Fantastic Beasts And Where To Find Them 5-film series

[Chen G. 3,948]

I much prefer a dumb spinoff to a dumb sequel. The former is just dumb, the latter messes with the finality of the films that came before it.

 

But yeah, they're playing-up Hogwarts way too much! The whole supposed appeal of these Fantastic Beasts films is that they're the first globetrotting Potter-ish films. Of course, the film probably will be quite globetrotting, but as a piece of marketing its very misleading. Not that I mind, but still!

[Holko 9,516]

19 minutes ago, Edmilson said:

If they want to appeal to people's nostalgia so much, why not make a Cursed Child movie with the original cast instead of these Fantastic Beasts nonsense? 

because CC is awful?

 

 

1 hour ago, Jay said:

Like a direct to video half-knockoff. Even that tagline. Yuck.

[TheUlyssesian 2,475]

1 hour ago, Edmilson said:

If they want to appeal to people's nostalgia so much, why not make a Cursed Child movie with the original cast instead of these Fantastic Beasts nonsense? 

 

Oh it's coming. Just you wait. Let the cast age a bit more. It is guaranteed 100% going to happen. 

[Once 605]

32 minutes ago, TheUlyssesian said:

 

Oh it's coming. Just you wait. Let the cast age a bit more. It is guaranteed 100% going to happen. 

If they somehow get Williams involved I'm all for it.

[Edmilson 7,426]

26 minutes ago, Once said:

If they somehow get Williams involved I'm all for it.

That'd be great, but if they take too long, Williams might be too old to score it. 

 

I don't think that, at age 95, he'd be willing to write over 2 hours of music for a blockbuster, but I really hope I'm wrong.

[Jay 37,336]

I does feel like Indy 5 will be his last big score

[TheUlyssesian 2,475]

Williams scoring Cursed Child wouldn't make it any less terrible though sadly. 

[Disco Stu 15,495]

IF Cursed Child was made at any time in the next 5 years, there is a negative one million percent chance that Williams would be involved in any way.

 

Look guys, Williams retired in 2005.  He's done only 1 movie since then that was not somehow Spielberg related (since Kathy Kennedy produced the sequel trilogy, I will consider it an honorary Spielberg connection).  I don't see that changing ever.

[TSMefford 1,509]

2 hours ago, Holko said:

Like a direct to video half-knockoff. Even that tagline. Yuck.

 

Couldn't resist

[Holko 9,516]

Ironically it looks better, the washed-out print and the plastic's distortion brings it together!

[Disco Stu 15,495]

Just now, Holko said:

Ironically it looks better, the washed-out print and the plastic's distortion brings it together!

 

This makes your comment even funnier 

 

[Chen G. 3,948]

14 hours ago, Disco Stu said:

since Kathy Kennedy produced the sequel trilogy, I will consider it an honorary Spielberg connection

 

And its part of what Williams knows is his magnum opus.

 

Totally different situation to his work on Harry Potter. Even his work on Indy is much more significant to his body of work in that he will have written five full scores' worth of it, not 2.5.

[JoeinAR 1,949]

Yeah but one of those "5" is the weak and insipid Least Crusade aka sort of like Raiders without the charm or joy.

[Arpy 4,145]

"Return to the Magic" 

 

You couldn't find a more open way of saying 'Please forget about Johnny Depp and JK Rowling!'.

[mrbellamy 6,275]

11 hours ago, Disco Stu said:

IF Cursed Child was made at any time in the next 5 years, there is a negative one million percent chance that Williams would be involved in any way.

 

Look guys, Williams retired in 2005.  He's done only 1 movie since then that was not somehow Spielberg related (since Kathy Kennedy produced the sequel trilogy, I will consider it an honorary Spielberg connection).  I don't see that changing ever.

 

Eh, I kinda think that if Chris Columbus announced tomorrow that he was doing it, he might be able to rope in Williams. 

 

But I agree he's effectively had one foot out of the industry since 2005 and we've just been lucky that his loyal exceptions have kept him prolific, anyway. 

[Chen G. 3,948]

12 hours ago, JoeinAR said:

Yeah but one of those "5" is the weak and insipid Least Crusade aka sort of like Raiders without the charm or joy.

