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La-La Land Records' HOOK (2CD Expanded) Anticipation thread


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The same as any other LLL release - in the official announcement email that goes out the night before release day. So sometime around 3am EST on March 27th.

The night before release day? :blink:

Dear God.

So until then we won't know whether this is gonna be a Complete Edition or just an Expanded Edition with music missing?

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La La Land Records = Label of the Year 2012. Everyone else, just pack it up. Nothing more to see here. WOW!!!!!

This is mostly for posterity but for those looking through old threads on this score, if you are looking for the 2012 Tim Burden Movie Magic Hook Special in which he talks with the boys at LaLa

I'm sorry, but you're crazy if you think that releases like the expanded Jaws, Close Encounters, and the Indy box are better than releases like Home Alone and 1941

The Matessino style is perfect for every Williams score

I don't own Home Alone, but I think the expanded 1941 is a tad too much. And it's nowhere near as long as Hook. There are a lot of short, softer cues in Hook, especially in the beginning of the film which are all a bit samey to me. I thought that many years ago when I heard the Concorde boot and I still think that today.

Comparing Hook with Jaws is just silly to me. Jaws is a very sparsely scored film, while Hook is pretty much wall to wall.

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I wasn't comparing the scores. I was comparing the presentations.

I prefer the complete presentation Matessino gave to Home Alone and 1941 to the Williams-mucked-with non-chronological presentations we got for Jaws expanded, CE3K expanded, and the Indy box.

In my PERSONAL opinion, 100% of the releases Williams has NOT been involved in have been perfect presentations, and the ones he HAS been involved with have all had flaws.

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The same as any other LLL release - in the official announcement email that goes out the night before release day. So sometime around 3am EST on March 27th.

The night before release day? :blink:

Dear God.

So until then we won't know whether this is gonna be a Complete Edition or just an Expanded Edition with music missing?

Well it is going to be a 2 disc release and it is going to have the Ultimate War most likely complete. I would buy it even for that alone.

I wasn't comparing the scores. I was comparing the presentations.

I prefer the complete presentation Matessino gave to Home Alone and 1941 to the Williams-mucked-with non-chronological presentations we got for Jaws expanded, CE3K expanded, and the Indy box.

I prefer and have always preferred Matessino style excellent complete releases. As I have always said, you can programme too long score into a shorter presentation but not the other way around.
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The same as any other LLL release - in the official announcement email that goes out the night before release day. So sometime around 3am EST on March 27th.

The night before release day? :blink:

Dear God.

So until then we won't know whether this is gonna be a Complete Edition or just an Expanded Edition with music missing?

I don't quite understand why you are surprised by this. With Intrada, La-La Land, FSM, Varese Club/LE, Kritzerland, Quartet, etc etc we never get the track lists until the CDs are for sale or at most a half-day before. This one is no different.

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We've suspected for longer then a year this was coming, a few more weeks aint gonna make much difference.

True. Heck if anything this hobby teaches you patience.
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I wasn't comparing the scores. I was comparing the presentations.

I prefer the complete presentation Matessino gave to Home Alone and 1941 to the Williams-mucked-with non-chronological presentations we got for Jaws expanded, CE3K expanded, and the Indy box.

In my PERSONAL opinion, 100% of the releases Williams have not been involved in have been perfect presentations, and the ones he has been involved with have all had flaws.

So if this Hook set is not perfect, the blame will go to John Williams and not your buddy Mike?

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I don't quite understand why you are surprised by this. With Intrada, La-La Land, FSM, and Varese Club/LE, we never get the track lists until the CDs are for sale or at most a half-day before. This one is no different.

To be honest, for me this release is the most anticipated release from any of these companies. Before, I never paid much attention to when the track titles were released. Home Alone, Black Sunday, Midway,1941, etc.... oh, I bought them all, but just as a matter of course.

This one, I actually can't wait to get a hold of it!

We've suspected for longer then a year this was coming, a few more weeks aint gonna make much difference.

Sometimes the wait is even the best part!

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It's a very exciting time. I'm sure the new set will be fantastic. I'm also positive LLL did everything they could to make it the best possible release.

