Will John Williams win his 6th Oscar for 'War Horse'?

[Ricard 2,245]

"his work on War Horse sounds like a cross between self-parody and a brazen attempt to steal Howard Shore’s amazing Lord of the Rings score"

That's the most ridiculous piece of crap I've read in a long time.

[indy4 155]

Indeed. Having uneducated people criticize a great score is probably the most frustrating type of bad review. I'd love to ask him exactly what parts feel like they were stolen from LotR - the author would probably say something along the lines of "You know...the strings and the horns and the epicness."

[Hlao-roo 389]

Howard Shore invented the orchestra.

[KK 3,307]

I can totally imagine people saying that Shore invented the choir!

But that review is ridiculous and very uneducated! I can't believe that the best score of 2011 is receiving this kind of thrashing...I'll have to judge how the score works in film when I watch it next week....but I'm certain that the score will work fine in film. Williams rarely fails to accompany the film perfectly with his music (he knows when to be restrained when necessary and he knows when to unleash orchestral force when needed).

[Hlao-roo 389]

Williams is overemphatic in a few early scenes in 'War Horse,' as is his wont, but the film catches up to the score's level of emotionality in due time. Williams's closing material is appropriately sentimental, rising to the occasion without overstating the case.

[Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488]

I actually feel like Williams was very restrained here. The score perfectly complemented the movie.

[Quintus 5,399]

Having uneducated people criticize a great score is probably the most frustrating type of bad review.

Frustrating yes, but valid all the same.

Lee - who would swap "uneducated" with ignorant; since the former has connotations of snobbery.

[Luke Skywalker 1,795]

meh, my sister also said war horse sounded a little like LOTR when she heard it....

(?!?!?!?!?!##"#!!!!!)

Maybe the connection is with the shire music.

She also said a part sounded like Far & away...

Maybe it just the british isles pastoral music 'sound'

[Jay 37,346]

After seeing the movie I am less positive about Williams' chances of winning the Oscar. As wonderful music as it is on the album, I can see academy voters either not really noticing it, or noticing it in a negative way in certain scnes that are somewhat overscored

[KK 3,307]

And so dies my last hopes of witnessing Williams 6th victory at the Academy Awards this year...I should have known Williams lost his chances once The Artist came around (still have to listen to that score...looking forward to it).

[King Mark 3,631]

Yeah now that I've seen the film I think Jason's right

And in my theater I thought the music had an underwhelming mix coming from the front channels only most of the time and sounding very "thin"

[Joni Wiljami 1,206]

Hell Yeah, Houston Film Critics got the nominations right:

Best Score

• Alexandre Desplat, Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows, Part 2
  
• Harry Escott, Shame
  
• John Williams, The Adventures of Tin-Tin
  
• John Williams, War Horse
  
• Ludovic Bource, The Artist
  

Finally some recognition for Tintin

[Not Mr. Big 4,639]

Excellent! And no Dragon Tattoo! Almost to good to be true.

[Luke Skywalker 1,795]

in the main page it a resume of nominations and the likes.

3 awards awarded as of today. No williams. The Artist 2 wins.

The artist is going to snatch most prizes

[crocodile 8,000]

Now imagine John Williams tackling a movie like The Artist. Having the film all to himself? That could have been something.

Karol

[indy4 155]

The score was featured so prominently and for so much time in War Horse that it was almost like a silent film. How long does it take for the first line of dialogue to be spoken in the first scene? At least a few minutes, I'm sure. And I don't think there's any dialogue in the final scene.

[TownerFan 4,983]

Will this give Williams more chances to win the Oscar?

http://blogs.indiewire.com/thompsononhollywood/kim-novak-protests-use-of-vertigo-score-in-the-artist

[Luke Skywalker 1,795]

I hope so, damn it! :lol.

[Richard Penna 3,684]

I'm less confident that Williams has a chance anyway because both WH and TT are open for nomination. It's going to be 2001 all over again.

[indy4 155]

At least in 2001 Williams lost to a great score, even if it is inferior to his efforts that year. The real tragedy was 2005.

[King Mark 3,631]

I'm still not sure why critics say the music is loud and upfront in War Horse

I saw MI4 last night and Giacchino's music was mixed 1000X times louder than Williams in War Horse

[TownerFan 4,983]

That's because Giacchino's music itself is just LOUDER than Williams' (i.e. it has much less dynamic range).

[King Mark 3,631]

Maybe Williams music just doesn't mix well with modern movie mixing. Sometimes the louder parts are loud enough (like Plowing ) , but a lot of the quiet underscore is lost in the mix. That's been true for the past 10 years

It's not like Superman The Movie anymore

[indy4 155]

I thought the mix in War Horse was very good, much better than Tintin. It helps that you have some scenes with virtually no dialogue or sound effects.

[KK 3,307]

I thought the mix in Tintin is great, with the music really receiving some great showtime in that movie.

