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Star Wars Prequel Music Resource (part 2)


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So too is the droid motif from TESB, which was largely excised from the film, and while the droids were in all six films, that set of notes was in one.

It's quoted in ROTJ once, during the battle of endor when r2 gets shortcircuited, i think.

That's so great about ROTJ. The only theme not used was Imperial motif, and that's just because it was completely replaced by the march.

Nope, 'fraid not.

Shame, it's an awesome little motif.

well at least You have Departure of boba fett in Arrival to kamino.

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I think the finished version works better, for two reasons. One, its more focused. Lucas mercilessly threw out material partaining to the establishment of the rebellion, the resolution of the mystery

Almost seems like it was made to fit with the fanfare bit of Flag Parade to me

I found something rather interesting. Not really important at all, but interesting. I've been going through my rip of Jedi: Fallen Order (I've only examined a handful of files thus far). There appears

So too is the droid motif from TESB, which was largely excised from the film, and while the droids were in all six films, that set of notes was in one.

It's quoted in ROTJ once, during the battle of endor when r2 gets shortcircuited, i think.

I don't think it's the same.

But don't forget he wrote a new motif for the Droids at the beginning of Jedi that was never used again. Given the way Williams scored AOTC, I can't see Fett's motif working within the music.

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So too is the droid motif from TESB, which was largely excised from the film, and while the droids were in all six films, that set of notes was in one.

It's quoted in ROTJ once, during the battle of endor when r2 gets shortcircuited, i think.

I don't think it's the same.

But don't forget he wrote a new motif for the Droids at the beginning of Jedi that was never used again. Given the way Williams scored AOTC, I can't see Fett's motif working within the music.

Yes it is. Battle of Endor I 6:12-6:18

Maybe the scene is not the one i mentioned.

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But don't forget he wrote a new motif for the Droids at the beginning of Jedi that was never used again.

Actually, it occured to me recently that it sounds like a hinting variation of Jabba's theme rather than a motif for the droids. It would make sense given that they are going to Jabba's palace.

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By the way the very clean ending of "The Conveyor Belt" as I stated earlier is from file music_CSDQ_FUM01 from PC rip of TFU 1. Those string notes were covered up in Battlefront 2. ggtuck the cue name that covered up that ending is actually "The Commerce Guild Prepares For War".

The pc rip of tfu which i have does not have that file?

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Hey that's a pretty good video, the edited video fits the music fairly well!

However, the edited music is not quite right:

You're missing all the material from Bounty Hunter files 038 and 016 - additional string stuff followed by the trumpet blasts, which the game makers tracked drums over - and then of course all the music after that that hasn'e leaked to a video game yet

And the crunching part at the end matches the OST edit/looping.

Also, all the footage of R2 and 3P0 in that scene was added long after Williams scored a cut of the film, I believe. At least the stuff with 3P0 becoming a battle droid was

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Yup, aside from the frenzied strings at the end of Finding the Conveyor Belt, there is also measures missing at the latter half of the Conveyor Belt itself (one such measure can be found in the Across the Stars single, or in the games, but it's in better quality from the single). I might see about re-editing my first Conveyor Belt video to show you what I mean.

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Personally, I hope they include tracked music into the scores, but ONLY in the includes where it was pre-planned to be tracked.

With the 'On the Conveyor Belt' cue -- was the music composed for that scene before or after the ridiculously stupid C3PO head nonsense made it clear that this movie had absolutely no redeemability?

Andy

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Most of us don't like the tracked music, the edits are absolutely horrible. The edits are generally covered up by sound effects in the film so you don't hear the edits.

If they do release the intended editions I really doubt they'll include the tracked music for AOTC and ROTS.

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I've been thinking the same thing. It feels like droid music, but melodically, it's related to Jabba's theme. Pretty cool.

As is 'The little peple work' there is some horn writting there that seems that the jabas concert vesion is going to appear.

And really it's also the droid's music in Star Wars.

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Personally, I hope they include tracked music into the scores, but ONLY in the includes where it was pre-planned to be tracked.

With the 'On the Conveyor Belt' cue -- was the music composed for that scene before or after the ridiculously stupid C3PO head nonsense made it clear that this movie had absolutely no redeemability?

Andy

It was composed before the C3PO getting his head and body switched.

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But Williams scored numerous scenes featuring heavy CGI...it seems like the cut he scored would have included the animatics wherever possible. The DVD mentions that the entire scene was conceived and shot very late - well after principal photography had wrapped - but it doesn't mention anything about the 3PO subplot specifically.

In any case, I don't think the substantial editing of the music for that whole sequence was a result of editorial changes. They could have kept the cues Williams wrote and used a little looping and some minor tracking to fill in the gaps, but instead, they replaced most of the material, and not with music that sounds similar. I think they just honestly didn't think "The Conveyor Belt" (and, in some cases, "Finding the Conveyor Belt") fit the film very well. It's very robotic, mechanical music, at least until the passages near the end, which makes it great for evoking the factory itself but not so great for trying to create drama with the characters. They tracked in the love theme, Yoda's theme, the more straightforwardly perilous music from "Zam Chase Pt. 1"...they wouldn't have done all this just because the original cue no longer quite fit the timing of the final cut. They would have made those changes with or without the 3PO subplot, IMO.

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I know for sure that at least part of the Threepio comic-relief was already there before Williams scored the picture. A friend of mine worked for LFL Licensing back then and he was invited in July 2001 to see a rough cut of the film together with all the LFL licensers. He told me that part of those comic scenes were already there (albeit in rough animation).

Williams saw the rough cut in Sept/Oct 2001, so it's not something that was added after that. I guess it's more like the scene had a different structure and substantial different pace, hence all the tracking/looping in the final mix.

