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gkgyver

Howard Shore's The Desolation Of Smaug (Hobbit Part 2)

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I never claimed there wasn't a theme for Beorn.... Just that I didn't notice anything on the OST that sounded like one to me.

Gkgyver posted like six different timestamp in Wilderland and House of Beorn that he thought was Beorn's theme; I personally didn't even hear the same melody being played at all those timestamps. Some of them though, yes. If that's Beorn's theme, it's not very strong or catchy.

I understand what figure GK is pointing to, but I'm disappointed by it being Beorn's theme. Not a very strong one I'm afraid.

But hearing the rest of the score, that's a fault I can live with.

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The TORn review for example says there is no theme for Beorn. Let me see ...

In "Wilderland", from 0:48-0:58, and 1:45-2:15, 2:22-2:31, then the action variation that follows, around 3:15, then slow and ominous from 4:09 to the end. Almost the entire track is an exploration of Beorn's theme.

Then in "The House of Beorn", it starts with the beginning of the theme ascending, passing from the first violins to the flutes, until about 0:26. This is immediately followed by a wonderfully gnarly reading of the theme by lower celli, harmonized with the bassoons.

In between is the first statement of the motif for Mirkwood, followed by the Woodland Realm, then again Mirkwood. Not sure if the boy soprano is singing Beorn's motif.

But starting around 3:05, the violin sections gather a last rousing statement of Beorn's theme.

Thanks for reposting the time stamps Georg! :)

The solo soprano melody returns in High Fells so I think it has to do with Gandalf's quest to find things out (i.e. points to the Ringwraiths) rather than with Beorn. Could it be that they are discussing these things at Beorn's house too.

Which reminds me, it will be interesting to hear the SE bonus track A Necromancer and will it feature more Beorn music since it comes before the House of Beorn or will the film cut to something else entirely between these scenes and it will feature more of Necromancer's themes. And we don't actually know if this bonus will be in the theatrical film at all or will it appear in the future EE.

I never claimed there wasn't a theme for Beorn.... Just that I didn't notice anything on the OST that sounded like one to me.

Gkgyver posted like six different timestamp in Wilderland and House of Beorn that he thought was Beorn's theme; I personally didn't even hear the same melody being played at all those timestamps. Some of them though, yes. If that's Beorn's theme, it's not very strong or catchy.

I understand what figure GK is pointing to, but I'm disappointed by it being Beorn's theme. Not a very strong one I'm afraid.

But hearing the rest of the score, that's a fault I can live with.

It is a very moody and ominous but I guess they will emphasize his dangerous and first threatning nature in the film (the big bear hunting for the dwarves was a sure give away). But I kind of like this motif even though it isn't highly hummable. It has great atmosphere about it.

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I really think that's just a harmonic Shore-ism and not an outright thematic link. But who knows?

Shore and Doug do!

Oh I never said that. I just said I wish the standard edition of DOS was one disc so it would appeal more to the general public, with only the best bits like the LOTR OSTs.

Why do you care if it appeals to the general public?

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So people will stop saying the music isn't as good as LOTR, there's only one theme etc.

Why do you care if people think the music isn't as good as LOTR? The only thing that matters is what you think. You think it's as good as LOTR? Yes? Then that's all that matters.

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Well I think there should be a 1 disc edition, so I can listen to different amounts of the score depending on my mood.

Make a 1 disc playlist on your computer. Done.

More music is better.

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So people will stop saying the music isn't as good as LOTR, there's only one theme etc.

Why do you care if people think the music isn't as good as LOTR? The only thing that matters is what you think. You think it's as good as LOTR? Yes? Then that's all that matters.

To strong minded individuals like you are I, yes. But not to members of the "herd".

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It is nice to be able to spot so much new details with each listen. The more subtle themes like the one for Mirkwood pop up amidst the elven music as well as in Flies and Spiders for example where I had previously missed it. Shore is really having fun with his exotically tinged Woodland Realm material, which becomes one of the central signatures of this score.

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The Universal Music Finland site (it handles Decca's releases here) says that the album will come out on the 5th of December here, meaning next Thursday. Let's see if that proves to be correct. :)

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I am in the last third of the score and it is pretty fantastic all around. I love how Shore has a chance to present the Moon Runes motif and the Map and Key theme in On the Doorstep. Plus there is a magnificent rendition of Thorin's theme here as well.

