin fell. Sure, he fell to the Dark Side for a number of really bad reasons. "I miss my mom / You guys are mean / Nobody likes me / You guys say I'm the best ever and you're holding me back / I'm a rebellious teenager and I need to rebel." But there was also a really good reason: he wanted to save the woman he loved from certain death. That's noble. But Anakin's sacrifice of his humanity to save Padme only accelerated her alienation, and ultimately caused her death anyways. I don't buy the "broken heart bit" one bit, not after seeing a pregnant woman be Force choked like that, then give birth to twins.

I don't buy it either especially since it was hard to believe they even loved each otherand there was no chemistry between them at all.

Lucas royally effed that relationship up. Between TPM and AOTC Anakin aged 10 years while Padme didn't.

[Trent B 337]

Hey, I'm just listening to AotC OS album. The music is reaaaaallly good... what is called "Ambush on Coruscant" (right after the Main Title). It's more enjoyable to just listen to the CD than actually watch the movie, I think.

To answer your question, the first part of the piece after the "Main Titles" on the OST for AOTC is from "Kamino Storm / Interview With Jango" from 1:39 to 2:10. Then 2:10 to the end is "Arrival At Kamino". Thanks to The Force Unleashed files it contains most (I would say 98%) of the real "Ambush On Coruscant" which is pretty cool music.

The unreleased music for AOTC has made the score a better listening experience. Hopefully one day we get a proper intended 2-CD set for AOTC and ROTS and TPM.

[Delorean90 42]

At that point, I don't really think Anakin would've listened to strong logic. He was acting purely through emotion (as proved by the fact that he chokes Padme even though the main purpose of his turning was to protect her). I know the choking happens afterwards, but it still shows that by that time Anakin was nuts.

Sure, we know that. But Obi-Wan doesn't know that. He doesn't know what Anakin's going to do. The point is that he doesn't really do much to try to help the situation. He pretty much acts incredulous, talks politics with Anakin, and then whips out his saber.

I think he knows all he needs to. He knows Anakin and Padme are together, he knows Anakin was frusterated with the Jedi Council, he knows Anakin was spending a great deal of time with Palpatine, who was earlier revealed to be the Sith Lord, he knows Anakin was still frusterated about his mother's death...

Really? From that he can deduce why the last time Obi-Wan saw him, Anakin was apologizing for his behavior, and then since he came back from Utapau, he discovers that Anakin's been murdering Jedi, including younglings? I don't think so. There's an important bit of missing information there: Obi-Wan doesn't know about Anakin's dreams, and he doesn't know that Palpatine offered to help him to save Padme. Sure, he knows there have been difficulties and frustrations, but he doesn't know WHY Anakin is doing this. And I know if I found out my best friend had suddenly killed a bunch of people, I'd want some real answers.

Again, the issue is that Obi-Wan doesn't seem to do much except come in to chew bubble gum and kick a$$. He doesn't ask questions, he doesn't try to figure anything out, he doesn't try to help, he just gives Anakin a verbal whooping, chops off his limbs and leaves him to burn (not entirely in that order, of course.). Where do you see Vader's line in ROTJ reflected in Obi-Wan's actions? I sure don't.

[Diego 21]

The murdering of "younglins" (is there something wrong with the word children?) also bothers me, shouldn't the Clones have done that and Anakin, being the chose one and so powerful and all, go after the fully trained Jedi?? Is there even a point about killing the children??

[Henry B 50]

It was just a way to cause a cheap emotional reaction in viewers. Oh no children how tragic!

[Nick Parker 3,040]

I think it was done to show "how far down the rabbit hole he went", if that makes sense.

EDIT: Well, that is one way to put it, Henry....

[Red 75]

It was just a way to cause a cheap emotional reaction in viewers. Oh no children how tragic!

Not only that it was horribly forced and abrupt. One minute he's shaking hands with Obi-Wan and the next he's murdering children. The character shift is not believable.

[Koray Savas 2,251]

Yeah, yeah the prequels suck. How many times are we gonna talk about it here? We know who loves them and we know who hates them.

[Datameister 2,042]

Now y'all are just grasping at straws. If the younglings hadn't made an appearance in the sequence after showing up several times in the prequels, you'd be complaining that the film shied away from the harsh reality of Order 66, and that it left the door open for lots of pre-adolescent Jedi escaping! The scene was included because Palpatine wanted every single Jedi exterminated, and they were Jedi. Was showing the deaths of numerous Jedi across the galaxy also an attempt at creating a cheap emotional reaction? Would it really have been better if the film had showed Palpatine issuing the order and then just cut to Obi-Wan escaping Utapau? EDIT: However, I agree that Anakin's conversion to the dark side was poorly executed, even though there were some surprisingly solid ideas in there. Wanting to save Padme from dying just like his mother did - that's actually a really good reason. But they didn't pull it off very well.

And I think Koray said it best.

[Ollie 1,059]

Actually killing kids was a gutsy and bold move, too bad it was set up poorly.

[Trent B 337]

Well not every single Jedi was exterminated during Order 66. According to the books a few Jedi managed to escape and hide but were eventually hunted through the years by Darth Vader. By the time the OT rolled around the only two true Jedi from the council that remained were Obi-Wan and Yoda.