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It's a very exciting time. I'm sure the new set will be fantastic. I'm also positive LLL did everything they could to make it the best possible release.

Indeed!

If even the 1-CD OS album is fantastic, this new release should be twice as good. Plus I can't wait to read the liner notes (whoever wrote them)...

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It's a very exciting time. I'm sure the new set will be fantastic. I'm also positive LLL did everything they could to make it the best possible release.

Exactly.
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All we know is that JW was involved, and he separated the three cues that create the "Ultimate War" into 3 separate tracks.

Which is not exactly a bad thing in my opinion. Makes navigating to your favourite part easier if a sequence is not a mammoth 18 minutes. In any case they will flow into each other as MV said.
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You guys pick apart the most insignificant thing. So what if the "Ultimate War" pieces are three pieces instead of eight with gapless playback? The way how it's set up on the LLL disc is fine by me and should be fine for every one else.

Now if they had the first portion end right before "Death Of Rufio" and had that cue completely on it's own with a clean intro / ending then that would be one thing to sort of bitch about. It would be a really weird listening experience. Just like "Hangar Management" not going into "Enterprising Young Men" on the so called "Deluxe Edition" for Star Trek.

Then again there were so many things wrong with the Star Trek set that I won't plague this thread with that. This is about Hook, not Star Trek.

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You guys pick apart the most insignificant thing. So what if the "Ultimate War" pieces are three pieces instead of eight with gapless playback? The way how it's set up on the LLL disc is fine by me and should be fine for every one else.

Nobody's complaining, Trent...

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You guys pick apart the most insignificant thing. So what if the "Ultimate War" pieces are three pieces instead of eight with gapless playback? The way how it's set up on the LLL disc is fine by me and should be fine for every one else.

You're right that we shouldn't be complaining (and no one is), but it won't stop us debating over the best way to present the music.

I don't like gapless playback much, and I have bought CDs solely to have lossless files I can join back together. It's a personal choice.

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So what if the "Ultimate War" pieces are three pieces instead of eight with gapless playback? The way how it's set up on the LLL disc is fine by me and should be fine for every one else.

It's not, not for me. But I know how to rip multiple tracks together as a single track, and will do that with this album when it arrives. So I'm not worried about it and don't feel that complaining would solve anything.

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I like clean endings and beginnings for every cues, like the HPSS leak

Gapless playback ruins listening to individual cues and joined tracks sometimes are too long (besides you can edit them toghweter if you want)

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Soon, with attitude like this, the only reasonable way of releaseing these things will be just pressings CD's with every single take of every single cue. Oh and after that everyone will demand all the rehearsals.

Karol

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The start of "Tink Grows Up" through the end of "Farewell Neverland" was intended to be one long contiguous chunk of music by the composer. I can't see how anyone would complain that a CD release preserves the composer's intention in this regard.

If La-La Land is giving us the composers intentions AND breaking what would otherwise be a 30-minute track into individual tracks so that the listener can still jump to his favorite moments but the composer's original intentions are preserved, they should absolutely be applauded.

It's how I would have done it if I was the album producer. And its what Williams wanted for this release!

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It's a tough decision for some. Honestly, 20 minutes of continuous track is hard to listen to sometime. And it's not particularly shuffle friendly. That's why I still haven't stuck together all of ToD's first half hour. What if I wanna JUST listen to Fast Streets of Shanghai?

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I prefer clean openings/endings, but that's not always feasible (if anybody remembers the discussion on Intrada's board about Conan The Barbarian). That said, I really don't want the last 30 minutes of the score to be shoved together, indexed tracks or not. No problem with the Ultimate War music being lumped together (that at least makes sense as a setpiece).

It's a tough decision for some. Honestly, 20 minutes of continuous track is hard to listen to sometime. And it's not particularly shuffle friendly. That's why I still haven't stuck together all of ToD's first half hour. What if I wanna JUST listen to Fast Streets of Shanghai?

Well, your opinion means nothing, you're just the customer and the target audience.