Bilbo's journey down the secret tunnel into Erebor really takes him sonically into another realm, which is creepy and echoing and uncanny. Shore paints vast alien spaces in the mountain with the eerie echoing gongs that also play part in Smaug's instrumental colours. Haunting stuff.

Smaug's themes come to their own here, slithering and roaring in turn with the heaving heavy bellow like undertones of the 2-chord motif joined by the exotic Eastern tinted theme hinted at Bag End and the wickedly cruel main theme heard in the AUJ prologue. There is interesting interplay between all of these ideas in the final tracks. Shore adds quite unusual (for LotR) rhythms and percussion beats to Smaug's music as well, making it very unique part of the musical Middle Earth.

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The previously discussed passage at the end of Kingsfoil, which is the same that underscores Arwen's prayer over Frodo at the ford of Bruinen in FotR perhaps has some relation to Elven healing in DoS. Perhaps Tauriel will bring some kind of healing help to the people of Lake-Town in the film.

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The previously discussed passage at the end of Kingsfoil, which underscores Arwen's prayer over Frodo at the ford of Bruinen perhaps has some relation to Elven healing in DoS. Perhaps Tauriel will bring some kind of healing help to the people of Lake-Town in the film.

Nailed on to be Kili.

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The previously discussed passage at the end of Kingsfoil, which underscores Arwen's prayer over Frodo at the ford of Bruinen perhaps has some relation to Elven healing in DoS. Perhaps Tauriel will bring some kind of healing help to the people of Lake-Town in the film.

Nailed on to be Kili.

So part of the gang stays at Lake-Town when Thorin goes to Erebor? I would perhaps bet on Bard's children rather than any of the dwarves on this one. Unless you have some better info on this.

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The Universal Music Finland site (it handles Decca's releases here) says that the album will come out on the 5th of December here, meaning next Thursday. Let's see if that proves to be correct. :)

Amazon.de says December 6th in Germany. Let's see ...

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The previously discussed passage at the end of Kingsfoil, which underscores Arwen's prayer over Frodo at the ford of Bruinen perhaps has some relation to Elven healing in DoS. Perhaps Tauriel will bring some kind of healing help to the people of Lake-Town in the film.

Nailed on to be Kili.

So part of the gang stays at Lake-Town when Thorin goes to Erebor? I would perhaps bet on Bard's children rather than any of the dwarves on this one. Unless you have some better info on this.

Yes I thought that was confirmed.

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The previously discussed passage at the end of Kingsfoil, which underscores Arwen's prayer over Frodo at the ford of Bruinen perhaps has some relation to Elven healing in DoS. Perhaps Tauriel will bring some kind of healing help to the people of Lake-Town in the film.

Nailed on to be Kili.

So part of the gang stays at Lake-Town when Thorin goes to Erebor? I would perhaps bet on Bard's children rather than any of the dwarves on this one. Unless you have some better info on this.

Yes I thought that was confirmed.

Ah I must have missed this bit of news. What an odd deviation from the novel. But then again this whole trilogy is one big deviation from the book. Not a big deal for me at this point.

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Kili seems to take a bad wound to the leg during the barrel chase. I guess it must be REALLY bad if he needs major healing.

If Tauriel is to heal a young girl (Bard's daughter?) as well, I imagine that might be in part 3, after Smaug's attack.

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I think Shore really succeeded on the material for Smaug. These rythmic, almost ticking percussion parts combined with brutal low brass really define Smaug's character - intelligent, sneaky and purely evil.

The Universal Music Finland site (it handles Decca's releases here) says that the album will come out on the 5th of December here, meaning next Thursday. Let's see if that proves to be correct. :)


Amazon.de says December 6th in Germany. Let's see ...

December 6th sounds good, I know what I'll be doing next weekend ;)

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I guess the they think it will rack up the tension if the film ends on a cliffhanger with Smaug attacking Esgaroth with some of our heroes still there? I wonder if

Kili could die before the BO5A?

.

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The previously discussed passage at the end of Kingsfoil, which underscores Arwen's prayer over Frodo at the ford of Bruinen perhaps has some relation to Elven healing in DoS. Perhaps Tauriel will bring some kind of healing help to the people of Lake-Town in the film.

Nailed on to be Kili.

So part of the gang stays at Lake-Town when Thorin goes to Erebor? I would perhaps bet on Bard's children rather than any of the dwarves on this one. Unless you have some better info on this.

