Faleel 5,345 Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 But I am sure they expected something just as memorable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodBoal 7,538 Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faleel 5,345 Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 You are right, memorable only comes from....Plan 9! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brónach 1,302 Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 A) The opening notes of My Dear Frodo are perfectly fine to open a film.B) We might end up with a different opening cue altogether. As usual.C) The film doesn't open directly into the Prologue itself but with a bookend scene, that's why it's not straight dark. Note the change at 1:56. And actually looking at the times I get the sligth impression that we are missing music from this area of the film. I would expect the opening scene to be a bit longer than 1:56 including the appearnce of the title and everything.On this ocassion, opening with something like Galadriel's epic opening lines is totally uncalled for. And that's coming from someone who hails that as some of the coolest opening 30 seconds of a film ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gkgyver 1,645 Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 But I am sure they expected something just as memorable.Is there any reason not to? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodBoal 7,538 Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gkgyver 1,645 Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 Shore started working on this score in 2004!! That makes the whole "Plan 9 affair" all the more disturbing.Can you imagine? He had it all planned in his mind since 2004: "And I will play that theme here, and that theme there, and for that sequence I will do things like this..." and suddenly, 9 years later, some dudes come in and screw all of your plans. How would you feel? If I was Shore, I would have left the project. I guess the guy has no artistic integrity whatsoever...We need a new leading motto for these scores.I suggest: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,336 Posted November 20, 2012 Author Share Posted November 20, 2012 Gold star! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete 907 Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 Maybe Plan 9 have also been working on the Hobbit since 2004 and in the end in the only way to settle it was a game of rock, scissors, paper?And has it been confirmed that that melody was written by Plan 9? I'm in the loop at all and haven't read most of this thread, so I'm speaking out of ignorance when I say I'm not convinced. Amazon says Neil Finn's song was written by him, but he has said he used a melody from the film. so that little spiel isn't entirely true. Is it possible the idea that Plan 9 wrote that melody is based on a mistake made on Amazon or one another site?Edit: Nevermind, I just read Doug's blog where he says that it is indeed Plan 9's melody. I guess you all knew that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incanus 5,714 Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 I would not heap all the responsibility of using the Plan 9 song Over the Misty Mountains Cold as a major thematic thread in the film on Shore's shoulders. If anything Shore is a collaborator and I can't think of him flatly refusing Peter Jackson if he suggested they should reprise the song in the actual score. As the musical duties were clearly separated, Plan 9 responsible for the diegetic music and Shore the score, I don't think there was any chance for Shore to come up with a song/melody for the Bag End scene where the Dwarves sing their chorus. Or if there was Shore's music wasnt' used. I actually do not feel so disturbed or worried about the song's inclusion in the score as such a memorable entity as Shore's music is strong and memorable in itself. I would say that living with and being conditioned by the Plan 9 song for a good part of a year and of course its own undeniable memorability is just playing tricks on people. This combined with thinking that it was Shore's composition and finding out it wasn't quite naturally creates some apprehension, especially if you think that this song melody was the best thing about the score. I would just think of the song as another thematic thread, a subtextual nod to the Quest, which transforms from the song of the Dwarves, a diegetic a motto of their purpose, into an orchestral story defining subtextual setting and forms another part of the tapestry. But of course we might either enjoy the music or mope about it. Our choice.P.S. If this ever happened in a Williams score, I would through the roof with lamentations. I let it slide with Shore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete 907 Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 I don't mind at all, I just assumed from its big orchestral statement it was Shore's melody. It certainly sounds great with his orchestrations and the power of the orchestra. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 Anyone thought of the possibility that Shore was absolutely fine with using and adapting the song and actually thought it was a great idea? Fucking hell, the CD isn't even out and people are already second guessing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete 907 Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 It certainly never occurred to me that he wasn't Ok with it. I don't quite get the mindset that would come to that conclusion to be honest. I just assumed it was his melody because it sounds great in the trailer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 People are already disappointed with The Hobbit because Shore didn't single handedly write ONE of the themes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KK 3,307 Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 I was disappointed about it at first, but I got it over it pretty quick. First, Shore really makes the theme his own (he really integrated into the fabric of his Dwarf material). Second, it sounds great in the score, and that's what matters in the end right? Creating great music?I think Doug explained the matter best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 Yes!People should not treat this score as a marred masterpiece. It's not! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke Skywalker 1,794 Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 Marred or a masterpiece? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 No a marred masterpiece. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamieC 13 Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 The cultural construction of the idea of authorship certainly has a tradition of causing its headaches. I guess that's fair to say of literature, movies...indeed, whatever medium you consider. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,399 Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 I was disappointed about it at first, but I got it over it pretty quick.I'm not quite there yet but hopefully after the third or fourth round of counselling I'll have a break through. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brónach 1,302 Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 I don't really care about the Plan 9 issue. I just treat it as if it was all Shore. It's all Shore.I mean, when Rósza uses medieval songs from Spain in El Cid, it's still (more or less) all Rósza to me... Even though I enjoy the original music on its own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wojo 2,453 Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 Yes!People should not treat this score as a marred masterpiece. It's not!Too late. I already cancelled my pre-order. Not one marred masterpiece will be placed into my mailbox in two weeks' time. Not one! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incanus 5,714 Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 That will be the name of my analysis of the score: The Score of The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey: A Marred Masterpiece Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,399 Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 And just link to a pdf instead of typing it up on the board because page numbers are useful for dissertations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4,643 Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 Yes!People should not treat this score as a marred masterpiece. It's not!It's no 'masterpiece' at any level, that's for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crocodile 7,998 Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 Hate the word, by the way.Karol Joni Wiljami 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TownerFan 4,983 Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 Yes!People should not treat this score as a marred masterpiece. It's not!It's no 'masterpiece' at any level, that's for sure.It's not a masterpiece, but it's film music crafted with care, intelligence and taste, something that it's becoming rarer and rarer nowadays, especially in cases of big tentpole franchise movies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KK 3,307 Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 I was disappointed about it at first, but I got it over it pretty quick.I'm not quite there yet but hopefully after the third or fourth round of counselling I'll have a break through.I decided I wanted to avoid all the tears and sob stories. Chaac's shrink on the other hand has seemed to have given up on any hopes of a breakthrough. Poor lad may be marred for life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodBoal 7,538 Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incanus 5,714 Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 Yes!People should not treat this score as a marred masterpiece. It's not!It's no 'masterpiece' at any level, that's for sure.Publicist has spoken! There is not much left to say, now, really.I'll cancel my analysis then. Might have been too gushy anyway.Oh and Doug Adams mentioned this on his blog regarding our collected musings on the content of the soundtrack release and the just ended recording sessions:Tweaks, sweeteners, and revisions were always a part of the process on the Rings films. They're just the film music equivalents of pick-up shots. The Hobbit is following suit. No worries! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,336 Posted November 20, 2012 Author Share Posted November 20, 2012 it's film music crafted with care, intelligence and taste, something that it's becoming rarer and rarer nowadays, especially in cases of big tentpole franchise movies.Yes! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,399 Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 I was disappointed about it at first, but I got it over it pretty quick.I'm not quite there yet but hopefully after the third or fourth round of counselling I'll have a break through.I decided I wanted to avoid all those tears and sob stories. Chaac's shrink on the other hand has seemed to have given up on any hopes of a breakthrough.Chaac's takes council only from L. Ron Hubbard's ghost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KK 3,307 Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 I was disappointed about it at first, but I got it over it pretty quick.I'm not quite there yet but hopefully after the third or fourth round of counselling I'll have a break through.I decided I wanted to avoid all those tears and sob stories. Chaac's shrink on the other hand has seemed to have given up on any hopes of a breakthrough.Chaac's takes council only from L. Ron Hubbard's ghost.That explains a lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brónach 1,302 Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 ¿¿¿??