;)

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The start of "Tink Grows Up" through the end of "Farewell Neverland" was intended to be one long contiguous chunk of music by the composer. I can't see how anyone would complain that a CD release preserves the composer's intention in this regard.

Wait, so there shouldn't be a gap between the end of "The Ultimate War" and "No More Hook"?

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I prefer every section of the orchestra isolated. Can always put them together, if I want to. But then again these labels chose to discriminate listeners like myself. ;)

Ben Folds released one of his albums in this manner. Not orchestral music, of course. An in fact, the album's initial release was overly loudness compressed and missing several "bonus" tracks found on various limited and Japanese releases. But after complaints, he re-released the whole thing as a two CD set, disc one being the full remixed album with all bonus tracks and disc two having all the individual elements for making personalised mixes.

Not that I've bothered to figure out what program I could use to read those element files... But it's a cool idea nontheless.

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That would get really annoying if you had to pick the mix for every release, but if they offered a pre-mixed version it would be pretty neat. My first order of business would be to quiet down the trumpets in Raiders. You can't listen to The Map Room: Dawn at an effective volume without shuddering when the trumpets come in near the end or adjusting the volume.

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The start of "Tink Grows Up" through the end of "Farewell Neverland" was intended to be one long contiguous chunk of music by the composer. I can't see how anyone would complain that a CD release preserves the composer's intention in this regard.

Wait, so there shouldn't be a gap between the end of "The Ultimate War" and "No More Hook"?

The end of "The Ultimate War" IS "No More Hook"!

For years we all thought that The Ultimate War ended with the croc falling on Hook, and that a cue we called "No More Hook" started with the next music we hear in the film.... but it turns out that's not true!

The cue "15m2 The End Of Hook" begins with the knife popping out of Hook's sleeve and ends by seguing to what we know as "Farewell Neverland". 20 seconds (5 bars) from the middle of the cue - meant to be heard as the smoke clears and the kids go "Hook's gone?", etc - was dialed out in the film, leading to why people thought it was two different cues

These missing 20 seconds were not included on any Hook bootleg and obviously can't be ripped from the DVD/blu since they weren't used.

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I prefer every section of the orchestra isolated. Can always put them together, if I want to. But then again these labels chose to discriminate listeners like myself. ;)

Ben Folds released one of his albums in this manner. Not orchestral music, of course. An in fact, the album's initial release was overly loudness compressed and missing several "bonus" tracks found on various limited and Japanese releases. But after complaints, he re-released the whole thing as a two CD set, disc one being the full remixed album with all bonus tracks and disc two having all the individual elements for making personalised mixes.

Not that I've bothered to figure out what program I could use to read those element files... But it's a cool idea nontheless.

:) I have that CD, I'm a big Ben Folds fan...

As for separate cues or joined together.....I think it makes most sense for the cues that Williams intended to segue together to be presented that way. Though that does create a problem in the films with wall-to-wall music. Phantom Menace would have a lot of super long tracks (unless indexed in the gap-less playback way).

However, from an archival perspective I REALLY love to hear the cue stars and ends. In the Harry Potter sessions leak, I thought it was way cool to hear how the Quidditch match was split up. It just gives me insight into Williams' composition process....the way he chooses to end one cue and have the next overlap. So in my ideal (and incredibly unrealistic) world, the score would be presented with cues segueing the way intended, but then on some bonus discs, we have an "archival" presentation of the sessions, cues separated.

I will be happy with Hook no matter what they do in terms of overlapping cues.

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Once again we are faced with the realities of producing a product VS offering a pile of raw material. Many here might be masters of editing but these CD sets are not created for them so they could have stuff to play with.

If a piece such as Ultimate War is meant to run for continous 20 or 30 minutes then I personally prefer to have it presented in gapless playback since it allows me still to navigate through it to a specific section but also allows the full piece of music to shine as pure music. Williams' intention was to produce this long musical sequence but the most convenient way is to record these things separately and then edit them together. The producers of the Hook have done exactly that for listening convenience. I don't like the start-and-stop nature of these individual cues since they are not fully rounded but meant to continue and often sound like they stop dead in the middle of a musical phrase.

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