La-La Land Records' HOOK (2CD Expanded) Discussion thread

[Dr. Rick 1,186]

Did Mike go to various sites around the globe to dig up materials for expansion?  I've read in some cases (i.e. Superman) where they were in a salt mine in Kansas and I'm assuming the masters were shipped to California?

[crumbs 14,584]

8 minutes ago, ATXHusker said:

Did Mike go to various sites around the globe to dig up materials for expansion?  I've read in some cases (i.e. Superman) where they were in a salt mine in Kansas and I'm assuming the masters were shipped to California?

 

Yes, often. I think Botanicus was found in Florida, and album masters have regularly been found in different countries (England for the E.T. album master, if I remember correctly -- the master tapes were burned in the LA Universal fire).

[Jurassic Shark 12,781]

1 hour ago, crumbs said:

I was really confused when Didier claimed the only reason Mike didn't do Hook was because he was based in LA and the master tapes were in NYC!

 

Just an utterly absurd reason, all things considered. How many expansions has Mike done now where the master tapes were scattered all over the globe?

 

 

Perhaps Mike had a bad internet connection at the time.

[Jay 38,749]

1 hour ago, crumbs said:

thanks to the existence of that bootleg containing all the film stem music in mint condition

 

Let's call that "the recording session leak", not "the bootleg" - to avoid confusion with the two 90s bootlegs for this score

 

Anyway, the recording session leak certainly did NOT contain "all the film stem music"; The only thing it has that comes from the film's music stem on the LLL CD is the end battle cues and the end credits opening.  The film version ending of Flight to Neverland and the film version of Banning Back Home are both on the LLL CD via the film's music stem but neither are in the recording sessions leak (the former was on the 90s bootlegs, the latter has never leaked).

And there is still music heard in the film (and therefore presumably clean on the film's music stem) that is both not on the LLL CD and has never leaked at all - the rest of 1m2 Peter's Entrance, the film version of 1m5 God Rest You Merry Gentlemen, the proper film version vocal overlays for 5m5 Show Us Your Hook, the drum insert for 7m5 The Lost Boys Ballet, the entirety of 8m4A Pick 'Em Up, the complete version of 10m3/11m1A Take Me Out To The Ballgame, the 13m2 To War!! insert, the 13m3 Crossed Swords insert, etc

[bollemanneke 3,529]

So do you have any idea why the film stem/the leak wasn't used in those cases? Was that just bad producing again?

[Jay 38,749]

You'd have to ask Didier that question, I have no idea in the world why he did what he did or used what he used

[Jurassic Shark 12,781]

He's a complex man.

[bollemanneke 3,529]

He was an accountant and missed the 60s.

[King Mark 3,666]

11 hours ago, Jay said:

 

Let's call that "the recording session leak", not "the bootleg" - to avoid confusion with the two 90s bootlegs for this score

 

Anyway, the recording session leak certainly did NOT contain "all the film stem music"; The only thing it has that comes from the film's music stem on the LLL CD is the end battle cues and the end credits opening.  The film version ending of Flight to Neverland and the film version of Banning Back Home are both on the LLL CD via the film's music stem but neither are in the recording sessions leak (the former was on the 90s bootlegs, the latter has never leaked).

And there is still music heard in the film (and therefore presumably clean on the film's music stem) that is both not on the LLL CD and has never leaked at all - the rest of 1m2 Peter's Entrance, the film version of 1m5 God Rest You Merry Gentlemen, the proper film version vocal overlays for 5m5 Show Us Your Hook, the drum insert for 7m5 The Lost Boys Ballet, the entirety of 8m4A Pick 'Em Up, the complete version of 10m3/11m1A Take Me Out To The Ballgame, the 13m2 To War!! insert, the 13m3 Crossed Swords insert, etc

 I think a  near perfect  playlist can be made by combining cues of the LLL and recording sessions leak. I also use Farewell Neverland from the OST. I made a good edit of the feast insert from the Concorde boot (the only good sounding part of that boot)  So all and all I'd say I don't care if this ever released again

 

Unless there's tons of unused music and alternates we never heard

[publicist 4,647]

They should just leak the little rest and we have everything we need. No one needs another 50$ Deluxe Set with three cd's. 

[Jurassic Shark 12,781]

Since the album is OOP, I don't see why they shouldn't fix the issues that are possible to fix if they're going to release it again.

[publicist 4,647]

They obviously would do that in a heartbeat, i am thinking pragmatically, though.

[mstrox 6,778]

A leak isn't released music.

[Jay 38,749]

I don't think any specialty label should ever make any decisions on what to release or not based on the existence of boots, promos, or isolated scores

[Demondm810 399]

Just now, Jay said:

I don't think any specialty label should ever make any decisions on what to release or not based on the existence of boots, promos, or isolated scores

Yeah I certainly hope not!

[Jurassic Shark 12,781]

Hasn't Mike argued in some cases that the existence of boots is a reason in itself to release expanded scores?

[Jay 38,749]

That doesn't sound familiar

[Holko 10,006]

I remember Mike said he can use it as a tool to convince JW, like with A.I., to get a new JW-approved release out to supersede and devalue the non-approved promo.

