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Harry Potter And The Deathly Hallows Part 1 by Alexandre Desplat


Josh500
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Guys, guys... Take it easy. Like with all things, some people love it, some people hate it and some don't care. Don't be bothered with those who hate the things you love, we all have different opinions.

Look, I'm annoyed with people who say modern JW scores are uninteresting and don't have that same spark he used to have. I say nonsense. I think he's better now than he was before. But some people think the other way around, and that's perfect. I respect their opinion and I even understand why they prefer "old" Williams to the "modern" one. It's mostly a generation thing, or what style you heard first. For example, if you heard Williams post-1993 output first, you'll probably enjoy this approach more. But if you were captivated with the music of your first viewing of Star Wars in 1977, you'll probably enjoy his pre-1993 more and complain all day that he uses too many notes nowadays.

And you know what? I love both Williams approaches, it's just that I prefer one to the other. But does that make the other far less better? Of course not! And as I said, it's subjetive to your age and taste.

The bottom line is: If someone shouts you on the street "Desplat sucks!" and you disagree, just keep walking.

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Sf1, honestly how dare you charge Bluenenkohl with statements like his his viewpoint is "untrue". He can observe anything he darn well wants. Based on his posts on thus forum he's not an unintelligent inarticulate boob, as much as you want to suggest insomany words .

I honestly wish there is an "ignore" feature on this forum because Im honestly getting tired of your vacuous overly biased rhetoric.

How weak as a response from you Fiery. Because others have arguments you don't like (you even ignore some of them) you start insulting with bullshit, posting untrue accusations (such as that i only post what i dont like about this score which i have proven you to be wrong - you didnt even respond) and now you wish to put people with another opinion on ignore?

What a weak weak way to discuss. Start respecting other peoples opinions, i also respect Blumenkohl i just cant take his post there serious...

If in my opinion things Blumenkohl said are untrue just accept it, that's life - opinions differ. And for me it is untrue that John Williams couldnt do better than Desplat because he has done better countless of times and it is in my opinion also untrue that this Desplat score is the most consistently good score... why are there people getting bored in half of the tracks then? why are there people dissapointed with this score then?

In the case of HP1 and PoA this isnt the case...

But well just ignore all the people with a different opinion, especially on a message board discussions will get much more pleasant for you then Fiery. :)

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King Mark, brush up on reading comprehension.

Fiery, there is an ignore feature, I love it!

Data and the rest who understand what I meant by a more consistent listening experience, I salute you.

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HP1 bores me to death.

I love Azkaban but my attention wanes in the latter half of the album.

I acknowledge both as good scores.

I love Desplat's score but I find that it sometimes tends to drag. I acknowledge it ad a good score.

Thats my take on it all.

No need to double post - The Mod Staff.

:)

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I'll be appearing in a national radio program with Desplat (via telephone) on Friday, a half-hour special on the HARRY POTTER scores. Should be fun!

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Nobody Expects The Spanish Inquisition!!!!

____________________________________________________________________________________________

Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisition!!

No need to double post - Your Friendly Neighborhood Smartass.

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You can say that again.

Mark "NFL" O has now rendered this joke meaningless. I still appreciate Taiko's rolling gif.

I was having some fun in a thread that has left its intended tracks pages ago.

Nobody Expects The Spanish Inquisition!!!!

____________________________________________________________________________________________

Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisition!!

No need to double post - Your Friendly Neighborhood Smartass.

You do realize that's my signature?

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Mark "NFL" O has now rendered this joke meaningless. I still appreciate Taiko's rolling gif.

I was having some fun in a thread that has left its intended tracks pages ago.

Then the N means Nuestro.

You do realize that's my signature?

Of course. Getting it to look similar was a challenge.

Humor. It is a difficult concept

...which the track "Detonators" captures quite well!

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Maybe someone can abduct Williams like Randy Quaid did with Chey Chase's boss in CHRISTMAS VACATION. He is not let go before writing alternate scores for HP 7 - then we can finally close this embarrasing MB chapter.

Woah, wait a second there!

It's embarassing?

Are you sure you came to the right place?

