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Gerhardt's Classic Film Scores series re-released


TownerFan

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We need details! Are they remastered? Are they the long releases or the shorter versions from the Dolby Surround release series? Do they come with the original liner notes? Are they actual pressed CDs (the series was available on CDR as an on-demand service).

If this is done well, it's outstanding news. I'm still missing several of these, and the series is without a doubt a milestone in film score history.

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These are great news indeed, but it took me quite a while and effort to get all of these cd's, just to seem them re-released just a few months later :music:

But they are great news nonetheless, these cd's must stay in print. Everyone who says they don't like Golden Age film music will surely change their mind after listening to these cds.

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This appeared today on Amazon:

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Great news, imho. Let's hope they got rid of that pesky Dolby Surround codec that plagued the previous RCA Victor releases.

Does it make a difference if you're just listening in stereo?

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The Dolby encoding wasn't done properly and it drains quite a bit of dynamics to the overall sound. If you listen to the old LPs, you can get the difference.

These recordings were spectacularly engineered by the great Kenneth Wilkinson (a longtime engineer of many classic Decca recordings of the 60s and the 70s) and they still sound amazing even by modern-day standards.

If you want a good summation of the whole Classic Film Scores series, take a read at this:

http://www.classicalcdreview.com/cfs.htm

Oh, I just found a link about the new releases on B&N: Here.

The covers don't look fancy, but don't be fooled by that. And it appears that they're quite cheap ($9.99 each).

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The Dolby encoding wasn't done properly and it drains quite a bit of dynamics to the overall sound. If you listen to the old LPs, you can get the difference.

These recordings were spectacularly engineered by the great Kenneth Wilkinson (a longtime engineer of many classic Decca recordings of the 60s and the 70s) and they still sound amazing even by modern-day standards.

I don't think this is relevant in these iPod and earbud times, Maurizio. I mean, people today think they are manic audiophiles because they bought a PC speaker set.

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Too bad the Waxman is not included. I wish I had the expanded version

I guess the other group of titles (Waxman, Rozsa, Steiner, Korngold Vol.2, Bette Davis, Star Wars/CE3K) will be released in the near future.

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The Dolby encoding wasn't done properly and it drains quite a bit of dynamics to the overall sound. If you listen to the old LPs, you can get the difference.

I've never compared them (I don't even think I have one of the original releases), but even with the supposedly inferior Dolby Surround mix, most of these sound stunning. The sound on the Herrmann disc is just awesome.

Too bad the Waxman is not included. I wish I had the expanded version

We still need track listings to confirm whether these are the full versions or the shortened ones.

Also, I consider it a missed opportunity that they're not releasing these (optionally) as a complete box set. Provided that the sound is good and it's the long versions, I'd definitely buy that, even though I have several of the old releases.

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  • 1 month later...

So they're out now. Here's a review of the first album from Film Score Click Track.

Apparently, it's the shorter versions (or at least this album is), in non-Dolby-muddled sound. Which made me realise something: So far, I was under the impression that originally, they first released the longer versions of these albums and then later shortened them for the Dolby Surround re-releases. Which in hindsight doesn't really make sense, since the shorter versions are LP length, and the actual original releases obviously hail from the LP era.

So there must have been (at least) three releases so far:

1) Original LP releases, roughly 45 minutes long

2) Original CD releases, about one hour long

3) CD re-issues, LP length, with Dolby Surround sound

To complicate things further, the now re-released shorter version of the first Korngold album includes the Captain Blood main title, which is NOT on the longer release. According to SoundtrackCollector, the shorter version is 49 minutes long and contains 12 tracks, whereas the longer version runs 20 minutes longer, but only has 10 tracks.

Comparing the track lists makes things even more confusing. The longer version drops The Adventures of Robin Hood, Juarez and Captain Blood, but adds The Sea Wolf and extends The Sea Hawk by 8.5 minutes, Of Human Bondage by 8 minutes, and Anthony Adverse and Betwee Two Worlds by two minutes each.

I've heard the longer version once or twice (never having found a physical CD, all I have is a download) and recall that Sea Hawk includes a lot of material which is also on the Errol Flynn compilation (also newly re-relased now). I don't know if it's the same recording or a separate one, though.