[Jay 38,749]

But that didn't determine LLL trying to license it from WB or not

[Jurassic Shark 12,781]

3 minutes ago, Holko said:

I remember Mike said he can use it as a tool to convince JW, like with A.I., to get a new JW-approved release out to supersede and devalue the non-approved promo.

 

Exactly!

 

2 minutes ago, Jay said:

But that didn't determine LLL trying to license it from WB or not.

 

But they wouldn't try to license it if JW wasn't going to approve it, right?

[Jay 38,749]

I've never heard of a label checking with a composer first before licensing something from a studio.  That's not really how it works.

[Jurassic Shark 12,781]

Okay, but since LLL wouldn't dream of releasing anything by JW without his consent, and since they've been burned before (Sugarland Express), I'd be surprised if they didn't check with him beforehand whether a release is completely out of the question.

[Jay 38,749]

How was anyone burned by Sugarland Express?  Universal Pictures has never granted a license to that score to anyone.  No money was exchanged anywhere

[Naïve Old Fart 10,221]

22 minutes ago, Jay said:

I've never heard of a label checking with a composer first before licensing something from a studio.  That's not really how it works.

 

Agreed. Since the studio probably owns the music, anyway, the studio wouldn't need the composer's permission. With someone like JW, however, they might just ask, as a courtesy.

[Jay 38,749]

Correct

[bollemanneke 3,529]

I wonder if MM ever discussed the leaks with JW/WB in HP's case.

[Jurassic Shark 12,781]

1 hour ago, Jay said:

How was anyone burned by Sugarland Express?  Universal Pictures has never granted a license to that score to anyone.  No money was exchanged anywhere.

 

I'm not talking about licensing fees, which of course aren't paid if there's no release, but rather the significant work put down by the label working on a release which seems to have come pretty far before JW nixed it.

[Jay 38,749]

I don't know where you get the idea they put any work into it.  No label has put any work into it.  No label has a license for it.

[Holko 10,006]

Didn't we hear it was supposed to be the first Universal Legacy title until JW nixed it relatively late into the process?

[Dr. Rick 1,186]

Yes I remember reading that on the FSM board from MV himself.

[Jay 38,749]

Because a label wanted it to be part of that line, doesn't mean a label paid for transfers or hired a producer to work on it yet

[Jurassic Shark 12,781]

Well, I think the statement was worded so it could easily be interpreted like that.

[Holko 10,006]

But good to know it's rotting away because JW is too humble/self-deprecating! Is it the same case with Story of a Woman?

[Dr. Rick 1,186]

Who says it's "rotting away"?  Maybe they've already done the remaster and are just in a holding pattern?

[Jurassic Shark 12,781]

It probably burned in the Universal backlot fire.

[Jay 38,749]

Mike told us in London that Sugarland Express was preserved fine.  The tapes have been transferred, he has it digitally.  JW doesn't want it released, so we wait.

[Jurassic Shark 12,781]

I wonder who paid for the transfer.

[Jay 38,749]

I would imagine Universal did it themselves

[Brundlefly 2,392]

4 hours ago, Jay said:

Mike told us in London that Sugarland Express was preserved fine.  The tapes have been transferred, he has it digitally.  JW doesn't want it released, so we wait

...for?

[Disco Stu 15,501]

For Williams to shuffle off this mortal coil, obviously.  So I guess I’m in no hurry for Sugarland to be released if that’s what it’ll take.

[Jay 38,749]

7 minutes ago, Brundlefly said:

...for?

 

He indicated to us he had an idea or a plan of how to release it, something like that.  It should be mentioned in the thread:

 

http://www.jwfan.com/forums/index.php?/topic/28986-details-from-mike-matessinos-london-talk/

[John Dutton 7,183]

16 hours ago, Jay said:

 JW doesn't want it released, so we wait.

 

Wait to die. Wait to live. Wait for an OST that would never come.

[crumbs 14,584]

So something I only recently discovered about this release is that the end credits track was just ripped from the film stems, and that "exit music" was Williams' intended close to the credits suite. I just figured, seeing as mostly everything in the credits is tracked from the score proper, that Kensington Gardens was intended the same way.

 

 

I figured Exit Music was a short suite Williams wrote to close off the soundtrack! Go figure.

[Tydirium 1,219]

Is there any known explanation for why the HOOK OST included the crappy version of "The Arrival of Tink / Flight to Neverland", where the theme disappointingly falls off at the end, rather than the triumphant full version included on this LLL expansion? That choice has always puzzled me.

[crumbs 14,584]

I think the extended ending in the film version was an insert recorded separately, so Williams just included the original recording sans insert.

 

[Jay 38,749]

Yep.  The OST presents how he originally composed and recorded the cue.  The longer ending is an Insert recorded later.

[Tydirium 1,219]

Ah, that makes sense then. Thanks!

[Holko 10,006]

Damn, what a mess of a release this is. Hopefully it won't take one more decade to supersede it.

[bollemanneke 3,529]

Yeah, I hope one of these days we might hear something about an improved release or something.

[Bellosh 3,811]

so i was listening to Hook (not a score i listen to often or know much of tbh), and the cue 'The Banquet' came on, and I was like holy smokes, that sounds familiar.  Well it's quite obvious an episode of Young Indy was temp-tracked with The Banquet cue.  Pretty cool in my book!  Take from the best!