If you think discussing on a JOHN WILLIAMS board whether or whether not JOHN WILLIAMS could or should score the finale to a franchise that he started (and had a good deal to do with its success) is emabrassing, and if you expect no discussion about whether or whether not JOHN WILLIAMS could have done better in said score, in a thread about said score that another composer wrote, then, pardon me, you should look for another place to hang around.

Some people talk off their high horse, having contributed nothing worthwhile to this discussion.

Someone like Koray should hold back with throwing around words like "credibility" with a record of statements like "Inception sounds nothing like Zimmer has done before and "GoldenEye is my favourite James Bond score".

For once I agree with king mark, there are inherent intricacies in a JW score, bold or quiet, that someone like Desplat isn't capable of matching. That may be neither good nor bad, but you should at least *acknowledge* it.

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You do realize that's my signature?

Of course. Getting it to look similar was a challenge.

Font: Ariel Black, Color: Green, Size: 5.

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Sf1, honestly how dare you charge Bluenenkohl with statements like his his viewpoint is "untrue". He can observe anything he darn well wants. Based on his posts on thus forum he's not an unintelligent inarticulate boob, as much as you want to suggest insomany words .

I honestly wish there is an "ignore" feature on this forum because Im honestly getting tired of your vacuous overly biased rhetoric.

How weak as a response from you Fiery. Because others have arguments you don't like (you even ignore some of them) you start insulting with bullshit, posting untrue accusations (such as that i only post what i dont like about this score which i have proven you to be wrong - you didnt even respond) and now you wish to put people with another opinion on ignore?

What a weak weak way to discuss. Start respecting other peoples opinions, i also respect Blumenkohl i just cant take his post there serious...

If in my opinion things Blumenkohl said are untrue just accept it, that's life - opinions differ. And for me it is untrue that John Williams couldnt do better than Desplat because he has done better countless of times and it is in my opinion also untrue that this Desplat score is the most consistently good score... why are there people getting bored in half of the tracks then? why are there people dissapointed with this score then?

In the case of HP1 and PoA this isnt the case...

But well just ignore all the people with a different opinion, especially on a message board discussions will get much more pleasant for you then Fiery. ;)

In response to your earlier comment about me: Yes. I can and do post without insulting people. I've been posting here for 4 years and am probably in the Top 5 by now. I think you've posted the most in these past 2 weeks about Desplat than you have since you first joined. Your arguments need major revision, because you use unsupported "facts." You start fine with an opinion that Williams could have done a better job, but then you go off saying everyone is bored by the album and everyone is disappointed. How are these supportive facts that prove Desplat is worse? They are opinions, and certainly not everyone holds them. It is very much the case that people are bored by Sorcerer's Stone and Prisoner Of Azkaban. I personally don't like Sorcerer's Stone.

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In response to your earlier comment about me: Yes. I can and do post without insulting people. I've been posting here for 4 years and am probably in the Top 5 by now. I think you've posted the most in these past 2 weeks about Desplat than you have since you first joined. Your arguments need major revision, because you use unsupported "facts." You start fine with an opinion that Williams could have done a better job, but then you go off saying everyone is bored by the album and everyone is disappointed. How are these supportive facts that prove Desplat is worse? They are opinions, and certainly not everyone holds them. It is very much the case that people are bored by Sorcerer's Stone and Prisoner Of Azkaban. I personally don't like Sorcerer's Stone.

I never said everyone, that would be stupid because you and many others posting in this thread like it very much and even i like parts of it ;).

My exact sentence: why are there people getting bored in half of the tracks then? why are there people dissapointed with this score then?

I didnt know that there are people getting bored with HP1 and PoA and it is hard to understand this because they are in my view both masterpieces. I guess i just generalized here

I'm just dissapointed about the in my opinion blown opportunities of DHpart1 to be a much much better score than what we got. Additionally i only discuss with you that much about this matter because i cannot understand why you and the other Desplat lovers just don't acknowledge the blown opportunities and the weaker soundtrack he composed regarding continuity (old themes,etc...), memorability and thematic voice.

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Okay, thanks for clarifying. I also hope you realize that "blown opportunity" and "weaker soundtrack" are still opinions. I don't believe that a franchise, especially one like this, needs to be heavily grounded with recurring themes. I mean, after all, it's called Hedwig's Theme, not Harry's Theme. Is Deathly Hallows better than Prisoner Of Azkaban? Hell no. I'd probably rank it evenly with Hooper's Order Of The Phoenix, despite both having drastically different styles. Either way, just because something doesn't have a catchy theme doesn't automatically make it unmemorable. Michael Clayton is one of my favorite scores.

