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Howard Shore's An Unexpected Journey (Hobbit Part 1)


Jay

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I'm sorry if i'm very obviously missing this Or it was already stated, but does anyone know where the flute statement of the Shire theme, or the main theme, which ever you want to call it that is played right when "The Hobbit" logo appears on screen directly after the WB, New Line Cinema, and other production logos have appeared, I'm not hearing it on the OST or Special Edition of "My Dear Frodo" which is where it should be, is it tracked form somewhere? I'm dying to hear it again

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It was one of the many rescores recorded after the OST CDs had been locked. Guess we gotta wait for The Complete Recordings!

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Pretty sure it was, the clarinet statement of the Shire theme as Bilbo is speaking after Thorin's hug (2:04 in STB, cut short about halfway through), then a short rising string bit (2:34 of STB) after that (I think as we see the eagles fly away?) is straight out of that track.

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Pretty sure it was, the clarinet statement of the Shire theme as Bilbo is speaking after Thorin's hug (2:04 in STB, cut short about halfway through), then a short rising string bit (2:34 of STB) after that (I think as we see the eagles fly away?) is straight out of that track.

There's some heavily rearranged music from the destruction of Isengard there too. I'm confident that all the 'tracked' music was re-recorded.

The total obliteration of Radagast's thematic material is odd - it's even gone from the Warg chase!

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Pretty sure it was, the clarinet statement of the Shire theme as Bilbo is speaking after Thorin's hug (2:04 in STB, cut short about halfway through), then a short rising string bit (2:34 of STB) after that (I think as we see the eagles fly away?) is straight out of that track.

There's some heavily rearranged music from the destruction of Isengard there too. I'm confident that all the 'tracked' music was re-recorded.

Yup! I forgot about that, but you're right about the Isengard music.

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Bilbo: the one that was heard in the trailer

Erebor: three horn calls

The Arkenstone: B minor chord

The Dwarves/Thorin: heard in "Axe or Sword?" (played by the horn section, and strings later on) and also heard in the first trailer at the end of the Plan 9 theme statement (played by the trumpets)

Smaug: heard in the prologue and in "Axe or Sword?" above Tibetan gongs

Radagast: heard in "Radagast the Brown" above the small percussion

The Necromancer: heard in the tracks for the Dol Guldur scenes

Gandalf: heard at the beginning of "Radagast the Brown"

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Some elements in the bonus tracks definitely sound like synth samples. For example, the violins in "The Edge of the Wild".

Maybe that's something for the next film?

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I saw the film again, and found the reused pieces a little bit less ghastly. But still, Breaking of the Fellowship was out of place completely. Gandalf talks about being afraid, and you hear the Shire whistle. Bad choice.

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Be that as it may, it was incredibly distracting. The other tracked/re-recorded material worked fine, but this along with the Nazgul theme were quite intrusive.

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Not at all, because when he's afraid, he thinks of Bilbo, who gives him courage. Hence the Shire's theme!

And I suppose the one HS wrote and recorded for that very scene wasn't good enough? Bollocks! Someone in the editing/cutting room has questionable feeling for film music.

And yeah, the Nazgul music didn't improve on second viewing.

The music for the eagles flying however is IMHO one of the best pieces HS wrote for Middle-Earth. It's really intriguing to think about what happened there. On one hand, you have scenes that were clearly rescored, like this one, and on the other you have those odd inclusions.

Makes you wonder why it wasn't ALL rescored. No time?

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Be that as it may, it was incredibly distracting. The other tracked/re-recorded material worked fine, but this along with the Nazgul theme were quite intrusive.

The Nazgûl theme fits perfectly because it reminds us that Thorin is part of a family that had one of the Dwarves' ring of power, and could have become one of the wraith of the rings. It's fucking brilliant!

They should have put the Grey Havens theme instead. As the idea of death reminds us of Valinor, the Undying Lands, which is where Sauron's fellow Maiar reside. And as we know, Sauron is responsible for the forging of the Rings of Power and convinced the Dwarf Lords to make their rings. And Thorin is a prince of the long line of Dwarf Kings. And he's fighting an old enemy of his people.

Now THAT would have been brilliant!

Not at all, because when he's afraid, he thinks of Bilbo, who gives him courage. Hence the Shire's theme!

And I suppose the one HS wrote and recorded for that very scene wasn't good enough?

No, it wasn't because it didn't have the Shire theme, obviously.

Oh but it did have the Shire theme. Put in a lovely wistful clarinet solo setting too.