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faleel 5,345 Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 Tweaks, sweeteners, and revisions were always a part of the process on the Rings films. They're just the film music equivalents of pick-up shots. The Hobbit is following suit. No worries!That explains a lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4,643 Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 Yes!People should not treat this score as a marred masterpiece. It's not!It's no 'masterpiece' at any level, that's for sure.It's not a masterpiece, but it's film music crafted with care, intelligence and taste, something that it's becoming rarer and rarer nowadays, especially in cases of big tentpole franchise movies.Shore's writing here seems rather bored, to be honest. He never was the world's greatest orchestrator but a lot of THE HOBBIT sounds really yawn-inducing, only pedantically recalling old material with only a few ideas here and there that actually seem to breath life. It's better than BATTLESHIP & co, yes, but 110 minutes of it is a bit too generous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SF1_freeze 131 Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 Shore's writing here seems rather bored, to be honest. He never was the world's greatest orchestrator but a lot of THE HOBBIT sounds really yawn-inducing, only pedantically recalling old material with only a few ideas here and there that actually seem to breath life. It's better than BATTLESHIP & co, yes, but 110 minutes of it is a bit too generous.Are there any recent scores you actually like publicist? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joni Wiljami 1,206 Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 Anything by Morricone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gkgyver 1,645 Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 Yes!People should not treat this score as a marred masterpiece. It's not!It's no 'masterpiece' at any level, that's for sure.It's not a masterpiece, but it's film music crafted with care, intelligence and taste, something that it's becoming rarer and rarer nowadays, especially in cases of big tentpole franchise movies.Yup.*cough* Skyfall *cough*Also, fellow publicist, you don't seem to know Howard Shore at all and his connection to Tolkien. If there is one thing he wasn't on The Hobbit, then it's bored. He didn't really leave Middle-Earth when finishing Return of the King.And placing The Hobbit just one step above sonic trash like Battleship is borderline insulting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KK 3,307 Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 Yes!People should not treat this score as a marred masterpiece. It's not!It's no 'masterpiece' at any level, that's for sure.It's not a masterpiece, but it's film music crafted with care, intelligence and taste, something that it's becoming rarer and rarer nowadays, especially in cases of big tentpole franchise movies.And placing The Hobbit just one step above sonic trash like Battleship is borderline insulting.Agreed. You don't like the score, that's fine. But that was a bit much.Usually publicist is a reasonable guy with sound opinions (like his opinions on Snow White or Prometheus). But I think you're just trying to make up for the inevitable love this score will get. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4,643 Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 Bad publicist has done it again... Maybe users here find it too outrageous to suggest that THE HOBBIT is not a particular interesting score and seems rather going through the motions, but i'm not utterly deserted in this perception, as in our little german filmmusic community at soundtrack-board.de, there was a rather pronounced disappointment by most listeners after the stream leaked.It may be only in this thread, but i find the STEPFORD-WIVES-like bevahiour going on here much more frightening than someone offering a mildly diverting opinion, but i will leave this thread for good because it just seems all so pointless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,399 Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 I haven't even heard The Hobbit yet, but I already know you're wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodBoal 7,538 Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,399 Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 Just you I'm afraid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodBoal 7,538 Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brónach 1,302 Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 Bad publicist has done it again... Maybe users here find it too outrageous to suggest that THE HOBBIT is not a particular interesting score and seems rather going through the motions, but i'm not utterly deserted in this perception, as in our little german filmmusic community at soundtrack-board.de, there was a rather pronounced disappointment by most listeners after the stream leaked.It may be only in this thread, but i find the STEPFORD-WIVES-like bevahiour going on here much more frightening than someone offering a mildly diverting opinion, but i will leave this thread for good because it just seems all so pointless.But... but publicist, you aren't that rare.There are disappointed people in here, and I'm sure it's not necesary to imagine Shore "going through the motions" when that's likely not the case. You just are bored by the result. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gkgyver 1,645 Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 Shore's writing here seems rather bored, to be honest. He never was the world's greatest orchestrator but ...Not the world's greatest orchestrator, but there are very few composer who have as distinct a style as Howard Shore. And I would even say the sound of his Middle-Earth music is absolutely unmistakable for anything else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crocodile 7,998 Posted November 22, 2012 Share Posted November 22, 2012 Audio interview with Shore on Classic FM.Karol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,336 Posted November 23, 2012 Author Share Posted November 23, 2012 What did he say? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crocodile 7,998 Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 Something about some music for some film...Karol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now