Howard Shore's The Desolation Of Smaug (Hobbit Part 2)

[BloodBoal 7,542]

Maybe whatever happened here was to make things... better?

I'm not denying that. I'm just saying that, while these changes were indeed probably made to make things better, that doesn't mean that things ended up being better in the end. To me, it just seems even more all over the place. Just sayin'!

[crocodile 8,857]

If you try to connect the dots, given some recent comments on the late recording sessions last year, you might arrive at the conclusion it is probably better if Howard Shore gets more time for the actual writing. That can only be a good thing.

Karol

[Incanus 5,848]

If you try to connect the dots, given some recent comments on the late recording sessions last year, you might arrive at the conclusion it is probably better if Howard Shore gets more time for the actual writing. That can only be a good thing.

Karol

Fully agreed Karol!

[Luke Skywalker 2,065]

I think the NZ goverment may have encouraged Jackson to do as many things as he can in his homecountry. With encouraging i mean economical help.

Which is normal and reasonable for a country to do. And for a film producer to accept. (who wouldnt)

[crocodile 8,857]

Yeah, that too. Plus, recording in the concert hall might bring back that wet sound you all love so much, given that Watford has closed down and Abbey Road was too big of a change.

Not to mention the fact \(which we talked about many times before) we can't really tell which orchestra plays which bits in FOTR and that maybe a production of this magnitude wouldn't employ musicians who can't play.

Karol

[Incanus 5,848]

Yeah, that too. Plus, recording in the concert hall might bring back that wet sound you all love so much, given that Watford has closed down and Abbey Road was too big of a change.

Not to mention the fact \(which we talked about many times before) we can't really tell which orchestra plays which bits in FOTR and that maybe a production of this magnitude wouldn't employ musicians who can't play.

Karol

Yes and as Mr. Pope said NZSO members are not half bad players.

[Lewya 361]

I hope this is not the case with DoS -

Right after 4.03

Pope creates gossip. I bet he is watching all the plotting going on in this thread. He is getting the cage ready people.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,616]

He looks like Ian Holm!

[Alex Shore 83]

Or Hannibal Lecter...

Hi again Howard...you make my music long time ago...

now Im here...

and Im going to eat you...

[Once 768]

Couldn't they just use the LPO with the London Voices? That wouldn't have make a big difference in terms of organization... In fact, it would have made everything easier (well, in my opinion, at least).

The big difference is that now Shore is the one that has to be up in the middle of the night on video connection, not Jackson.

[Luke Skywalker 2,065]

LLuís Omar. Black sweater included!

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,616]

Turtle neck!

OMG!

He is gonna do the same on the new Star Wars film!

[SafeUnderHill 205]

[KK 3,310]

Haha, I'm sure Doug was likely pointing to us. This is after all the film score web's centre for cynicism, paranoia and conspiracy.

[SafeUnderHill 205]

[Sharkissimo 1,975]

http://www.jwfan.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=23304&p=945626

[BloodBoal 7,542]

This hasn't been mentioned on the forum has it?

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/entertainment/news/article.cfm?c_id=1501119&objectid=11141634

Dude, it's been posted on the previous page!

Article on recording DOS.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/entertainment/news/article.cfm?c_id=1501119&objectid=11141634

EDIT: Damn you, Prometheus!

[gkgyver 1,647]

Even if we don't have to worry, it doesn't make any damn sense to have the composer neither in the place the movie is shot, nor where the music is recorded, nor where the choir is recorded. I mean, it's like Jackson directing Desolation Of Smaug via webcam from Shanghai.

[SafeUnderHill 205]

[BloodBoal 7,542]

Even if we don't have to worry, it doesn't make any damn sense to have the composer neither in the place the movie is shot, nor where the music is recorded, nor where the choir is recorded. I mean, it's like Jackson directing Desolation Of Smaug via webcam from Shanghai.

+1. What's next? Every musician in the orchestra playing in a different country?

[gkgyver 1,647]

Unless, of course, Jackson and Shore can't stand to be in the same room

[Sharkissimo 1,975]

Maybe they have a restraining order?

