Ricard 2,245 Posted November 12, 2011 Share Posted November 12, 2011 This was posted on the temporarily board last night while the site was down for a few hours:(Originally posted by Lukas Kendall on the FSM board)http://www.salon.com..._greatest_hits/Quite a controversial list. I'd say at least half of those titles aren't on most people's top 10 JW scores. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,352 Posted November 12, 2011 Share Posted November 12, 2011 The Long Goodbye at #3........... wow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trent B 337 Posted November 12, 2011 Share Posted November 12, 2011 WTF? Revenge Of The Sith is number 2? Um, sorry but this guy is an freaking idiot. Everyone knows that Star Wars (ANH) and Empire Strikes Back combined beat Revenge Of The Sith out of the stars (pun intended). Also most everyone considers Star Wars and Empire to be Williams top two scores ever done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Brigden 7 Posted November 12, 2011 Share Posted November 12, 2011 "Williams superimposes “Duel of the Fates” — the prequel cue that expresses the tension between the dark and light sides of the Force — over the optimistic “The Force Theme,” which we associate with Luke in chapters IV-VI; this cue foreshadows both Anakin’s moral failure in the second half of “Sith” and his belated redemption in the “Return of the Jedi.”What, in a cue tracked from The Phantom Menace? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elmo Lewis 6 Posted November 12, 2011 Share Posted November 12, 2011 It is indeed a peculiar list, but it is very aplty justified by the author.He intends to pick a score from each genre and era of Williams' career (the subtitle of the piece hails Williams as "Hollywood's most versatile composer"), so that seems to be his primary goal. After that, the way he justifies the most mind-boggling choices is quite reasonable considering he is addressing people who don't know Williams very much.His reasoning, and you may or may not agree with it, is that "since Raiders doesn't seem to say more of Williams' talent than Superman, let's give the very odd Long Goodbye a shot."Either that or he's well-versed in the hipster technique of hailing an artists' most obscure and early works as his best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,352 Posted November 12, 2011 Share Posted November 12, 2011 he's well-versed in the hipster technique of hailing an artists' most obscure and early works as his best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Brigden 7 Posted November 12, 2011 Share Posted November 12, 2011 Incidentally, I don't think it's a terrible list. I adore THE LONG GOODBYE, and it's pretty cool to see THE FURY and TEMPLE OF DOOM get some plaudits outside fan circles. Obviously you and I's list would probably have some different choices, but based on previous Salon articles I was worried it'd just be a bunch of relatively obscure ones. To score fans, I mean. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricard 2,245 Posted November 12, 2011 Author Share Posted November 12, 2011 he's well-versed in the hipster technique of hailing an artists' most obscure and early works as his best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor 7,495 Posted November 12, 2011 Share Posted November 12, 2011 Cool, unorthodox list that refreshingly tries to avoid many of the old war horses (pun intended). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miguel Andrade 1,263 Posted November 12, 2011 Share Posted November 12, 2011 I haven't checked the link yet, but at any rate, The Long Goodbye is an extraordinary exercise in scoring a film from a complete different perspective that most are. And in the end, terribly effective too.Miguel, who is actually reading this days the Raymond Chandler novel on which the film is based. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elmo Lewis 6 Posted November 12, 2011 Share Posted November 12, 2011 Cool, unorthodox list that refreshingly tries to avoid many of the old war horses (pun intended). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricard 2,245 Posted November 12, 2011 Author Share Posted November 12, 2011 I haven't checked the link yet, but at any rate, The Long Goodbye is an extraordinary exercise in scoring a film from a complete different perspective that most are. And in the end, terribly effective too.Definitely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeinAR 1,949 Posted November 12, 2011 Share Posted November 12, 2011 Jeez what a bizarre list! Revenge of the shit being on any best list is just ridonculous.Salon has always been a piss poor online magazine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted November 12, 2011 Share Posted November 12, 2011 Joe! You are alive??