And one of those 2.5 is Chamber of Secrets which is…well, to use a technical, film theory term….zzzzzzz.

[GerateWohl 4,350]

14 hours ago, Jay said:

I does feel like Indy 5 will be his last big score

And that is perfectly ok. Anyway it makes more sense, due to his growing reputation in the concert halls, that we writes rather concert works than new film works.

 

I think, there is no real challenge left, nothing left to proof, that isn't already proven.

• He is a genius (check)
• He is the greatest composer alive (check)
• He is well regarded in all relevant musical circles (check)
• He can conduct any orchestra he likes (check)

Why the heck would he score another movie if not for his friend Steven Spielberg?

 

 

[crumbs 14,306]

The marketing demonstrates what a thoroughly soulless, cynical exercise this franchise is.

 

So lacking in inspiration that, only three films in, they're relying entirely on characters and locations used ad nauseam in 9 previous films.

[mstrox 6,649]

It’s my understanding that, based on the pre-established lore, you couldn’t tell the tale of Grindelwald without heavily involving Dumpledore.  It was fairly clear to me the moment they unmasked doughy old Johnny at the end of part 1 and made the series about chasing him, at any rate.

 

I thought the first two movies were fun and look forward to watching the remainder when they come onto streaming (presumably HBO Max), which seems like the best way to minimize certain people’s profits without outright stealing the thing.

[GerateWohl 4,350]

The weird thing about changing the actor of Grindelwald is that they already changed the actor in movie 1 from Colin Farrel to Johnny Depp and people in this series are anyway permanently changing shape. Then exchanging an actor without justification in the story is strange.

[mstrox 6,649]

I hope they address like they did in On Her Majesty’s Secret Service.

[Disco Stu 15,495]

Changing actors between films and not referencing it in the film is the normal thing to do, there's no need to address it.  Just look at the Harris/Gambon situation, that is the way to do it.

[Edmilson 7,426]

Or Terrence Howard and Don Cheadle on the MCU.

[TheUlyssesian 2,475]

5 hours ago, mrbellamy said:

 

Eh, I kinda think that if Chris Columbus announced tomorrow that he was doing it, he might be able to rope in Williams. 

 

There is no earthly possibility of Chris Columbus getting the directing job on Cursed Child. None whatsover. Nada. Nil.

[Edmilson 7,426]

You guys know it's gonna be David Yates again for CC, right? Unless these FB movies completely tank with the critics and the box office, I think the job is Yates' to lose.

[Raiders of the SoundtrArk 2,433]

No matter the critics and the box office. If they cared about that they would have keep Yates all this time. He never directed a good Harry Potter and bumped FB1 & 2 box office, plus Tarzan and all that with the Warner

[TheUlyssesian 2,475]

Blockbuster film-making is very very very very different from a passion project film-making. 

 

You need broad competence, reliability, pleasantness, collaborative nature, ability to work with execs and multiple people and capability to bring in the picture on time and on budget. It is not an unremarkable skill. Perhaps does not deliver great artistic masterworks - but does the needful, gets the job done, and provides a lot of the audiences with pleasure and lot of the stakeholders with profits.

 

Yates has all of that. So he stays. 

[Chen G. 3,948]

4 hours ago, crypto said:

The marketing demonstrates what a thoroughly soulless, cynical exercise this franchise is.

 

Meh. I never let the marketing colour the way I think about a film: the film is the film, the marketing is the marketing. The one has no bearing on the other.

[GerateWohl 4,350]

2 hours ago, Disco Stu said:

Changing actors between films and not referencing it in the film is the normal thing to do, there's no need to address it.  Just look at the Harris/Gambon situation, that is the way to do it.

Usually, I agree. I just mean, that in a story, where a person, apart from the exchange of actors, is anyway played by multiple actors because of shape shifting etc. is a little more tricky. 

It is a little bit like in Star Wars Episode 9, where we had a strange mixture of people's appearances, holograms, force ghosts, these remote force connections between Rey and Kylo, Han Solo as a remembrance somehow. I swear, as on the resistence base suddenly Lando appeared out of nowhere and talked to Poe, I asked myself what kind of appearance that is now out of all those that existed in the story.

