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La-La Land Records' HOOK (2CD Expanded) Anticipation thread

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I think it's honestly one of speliberg's best, and I think, regardless of what the critics said, it's a good movie. As it's not only my opinion, but everyone i've ever talked to loves it also.
After medication, i suppose.

+1

Never was a fan of the movie, nor will I ever be...

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I watched Hook again today after about 10 years since the last time I saw it. Surprisingly, I like it better as an adult than I did as a child or a young person. There was something about Peter Banning's struggle with work/life balance that seems more relevant to me now in a general sense. I also liked the portrayal of Banning's life in the US as grounded, work-focused and almost neo-realist, but the moment the film shifts to the UK, the film becomes a fantasy as if London represents some whimsical old-world nostalgia. I suppose this is part of why some critics think the film is disjointed, but I always attributed that criticism to the fact that the moment Dustin Hoffman appears, we lose interest in Peter's story of self-discovery (whether real of imagined, he still becomes a better man at the end), because Hoffman chews up every scene he's in, even Robin Williams can't keep up because he's playing what could arguably be the most "normal" role of his career at that point.

I actually find it remarkable how restrained Williams is early on in the film. Even after his character shift he never goes into his usual manic comedic shtick.

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It's too bad Kevin Kline, who they originally cast as Peter, had to back out because the movie Soapdish was taking too long to film. I think he would have played the part better.

I love SOAPDISH, but it would have been interesting how Kline's presence would have changed the tone of the movie. Williams was a good choice, but in many scenes he's playing a Bob Hope-type character who is stranded in a psychedelic ROAD TO NEVERLAND picture and then rapidly switches gears to play one of Spielberg's awful 'emotional' scenes which feel like especially revolting tv...those even John Gielgud (or Kline) couldn't have saved and that's saying a lot.

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While I won't pretend to say Hook is a great movie, it is definitely a fun movie and most certainly not Spielberg's worst (I would say Always or the Lost World are way worse, and most would also argue 1941 was equally bad). The score is in my personal Top 10 best Williams scores ever.

And baseball is the best sport ever!!! LOL

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It's not in my top 10 (if I ever had one) and I wouldn't say this is as great music as people say, but I admit this is one of the most entertaining scores Williams has ever written. Just the sheer amount of memorable themes and colourful sequences.

The reason I want this album is not so much for expansions, but for improved sound quality which was quite weak on the OST.

Karol

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I love it all. Wonderful escapist fantasy. Negative reaction to the movie by adults always sounds to jaded and cynical to me. But I'm biased because I've "believed" since I was 4.

This is exactly what I say about the Star Wars Prequels.

Everyone has his/her own truly all-time favourites and we all stand up to defend and protect them from what we think is unfair negative criticism, particularly when it comes to problematic pieces like Hook.

I saw the film when I was 13 and of course I liked it for what it was. But later on I began to see its own limits and I understood why this is a problematic movie. On the paper, it was the perfect Spielberg film, full of themes and motifs dear to the director. It could have been really a landmark for his career at that time, because the potential was to realize a painfully take on the loss of innocence and childhood. The problem of the film lies in a script that doesn't spend enough time to make us believe that Peter Banning/Pan can actually become a child again. I think the pivotal moment when Pan finally finds his "happy thought" (i.e. being a father) is absolutely wrong. Banning can become Pan again and fight Hook back only if becoming a true child again and rediscovering his true inner self, hence I would have had him transforming again into a real child (I agree it wouldn't have been easy in terms of suspension of disbelief, btw). The deep nature of James Barrie's original story was to stop the time and make childhood an endless state, so Spielberg should have had the guts to make us see a true Peter Pan without putting an adult into ridiculous tights and hairdo, but casting a real child for that segment of the film. Then, when he realizes that he can't be a child again forever and must return to his adult self because has a family and two kids, the moment would have been infinitely more painful.

However Spielberg already did a movie like that. It's called Empire of the Sun.

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The problem of the film lies in a script that doesn't spend enough time to make us believe that Peter Banning/Pan can actually become a child again. I think the pivotal moment when Pan finally finds his "happy thought" (i.e. being a father) is absolutely wrong. Banning can become Pan again and fight Hook back only if becoming a true child again and rediscovering his true inner self, hence I would have had him transforming again into a real child (I agree it wouldn't have been easy in terms of suspension of disbelief, btw).

Or it would be necessary to see how the transformation into Pan affects Banning's real life. Spielberg only offers lame patronizing speeches.

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when [Pan] realizes that he can't be a child again forever and must return to his adult self because has a family and two kids, the moment would have been infinitely more painful.

The closest that the movie came to that is when Peter Pan celebrates the disappearance of Hook into the stuffed crocodile with as much glee and delight as any of the other [surviving] Lost Boys, and his two children stand by looking solemn, like "can we go now?"

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Confirmation that John Williams was involved in this release from the FSM thread (there are three posts here, quoting is different on FSM):

This continuous track (but indexed) of pure film score glory:

5. The Ultimate War: To War** 9:45

6. The Ultimate War: The Death Of Rufio* 2:36

7. The Ultimate War: Sword Fight* 5:32

* Previously unreleased

** Contains previously unreleased material

smile.gif

Wonderful. Intrada probably would have put that as one long track.