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4,643 Posted November 12, 2011 Share Posted November 12, 2011 Either that or he's well-versed in the hipster technique of hailing an artists' most obscure and early works as his best.Then, HEIDI and GIDGET GOES TO ROME surely would get their well-deserved mention. I don't really remember, but HEIDI wasn't half-bad, i think.Apart from CMIYC, i don't see many eyeraisers on their list. Of course, if they employed more authors named KENOBI88 or LUNA_LOVEGOOD, the list would be more to this MB's linking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricard 2,245 Posted November 12, 2011 Author Share Posted November 12, 2011 You're part of this MB.EDIT: Congrats on your 2000th post Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BurgaFlippinMan 7 Posted November 12, 2011 Share Posted November 12, 2011 I noticed under his Superman entry he claims Williams' themes are going to be used in the upcoming reboot, a statement backed up by the ever 'reliable' IMDB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricard 2,245 Posted November 12, 2011 Author Share Posted November 12, 2011 That's just an unfounded rumor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Ware 526 Posted November 12, 2011 Share Posted November 12, 2011 I suspect that the new Superman will do everything it can to distance itself from Superman Returns, such as not using Williams' themes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joni Wiljami 1,206 Posted November 12, 2011 Share Posted November 12, 2011 At least he got right the number one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted November 12, 2011 Share Posted November 12, 2011 Jaws at number 6. No E.T.Rubbish list. The worst ever! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hlao-roo 389 Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 After that, the way he justifies the most mind-boggling choices is quite reasonable considering he is addressing people who don't know Williams very much.Indeed, conservatives far outnumber liberals among the film music community.By the way, I love how Williams is actually being celebrated by an established publication (the first major online-only magazine, in fact), and people (aside from Thor, who, naturally, doesn't count) are lining up to take a piss on the author (who's a big Spielberg fan, too). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4,643 Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 You're part of this MB.EDIT: Congrats on your 2000th post I'm the angry black community.Gosh, 2000? Will my cheque arrive this month? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,399 Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 It's a respectable list. I just don't agree with his choices.Sith being on there is baffling, though.Lee - who hopes in vain that these Superman rumours come true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Mark 3,631 Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 I strongly disagree with :Catch Me if You CanCinderella Liberty (actually in the bottom 5 Williams scores to me, at least musically)JFKLong GoodbyeI somewhat disagree with RotS and The Fury but they are in my top 20The proof that he doesn't know what he's talking about is he cites a chopped up tracked cue from TPM to help justify RotS being on the list Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4,643 Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 I strongly disagree with :Cinderella Liberty (actually in the bottom 5 Williams scores to me, at least musically)I can imagine that...NEPTUNES'S BAR rules! And seriously, i the bluesy love theme is a keeper. The Rosemary Clooney version is just heartbreaking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,399 Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 I disagree KM, I think he does know what he's talking about, to a point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Mark 3,631 Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 There's no way in hell you can pick RotS over The Empire Strikes Back or Star Wars for a "top ten list" , no matter what kind of smart ass arguments you can come up with Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,399 Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 Yes.It really is fucking stupid that he chose Sith as his Star Wars entry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Mark 3,631 Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 Or put Cinderella Liberty and The Long Goodbye on there but not E.T.He makes arguments why those scores are effective in their respective films , fine, but it has nothing to do with Williams 10 best scores of all time IMO (definitely not music wise) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,399 Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 I'm not bothered that he happens to prefer Cinderella Liberty over E.T. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Mark 3,631 Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 ok, well RotS does make it in my top 15 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4,643 Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 I wouldn't have chosen CL, either.On the other hand, is the melancholy end title of SUGARLAND EXPRESS not essential Williams (for me it is)? Or DANCE OF THE WITCHES? If you have 10 titles, it can't be all Spielberg/Lucas fan favourites. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 Some guy's opinion. Big deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Docteur Qui 1,544 Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 Anything that makes the unfamiliar listener go out and try some of Williams' less famous scores is a good thing to me, regardless of whether I agree with the dude's opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor 7,495 Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 Some guy's opinion. Big deal.Exactly. It's HIS list. He can put whatever he wishes on it; even if it's JOHN GOLDFARB PLEASE COME HOME ten times in a row. Never understood why people have the desire to put down or otherwise slander another person's SUBJECTIVE list, even though it isn't exactly like their own. Baffling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elmo Lewis 6 Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 Sith being on there is baffling, though.His reasoning, and I don't think this should be ignored, is that it's the score that best represents the importance of his leit-motifs in a score. Not the best score per se: the best example of what potential Star Wars' copious leit-motfs have. Since that, and not the quality of the music, is the author's point, it makes sense to have Sith and not superior scores with less themes like ESB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 ROTS has more themes then TESB? