Brónach 1,302 Posted February 9, 2012 Share Posted February 9, 2012 I think The Ferry Scene is a very good track. I enjoy it on a purely visceral level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KK 3,307 Posted February 9, 2012 Share Posted February 9, 2012 I think Williams did a fantastic job with The Ferry Scene, haunting in its prime.Black Sunday is also a great, not well known score! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SF1_freeze 131 Posted February 9, 2012 Share Posted February 9, 2012 Probably my favourite cue from the score.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5UBN5JSAbI4Agreed, if i come back to listen to the score its always stuff of the first half and either this or the Nurse Dhalia one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genius_Gone_Insane 5 Posted February 9, 2012 Share Posted February 9, 2012 It's all over the place.Agreed. John Williams makes some memorable music. Action music is not one of them.^Not this. So what you're saying is the horn fanfare as The Last Battle kicks in wasn't memorable? You don't remember the music 5 minutes later when Ben Kenobi says "Use the Force, Luke... Trust your feelings"?"Here they come"....dun dun...dun dun.....DAH DAH DAHHH DAAAAH DAHHHHH!!!!! <--my childhood was based on that scene.I find your post insulting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharkissimo 1,973 Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 While I love Williams old action style more, I certainly enjoy and admire his modern action writing. Williams is a fantastic action writer. One of the things I've always admired about modern Williams is how regardless of how busy and "over the place" the action music sounds like, its still very structured and enjoyable. What I found myself marveling at when listening to Tintin, is how Williams manages to make his music sound so "busy" yet still very enjoyable. Only Williams can pull that level of complexity off without his music being dubbed as atonal work.What's wrong with that? I don't think you quite grasp what "atonal" means. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 Atonal is the devil's throat gurgling! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ComposerEthan 8 Posted February 10, 2012 Author Share Posted February 10, 2012 <p>Wait, so Williams work isn't atonal at times (His modern action music)? Sorry, I'm not trained in theory, so I think of it as atonal..</p><p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faleel 5,347 Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 (Sorry about the slight off topic) Listen to Rosenman's LOTR and compare it to Star Trek IV, LOTR is considered more Atonal than ST:IV Vs.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LFijX7O7rz4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ComposerEthan 8 Posted February 10, 2012 Author Share Posted February 10, 2012 Wait, so Williams work isn't atonal at times (His modern action music)? Sorry, I'm not trained in theory, so I think of it as atonal.. "The Ferry Scene"? Really? Talk about scraping the bottom of the man's portfolio barrel. Have some people been bashed in the brain by a falling meteor or something? It's hard to imagine some of you as functioning members of society! I'll just leave these here: "The Ferry Scene" I have those. Anymore action cues similar to those? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KK 3,307 Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 While I love Williams old action style more, I certainly enjoy and admire his modern action writing. Williams is a fantastic action writer. One of the things I've always admired about modern Williams is how regardless of how busy and "over the place" the action music sounds like, its still very structured and enjoyable. What I found myself marveling at when listening to Tintin, is how Williams manages to make his music sound so "busy" yet still very enjoyable. Only Williams can pull that level of complexity off without his music being dubbed as atonal work.What's wrong with that? I don't think you quite grasp what "atonal" means.I understand what atonal means. And I was never saying atonal was a bad thing. When done right, you have some great material, like Penderecki's work or even Williams score for Close Encounters with the Third Kind. But the majority of listeners tend to dislike atonal music, and while Williams modern action sometimes appears to be so, it never is. A lot of people find atonal music unenjoyable, but if they consider Williams' modern action atonal (which its not), then it sure as hell is very entertaining "atonal" music. (Sorry about the slight off topic) Listen to Rosenman's LOTR and compare it to Star Trek IV, LOTR is considered more Atonal than ST:IV Vs. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LFijX7O7rz4 God, those Mordor chants always crack me up! Sometimes Rosenman's LOTR score has its moments, but its usually hard for me to take that score seriously (especially with the really childish main theme). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faleel 5,347 Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 Well her is shore's verion KK:Luuuuuugbuuuuuurzzzz LuuuuuuuuuggggBuuuuuuurzzz (or however its spelled) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharkissimo 1,973 Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 <p>Wait, so Williams work isn't atonal at times (His modern action music)? Sorry, I'm not trained in theory, so I think of it as atonal..</p><p>Here are some examples of atonal writing in modern Williams action/suspense cues.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zztndQcGzOghttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3OllIfXudpI&feature=related(2:16 to end) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k7Xk72Xww7Y&feature=mfu_in_order&list=UL http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zVcsyUK0alU Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488 Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 I know this is about JW, but I think you'd enjoy Jerry Goldsmith's action scores. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ComposerEthan 8 Posted February 11, 2012 Author Share Posted February 11, 2012 Examples please? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faleel 5,347 Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 Moved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romão 2,274 Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a62n5vcfebshttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQJwqE6tclghttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vEvLynWqmsA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faleel 5,347 Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 Moved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuck 154 Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 I'll add some to that Jerry Goldsmith action scores: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e1GCq8MFrMo&t=5m32s^Skip to 5:32 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuck 154 Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 I'll add some to that Jerry Goldsmith action scores: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e1GCq8MFrMo&t=5m32s^Skip to 5:32 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MmQjaMXDWbchttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H2amnhCS8-s Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muad'Dib 1,802 Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wsfPkETdy3Ahttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JqLCJ5bJkgg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KK 3,307 Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 Well her is shore's verion KK:Luuuuuugbuuuuuurzzzz LuuuuuuuuuggggBuuuuuuurzzz (or however its spelled)Barin Catharad! Get it right Faleel! I'm not trying to make comparisons between Shore's work and Rosenman's work because they're two different films, but it really is hard to take Rosenman's score seriously. The main theme was so annoying in its persistance during the film. And the Mordor chanting is pretty darn funny if you ask me As for Goldsmtih, his action music is freakin awesome in its prime. One of my favourite Goldsmith scores, The Wind and the Lion:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DFORF8iSnsY Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faleel 5,347 Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 The main theme was so annoying in its persistance during the film.I liked it in its appearance in the film... the end credits... not so much.....my favorite statement of it: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuck 154 Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 Of course the quintessential Goldsmith action score is none other than: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xxDw5BuCWGg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 The Mother of all action scores! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharkissimo 1,973 Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 Meh. Prefer Part I. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuck 154 Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 First Blood's action scores are not as engaging or fast paced as compared to the sequels, it's more sneaky, more depressing and/or sorrowful. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w3k5ST8uBAchttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IQy_2Cz4kAM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 First Blood is a little bit more a thriller/suspense score with only a few monuments of sustained action.Rambo: First Blood part II has plenty of cues brimmed with adrenaline pumping action. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuck 154 Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 And Rambo III turned up the notch higher. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faleel 5,347 Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 I have heard that FB III sounds a bit like Trek V? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 Hmm...not really.They are from the same era, so that have that same general style. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Brigden 7 Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 I never got on with 3. Maybe it was the performance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 And Rambo III turned up the notch higher.I don't know about that. The NPO's performance is certainly more gripping then that of the Hungarian orchestra. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuck 154 Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 And Rambo III turned up the notch higher.I don't know about that. The NPO's performance is certainly more gripping then that of the Hungarian orchestra.It's not how the orchestra played the score but the way Jerry combined ethnic music with synthesizers; a melding together of Jerry Goldsmith's earlier love of ethnic instruments and his newfound love of synthesizers while still keeping the action cues in a cohesive, uncluttered manner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joni Wiljami 1,206 Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 John Williams Action MusicTopic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brónach 1,302 Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 Love the sudden Goldsmith lovefest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Brigden 7 Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 Love the sudden Goldsmith lovefest.Me too.Hornist obviously doesn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joni Wiljami 1,206 Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 Of course its more than ok but why not to start a new thread called JG action music. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 Why don't you start one? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joni Wiljami 1,206 Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 I'm not a big fan. But I love almost more than anything his lyrical stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488 Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 Composer Ethan is on a journey here. John Williams' action music was his first important steps into a larger world. This journey will bring him full circle, of course. But now, he must take on Goldsmith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joni Wiljami 1,206 Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 Keep them coming then, what you waiting for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faleel 5,347 Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 Of course its more than ok but why not to start a new thread called JG action music.(its not called JG action music but...)Done!http://www.jwfan.