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I'm just dissapointed about the in my opinion blown opportunities of DHpart1 to be a much much better score than what we got. Additionally i only discuss with you that much about this matter because i cannot understand why you and the other Desplat lovers just don't acknowledge the blown opportunities and the weaker soundtrack he composed regarding continuity (old themes,etc...), memorability and thematic voice.

I think everyone has 'acknowledged' that the score doesn't conform to Williams' style of obvious themes and grand set pieces. Memorability and effectiveness as a score on the other hand, is up to individuals to decide.

What I've gathered from the grapevine is that alternate approaches were tried, incorporating Williams' themes much more, but the darker, more serious tone of the story (this isn't school any more) and that most of the story doesn't take place at Hogwarts required a different approach, and that using Hedwig's theme more for example, just didn't work. I don't believe that any continuity faults with this score lie with Desplat.

We'll never know what Williams would've given us, but what you're doing is taking the two factors - lack of themes/instant memorability, and the lack of Williams, and assuming that they're a direct consequence, without considering whether the storytelling was the dictator. Then on top of that, you wonder why no one shares your views on effectiveness as music. The latter is your problem.

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Very well articulated richuk. You said exactly what I've been trying to say. And I'll add that to some of us, we don't see HP7 by Desplat as a "blown opportunity"- this is a perception by some with a different lexicon than others.

And sf1, I don't mind different viewpoints at all. Mark Olivarez doesn't share the same enthusiasm for Desplat and we get along fine because neither one of us tries to convince the other by invalidating their personal preferences when it comes to music. I have also gained a lot of respect for Blunenkohl and Koray on this thread.

Anyhow I'm resigned to the fact that we just don't see eye to eye on this particular score or composer.

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My article on the HARRY POTTER scores is up, which is a precursor to tomorrow's radio show, which I mentioned earlier:

"The Harry Potter saga - uneven musical magic":

http://montages.no/2010/11/harry-potter-saga-med-ujevn-musikalsk-magi/

Use Google Translate to get the gist of it.

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Upon hearing what he's done, I'm very happy Desplat composed his own themes and did not go with Williams's.

Also, I'd like to repeat that I find most of them instantly memorable, too, in a literal way. Like I already said, after listening to the CD only twice, I was humming them. So that kind of puts the main criticism that they're not recognizable on shaky subjective ground.

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The other element of Desplat's style I really enjoy is his use of thematic & motivic imitation between instruments. Even if it's just an interval it helps to bind them usic together by giving that sense of structure. He also recaps his theme on Obliviate in later cues like "Polyjuice Potion". I'm also impressed with the adherence to Williams' style of non-metered writing. Meaning, Desplat's usual style has a very strong sense of time signature, whereas Williams varies his meter and tempi so much that it's often very "free" sounding and not metronomic in its feel. This is another area where I see Desplat respecting Williams by employing these non-metered feeling sections and tempo changes. I also hear much more ornamentation in the lines with more trills and mordants than is usual; in his music.

I'm not bringing this up as an attempt to convince those who don't like it- I think it's really cool to identify some of the aspects that I find particularly compelling and fun when listening to this score. It's probably tied with Powell's How to Train Your Dragon as my fave score of the year. ;)

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Upon hearing what he's done, I'm very happy Desplat composed his own themes and did not go with Williams's.

Also, I'd like to repeat that I find most of them instantly memorable, too, in a literal way. Like I already said, after listening to the CD only twice, I was humming them. So that kind of puts the main criticism that they're not recognizable on shaky subjective ground.

Likewise, many people find them not memorable at all, and that, by the same reasoning, puts the praise that they are instantly memorable, also on very shaky subjective ground.

By the way, I still don't get what Conrad Pope meant when he said that the emotional climax during Ron's leaving was conveyed by the voicing of a single chord. I hear that neither in the omitted, nor the movie version.

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I don't think Desplat's themes are "instantly memorable" but he does work them into almost all of the tracks in various obvious and not-so obvious guises that lends a sense of cohesion to his score. There are a couple tracks that seem more underscorish but most of them I find compelling melodically, harmonically or texturally in some way shape or form. I did find the last track a little bit anti-climactic though...very much "To be Continued..." sounding.