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elmo Lewis 6 Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 Doesn't it? It has themes from five previous movies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hlao-roo 389 Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 Sith being on there is baffling, though.His reasoning, and I don't think this should be ignored, is that it's the score that best represents the importance of his leit-motifs in a score. Not the best score per se: the best example of what potential Star Wars' copious leit-motfs have. Since that, and not the quality of the music, is the author's point, it makes sense to have Sith and not superior scores with less themes like ESB.Dude, would you stop assessing the author's opinion in context? It's really annoying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BurgaFlippinMan 7 Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 Or put Cinderella Liberty and The Long Goodbye on there but not E.T.He makes arguments why those scores are effective in their respective films , fine, but it has nothing to do with Williams 10 best scores of all time IMO (definitely not music wise)The problem with cramming his list full of the usual suspects of Williams' greatest most people would agree with is that it neutralizes this sentence in his introduction."there is more to Williams’ career than iconic theme music" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nightscape94 965 Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 It just seems to me that the author wanted to pick 10 not overly discussed scores, and took the opportunity to discuss them. They're clearly not his "greatest hits", but in a way it's refreshing that someone is still paying attention. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 Wrong!The author was just talking out of his ass. He clearly does not have a clue!Jaws at 6 and no E.T.: The Extra Terrestrial! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor 7,495 Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 I did two articles awhile back for my own film magazine, showcasing Williams' less famous sides:Part 1: http://montages.no/2009/12/john-williams-ukjente-sider/Part 2: http://montages.no/2009/12/john-williams-ukjente-sider-del-2/So I can definitely see where the author is coming from. It's not like he intended to pick out the 10 most successful or famous JW scores. It's just a personal list of favourites. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gkgyver 1,645 Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 Cool, unorthodox list that refreshingly tries to avoid many of the old war horses (pun intended). That's beside the point.If you make a "John Williams' Greatest Hits" list, the list should be just that, not a deliberately "fresh" list, but his de facto greatest hits. And Sith, CMIYC and others aren't anywhere near that.Or name it "My favourite John Williams scores".Episode III being 4 spots above Jaws is ridiculous, no matter how "fresh" it sounds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elmo Lewis 6 Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 I think it's just the headline that's confusing (purposefully so, in order to gain more clicks). It's very likely that the author didn't even come up with it himself, but it was rather a visitor-friendly editorial choice.I find the rest of the article to make reasonable sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romão 2,274 Posted November 14, 2011 Share Posted November 14, 2011 Refreshing list. I'm sick and tired of Top 10 lists that include only JW's action adventure scores. We are in a message board dedicated to a wonderfuly versatile composer, and what most praise is his more bombastic side.For instance, I'd find more baffling if a list like this didn't inclue JFK than ESB. Now there's an unique and indispensable JW score Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
indy4 155 Posted November 14, 2011 Share Posted November 14, 2011 Jeez, people on this board are intolerant. Sorry, but there's not an objective standard for artistic achievement. Just because his iconic epics are appreciated most by the general public, doesn't make them the best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hlao-roo 389 Posted November 14, 2011 Share Posted November 14, 2011 I think it's just the headline that's confusing (purposefully so, in order to gain more clicks). It's very likely that the author didn't even come up with it himself, but it was rather a visitor-friendly editorial choice.I find the rest of the article to make reasonable sense.As if you would know anything about this sort of thing! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elmo Lewis 6 Posted November 14, 2011 Share Posted November 14, 2011 I never speak of what I know. I find it in poor taste. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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