[BloodBoal 7,542]

Yeah. Maybe there's a clause in the contract between Shore and PJ that goes like this: "Both parties solemnly swear they won't get near each other during the whole duration of the recording sessions"

[gkgyver 1,647]

Maybe they have a restraining order?

Yes, across a whole continent. God knows what Howard is capable of when he sees PJ.

[Alex Shore 83]

Maybe they have a restraining order?

Yes, across a whole continent. God knows what Howard is capable of when he sees PJ.

[gkgyver 1,647]

"Talk English to me dude!"

[Jim Ware 564]

Where was LOTR recorded? I thought it was in Abbey Road too, but apparently that was only used for AUJ and is why the Hobbit has a different sound to LOTR.

Primarily CTS Watford and Abbey Road. A lot of effort was made to ensure consistency of sound between the two venues.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,616]

AUJ does have that dryer Abbey Road sound.

[Code 000. Destruct. 0. 4,260]

Maybe I'll run into Shore in NYC.

[BloodBoal 7,542]

I'm sure he would have said everything's just fine...

[Code 000. Destruct. 0. 4,260]

"Everything's fine - who are you, again?"

[crocodile 8,857]

Even if we don't have to worry, it doesn't make any damn sense to have the composer neither in the place the movie is shot, nor where the music is recorded, nor where the choir is recorded. I mean, it's like Jackson directing Desolation Of Smaug via webcam from Shanghai.

Chamber of Secrets was recorded without John Williams and it is arguably the best performance of all three HP soundtracks.

Again, if it works for them, then why worry? Maybe Shore works best in peace and quiet.

Karol

[gkgyver 1,647]

Even if we don't have to worry, it doesn't make any damn sense to have the composer neither in the place the movie is shot, nor where the music is recorded, nor where the choir is recorded. I mean, it's like Jackson directing Desolation Of Smaug via webcam from Shanghai.

Chamber of Secrets was recorded without John Williams and it is arguably the best performance of all three HP soundtracks.

And it is arguably the least original.

Apples and oranges.

[Sharkissimo 1,975]

Even if we don't have to worry, it doesn't make any damn sense to have the composer neither in the place the movie is shot, nor where the music is recorded, nor where the choir is recorded. I mean, it's like Jackson directing Desolation Of Smaug via webcam from Shanghai.

Chamber of Secrets was recorded without John Williams and it is arguably the best performance of all three HP soundtracks.

And it is arguably the least original.

That's because of Williams's rushed schedule that year (COS > AOTC > MR).

[tannhauser 101]

It's like Doug said, smooth is good.AUJ was a mess in places due to late film changes. Maybe if Shore had more time to write the final score would have been smoother. So if this results in shore having more time to write and consequently a better score, I'm happy. The NZSO sounded just fine on FOTR. And remember, lots of different orchestras and conductors perform Shores work live to projection around the world and it sounds as incredible as ever. As far as what we can expect of the end product, there's literally nothing to worry about here folks, just much to be excited about.

[crocodile 8,857]

Even if we don't have to worry, it doesn't make any damn sense to have the composer neither in the place the movie is shot, nor where the music is recorded, nor where the choir is recorded. I mean, it's like Jackson directing Desolation Of Smaug via webcam from Shanghai.

Chamber of Secrets was recorded without John Williams and it is arguably the best performance of all three HP soundtracks.

And it is arguably the least original.

Apples and oranges.

I thought we were talking about composer not being present at the recording sessions and how that affects the final recording. Not writing, but recording/orchestra performance.

How is that not related?

Karol

[KK 3,310]

I'm sure he would have said everything's just fine...

Or he could have broke into tears, lamenting on the trauma PJ had him endure while TheGreyPilgrim would be forced to console and comfort him.

[Code 000. Destruct. 0. 4,260]

And, perhaps, kindly offer to take on scoring responsibilities.

Even saying that in jest feels sacrilegious.

[Alex Shore 83]

According amazon... The DOS score will be released also on VINYL on december 3 !

[Incanus 5,848]

Even if we don't have to worry, it doesn't make any damn sense to have the composer neither in the place the movie is shot, nor where the music is recorded, nor where the choir is recorded. I mean, it's like Jackson directing Desolation Of Smaug via webcam from Shanghai.

