La-La Land Announces Batman Returns (Complete)

[Jay 37,268]

Absolutely it does

[crocodile 7,978]

Has anybody listened to this one yet?

Karol

[Jay 37,268]

I'm about to start it up in a few minutes

[crocodile 7,978]

Let me know as soon as you finish, alright? I'm dying here.

Karol

[davros72 1]

I'm about to start it up in a few minutes

You got yours already? D'oh!

[TownerFan 4,983]

This is my favorite Danny Elfman score, folks. There is SO MUCH going on beneath the surface, and I'm so grateful I got the chance to write about it at length for La-La Land's new release. In my vast collection, there are few scores I get this enthusiastic about. Hearing it in its complete form for the first time, apart from the film and with deleted cues restored, was a revelatory experience for me ... as I hope it will be for you, too.

Wow... you're making me almost drooling I can't buy it now, but I hope I'll be able to afford it in the next months--if it doesn't sell out before!

Batman Returns is one of my all-time Elfman favourite too, only preceded by Edward Scissorhands and Nightmare Before Christmas. It shares several stylistic similarities with these scores and I like to think of them as a kind of musical tryptich.

I miss very much this Elfman style. Back then, he seemed really above and beyond almost every other film composer, with such a personal voice and a wonderful creative flow score after score. He of course matured a lot since then and he composed some very beautiful scores like A Simple Plan, Big Fish, Corpse Bride and Milk. But I miss this peculiar, unique voice.

[Andy 4,071]

I miss that voice too, Maurizio. I think Elfman's "vintage" sound was so unique and peculiar, he made a conscious effort to reinvent himself. These days, you either dig it or you don't. For a while there, his sound had a profound influence on pop culture in general. I can't count the number of Toys R Us Christmas sale television commercials that were scored to sound like Edward Scissorhands.

[Ollie 1,059]

I agree.

[crocodile 7,978]

I love that particular myself, especially because it reminds me so much of my childhood. But at the same time I'm more than happy for Elfman to move away from that and do something else. In the long it wouldn't have been so rewarding had Elfman scored films the same way for 20 years. That's why Terminator Salvation or Sommersby (among others) are so great!

Karol

[Jay 37,268]

OK I finished listening (to the score proper, not the bonus tracks yet)

The first track is the same familiar Main Title you already knew from the OST, but then right away you start hearing new music, and the rest of the listening experience becomes quite different from the OST. I was working while listening, so wasn't giving it my full attention, and haven't read John's liner notes yet, but I enjoyed every minute of it. This is a great CD release. Can't wait to listen to it again already!

However: On to Star Trek 5 next

Oh, and I agree that Edward Scissorhands / Batman Returns / Nightmare Before Christmas is like a "trilogy" of Elfman scores in a way.... actually, its a trilogy for Tim Burton as well. For both people, its kind of 3 movies/scores of them just being them, with minimum studio interference and just their true voices shining. Neither has been the same since or before.

I cannot take credit for that theory though: It was first proposed to me by Mr. John Takis

[crocodile 7,978]

OK and how does it sound?

Karol

[Charlie Brigden 7]

OK I finished listening (to the score proper, not the bonus tracks yet)

The first track is the same familiar Main Title you already knew from the OST, but then right away you start hearing new music, and the rest of the listening experience becomes quite different from the OST. I was working while listening, so wasn't giving it my full attention, and haven't read John's liner notes yet, but I enjoyed every minute of it. This is a great CD release. Can't wait to listen to it again already!

However: On to Star Trek 5 next

Oh, and I agree that Edward Scissorhands / Batman Returns / Nightmare Before Christmas is like a "trilogy" of Elfman scores in a way.... actually, its a trilogy for Tim Burton as well. For both people, its kind of 3 movies/scores of them just being them, with minimum studio interference and just their true voices shining. Neither has been the same since or before.

I cannot take credit for that theory though: It was first proposed to me by Mr. John Takis

Musically I think so, but I don't agree with the film, just because Nightmare was a lot of Henry Selick in the animation direction. Burton wasn't even around that much during production. If you look at Selick's work after that (even in stuff like The Life Aquatic) you can see his imprint.

[Jay 37,268]

Yea, I agree it holds more water for Elfman than for Burton

Karol, the sound quality was stellar.