Then they would have to change it to this because that is the way Mr. Williams wanted it.

MV

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Oh hey, you're right! I didn't realize MV's followup post hadn't been posted over here.

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Can somebody confirm the track timings for the segment of the track list we have? Any major edits? We probably can't know for sure since we don't know how much time is left at the end of each track, but we can still anticipate major edits.

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The Fly quote or not, let's not panic just yet. Somehow I doubt JW did anything drastic, given this type of release.

I think Williams and Goldenthal have been hanging out and plotting how to intervene in LLL releases.

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Can somebody confirm the track timings for the segment of the track list we have? Any major edits? We probably can't know for sure since we don't know how much time is left at the end of each track, but we can still anticipate major edits.

Added up, the three LLL tracks come to 17:53. The pre-Concord track 'The Ultimate War' runs 19:52, but that appears to include No More Hook (or w/e the cue's called; that short one when the Crocodile falls on him). So... possible edits?

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I think the only major editing question would be whether the inserts for Part I are incorporated in the track or included as extras.

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Hmmm, I hope Williams didn't veto anything from the release. I just want to know for sure! Waiting for the track list is killing me!

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Same here man, the next 23 days need to go by a lot quicker! :D

Anyhoo, just looked at the three Ultimate War tracks I have, combined they run almost 20 minutes... HOWEVER, when you snip out the Tinkerbell becoming big music, it runs about 17:29ish. So maybe the LLL version has the inserts.

I should probably be focusing on something else, haha.

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I think it's safe to assume the Tink grows up will be separate from the "Ultimate War" bits judging by the times. The "No More Hook" portion would probably start track 8, especially if it continues to be a gapless playback portion like with the rest of the "Ultimate War" bits. That's just my THEORY though. We'll find out in just over 3 weeks.

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Do we know the Ultimate War segments will be gapless playbacks? I assumed they were just separate cues that overlap in the film, like how "Map/Out of Fuel" and "Slalom on Mt. Humol" were separate tracks on the Concord ToD expansion.

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Confirmation that John Williams was involved in this release from the FSM thread (there are three posts here, quoting is different on FSM):

This continuous track (but indexed) of pure film score glory:

5. The Ultimate War: To War** 9:45

6. The Ultimate War: The Death Of Rufio* 2:36

7. The Ultimate War: Sword Fight* 5:32

* Previously unreleased

** Contains previously unreleased material

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So Williams requested that one long track be broken up and require gapless playback or an audio editor to play back properly?

Ugh.

Yes, musically it makes sense to have them as gapless playback. It would be weird to hear each cue on its own with a clean intro / ending.

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Okay, I don't want one long track that lasts 18 or 19 minutes!

So breaking up the cue was the right choice. This isn't just 1 cue anyway! This is a piece made up of several cues spliced together!

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Odd that Williams requested gapless playback for this, but in the Indy box set requested all the cues remain separate even when written to adjoin one another.

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Ultimate War runs around 17 and a half minutes without the music from the preceding Tinkerbell scene and No More Hook segment. I think we can safely assume that it is the complete music for the sequence.

I hope Williams only had input on how the cues should be separated or joined and not in excising anything from the release to create one of his dreaded listening experiences. I do love the man's music but I certainly do have some issues with the way he arranges it on his albums.

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Mmmm... Now that I know that Williams is involved, I wouldn't be surprised if the 2-CD set actually includes the OST twice.

You are going to get this set?

I thought you were just here for comic relief, not even a JW fan!

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I applaud Williams involvement in the release of his own music. Especially with Hook, which is a great score, but certainly overlong. There's a lot of stuff that simply slows the score down.

If only Williams had the same pride for his music like e.g. Howard Shore who wanted Complete Recordings of LotR scores released. He is just too humble for his own good when it comes to his best work. On the other hand I would love some insight from the Maestro on the genesis of this score.

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I applaud Williams involvement in the release of his own music. Especially with Hook, which is a great score, but certainly overlong. There's a lot of stuff that simply slows the score down.

I'm sorry, but you're crazy if you think that releases like the expanded Jaws, Close Encounters, and the Indy box are better than releases like Home Alone and 1941

The Matessino style is perfect for every Williams score

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So when are the track titles gonna be released?

I need some new info!

I applaud Williams involvement in the release of his own music. Especially with Hook, which is a great score, but certainly overlong. There's a lot of stuff that simply slows the score down.

I'm sorry, but you're crazy if you think that releases like the expanded Jaws, Close Encounters, and the Indy box are better than releases like Home Alone and 1941

The Matessino style is perfect for every Williams score

Not crazy. Just a matter of taste.

Although I also prefer the Matessino style, I don't really mind if Williams himself wants to get involved. I respect the maestro's wishes.

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So when are the track titles gonna be released?

I need some new info!

The same as any other LLL release - in the official announcement email that goes out the night before release day. So sometime around 3am EST on March 27th.

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