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La-La Land Records' HOOK (2CD Expanded) Anticipation thread


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La La Land Records = Label of the Year 2012. Everyone else, just pack it up. Nothing more to see here. WOW!!!!!

This is mostly for posterity but for those looking through old threads on this score, if you are looking for the 2012 Tim Burden Movie Magic Hook Special in which he talks with the boys at LaLa

That is illegal, sir!

Only if you profit by it. I would not presume to share any of this music with anyone. Ever. Never. Absolutely not.

Are sure you are not mixing CDs with women Stefan? Holding and hoarding them in basements is illegal.

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Great to see this finally officially confirmed :)

Wonder what part of the process was 'back breaking'....costs? rights? convincing Williams to allow more than just an OST reissue with bonus track?

I should watch the film again (in blu-ray glory of course) and hear all of the wonderful unreleased music.

* not that I'm in any way, shape or form, ungrateful, but can we have the Jurassics next. Pretty please?

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So are you guys more thrilled about this than you were about the "Expanded Indiana Jones Box Set"?

That went by quickly, didn't it?

So much excitement, then once it was released, almost everybody had only one thing on their minds (the SPEED), and then it was forgotten quickly, wasn't it?

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So are you guys more thrilled about this than you were about the "Expanded Indiana Jones Box Set"?

That went by quickly, didn't it?

So much excitement, then once it was released, almost everybody had only one thing on their minds (the SPEED), and then it was forgotten quickly, wasn't it?

I guess the issues with speed and not getting the complete scores affected the reception somewhat. That said the Indy Box is something I listen to in one form or another quite often.

Well this has no doubt been produced with much more competency than the Indy box was.

Plus, we don't know yet how much involvement Williams has had.

I think the producing philosophy is should I say "fanatic" friendlier here if possible, meaning a complete and comprehensive release of the whole score. ;) Or so I really hope.
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So much excitement, then once it was released, almost everybody had only one thing on their minds (the SPEED), and then it was forgotten quickly, wasn't it?

it's not forgotten. Everytime I listen to it I remember how much better this could have been

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I guess the issues with speed and not getting the complete scores affected the reception somewhat. That said the Indy Box is something I listen to in one form or another quite often.

Yep, same here.

it's not forgotten. Everytime I listen to it I remember how much better this could have been

So, KM, looks like you'll still be around by the time the expanded Hook is released after all! Good for you! :P

Plus, we don't know yet how much involvement Williams has had.

He wrote the whole caboodle! That enough for ya? :rolleyes:

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I think the producing philosophy is should I say "fanatic" friendlier here if possible, meaning a complete and comprehensive release of the whole score. ;) Or so I really hope.

I for one wouldn't mind if the 'fanatics' get the finger as often a possible. The whole whiny act-as-if-life-depends-on-some-shitty-percussion-overlay attitude is just disgraceful, no matter how yo look at it.

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Did Williams have any involvment with 1941?

No

The expansions Williams has stayed out of have been perfect - 1941, Home Alone, LLL Poseidon, Black Sunday, Family Plot, Midway, etc.

The expansions Williams WERE involved in have been... not perfect - ET, CE3K, ET again, Indy Box, etc

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So much excitement, then once it was released, almost everybody had only one thing on their minds (the SPEED), and then it was forgotten quickly, wasn't it?

it's not forgotten. Everytime I listen to it I remember how much better this could have been

Yes.

Plus, we don't know yet how much involvement Williams has had.

He wrote the whole caboodle! That enough for ya? :rolleyes:

LOL

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I think the producing philosophy is should I say "fanatic" friendlier here if possible, meaning a complete and comprehensive release of the whole score. ;) Or so I really hope.

I for one wouldn't mind if the 'fanatics' get the finger as often a possible. The whole whiny act-as-if-life-depends-on-some-shitty-percussion-overlay attitude is just disgraceful, no matter how yo look at it.

I am more of a middle road person in this. I am happy with a complete score but I certainly do not need every alternate take of everything. I have seen pretty hopeful speculation of 3 disc release for this to cover all alternate material. Also I have seen seriously concerned folks who think this won't be a great release if there aren't at least 3 discs.
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I for one wouldn't mind if the 'fanatics' get the finger as often a possible. The whole whiny act-as-if-life-depends-on-some-shitty-percussion-overlay attitude is just disgraceful, no matter how yo look at it.