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I think they just honestly didn't think "The Conveyor Belt" (and, in some cases, "Finding the Conveyor Belt") fit the film very well. It's very robotic, mechanical music, at least until the passages near the end, which makes it great for evoking the factory itself but not so great for trying to create drama with the characters.

Williams had sense. He know that shtick would be a lost cause.

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Yes and no...I mean, generally speaking, his music for the prequels elevates the films by creating emotions that truly are not otherwise present. Is it enough for the characters to pass off as believable human beings? No. But it's a step in that direction, and the resulting music can be wonderful. But that's not where his priorities were for the droid factory sequence, and I guess Lucas or Burtt or whoever disagreed with his approach. "The Conveyor Belt" is particularly wonky in the beginning. It's delightful on its own, but I'm not sure it would have done the film any favors.

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No, I no know what you mean.

It's kind of the scenario where Scott and Rawlings gradually replaced a lot of Goldsmith's score with the stuff from Freud - particularly with the death of Dallas.

Both Charcot's Show/Desperate Case and The Shaft were atonal in construction, but there was a crucial difference. While the later was cold, objective, dispassionate and almost playful (with the offbeat steel drum rhythms, serpent growls, harmon muted trombone squarks, and tuba farts) - pretty much interpreting the sequence from Ash's perspective.

Scott/Rawlings on the hand, wanted us to sympathise with 'our' (the audience's) character - Lambert, who's distraught, considering both herself and Ripley have been pining for Dallas. The Freud music, which is highly expressionist, subjective and emotive - served that intention better.

Both are scary for sure, but one is more personal.

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Yes and no...I mean, generally speaking, his music for the prequels elevates the films by creating emotions that truly are not otherwise present. Is it enough for the characters to pass off as believable human beings? No. But it's a step in that direction, and the resulting music can be wonderful. But that's not where his priorities were for the droid factory sequence, and I guess Lucas or Burtt or whoever disagreed with his approach. "The Conveyor Belt" is particularly wonky in the beginning. It's delightful on its own, but I'm not sure it would have done the film any favors.

In the AOTC DVD commentary track, Burtt states that both the Zam Chase sequence and the conveyor belt sequence were temp-tracked with a percussion-only cue specially created by Burtt himself. He and Lucas wanted a purely rhythmic approach for these scenes, giving the music a purely unobtrusive role. It's clear Williams saw things a bit differently and then went on composing the music he felt best for those sequences, following their indications without renouncing to be deeply musical (i.e. composing a piece of real music that enhances drama/pace/emotional involvement).

I guess Lucas and Burtt didn't like what JW wrote for those scenes (on the DVD commentary track Burtt even states that Williams' cue for the Zam Chase is too heavy and chaotic), so they completely re-edited and conformed those pieces to suit them with what they had originally in mind.

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I'm afraid I'm not familiar with your example, but it certainly sounds like a similar situation. :D

You're familiar with Alien? :tumbleweed:

In the AOTC DVD commentary track, Burtt states that both the Zam Chase sequence and the conveyor belt sequence were temp-tracked with a percussion-only cue specially created by Burtt himself. He and Lucas wanted a purely rhythmic approach for these scenes, giving the music a purely unobtrusive role. It's clear Williams saw things a bit differently and then went on composing the music he felt best for those sequences, following their indications without renouncing to be deeply musical (i.e. composing a piece of real music that enhances drama/pace/emotional involvement).

I guess Lucas and Burtt didn't like what JW wrote for those scenes (on the DVD commentary track Burtt even states that Williams' cue for the Zam Chase is too heavy and chaotic), so they completely re-edited and conformed those pieces to suit them with what they had originally in mind.

God I hate how much control Burt got overseeing the music in the prequels. Mini-dictator he is.

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Well i don't think the Zam Chase was edited all too much. So Lucas must have liked it enough to overrule Burtt and keep it almost completely in the film.

There's a lot of editing in the final mix. Almost all of the Asian-influenced percussion stuff was totally excised (which is quite ironic if you think that the original request was to compose a percussion-heavy piece!) and there's the usual butchering of several bars here and there, mostly due to editing changes made after the scoring sessions.

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Yeah, it's cool. I understand that it inappropriately calls to mind a very different genre of music, but in purely aesthetic terms, what's wrong with it? I think there are a lot of crazy things in that piece, and the guitar is just one of many.

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I think at first hearing I was like "what the hell!!" But after seeing the scene I see how it would have been cool...confused why it was removed though.

Mr. Lucas made one of his few wise decisions and removed it. ;)

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Hell if Burt had his way there would be no music in the Prequels.

I was told that at one point Burt made the argument that Star Trek (2009) could have survived with out music. In fact Abrams stepped in told Burt that he wanted the music in there and restored a good portion of Giacchino's score. The part where the Enterprise was firing on the Narada when she was being pulled into the black hole. Supposedly Burt wanted to have NO music in that sequence. I'm glad Abrams went back and changed that adding music in the right spots.

Ben Burt is a great sound designer, that much is certain. However, he is a very lousy person on trying to have a say so on where music goes in scenes. He should not be allowed any where near the mixing of the sound effects, dialogue and score after he does the sound effects work for films.

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I could never hate Burtt - as you said, Trent, his sound design work is fantastic. But based on the information available to us...yeah, his influence on the music is not always a good thing. Of course, sometimes lack of music is a powerful thing, and sometimes tracked music does fit the film better than what was originally written, but still.

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Yeah, I can see both sides. Composers getting annoyed because their music is being covered up by sfx and sound designers getting annoyed because their work is being covered with music LOL.

Back to star wars, I am curious. With the rots PDFs that people apparently have, is there any evidence for there being an unused cue written for DVader marching into the temple with the clones? It always bugs the crap out of me to hear that tracked arena music in that scene.

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