Yes I thought that was confirmed.

Ah I must have missed this bit of news. What an odd deviation from the novel. But then again this whole trilogy is one big deviation from the book. Not a big deal for me at this point.

I think it has also something to do with many of the dwarves being redundant from a storytelling point of view, and you can deal with them a lot easier in two separate storylines than having 80% just sit "On the doorstep" while Bilbo, Thorin and Balin act out the story.

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The previously discussed passage at the end of Kingsfoil, which underscores Arwen's prayer over Frodo at the ford of Bruinen perhaps has some relation to Elven healing in DoS. Perhaps Tauriel will bring some kind of healing help to the people of Lake-Town in the film.

Nailed on to be Kili.
So part of the gang stays at Lake-Town when Thorin goes to Erebor? I would perhaps bet on Bard's children rather than any of the dwarves on this one. Unless you have some better info on this.
Yes I thought that was confirmed.
Ah I must have missed this bit of news. What an odd deviation from the novel. But then again this whole trilogy is one big deviation from the book. Not a big deal for me at this point.

I think it has also something to do with many of the dwarves being redundant from a storytelling point of view, and you can deal with them a lot easier in two separate storylines than having 80% just sit "On the doorstep" while Bilbo, Thorin and Balin act out the story.

If that was the thinking then I really can't blame Jackson and Co. What made the members of the Fellowship so great was that they split up and each group had their own story lines. I'm interested to see where they go with this.

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The previously discussed passage at the end of Kingsfoil, which underscores Arwen's prayer over Frodo at the ford of Bruinen perhaps has some relation to Elven healing in DoS. Perhaps Tauriel will bring some kind of healing help to the people of Lake-Town in the film.

Nailed on to be Kili.
So part of the gang stays at Lake-Town when Thorin goes to Erebor? I would perhaps bet on Bard's children rather than any of the dwarves on this one. Unless you have some better info on this.
Yes I thought that was confirmed.
Ah I must have missed this bit of news. What an odd deviation from the novel. But then again this whole trilogy is one big deviation from the book. Not a big deal for me at this point.

I think it has also something to do with many of the dwarves being redundant from a storytelling point of view, and you can deal with them a lot easier in two separate storylines than having 80% just sit "On the doorstep" while Bilbo, Thorin and Balin act out the story.

Yes I know there is that film making logic. But then again most of the dwarves are window dressing for Thorin and Balin anyway.

I think it has also something to do with many of the dwarves being redundant from a storytelling point of view, and you can deal with them a lot easier in two separate storylines than having 80% just sit "On the doorstep" while Bilbo, Thorin and Balin act out the story.

If that was the thinking then I really can't blame Jackson and Co. What made the members of the Fellowship so great was that they split up and each group had their own story lines. I'm interested to see where they go with this.

In LotR the natural split up of the Fellowship worked to the advantage of the film makers really. Here they have to force it since nothing of the sort happens in the novel. And yes there is a certain filmic narration logic to it. Makes also the story telling more compelling at Lake-Town when there are members of the company there to witness the events (and these are people the audience is hopefully invested in).

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It's not hard to predict. Something has to happen in order to fill those 160 minutes if Smaug doesn't find his demise in DOS. A quick stop at Beorn's, Mirkwood, the barrel ride, the secret door being unlocked and Smaug's reveal would otherwise not be that much.

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I hope that they will have the two group split up again into two small groups each,. That way, they can have all four groups go to four different locations, and we will have characters to care about in all sorts of places. That'd be awesome.

Was it not enough for them to have Bard, his invented family, Legolas and that invented Elf in Laketown during Smaug's attack? Or did they think we wouldn't care enough about all those characters?

Bard aside I think you know the answer to that already.

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One of my favourite tracks on the album is Flies and Spiders. Absolutely brilliant. Shore's action music has now more focus than ever. It's been already evident last year, but this time he has knocked it out of the park in this department.

Karol

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Was it not enough for them to have Bard, his invented family, Legolas and that invented Elf in Laketown during Smaug's attack?

Tauriel is not invented!

She is a character based loosely on a potential Tolkien figure about which we will possibly be informed about next year, or after 2014, and she gives justification for the Legolas character to do more than a cameo, which would have been nonsense anyway because if you have Orlando, you'll want young female demographics drooling over his colour-graded eyes!

:pfft:

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