[Trent B 337]

Okay I gave this score a try today. Honestly I really don't like it as I do the original Batman. To me it seems like Elfman is trying to hard to top off the score for the original Batman film. I mean I do like the darker tone he gave for Batman's theme, especially when the choir plays. However, the initial score itself is just rubbing me the wrong way. I thought I would like it...but just nope.

[Demondm810 398]

This release is a revelation. Absolutely INCREDIBLE. The stereo separation is insane. John Takis is soooo right about details, and things under the service. Orchestration is wayyyyyyy better than I ever thought it was. I was in love with this score before, and I can't believe how amazing it is. CONGRATS to everyone involved!!!!

The old OST album is now the most worthless album in the world. Seriously.

[artyjeffrey 20]

To be honest, I bought the OST years ago... and never listened to it. Can't explain that one. So I guess I'll pass on this one, since it must not be that important to me.

[Datameister 2,034]

I agree with both of the above posts [EDIT: not counting artyjeffrey's], actually - the tone of this score as a whole doesn't do it for me, despite some standout moments, but based on the samples, this release sounds amazing. Seems like La-La Land and the other film score labels are just getting more and more consistent in providing that sort of sound quality, and it's thrilling. I like to think that I evaluate music based on the actual content of it, but I have to admit that sound quality and mix and whatnot do make a big difference.

Imagine if one of these labels somehow got their hands on the rights to the Star Wars OT!

[Demondm810 398]

I agree with both of the above posts [EDIT: not counting artyjeffrey's], actually - the tone of this score as a whole doesn't do it for me, despite some standout moments, but based on the samples, this release sounds amazing. Seems like La-La Land and the other film score labels are just getting more and more consistent in providing that sort of sound quality, and it's thrilling. I like to think that I evaluate music based on the actual content of it, but I have to admit that sound quality and mix and whatnot do make a big difference.

Imagine if one of these labels somehow got their hands on the rights to the Star Wars OT!

Don't tease.

[Datameister 2,034]

Hehehehe...I can dream...

[Trent B 337]

It would be nice if Lucasfilm let either FSM or La-La Land release the Original Trilogy scores with a proper remix and restoration for the sound quality. That would be a dream come true.

[Ollie 1,059]

This release is a revelation. Absolutely INCREDIBLE. The stereo separation is insane. John Takis is soooo right about details, and things under the service. Orchestration is wayyyyyyy better than I ever thought it was. I was in love with this score before, and I can't believe how amazing it is. CONGRATS to everyone involved!!!!

The old OST album is now the most worthless album in the world. Seriously.

I agree, fantastic release.

[crocodile 7,978]

All I can say it's beautifully put together album. I'm loving every second of it. And yes, the liner notes were really enjoyable and enlightening. For example, I haven't noticed the Batman theme in the Face to Face song before.

Thanks to all involved. You made one film music fan very happy today.

Karol - surprised to learn how well he knew the complete score

[Koray Savas 2,251]

I forgot how much circus-y music was in this score. Not my cup of Elfman.

[Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488]

There's loads, but it honestly fits the movie like a glove.

[Demondm810 398]

I can't get enough of this score. It's been playing non-stop for days. Unbelievably good. I even like the circusy music! You get to hear the building blocks for "Making Christmas"! Either that, or you get to hear him steal a bit! I'm not sure which movie he would have written for first...

!

[crocodile 7,978]

There is some proto-Nightmare Before Christmas writing in there as well. I could swear I heard some very close passages.

Karol

[Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488]

There are two songs with a similar melody to Batman Returns. Jack's Obsession has the Penguin's theme.

[crocodile 7,978]

Just wanted to mention that I always loved the Sore Spots cue. The quasi-romantic-but-not-really Herrmann-like setting of the material of the two characters is lovely. With the suiting-up stuff added at the end it's even better.

Karol

[crocodile 7,978]

It's funny what you can learn from the internet. I just read the updated review of Batman Returns on Filmtracks. Apparently, according to the reviewer the sound quality of the La-La Land edition doesn't differ from that of original albums. Apparently, it is even worse!

What... the... fuck?

Karol

[Jay 37,268]

Filmtracks stopped being relevant years ago. The LLL release sounds great!

[OneBuckFilms 319]

Personally, I've been really loving this release since getting it. The sound, IMHO is great, as is the score.