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=21348 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skyy38 21 Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 One of my favorites.The music for the TIE Fighter Attack is based on the Rebel Fanfare, with descending five-note phrases occurring throughout. This is film scoring at its most triumphant - a cue unlike any other ever written fora movie, and so kinestheticaliy connected to the imagery that it is impossible to believe either existed before the other. A crescendo is reached with the Death Star motif, which brilliantly carries the drama into its final act by musically reminding the audience that the real battle is still to come. russds 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ComposerEthan 8 Posted March 4, 2013 Author Share Posted March 4, 2013 Sorry to bring this up, but is there anything like the Dovchenko part in Ants from KOTC? Like percussion and brass, much like The Flying Wing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,355 Posted March 4, 2013 Share Posted March 4, 2013 Why would you be sorry to bring that up? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naïve Old Fart 9,524 Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 "John Anderton's Escape" is a great cue. Stylistically it's probably the most extremely modern of Williams' action cues. "Chase Through Couruscant" as well. Agreed. I also like "Everybody Runs".Ilistened to "The Battle Of Endor", the other day: complexity to the power of 10. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karelm 2,913 Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 It seems like JW’s action music fits into three distinct categories.Ostinato: categorized by rhymic repition. Swashbuckling: emphasis is on melody and harmony and ornaments. This is the Korngoldian/old fashion approach to action music. Modern: clusters and advanced techniques. Great for intense dinosaur music.Examples of the Ostinato action:Empire Strikes Back: Hyperspace - Phantom Menace: Duel of the Fates (after chorus)Minority Report: Everybody Runs! Minority Report: Spiders! Examples of Swashbuckling/Melodic Action:ESB: Asteriod Field: Jaws: Shark Cage Fugue: Star Wars: Battle of Yavin: Hook: Ultimate War: Jurrasic Park: TRex: Far & Away, Indiana Jones, Superman, etc.Modern:Jurassic Park - Raptor: I think if broken down by these three styles, you see more continuity in his action approach. For example, ostinato approach that seemed fresh in Minority Report was heard in Hyperspace too so its really just a matter of which action approach was used rather than an evolution. It seems like his bigger action sequences such as Battle of Hoth, Desert Chase in Indiana Jones, T-Rex finale in Jurassic switch between these various approaches depending on the dramatic needs. russds 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ComposerEthan 8 Posted March 5, 2013 Author Share Posted March 5, 2013 Do we have more of his modern stuff? I really do enjoy the "random" that Williams adds to his action cues, like the brass when Indy starts to fight Dovchenko, or those flute/xylophone runs that he tends to use a lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharkissimo 1,973 Posted March 6, 2013 Share Posted March 6, 2013 It seems like JW’s action music fits into three distinct categories.Ostinato: categorized by rhymic repition. Swashbuckling: emphasis is on melody and harmony and ornaments. This is the Korngoldian/old fashion approach to action music. Modern: clusters and advanced techniques. Great for intense dinosaur music.Examples of the Ostinato action:Empire Strikes Back: Hyperspace - Phantom Menace: Duel of the Fates (after chorus)Minority Report: Everybody Runs! Minority Report: Spiders! Examples of Swashbuckling/Melodic Action:ESB: Asteriod Field: Jaws: Shark Cage Fugue: Star Wars: Battle of Yavin: Hook: Ultimate War: Jurrasic Park: TRex: Far & Away, Indiana Jones, Superman, etc.Modern:Jurassic Park - Raptor: 'Raptor Attack' from JP is a suspense cue, not an action cue.'T-Rex Rescue & Finale' employs plenty of tone clusters, although there's melodic material too.Here's how I'd categorise Williams's action music :Modernist - Employment of ostinati, short melodic/harmonic/rhythmic cells, syncopations, polytonality, tone pyramids, tone clusters, aleatoricism, extended techniques, electronic percussion, minimalist devices etc. Romantic - Think Korngold, Steiner and Walton - lots of orchestral flourishes, big thematic statements, boom-tz, triads moving chromatically in parallel motion, frequent use of compound rhythms (i.e. 9/8 or 12/8) and triplet figures, strings in octaves, horns in unison or as propulsive chords (i.e. 8th note -Δ7ths) etc. Hybrid/Post-Modern - Like a Venn diagram - most of Williams's action writing falls here - not entirely one or the other. A bit of both, depending on what's happening on screen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karelm 2,913 Posted March 7, 2013 Share Posted March 7, 2013 'Raptor Attack' from JP is a suspense cue, not an action cue.'T-Rex Rescue & Finale' employs plenty of tone clusters, although there's melodic material too.Here's how I'd categorise Williams's action music :Modernist - Employment of ostinati, short melodic/harmonic/rhythmic cells, syncopations, polytonality, tone pyramids, tone clusters, aleatoricism, extended techniques, electronic percussion, minimalist devices etc. Romantic - Think Korngold, Steiner and Walton - lots of orchestral flourishes, big thematic statements, boom-tz, triads moving chromatically in parallel motion, frequent use of compound rhythms (i.e. 9/8 or 12/8) and triplet figures, strings in octaves, horns in unison or as propulsive chords (i.e. 8th note -Δ7ths) etc. Hybrid/Post-Modern - Like a Venn diagram - most of Williams's action writing falls here - not entirely one or the other. A bit of both, depending on what's happening on screen.You're right about the Raptor music being more suspense than action. I was thinking of the scene where the girl was running from the Raptor into the shed (where the hand falls on her) but forgot which scene that was...been awhile since I've seen the film. Regarding your classifications, why do you consider ostinati as a modernist characteristic when that's been around for hundreds of years and does seem to be to be a category in itself since he does it so often as a way to deal with action scenes. It also just doesn't sound modern. Are you thinking this is modernist in terms of how action scenes are done today...in which case I certainly agree with you. Please explain that further. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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