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Does anyone know where the three iTunes bonus tracks -- Voldemort, The Dumbledores, and Bellatrix -- fit into "score order" within the rest of the album? I just bought them.

I'm fairly sure that:

- Voldemort should go between Snape to Malfoy Manor and Polyjuice Potion

- The Dumbledores between The Will and Death Eaters

- Bellatrix between Captured and Tortured and Rescuing Hermione

I've seen the film for the third time tonight. With the above iTunes bonus tracks, it doesn't sound like there is much, if anything, significant missing from the score. The only major thing I noticed was that there is a percussion over-dub in the film during "The Elder Wand".

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Well, Desplat has shown us once more what a skillfull composer he is and how many musical colours he can blend seamlessly into eachother to create an exiting, uplifting web of modern orchestration.

This score is perfect for the film it was written for - it is subtle, not atall boring and I don't know - maybe I am just a musical genius but the Theme from "at Burrows" or "To Malfoy Manor" initially stuck in my head - after the first listening

Desplat was the best thing that could happen to the franchise.

Gkgyver has started the discussion by telling his opinion- which is fine, but slightly turned more and more into a classic MB-Troll - what amazes me, is that he keeps on whineing "This film deserved better... where are the themes... what a let down... meeeehhh"

To my ears these are the most ignorant and arrogant things to say. The people involved are professional filmmakers, highly creative and skilleful people - they know what they want to achieve and and they are actually able to do that. Who are you gkyver, to even think that you have the slightest idea what could work better

You make it sound like you know better then Desplat himself how to write a filmscore for a Hary Potter-film!

... now if that isn't arrogant, what is?

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MissPadmé, I think you're somewhat out of line for accusing someone of being arrogant for simply venting his disappointment in a piece of art - professional or not. He had high hopes for something - especially based on the Williams Potter scores and Desplat's own self-hyping - and they were obviously dashed. Who are YOU MissPadmé to even think someone cannot be allowed to be a vocal critic?

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And who are you to say anything?

Perhaps you should go back and read this thread because she's not the only one on either side of the argument to make controversial statements.

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Does anyone know where the three iTunes bonus tracks -- Voldemort, The Dumbledores, and Bellatrix -- fit into "score order" within the rest of the album? I just bought them.

I'm fairly sure that:

- Voldemort should go between Snape to Malfoy Manor and Polyjuice Potion

- The Dumbledores between The Will and Death Eaters

- Bellatrix between Captured and Tortured and Rescuing Hermione

I've seen the film for the third time tonight. With the above iTunes bonus tracks, it doesn't sound like there is much, if anything, significant missing from the score. The only major thing I noticed was that there is a percussion over-dub in the film during "The Elder Wand".

This sounds right to me; concerning the first two cues I'm certain.

I still haven't received the actual score CD - the mail room lady went on vacation :/

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Likewise, many people find them not memorable at all, and that, by the same reasoning, puts the praise that they are instantly memorable, also on very shaky subjective ground.

Certainly, except I don't base my praise of the score on the fact that they're instantly memorable.

- Voldemort should go between Snape to Malfoy Manor and Polyjuice Potion

- The Dumbledores between The Will and Death Eaters

- Bellatrix between Captured and Tortured and Rescuing Hermione

I've seen the film for the third time tonight. With the above iTunes bonus tracks, it doesn't sound like there is much, if anything, significant missing from the score. The only major thing I noticed was that there is a percussion over-dub in the film during "The Elder Wand".

Excellent, thanks. Good to hear that most music is on the album, and there are still three tracks to come. This is at least one score then we won't be seeking the recording sessions of the next twenty years.

Do you remember what music from the film remains unreleased?

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Well, Desplat has shown us once more what a skillfull composer he is and how many musical colours he can blend seamlessly into eachother to create an exiting, uplifting web of modern orchestration.

This score is perfect for the film it was written for - it is subtle, not atall boring and I don't know - maybe I am just a musical genius but the Theme from "at Burrows" or "To Malfoy Manor" initially stuck in my head - after the first listening

Desplat was the best thing that could happen to the franchise.