Chamber of Secrets was recorded without John Williams and it is arguably the best performance of all three HP soundtracks.

And it is arguably the least original.

Apples and oranges.

I thought we were talking about composer not being present at the recording sessions and how that affects the final recording. Not writing, but recording/orchestra performance.

How is that not related?

Karol

Yes this is rather a performance issue rather than of originality of the writing or its quality. The fact that CoS is not as original as HPPS or HPPOA isn't tied to the performance. Naturally it would have been different if JW had been conducting it himself but I wager that it would have not been drastically different. Chamber of Secrets was a scenario, where Williams had to rush a lot of material for the film when his schedule for Catch Me If You Can was pressing on him. Still he apparently wrote new material up to the last minute (of the recording sessions) but the score does have a strong sense of adaption of older materials. But in the case of DoS Shore has been able to focus on writing exlusively for the film full-time, which makes a whole lot of difference.

You can think about it this way: Relinquishing some of the control over the minutiae of the scoring process into the hands of other professionals will both save time for Peter Jackson to supervise the recording sessions at Wellington, while he runs the whole post production circus and for Howard Shore who can focus purely on delivering the best possible music with his staff in New York and delivering it to the capable hands of Conrad Pope and NZSO, who will perform and record it. Pope is an experienced conductor, orchestrator and all around master of film scoring process, so he is able to make the needed adjustments to the music on the podium, omitting bars where needed, changing a solo trumpet to an oboe etc. to conform the score to the picture and to the director's needs. Sure Shore seems to leave some of these decisions to other people but what he gains is free time to work on writing the new cues, doing major changes to older ones, implementing entire rewrites etc. I don't see this (if any of the above speculation hits close to the mark) as a bad thing, rather a newly structured way to create this music and this doesn't differ so much from the norm of modern day film scoring.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,616]

Chamber of Secrets was a scenario, where Williams had to rush a lot of material for the film when his schedule for Catch Me If You Can was pressing on him. Still he apparently wrote new material up to the last minute (of the recording sessions) but the score does have a strong sense of adaption of older materials.

JW wrote around 40 minutes of music, the test was composed or adapted by William Ross.

[BloodBoal 7,542]

[Incanus 5,848]

Chamber of Secrets was a scenario, where Williams had to rush a lot of material for the film when his schedule for Catch Me If You Can was pressing on him. Still he apparently wrote new material up to the last minute (of the recording sessions) but the score does have a strong sense of adaption of older materials.

JW wrote around 40 minutes of music, the rest was composed or adapted by William Ross.

Of that there are still differing testimonies. I believe that there is more than 40 minutes of Williams written new music in that score.

Why don't people want to accept the simple fact that this score will suck big time?

Never!

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,616]

Of that there are still differing testimonies.

Revisionist history. Like Holocaust deniers!

[Incanus 5,848]

Of that there are still differing testimonies.

Revisionist history. Like Holocaust deniers!

Great! Play the Holocaust deniers card on this subject why don't you!

Desolation of Smaug though will be a Howard Shore score through and through.

And regarding the use of London Voices I think they wanted to retain the services of one of the leading choirs in the business, one that has the versatility and ability to deliver various ensembles with hand picked singers for the engagement. Not to belittle New Zealand's choirs but London Voices was a great choice. And they got to keep part of the original LotR sound this way too. And they know how to sing Elvish and Khuzdûl better than anyone in the business.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,616]

That's not the impression I've been getting in the last few weeks.

[BloodBoal 7,542]

It will be the best score from Shore not composed by Shore!

[Incanus 5,848]

That's not the impression I've been getting in the last few weeks.

It will be the best score from Shore not composed by Shore!

Are you both implying that Shore didn't compose the music? Are you being jocund at this point or deliberately obstuse?

[BloodBoal 7,542]

You're the one interpreting it that way! Now, what does that tell us?

[Incanus 5,848]

You're the one interpreting it that way! Now, what does that tell us?

That I have hope and trust in Shore and his music and you are a bunch of worrywort pessimists who love to wind people like me up!