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Be that as it may, it was incredibly distracting. The other tracked/re-recorded material worked fine, but this along with the Nazgul theme were quite intrusive.

The Nazgûl theme fits perfectly because it reminds us that Thorin is part of a family that had one of the Dwarves' ring of power, and could have become one of the wraiths of the ring. It's fucking brilliant!

Not at all, because when he's afraid, he thinks of Bilbo, who gives him courage. Hence the Shire's theme!

And I suppose the one HS wrote and recorded for that very scene wasn't good enough?

No, it wasn't because it didn't have the Shire theme, obviously.

Of course it does, why would I say it?

This instance and the moment when Bilbo escapes Gollum make me think how PJ ticks as a filmmaker. He wants it bold and obvious. The choir, which would have scored Gollum cursing Bilbo replaced by dramatic chase music. No lyricism.

Makes me wonder how all these wonderful soloist pieces made it into LotR in the first place.

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Oh but it did have the Shire theme. Put in a lovely wistful clarinet solo setting too.

Oh, my bad. Well, I have yet to listen to the soundtrack!

Why are you still holding back? You do know that the film will only worsen your impression of the score, right? You're better off sticking with enjoying the album now, before you come out the film feeling too sour to hear Shore's actual intentions for the music.

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With the notable exception of that inexplicable blaring Nazgul theme, I thought all of the "temp track love" I heard made perfect sense thematically. In context, even the Gondor Rising made sense, given the scene it accompanied.

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But its not really. Its a resolution theme to give a sense of prosperity and celebration for the fourth age of Middle-Earth under Gondor's rule. That's why you hear foreshadowing of it early on in RotK or soaring statements after the destruction of the ring.

While it may emotionally fit in that scene in the Hobbit, contextually it makes no sense.

And its easy to come up with far-fetched theories, because in some way or the other, its all related! Heck they could have tracked the fellowship theme there and someone would have argued that the theme is trying to draw the likeness to the fellowship and that the theme stands for the sense of camaraderie...it fits!!

Regardless of the excuses we come up with, that theme was tracked in there, likely due to time restraints. If the proper time and freedom was given, I'm sure Shore would have had different music composed for that scene.

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If I'm remembering correctly, it's the whole "other races kneeling before hobbits" thing. In fact, I'll just call it that now. The "some dudes kneel before hobbits" theme.

It's not used in LotR in such a scene, not even once.

It also plays under the crossroads scene and is in itself a variation of the Anduril/Silver Trumpets theme. Theories can be made endlessly, but the fact that the rest of that scene comprises direct quotations of both "Samwise The Brave" and "Master Peregrin's Plan" cements the idea that it was included merely for effect and has *no* thematic connection whatsoever.

Regardless of the excuses we come up with, that theme was tracked in there, likely due to time restraints. If the proper time and freedom was given, I'm sure Shore would have had different music composed for that scene.

Sorry, but that argument seems fishy. I doubt that Thorin hugging Bilbo was a last minute addition, so that it couldn't have been scored in time. And really, if my memory serves me well, HS did record music for that, it is in "A Good Omen" (hence the track title, because it accompanies that very scene).

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Regardless of the excuses we come up with, that theme was tracked in there, likely due to time restraints. If the proper time and freedom was given, I'm sure Shore would have had different music composed for that scene.

Sorry, but that argument seems fishy. I doubt that Thorin hugging Bilbo was a last minute addition, so that it couldn't have been scored in time. And really, if my memory serves me well, HS did record music for that, it is in "A Good Omen" (hence the track title, because it accompanies that very scene).

Right, but my point was that I seriously doubt Shore wanted the Gondor Reborn theme there. It was probably temp-tracking, and then either Jackson or producers wanted different music there for LotR nostalgia, or the re-editing mess, so Shore had that re-recorded to their will.

It also plays under the crossroads scene and is in itself a variation of the Anduril/Silver Trumpets theme.

You mean the Minas Tirith theme?

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I really prefer thinking it was time issues. Otherwise, the next two films won't be better than this one.

And generally speaking, I can't believe they don't trust HS in his scoring choices. The man is a veteran composer and knows what he is doing. Lord of the Rings speaks for itself. And so does the Hobbit album. I hate to think that they would force him to resample his own scores for a cheap nostalgia kick.

That is not film scoring.

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Indeed. It made me sick hearing "A Hobbit's Understanding" being tracked for the millionth time, and hearing excerpts of "Breaking of Fellowship" hear and there. It was a terribly cheap way to try and bring back the emotional sustenance of the Fellowship finale. And it especially works against it when that same kind of emotion is not displayed on screen.