Gkgyver has started the discussion by telling his opinion- which is fine, but slightly turned more and more into a classic MB-Troll - what amazes me, is that he keeps on whineing "This film deserved better... where are the themes... what a let down... meeeehhh"

To my ears these are the most ignorant and arrogant things to say. The people involved are professional filmmakers, highly creative and skilleful people - they know what they want to achieve and and they are actually able to do that. Who are you gkyver, to even think that you have the slightest idea what could work better

You make it sound like you know better then Desplat himself how to write a filmscore for a Hary Potter-film!

... now if that isn't arrogant, what is?

Do you also defend Williams that much when he delivers something a lot of people consider sub par?

You don't have to be SOMEONE SPECIAL to have a better idea than someone else (even a skilled and respected composer). Look for example at Spielberg, one of the best directors on earth. He perfectly knows how to achieve something, is highly creative and skilled but he delivers sub par movies from time to time where the majority of the people would cut one thing out and the film would have been much better.

So in that cases the majority (ordinary people) would have had a better idea or approach than the great Steven Spielberg... (Example: the ridiculous ape and vine swinging scene in crystal skull...I'm sure 90 percent of the people would have told him that this is shit if he asked on the street... and pls don't blame it on Lucas... Spielberg was director and he could have cut it out)

Or do you honestly believe Desplat is such a genius that he is right all the time? That would be pretty naive as even the Nr.1 John Williams is wrong from time to time...

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The only thing to my ear the remains unreleased (but when i go see the film again will really listen to here if its tracked from a different part of the score) is the alternate version of 'Ron Leaves' which underscores the scene in the film. The OST has quite a lot of music not heard in the film:

- 'Snape to Malfoy Manor' - is longer than the version in the film

- 'Polyjuice Potion' has many sections that fill in what are unscored moments in the film

- the majority of 'At The Burrow' is missing in the finished film

- 'Harry and Ginny' has a lot more on the OST

- 'The Will' once again, contains more music than the film version of the score (including a version of Hedwig's Theme that does not appear in the film)

- 'Ron Leaves' very different cue the version in the final film

- 'Hermione's Parents' which also underscores the Silver Doe scene, again fills in a lot of unscored moments in the film, i guess to make a more cohesive listening experience

- 'Lovegood' not heard in the film at all

- 'Farewell to Dobby' is a little bit longer and goes through slightly more development than the film version

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I agree with Miss Padme on this. The fact is, we don't know all of the discussions and work process of the filmmakers and how they ended up with what they did. Obviously no filmmaker or artist goes into any venture thinking "I'm going to mess this up".

SF1, my continual problem with your posts is that, much as you vehemently deny it, your position is motivated by personal bias. Even when you're supposedly speaking "objectively", you're using adjectives that are based on subjective opinion assertions like "forgettable themes" or something to that effect ARE personal reactions- they aren't objective. Objective would be "Desplat uses an alternating string ostinato of a minor 3rd to major second as a basis to begin Obliviate. He then introduces the theme which modulates to a new key with the horns playing a suspended 4th chord as a means of changing the key center of the piece providing contrast to the previous sectional build. This is musical observations. It's as objective as saying 2+2=4.

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Yeah but come on David, almost every single criticism made on this board is motivated by personal bias.

How many hundreds of times have I read things here about Williams like, this piece is generic, written on autopilot, nothing but filler material, uninspired.

You get this here on an almost daily basis and any attempt at defending it is answered with the age old .....fanboy.

I don't think it would be unfair to say that even you have made those kind of comments based on personal reactions about the likes of Zimmer and co, many times over the years.

I couldn't care less to be honest but if SF1 is to be your target, it seems a little unfair when 99.9% of the posters here write exactly the same things.

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How many hundreds of times have I read things here about Williams like, this piece is generic, written on autopilot, nothing but filler material, uninspired. You get this here on an almost daily basis and any attempt at defending it is answered with the age old .....fanboy.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kHmvkRoEowc&feature=fvw

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Ultimately, and I agree with Dave up there, if one just admits that aesthetically they don't enjoy the score then it's fine. It's your personal opinion. But when you go saying that it's completely ineffective, bad writing, then that is something else. Desplat actually wrote REAL MUSIC here. If you don't enjoy it then that's fine, but that doesn't make it a "bad score".

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