[bollemanneke 3,342]

9 hours ago, Arpy said:

"Return to the Magic" 

 

You couldn't find a more open way of saying 'Please forget about Johny Depp and JK Rowling!'.

Or COG.

 

2 hours ago, TheUlyssesian said:

 

There is no earthly possibility of Chris Columbus getting the directing job on Cursed Child. None whatsover. Nada. Nil.

Why not, though? He did start the whole thing with a fantastic entry and nobody is exactly eating up the FB movies.

[JoeinAR 1,949]

7 hours ago, Chen G. said:

And one of those 2.5 is Chamber of Secrets which is…well, to use a technical, film theory term…. brilliant.

I agree. 

[Chen G. 3,948]

No you don't.

[Edmilson 7,426]

I really don't know why people consider Chamber of Secrets the worst HP movie. I really like it! It's darker, more sinister and has better action scenes and VFX than Philosopher's Stone (which I also like). Williams' score (that is, excluding the HP1 music Bill Ross adapted) is pretty great. 

[Chen G. 3,948]

13 minutes ago, Edmilson said:

It's darker, more sinister and has better action scenes and VFX than Philosopher's Stone

 

Its true. It has greater urgency than the previous film, higher stakes - but not enough for a second film. I can give the story structure (or lack therof) in the first film a pass in ways that I can't with the second.

 

Its not some terrible abomination, hardly! But its not a very good film, I feel. I do think its the worst (Fantastic Beasts notwithstanding).

[GerateWohl 4,350]

The worst of the eight HP movies is The Goblet of Fire. 

But we had that conversation multiple times, I think.

And I admit, The Crimes of Grindelwald is worse.

[Chen G. 3,948]

38 minutes ago, GerateWohl said:

The worst of the eight HP movies is The Goblet of Fire. 

 

Goblet of Fire is definitely a mixed-bag: there's some bad oversight on special effects (when Dumbeldore reveals the Goblet his eyeline totally is off, for example) and some of it is just overly-emphatic: The great Sir Michael Gambon (whom I otherwise love as Dumbeldore) is just in a state of hysteria almost all throughout the movie for no appearant reason. People dislike the grading on The Half-Blood Prince, but this film is even worst, where the night scenes are graded in ways that just make it look murky and weird.

 

But I do find it a more competently directed film than the Columbus entries, which have this slightly bland mise-en-scene, and the child actors had mostly grown into their parts very nicely compared to some of the hokum that happens especially in Philosopher's Stone. There's little, for instance, that could be improved on the scene of Voldemort's return. So I can't really say its worst than those. I'm not a big fan of Deathly Hallows: Part Two though. Is it worst than Chamber of Secrets? I don't think so.

[TheUlyssesian 2,475]

5 hours ago, bollemanneke said:

Why not, though? He did start the whole thing with a fantastic entry and nobody is exactly eating up the FB movies.

 

His career has straight tanked since HP2 and that was like 2 decades ago. He's not getting near a 200 mil blockbuster anymore. He has made only 2 movies in the past decade, is not in demand, delivered bomb after bomb after Harry Potter and delivered a Razzie nominated film last time he worked with a big budget. He has been reduced to making things like The Christmas Chronicles: Part Two for Netflix.

 

He's toast.

 

1 hour ago, Chen G. said:

The great Sir Michael Gambon (whom I otherwise love as Dumbeldore) is just in a state of hysteria almost all throughout the movie for no appearant reason.

 

This scene really shocked me in the theaters.

 

 

[Chen G. 3,948]

5 minutes ago, TheUlyssesian said:

His career has straight tanked since HP2 and that was like 2 decades ago.

 

He was never a very accomplished director. I mean, I like Home Alone, Mrs. Doubtfire and Philosopher's Stone as much as the next man. But is it due to their mise-en-scene? Not really, no.

[TheUlyssesian 2,475]

20 minutes ago, Chen G. said:

 

He was never a very accomplished director. I mean, I like Home Alone, Mrs. Doubtfire and Philosopher's Stone as much as the next man. But is it due to their mise-en-scene? Not really, no.