It's surprising how much of the film relies on LotR nostalgia (the little references). And the what sucks is that a lot of people are going to come out thinking Shore was just rehashing his old stuff. I remembering reading a review from TORN that commented on how the score was much of the same except for the Misty Mountains theme.

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I am going to take a thorough listen today. I have been a bit too busy to truly sit down and enjoy the score from beginning to the end properly after the initial listen.

Mikko - who also really likes Bilbo's Theme(s).

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It makes you sick?

Urgh I really hate fanboys.

It gets really tiring on the ears to hear the same theme, in the same progression, in the same freaking presentation about 15 times in the movie! Its not fanboyism as it has nothing to do with the fact that Shore's original music wasn't heard. The fact is that the aforementioned passage became incredibly redundant to the point where it seemed like a cheap tactic to enforce emotions that were not necessarily there. Basically, that cue had special significance in the LotR films with its big finales and long emotional speeches. To harken back to that is great, but to repeat it ad nauseum for every little moral and lesson along the way is just a cheap way to rile up LotR nostalgia.

On the other hand, I wonder if Shore will give us the same kind of powerful emotional conclusion with Bilbo's Theme.

KK - whose listening to the score and really liking Bilbo's Theme(s) as well

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Jackson obviously tries to evoke connection to LotR with those carbon copy renditions of the old themes. I found it at times rather tiring in its obviousness. But the masses will not even blink at such things, only us obsessive film music fans.

Also as complained before the insertion of the Plan 9's theme everytime the Dwarves do something even remotely heroic became noticeable and when many of the renditions sounded exactly the same it had the feel of film makers slapping it on the footage for the lack of better ideas or consultation with Shore.

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Jackson obviously tries to evoke connection to LotR with those carbon copy renditions of the old themes. I found it at times rather tiring in its obviousness. But the masses will not even blink at such things, only us obsessive film music fans.

I don't know...I think as a casual film goer, I'd notice it too. Although it works at times, stuff like "A Hobbit's Understanding" seemed a bit over the top for some of the scenes it accompanied. The emotion that the music suggests, is not always reflected in the scene it accompanies, leaving you strangely cold and curiously wondering what the music and film is trying to make you feel at this point.

Not sure if I'm the only one who felt that way, but the effect can make the emotional atmosphere seem "artificial" at times.

Also as complained before the insertion of the Plan 9's theme everytime the Dwarves do something even remotely heroic became noticeable and when many of the renditions sounded exactly the same it had the feel of film makers slapping it on the footage for the lack of better ideas or consultation with Shore.

Indeed. I didn't think it would bother me when I saw you first mention it, but it did in film. Particularly in the Out of the Frying Pan chapter. The music is playing some suspense material as Bilbo is about to be attacked, but then out of nowhere, you hear the "Roast Mutton" action variation of the theme as the dwarves attack. It seemed so forced.

In fact, there were a lot moments where the film and the music cuts seemed a bit forced.

I have faith in PJ!

Face it Cosman, its over.

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Why would there be a CR set after this? Assuming that this is the complete score of Shore's original intentions, what more could they add to make it a worthwhile release?

Promo has 16 score tracks according to this: http://www.ebay.com/itm/THE-HOBBIT-AN-UNEXPECTED-JOURNEY-FYC-FOR-YOUR-CONSIDERATION-OSCAR-SCORE-SONG-2CD-/330841075617?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4d07aa2fa1

Also, if those changes were made in any way against Shore's wishes, is he going to want them released?

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Wow apparently my post at Doug Adams' blog, as harmless it was as I was just saying how Shore's original Dwarven music would have fitted the Azog/Thorin duel more than fine, was apparently moderated and didn't make it to the blog's discussion. :(

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Either internet swallowed my message or it did not pass the moderation. Odd in any case.

EDIT: Oh now my post is where it is supposed to be. Good. Good.

This score actually keeps getting better with each listen as I spot new stuff. Christmas time will be excellent time to get acquainted with this music very thoroughly. :)

The Dwarven music has become my favourite material here along with Bilbo's new music. The Erebor theme especially in its relative simplicity is something I find myself humming again and again. Thorin/Dwarves theme is equally noble and yearning melody perfectly capturing their race and personality. Bilbo's theme with its Shire music whole step honest and simple motion and a good hint of Bilbo's Song from RotK is direct and emotional core of the score.

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