So what I'm now wondering is: Ignoring sound issues, is one of these two versions "better", or do they both have flaws? In other words, where does the additional material on the longer version come from - is it material also available on other discs in the series? Also, I know there's at least one more album in the series that was available in two versions, the Waxman disc. What's the deal there?

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  • 4 months later...

I've been wondering. Haven't found any track listings yet.

Also, I still don't fully understand the release history of these series, and the associated varying lengths of some of the programmes.

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  • 9 years later...

I just purchased the 12-CD box, I was looking at it for some years now!!!

 

Below, this 1978 compilation seems an essential companion to the boxset (I bought it some times ago on CD), as it features at least a cue "The Thing (From Another World): Suite (Tiomkin)" not present on any other Gerhardt album, except on this compilation.

 

The original covers says clearly that it "Contains 6 Previously Unreleased Selections")

 

LP Cover 

R-4773259-1518668318-7344.jpeg.jpg

 

CD cover

R-10262933-1494312960-1756.jpeg.jpg

 

https://www.discogs.com/Charles-Gerhardt-National-Philharmonic-Orchestra-Spectacular-World-Of-Classic-Film-Scores/release/10262933

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Interestingly enough some of the exclusive cues from this set have made it as Encore selections in the Vocallion Dutton SACD/CD pressings. 

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  • 2 years later...

So… thinking about taking the plunge. How important do you think the liner notes are in appreciating this music, for which I’ve not seen most of the films?

 

I am weighing the convenience of the box set against the information supplementing the individual releases (which would be a bit of a pain to track down).

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They are pretty densly written essays. I only read them a few times. The music is the real treasure. You can probably find the scanned copies online at musicbrain.com

 

But the Vocallion Dutton label which issued the multi channel SACD/CD has retained the original notes but only 7 albums have been issued to date.

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9 hours ago, Amer said:

But the Vocallion Dutton label which issued the multi channel SACD/CD has retained the original notes but only 7 albums have been issued to date.

 Ooh yeah those look pretty nice.  Thank you.  Those look like the way to go, assuming they continue and release them all.  If I'm going to do this, I want to give the music the best chance it has of hooking me.  Blank cardboard sleeves with no artwork leaves too much to the imagination.  I really need context to appreciate it, since I've not seen most of these films.

 

I'm torn though, because the budget price of the box set is attractive.

 

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I'm interested in the Dutton Vocalion releases, especially SW/CE3K, because that wasn't included in the previous series of remasters. But they seem to be hard to get in mainland Europe? At least that one is only available as an import on Amazon, and not at all on JPC.

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34 minutes ago, Marian Schedenig said:

I'm interested in the Dutton Vocalion releases, especially SW/CE3K, because that wasn't included in the previous series of remasters. But they seem to be hard to get in mainland Europe? At least that one is only available as an import on Amazon, and not at all on JPC.

 

you mean this? https://www.jpc.de/jpcng/poprock/detail/-/art/national-philharmonic-orchestra-star-wars-close-encounters-of-the-third-kind/hnum/11129694

 

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7 hours ago, Gurkensalat said:

 

D'oh. Last time I checked, they didn't have it. And now I just missed the free shipping weekend…

 

PS: I guess searching for strings like "Gerhardt", "Williams", "Classic Film Scores", and "Star Wars" was just the wrong approach, because only the last one even appears in the title and tags (and for SW you get so many results that it didn't even show up on the results page.

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In any case, I think, you can skip the Tiomkin album. It is my least favourites of them.

For the Waxman album, for almost all the scores teasered there good complete re-recordings exist, which I prefer. That is why I also don't listen too often to that one.

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25 minutes ago, Jurassic Shark said:

You're such a completist. ;)

You got me. :sarcasm:

 

27 minutes ago, Jurassic Shark said:

The Bad and the Beautiful 

That album and the Herrmann album are probably the best.

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14 hours ago, Andy said:

So if I were to pick, say 2 or 3 to start with, which ones would you recommend?