That would be debatable in many cases, but certainly not in the case of the Indy boxset.

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Around 150 minutes of unique music was recorded for Hook. 2 Discs is fine.

Indeed. It is truly enough to cover the whole score and all the relevant alternates. This has been discussed before but film music community has become very demanding and often the demands (or hopes) for several CDs of alternates seems unrealistic and absurd. Some fans seem to act as if they are entitled to be the judges of what should go on these albums. There is strange tone of entitlement in the demands of these ardent fans who seem to view a CD release as a source of raw materials from which they can choose what to use as they shape their own score and not a coherent whole, a produced product and experience the labels and composer wish to provide.

I for one do not have any worries about this release. LLL has proved themselves time and time again with their meticulous releases that have provided truly comprehensive presentations of many scores. And I know they have done their best and taken this time and effort of 3 years to pull this off. I have to hand it to their dedication and love of this music.

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You would only need 3 discs if you wanted to present the Ultimate War twice - once with inserts, and once without.

OR if they were able to include the original song demos.

OR if they were obliged to include the original OST unchanged on its own disc.

Otherwise, 2 discs is fine. Believe me, I know. Outside of John Takis I am likely the world's biggest expert on this score. I've been studying it and collecting information on it for half my life.

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That would be debatable in many cases, but certainly not in the case of the Indy boxset.

The point is not so much what you feel about individual cases but the big picture. If miles of bandwidth are devoted to the findings of miniscule recording flubs, allegedly wrong takes, wrong pitches etc. (which hardly anyone would have noticed if not told repeatedly on the INDY set) which are then bemoaned like a national tragedy by the dvd-by-stopwatch fans , then it's as fair to vent the ever-reliable GET A LIFE. There are more important things in life than complete score releases, after all.

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You would only need 3 discs if you wanted to present the Ultimate War twice - once with inserts, and once without.

OR if they were able to include the original song demos.

OR if they were obliged to include the original OST unchanged on its own disc.

Otherwise, 2 discs is fine. Believe me, I know. Outside of John Takis I am likely the world's biggest expert on this score. I've been studying it and collecting information on it for half my life.

The price seems to indicate 2 discs unless they are planning to be really generous. :)
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There are a lot more things missing on the Indy box set that just the wrong pitch and missing overlays.

And there is no way to "allege" a wrong take. it's either the right take or the wrong take. It's black and white.

You are severely misinformed about things here.

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There are a lot more things missing on the Indy box set that just the wrong pitch and missing overlays.

And there is no way to "allege" a wrong take. it's either the right take or the wrong take. It's black and white.

You are severely misinformed about things here.

Publicist is just much more uncaring of these things. He just enjoys the music.
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Most of these ubber complete fan made 3 or 4cd's Hook sets always include a bunch of redundant stuff and those concert suites from Williams on Williams.

2cd's should be absolutely perfect

Absolutely.

I would recommend the Williams on Williams album though, for the Hook pieces alone. :)

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I haven't logged in a while and decided on a whim to visit the site this morning and lo and behold what do I see? This beautiful post on the main page. Extremely busy and frustrating at work right now but this completely made my day.

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I wouldn't turn down a 3CD set with the original album on it (if only because it would make my shelf space slightly bigger), but I have no problem holding onto the Epic release either. It's a pretty well-assembled soundtrack, covers most of the bases and has a lot of my favorite cues.

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Two CDs seems a bit... excessive. But it's nice to see that 2-disc Hook become a reality for the rest of you.

What you call excessive I call necessary and welcome.

Exactly. That's like saying that the OST of ESB was enough. Crazy.

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You are severely misinformed about things here.

For instance? About people who have nothing better to do than dissecting the same films over and over and over again and then being anal and whiny because the record is missing a triangle? (that's not even stretching it)

There's an end to all things and it isn't necessarily hoarding every microsecond of INDIANA JONES and HOOK music. Music time should be much better spent on the trillions of other musical treasures music history offers.

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Publicist a lot of us are obsessed with having John William complete scores. This is why this forum exists.

I don't want every microsecond of Goldsmith's, Horner's an Giacchino's music, but I want every microsecond of Williams music

The Indy box set is missing over an hour of music that could have been there. Its not just missing small overlays.

Are you counting KotCS?

