Howard Shore's An Unexpected Journey (Hobbit Part 1)

[Faleel 5,347]

I want a end credits song more in line with In Dreams.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[gkgyver 1,645]

I don't really care who the singer of the second one will be, or what it'll be about, as long as Shore is writing the thing.

Bring back the boy soprano I say.

And generally, a vocal soloist would do the score some good. I kind of missed the solo elements in AUJ.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

A Middle Earth version of Puff The Magic Dragon

[Incanus 5,714]

Spot on BB. Spot on!

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

And generally, a vocal soloist would do the score some good. I kind of missed the solo elements in AUJ.

I am actually glad those were scaled back on AUJ. Now Shore has something he can slowly build towards.

[Incanus 5,714]

I don't really care who the singer of the second one will be, or what it'll be about, as long as Shore is writing the thing.

Bring back the boy soprano I say.

And generally, a vocal soloist would do the score some good. I kind of missed the solo elements in AUJ.

Not many chances for those in so Dwarven adventure up to this point. Perhaps in Rivendell but the scenes were rather short in that section of the film apart from the council.

[Faleel 5,347]

And generally, a vocal soloist would do the score some good. I kind of missed the solo elements in AUJ.

I am actually glad those were scaled back on AUJ. Now Shore has something he can slowly build towards.

"I had to wait for the story to progress, I couldn't use her in Journey"

[Incanus 5,714]

Yeah perhaps there will be more soloist work in the upcoming films.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Could not use who?

[Jay 37,358]

I'm expecting something like that...

[Faleel 5,347]

Could not use who?

whatever soloist will appear in DOS/TABA.

[Incanus 5,714]

Could not use who?

whatever soloist will appear in DOS/TABA.

Shore said that about Renée Fleming, that he couldn't use her in FotR or TTT. The story and music had to develop to a certain level before that. Same with James Galway.

As I have been listening to the Hobbit score in the last couple of days I have to say they made a correct choice when they replaced the Eagle rescue part of the finale with the Nature's Reclamation. As great as Shore's original intention on the OST is it doesn't quite make the thematic and dramatic connection it needs to truly make it as emotionally satisfying as the film version. The quick hint of the Nature's Reclamation in Out of the Frying-Pan really demands that the theme returns in a bigger guise for the eagles' actual arrival and the film version delivers in this respect, in spades. I know Shore was trying to steer away from writing something too familiar and kind of hints at the Nature's music in his original version but as I said, the connection is not strong enough.

[gkgyver 1,645]

I agree.

But something extraordinary like Nature's Reclamation is being written every 10 years or so, so there was not much Shore could have done to evoke the same power, except outdoing himself tenfold.

[Faleel 5,347]

Unfortunately you lose the main title theme bookend though.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Natures Reclamation seems to haunt Shore! He had to use it out of its original context in ROTK, not he was forced to use it again in The Hobbit.

I wonder if he hates it now...

[Faleel 5,347]

Yeah! and he was forced to use the Ring theme in the hobbit too!

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Faleel 5,347]

Oh come on, he won't do that!

















































He will have it re-recorded.

[Incanus 5,714]

The Battle of Five Armies use of the theme is pretty much given. I wonder if there is a choral version of the Misty Mountain theme preceding it.

[Faleel 5,347]

Dwarf choir, singing the actual lyrics, either in Khuzdul, or English.

[Incanus 5,714]

With a deepest possible bass soloist voice getting a 2 minute aria all to himself in the middle. It'll be like a Welsh mining choir, voices from hell.

[Faleel 5,347]

nah, they will use neil finn.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Incanus 5,714]

Yes a much logical choice I admit. But it will be just looping his ya-ya-ya-ya section of the original Song of the Lonely Mountain, possibly re-recorded.

EDIT: If BloodBoal and I both confirm it at the same moment then it will be so! As we if anyone here know the mind of Peter Jackson!

[Faleel 5,347]

I thought the YA'YA'YA'YA's where done by his sons or whatever though?

[Incanus 5,714]

I thought the YA'YA'YA'YA's where done by his kids or whatever though?

The other one is 30 and the other 24 years old. Hardly kiddies anymore. I have no idea how they participated in the music. I have not analysed the song that much. Maybe they truly were the ones hitting the anvil and singing that ya-ya-ya trite.

[Faleel 5,347]

All I knew is that they were his sons, did not know their ages.

[Incanus 5,714]

When in doubt Faleel, always follow your google.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Faleel 5,347]

Anvil's are already a part of Orcish music I think, (mostly Isengard) so... there will probably be Anvils somewhere.

The next song will be called "Live and Let Smaug" BTW.