I thought I read some where once that a group of clones trusted one of their Jedi Generals so much that they couldn't obey the Order 66 because he helped them survive through thick or skin, so the clones let him flee.

[John Crichton 4]

Yeah, yeah the prequels suck. How many times are we gonna talk about it here? We know who loves them and we know who hates them.

Actually it's nice to see them being discussed rationally now. Back when they first came out it the typical prequel "discussion" involved a whole bunch of name calling and little else.

[Henry B 50]

Now y'all are just grasping at straws. If the younglings hadn't made an appearance in the sequence after showing up several times in the prequels, you'd be complaining that the film shied away from the harsh reality of Order 66, and that it left the door open for lots of pre-adolescent Jedi escaping! The scene was included because Palpatine wanted every single Jedi exterminated, and they were Jedi. Was showing the deaths of numerous Jedi across the galaxy also an attempt at creating a cheap emotional reaction?

I'd say the younglings bit was a grab at the audience's heartstrings because other characters melodramatically referred to it three or four times. "I have seen a hologram of him ... *gasp* ... killing younglings!" Obi-Wan neglects to mention all the other Jedi. Also, I could have sworn there were adult Jedi in that hologram. Obi-Wan only find the children's bodies. But then, Anakin's fall to the dark side was so stupidly executed that I didn't really buy into his excessive sadism. Maybe if his fall had been gradual and more tied to the pursuit of power I would have really understood why he makes killing children such a priority.

[indy4 155]

At that point, I don't really think Anakin would've listened to strong logic. He was acting purely through emotion (as proved by the fact that he chokes Padme even though the main purpose of his turning was to protect her). I know the choking happens afterwards, but it still shows that by that time Anakin was nuts.

Sure, we know that. But Obi-Wan doesn't know that. He doesn't know what Anakin's going to do. The point is that he doesn't really do much to try to help the situation. He pretty much acts incredulous, talks politics with Anakin, and then whips out his saber.

He knows that Anakin is strangling his lover, so I think he knows that he's acting purely impulsive. I do see what you're saying though, you've opened my eyes to flaws I hadn't even noticed. It is far from a flawless scene, but I don't think there's any plot holes that can't be bridged with a little plot extension, however weak it may be.

I think he knows all he needs to. He knows Anakin and Padme are together, he knows Anakin was frusterated with the Jedi Council, he knows Anakin was spending a great deal of time with Palpatine, who was earlier revealed to be the Sith Lord, he knows Anakin was still frusterated about his mother's death...

Really? From that he can deduce why the last time Obi-Wan saw him, Anakin was apologizing for his behavior, and then since he came back from Utapau, he discovers that Anakin's been murdering Jedi, including younglings? I don't think so. There's an important bit of missing information there: Obi-Wan doesn't know about Anakin's dreams, and he doesn't know that Palpatine offered to help him to save Padme. Sure, he knows there have been difficulties and frustrations, but he doesn't know WHY Anakin is doing this. And I know if I found out my best friend had suddenly killed a bunch of people, I'd want some real answers.

Again, the issue is that Obi-Wan doesn't seem to do much except come in to chew bubble gum and kick a$$. He doesn't ask questions, he doesn't try to figure anything out, he doesn't try to help, he just gives Anakin a verbal whooping, chops off his limbs and leaves him to burn (not entirely in that order, of course.). Where do you see Vader's line in ROTJ reflected in Obi-Wan's actions? I sure don't.

I think at this point Obi is realizing that 1. Anakin isn't thinking straight, and impulsive thinking means one doesn't always need a logical motive to do something crazy, 2. he had reasons to be angry, in general and specifically with the council and 3. he had been spending plenty of time with a Sith Lord, so it's just assumed that Palpatine turned him.

Again, it is a very weak link, and I agree that the scene doesn't make complete sense. It would make more sense for Obi-Wan, being both a close friend of Anakin and a man who seems to prefer reasoning over violence, to try to reason with Anakin, try to turn him back. But I don't think the scene we got is entirely unbelievable.

[Datameister 2,042]

Fair enough, Henry...the mentions of it were excessive, and not very well executed. But the scene itself was not, if you ask me. And there was something unnervingly sincere about the way the little kid jumps slightly when Anakin turns his saber on. (The same could not be said of the delivery of his lines, but at that age, it's no huge surprise.)

[Henry B 50]

Fair enough, Henry...the mentions of it were excessive, and not very well executed. But the scene itself was not, if you ask me. And there was something unnervingly sincere about the way the little kid jumps slightly when Anakin turns his saber on. (The same could not be said of the delivery of his lines, but at that age, it's no huge surprise.)

Hmm, I've never noticed that jump. It's certainly not a cardinal rule of mine that every single moment in the prequels is poorly acted.

[Red 75]

Actually killing kids was a gutsy and bold move, too bad it was set up poorly.

It probably could have been effective, but still it comes off to me as Lucas just trying to shock.

It's almost humorous that Lucas couldn't pull off Anakin's conversion to the dark side in three whole movies. I mean gee whiz, Christopher Nolan did it in one with Harvey Dent.