Very much the dark, beautiful Elfman I love to play at volume

I originally thought it would simply be overload, but the oposite has been true.

[Wojo 2,453]

I'm not sure why I haven't bought this one yet. Or First Knight. Come August, I may just place a $200 order with LLR and be done with it.

[OneBuckFilms 319]

I hope to pick up First Knight at Comic-Con. I'll say this: LLLR have been producing some stunners over the last few years.

Independence Day

Star Trek V

Home Alone

Batman

Batman Returns

The Edge

Alien Resurrection

InnerSpace

Mars Attacks (yet to get)

Spaceballs (missed, may need to get on secondary market soon)

First Knight (yet to get)

Medal of Honor Soundtrack Collection (yet to get)

The Punnisher (yet to get)

[Datameister 2,034]

It's funny what you can learn from the internet. I just read the updated review of Batman Returns on Filmtracks. Apparently, according to the reviewer the sound quality of the La-La Land edition doesn't differ from that of original albums. Apparently, it is even worse!

What... the... fuck?

Karol

The sound quality of the LLL release is better than the score itself!

[Demondm810 398]

Hopefully this will not offend, but the reviewer on Filmtracks makes no sense. Never has.

Has he lost his hearing? Batman Returns sounds absolutely amazing. The clarity and detail is stunning.

[Ollie 1,059]

What Jason said.

No offense because I know some of you here like to fine tune and do analysis on the music, but whenever someone complains about sound, mastering, digital pops etc etc etc. I just ignore it.

Too many people suddenly think they are experts.

[Wojo 2,453]

If I hear a digital pop in an album, it was probably because I was trying to burn a DVD, download a movie, play a game, and defrag my hard drive while ripping the album and on Facebook.

[fommes 153]

I thought Batman Returns has always sounded good, on the original soundtrack as well as on the LLL CD. Generally I have no problem with Filmtracks at all, but this criticism seems a bit strange.

[Trent B 337]

I think who ever reviewed the La-La Land version of Batman Returns on Filmtracks doesn't have that great of hearing. Even I could tell the sound quality was good before I sent it to a fellow JWFANer.

[Richard Penna 3,667]

Hopefully this will not offend, but the reviewer on Filmtracks makes no sense. Never has.

Has he lost his hearing? Batman Returns sounds absolutely amazing. The clarity and detail is stunning.

Clemmenson can have some weird opinions, along with his blatant composer/stylistic biases. I don't put much stock in his reviews these days.

[Demondm810 398]

Exactly. Complete absence of consistency.

[Taikomochi 1,136]

Filmtracks is not the best website for reviews. They have no appreciation for ambience and automatically knock anything with it down, Close Encounters got four stars mainly for that reason.

[Trent B 337]

Filmtracks is not the best website for reviews.

That's all you needed to say.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Exactly. Complete absence of consistency.

Is a critic required to be consistent?

[Demondm810 398]

Exactly. Complete absence of consistency.

Is a critic required to be consistent?

Required, technically not. But in my opinion, without consistency there is little weight in their words.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Ok but how does this inconsistency manifest itself? Does he post a review on a score one week, only to change his mind about that score in the next week?

[crocodile 7,978]

No. But he criticized the score presentation as well. All his previous issues were fixed with the new album. I don't blame him for not liking the score (it's a very polarizing one), but there is absolutely nothing wrong with the new presentation. He often does these sub-ratings (for different albums) aside from the main rating, and yet there is none in this case.

Karol

[Taikomochi 1,136]

It's still not as bad as their "The Social Network" review, which spent much of the review complaining about the concept of facebook itself, then gave the score a "FRISBEE" rating, having never heard it in the film, as if that was a score you should only heard out of context of the film.

[Trent B 337]

While I personally couldn't get into the score but I found nothing wrong with the presentation or the sound quality. It was right in line with their release for Batman. If anything Batman Returns had better sound quality than Batman did.

[OneBuckFilms 319]

While I personally couldn't get into the score but I found nothing wrong with the presentation or the sound quality. It was right in line with their release for Batman. If anything Batman Returns had better sound quality than Batman did.

I found that Batman Returns sounded absolutely great on the LLLR CD.

The OST, to my mind, pretty much doesn't exist.

The music is not as iconic as Batman, but it's great stuff.