[Incanus 5,714]

Anvils are also part of Acme's musical world. Haven't you seen Looney Tunes?

[Faleel 5,347]

Now Mr. Incanus, you shouldn't make fun, I was being serious.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Incanus 5,714]

The man in the middle looks like he was hit by one. Right in the snoz.

Now Mr. Incanus, you shouldn't make fun, I was being serious.

And while on the subject of anvils I don't think Shore will use them for Dwarves if they are established for the Orcish musical palette. But then again you'll never know with these artistic decisions.

[Barnald 365]

Dwarf choir, singing the actual lyrics, either in Khuzdul, or English.

I have it in my head now: that section of the wall comes down, Bifur shouts "Baruk Khazâd! Khazâd ai-mênu!" (because he has to say something significant at some point, and they can't always use 'Du Bekar'!), and the Dwarves crash into action, accompanied by the grandest possible statement of the 'Misty Mountains' theme with male choirs singing a section of the lyrics in Khuzdul. That would be something else.

[KK 3,307]

Howard Shore is always looking to expand the musical canvas of Middle-Earth with new colours and sounds. I can't wait to hear the epic synths and foghorns for Smaug!

[gkgyver 1,645]

Natures Reclamation seems to haunt Shore! He had to use it out of its original context in ROTK, not he was forced to use it again in The Hobbit. I wonder if he hates it now...

It's not out of context and never was.

[Jilal 569]

Howard Shore is always looking to expand the musical canvas of Middle-Earth with new colours and sounds. I can't wait to hear the epic synths and foghorns for Smaug!

Don't forget the vuvuzela's!

[Faleel 5,347]

They already had that in AUJ, dale's roof-horns.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Natures Reclamation seems to haunt Shore! He had to use it out of its original context in ROTK, not he was forced to use it again in The Hobbit. I wonder if he hates it now...

It's not out of context and never was.

It was never intended as a theme for the Rohirrim!

[Incanus 5,714]

Natures Reclamation seems to haunt Shore! He had to use it out of its original context in ROTK, not he was forced to use it again in The Hobbit. I wonder if he hates it now...

It's not out of context and never was.

It was never intended as a theme for the Rohirrim!

This depends on are we literal minded with the usage of any and all the themes or do we choose to see this kind of thematic use as expanding the original subtextual meaning of the motif. Others choose to believe it was all a wicked PJ plot as he loved the theme so much he wanted to use it for those scenes in RotK and others consider this just a new fitting application of the thematic material, which Shore came up with and considered to be apt.

LotR scores are special for their thematic density, meaning that there is an individual motif for so many small aspects of the story alongside with the larger ideas. In such a musical structure these small ideas are so specific leitmotifs for these individual things, places, characters or emotions that it feels a bit odd for them to suddenly gain a new meaning. Good examples are the Ringwraith theme and the Gondor Reborn theme at the end of the Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey.

On the other hand to my mind the use of Nature's Reclamation as a symbol of Good and the inherent rightness of Middle Earth itself, which is carried through the Rohirrim into battle against the Evil in RotK, is a very poignant and beautiful thematic subtext, one which I can certainly accept.

I guess the gist of this all is that I can certainly buy a use of theme if it has some kind of acceptable logic or connection to the action at hand in the film.

[gkgyver 1,645]

Natures Reclamation seems to haunt Shore! He had to use it out of its original context in ROTK, not he was forced to use it again in The Hobbit. I wonder if he hates it now...

It's not out of context and never was.

It was never intended as a theme for the Rohirrim!

There is way more subtext going on in the themes and their usage than the pure application of character themes when they are on screen.

I thought you had that understanding figured out after ten years ... You dissapoint me!

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[gkgyver 1,645]

That's The Hobbit. I was talking about the good old days

[tannhauser 101]

I hope with the sessions for the EE Shore gets some time to touch up the existing score a bit and rerecord some of the heavily edited cues in a smoother way.

[SafeUnderHill 205]

[SafeUnderHill 205]

[Barnald 365]

I know we probably won't know the lyrics of the choral parts until Doug's book appears, but I got the second Hobbit chronicles today and noticed a rather random line in Khuzdul:

"Ikhf'id-ursu khazad!' = 'Feel the fire of the Dwarves!'

I don't know if it's been observed before, but I'm quite certain that this is the first choral line in 'An Ancient Enemy', when it first cuts to the shots of the battle. There's another line in the book - 'Imrid amrad ursul!' (Die a death of flames!), but I can't make this out in the track. 'Imrid' seems to feature, and possibly 'ursul', but not in this combination.

A rather insignificant observation in the grand scheme of things but at least it bumps up the thread.