 

IMG_7459.jpeg

I'd have to add to the recommendations for the Herrmann and Waxman albums which are both exemplary, but also offer a good mix of well known (Citizen Kane - but not Herrmann's own Welles Raises Kane suite, Gerhardt's represents the score much better with more of the moodier material) but also less well known (White Witch Doctor) selections. Not gonna lie, the Herrmann one makes me hanker for a new recording of Beneath the 12-Mile Reef as the 10 minutes here are superb and the original recording just doesn't do it justice. I would also recommend either of the Korngold ones, although The Sea Hawk collection is the one that gets the most play, although of the above, the Captain Blood album is terrific and features the longer suite from The Sea Hawk than the titular Korngold only collection.

 

It makes me wonder what Gerhardt might have put on a more general John Williams collection. His three Star Wars albums are great (although not perhaps as good as his golden age ones - indeed my favourite from those is the CE3K suite which is far more interesting and longer than JW's own concert suite). If we assume it would have been in the late 70s/early 80s with no Star Wars, I expect maybe a suite from Jaws, Dracula, the Reivers  and Jane Eyre(Gerhardt included a 5 minute suite of the former on The Prince and the Pauper compilation, albeit only the 2 minute Ride to Thornfield from the latter) maybe a different suite from the Cowboys (i.e. not the Overture)... maybe the theme from Lost in Space, which really could use a good new recording!

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14 hours ago, Andy said:

So if I were to pick, say 2 or 3 to start with, which ones would you recommend?

 

  • Captain Blood (various composers)
  • The Sea Hawk (Korngold)
  • Sunset Boulevard (Waxman)
  • Citizen Kane (Herrmann)
  • Star Wars/CE3K (Williams)

 

These are all essential.

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The Waxman album is my favourite of the whole series. Sunset Blvd, Taras Bulba and specially The Bride of Frankenstein have never sounded better 

3 minutes ago, Marian Schedenig said:

 

  • Captain Blood (various composers)
  • The Sea Hawk (Korngold)
  • Sunset Boulevard (Waxman)
  • Citizen Kane (Herrmann)
  • Star Wars/CE3K (Williams)

 

These are all essential.

 

Absolutely agree with this top 5.

 

The Rózsa is a weird one, for as good as it is, I don't really think it covers the composer's best stuff.

 

I also have a soft sport for the Newman

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3 hours ago, Marian Schedenig said:

 

And yet A Place in the Sun is the clear highlight of that album!

 

 

 

The Bride of Frankenstein still takes the crown to me, but I agree, that performance has never been bettered. Not even by Williams. Prince Valliant is also terrific.

 

I simply adore the suite from The Robe on the Newman album

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1 minute ago, Romão said:

The Bride of Frankenstein still takes the crown to me, but I agree, that performance has never been bettered. Not even by Williams. Prince Valliant is also terrific.

 

I simply adore the suite from The Robe on the Newman album

 

I think I prefer the Prince Valiant suite to the full score, but for The Robe, it's the other way round.

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Just now, Marian Schedenig said:

 

I think I prefer the Prince Valiant suite to the full score, but for The Robe, it's the other way round.

 

Totally agree. But I discovered The Robe through this suite, so it deserves kudos for opening my ears to a really great score

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3 hours ago, John Chambers said:


Couldn’t agree more but I think Mike M did a phenomenal job on the original recording considering it’s age and I listen to and thoroughly enjoy the Kritzerland release regularly. It’s one of my very favourite underwater scores and certainly in my top 10 Herrmann.

 

But to me no composer benefits more from a great sounding re-recording than Herrmann to really revel in the detail of those orchestrations and my top 2 wished for Herrmann re-recordings are ‘Beneath the 12 Mile Reef’ and ‘Journey to the centre of the Earth’. But if they never come I’ll always be grateful for the Gerhardt ‘reef’ suite and the Herrmann conducted ‘Journey’ suite on Phase IV and the fact that such a great job has been done by Mike M on both original recordings.

Also couldn't agree more than the original recording sounds pretty great all things considered, but guess there are always limits. However, also agree that Herrmann benefits greatly from re-recordings, you can hear so much more of his unusual orchestral textures - particularly the bass instruments, bassoons and so forth, which are more easily lost in older recordings. Guess that applies equally to 12-Mile Reef as it does to Centre of the Earth. Having said that, my main gripe with the latter are the interpolated songs, which could hopefully be artfully taken out in a new recording (not sure how integrated they in the original written score).

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