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For instance? About people who have nothing better to do than dissecting the same films over and over and over again and then being anal and whiny because the record is missing a triangle? (that's not even stretching it)

We are "whiny" about a product that we paid good money for not being representative of the full creative breadth of the work done by this web forum's patron saint of existence. During that time, we do manage to hold down jobs, get plenty of sleep, clean the dishes, and bang our sweethearts.

You are whining about whiners.

Who's the bigger ingrate?

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Two CDs seems a bit... excessive. But it's nice to see that 2-disc Hook become a reality for the rest of you.

Sorry to be blunt but this has to be the most dumb post I've read in a while.

Hook definitely deserved the full treatment and 2-CDs is necessary to present the entire score.

As Jason pointed out most of the "3-CD" and "4-CD" stuff had unnecessary material. I'm sure with any alternates and the main body of the score it will fit onto 2-CDs. It will be a tight fit but it will work.

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I think the worst part about scores not being fully released is that we've already had to wait...and waiting in and of itself isn't a bad thing,. I can handle that. Its the TIME that's the enemy.

Look at Return of the Jedi... they couldn't even find those masters for the SE's... and that was maybe 10-15 years later? THat's obscene!

Look at Towering Inferno how most of the score is missing or damaged. Look at a myriad of other scores that are COMPLETELY MIA. This to me is more than a travesty. Its a disgrace. Film is a part of history. Many films like Star Wars are a legacy...a part of our heritage. And to LOSE a part of them? To let the film stock degrade... these are all unforgiaveble crimes on the historical and artistic history of our generations.

... that tyraid over lol...

I think that when they have the oppourtunity to release these complete scores, to NOT include alternates is disheartening. It may be the last time such an oppourtunity arises for them to do this. And when they chose not to, It makes me wonder if those recordings will simply be lost to time...will we ever see them? Will they ever be released?

Its nit picky, but I worry about those things becuase to me, the most interesting things about scores are the alternates...what they didn't do...decided not to do or tried..and what didn't work. Those show more about what the score is envisioned to be than anything...

At the same time, I do understand why they don't do it... I don't like that they don't...but I understand :-/

Maybe one day heh

As far as HOOK goes, I know I'll be listening to it nonstop for weeks to come! heh

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Two CDs seems a bit... excessive. But it's nice to see that 2-disc Hook become a reality for the rest of you.

Sorry to be blunt but this has to be the most dumb post I've read in a while.

Hook definitely deserved the full treatment and 2-CDs is necessary to present the entire score.

As Jason pointed out most of the "3-CD" and "4-CD" stuff had unnecessary material. I'm sure with any alternates and the main body of the score it will fit onto 2-CDs. It will be a tight fit but it will work.

Trent,

dontfeedthetrollo.jpg

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I think that when they have the oppourtunity to release these complete scores, to NOT include alternates is disheartening. It may be the last time such an oppourtunity arises for them to do this. And when they chose not to, It makes me wonder if those recordings will simply be lost to time...will we ever see them? Will they ever be released?

Its nit picky, but I worry about those things becuase to me, the most interesting things about scores are the alternates...what they didn't do...decided not to do or tried..and what didn't work. Those show more about what the score is envisioned to be than anything...

At the same time, I do understand why they don't do it... I don't like that they don't...but I understand :-/

From film music preservation point of view you are completely right. It might be the only time and chance to preserve some of these scores and extend their life span by transferring them into digital form. Unfortunately harsh realities of cost and finance play a large part in this, especially in these economically uncertain times. I am sure that most agree that if there was unlimited funding for such things, most scores would see the light of day in complete form if legal minutiae etc. could be overcome.

Alternate material by which I mean here something significantly different from the final material found in the film are fascinating, illuminating the scoring process and how the music evolves and how different things can be tried and scenes approached differently. I think that if there is a chance to preserve and present such material to the public by including it on the complete score releases then it should be done. But it should be noted that complete score releases are not raw material presented to the public but intended to form a whole and a product, artistically speaking as well as commercially. And what do you include on such releases? What is a significant alternate or something worth including? I would say that different takes, meaning a performance of same cue with minor modifications are rather redundant. They rarely illuminate anything but considerations of instrumentation and balancing of sound in the film. Sometimes even those could be included and have been. A truly different approach, a newly written piece to replace something written previously is surely more interesting and a more vital inclusion, also showing how the process of film making has changed the music and composer's approach to a scene. In themselves alternates are not so interesting as in the context of the whole score. They can be of course rip roaringly brilliant music on their own but orphaned without the surrounding music.

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