Its sad, I started the year thinking there was no way Williams was going to miss his 6th Oscar this year. But the more I think about it, there really is no way I see how the Academy (along with other award groups) will fail to give The Artist the big award. I think this Hermann issue will blow over quite soon.

Its a good score mind you, and I'd definitely prefer it winning to the horrid TGWTDT (I'm not sure I'll truly ever understand how the Social Network won last year), but this is Williams' year! Alas, the idea of a good score for a silent picture is too good an opportunity for the voters to miss. Essentially everyone who will vote will pick the Artist when music comes to mind because the movie is in such a way.

I want War Horse to get the Oscar (if not, Tintin, but I doubt that will get it) but there is no way I see that happening now (unless The Artist somehow gets disqualified, though I highly doubt it).

- KK

[Joe Brausam 214]

I can't speak for Dragon Tattoo, but even though The Social Network didn't interest me in the slightest on a musical level, it WAS effective in the film. Very effective, really. So on that merrit, I have to say it did deserve the award.

The fundamental question here is - should the academy be awarding the composer, the musical work, or the degree to which the musical work supports the film?

[Jay 37,346]

The degree to which the musical work supports the film, though unfortunately that isn't what actually happens

[Joe Brausam 214]

Exactly. So going by that criteria, I think The Social Network did deserve the award, regardless of how we feel about the music itself.

And honestly, going by the criteria also, I don't think that War Horse should get the award, even though on a purely musical level I think it completely deserves it.

[KK 3,307]

To be honest, the score was barely audible in The Social Network. I could only really hear it during the rowing montage with Greig's music on synthesizer and pop music for the parties. So really, I don't think the score was effective to such an extent. Is it appropriate for the film? Yes. But the film would have worked equally fine without a score at all (thats how inaudible it was). In that regard, TSN is not really a great score that meets the Oscar "criteria" (although that changes every now and then to their comforts and need).

TSN needs a cold, more ambient kind of score. There are many atmospheric scores that would have worked better than Ross and Reznor's score. Clemmenson and Broxton bring up really good points in their reviews of The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo. They compose a mass of music ambient music that really pays no regard to the film. In other words, the composers compose music (more like soundscapes) that go on for minutes without much change (a.k.a. droning) so that Fincher can easily paste those snippets on to screen. A single droning note is quite apt for the cold style of Fincher's films, but that doesn't make it an effective film score. Take for instance, TWGDT. Its a cold-hearted movie, we get it. And thats why there's droning. But what about addressing the complexities and the sense being lost in Salander's character. The humane side to the characters are lost in the music. Where is the narrative in the music? Its like they composed stock music to Fincher's description of what he envisioned is the film and slapped it on the picture. It works, yes, but thats all it does. That in no way elevates the score to "best of the year", even in accordance with the Academy's criteria.

A truly great film score (in this case for a Fincher film) would perfectly address the visuals while synching up with the emotional climaxes of the narrative and the characters. Both Howard Shore and David Shire did this quite effectively with Fincher's past films (even though some of those scores may not make the best stand alone listens). The music can be cold, ambient and atmospheric while simultaneously showing purpose, definition and signifying the narrative of the film. Even Cliff Martinez does a better job with his experimental soundscapes for films like Drive (although I've never been able to enjoy scores like that). The thing about Reznor and Ross is that they fail to really address the film. A little tinkering there for mystery, and some faster loops for "action" are not what I'm talking about. With any of Fincher's recent films, a single droning note would suffice for the entire film...but that doesn't make it a great score, it only makes it appropriate at best.

Reznor and Ross have only gotten so much attention recently because they're popular artists who are trying something new in a different genre they haven't explored. Since they don't follow traditional film music, critics are manipulated into thinking they're bringing something revolutionary to the table (although droning has been around for a while now). In this regard, if any popular artist was to venture into film music with an unconventional technique, they will inevitably be showered with praise and awards (regardless of the quality of the work in its role).

So no, even when judging to the degree of how well the music worked in film, The Social Network was most definitely not the best score of last year and nor is TWGDT.

War Horse may have been a bit overscored in the beginning, but other than that it was perfect. But if we were to be really picky then, I'd put Tintin up instead (considered how it was brilliantly scored). The Artist also fits the criteria very well, and we all know that score is going to win anyways (even Reznor won't be able to change the game of Academy politics).

I hope some of that made sense...

[filmmusic 1,826]

a few hours remain until we find out!!

[Ricard 2,245]

This thread was about the Oscars, but yes, in a few hours Ludovic Bource will win the Golden Globe.

http://www.jwfan.com/?p=1741

I really hope I'm wrong.

[filmmusic 1,826]

This thread was about the Oscars, but yes, in a few hours Ludovic Bource will win the Golden Globe.

http://www.jwfan.com/?p=1741

I really hope I'm wrong.

Oops!