 

He was never respected. This is how a top critic assessed his mis-en-scene for the first film - 

 

Quote

it’s obvious that director Chris Columbus positions his camera very arbitrarily and has little idea how to stage action dramatically or visually build to climaxes, relying instead on special effects and John Williams

 

[Chen G. 3,948]

That's not an entirely unfair assesment, frankly.

 

I mean, I don't want to overstate the case: obviously, the movie does work, so obviously the directing is at least functional. There are some nice camera moves (the reveal of the Nimbus 2000 isn't half-bad) and such.

 

But the whole, the camera's just a little bit too in awe of its surroundings. He's also not very good with his actors: the only ones truly excelling are Alan Rickman and a small cameo from Sir John Hurt.

[mrbellamy 6,275]

9 hours ago, TheUlyssesian said:

There is no earthly possibility of Chris Columbus getting the directing job on Cursed Child. None whatsover. Nada. Nil.

 

1 hour ago, TheUlyssesian said:

His career has straight tanked since HP2 and that was like 2 decades ago. He's not getting near a 200 mil blockbuster anymore. He has made only 2 movies in the past decade, is not in demand, delivered bomb after bomb after Harry Potter and delivered a Razzie nominated film last time he worked with a big budget. He has been reduced to making things like The Christmas Chronicles: Part Two for Netflix.

 

He's toast.

 

I think that's overstating the quandary Columbus is in. He's still a likeable Hollywood presence with producing clout and there's a long history of directors and movie stars backed into corners in which they try to get themselves out off the back of a previous hit (Lana Wachowski just attempted this). And if Netflix can be believed - not that I do, really - Christmas Chronicles 2 was a popular enough title. 

 

But I only mention him because he's basically the first person to mention the possibility of a Cursed Child movie in the media and it strikes me as the sort of thing where he might want it bad enough for his career that he'd actually pitch himself for it. Especially if he can't get other things going, he could get himself into those rooms, he could get David Heyman and Warner Bros on the phone, easy. Very generously, I would say it's a less than 50% chance that he could ever get that gig but it's not 0%. It'd be surprising but not THAT shocking. 

 

That said the ball's obviously in Yates' court and he'd have about as much stake in a nostalgic HP reunion glow as Columbus, better track record currently, similar competence as a studio guy, all those things are true of Yates. I'm sure the cast would be happy to reunite with either. And depending on how Secrets of Dumbledore shakes out, Yates might be looking for a little rehab himself lol. He clearly doesn't seem to have any interest in letting Potter go so it's definitely his to lose. 

 

Anyway I'm not saying it would ever actually happen, just that it's literally the only scenario I can think of that could get John Williams on it. And Columbus would have to start filming yesterday. It's not happening. 

[TheUlyssesian 2,475]

Columbus would get laughed out of the room if he pitched himself. 

 

The fact is if a two-part Cursed Child adaptation is made, it would be outrageously expensive - a combined budget of 350-400 mil wouldn't surprise me, and the combined gross of both films could be expected to top 2 billion.

 

It isn't whether he has the skill - that's arguable.

 

But could any rational set of suits trust him with a project so valuable. I think not. 

[mrbellamy 6,275]

44 minutes ago, TheUlyssesian said:

Columbus would get laughed out of the room if he pitched himself. 

 

Just because you would doesn't mean they would. He's not persona non grata. 

 

44 minutes ago, TheUlyssesian said:

any rational set of suits

 

A poor assumption, Hollywood is an insane place and WB in particular has been making awful business sense lately...

 

They could presume to sell two Harry Potter movies by the guy who successfully made two Harry Potter movies which are still fan favorites. Columbus couldn't sell a whole lot else these days but he could sell that. I don't expect they'd be good. 

[Alex 2,835]

I just want Cuaron involved in HP in some capacity. I spot something new every time I watch POA.

[Docteur Qui 1,544]

I think it's a shame that JKR, WB and the Wizarding World brand are so gung-ho about "canonising" the film series as the definitive media portrayal of the Potter world. Now we're in the golden age of streaming, imagine a 10-episode, 7-season long adaptation of the novels with HBO money! It will never happen of course; there's no financial benefit in re-adapting such a successful series with such strong branding, plus casting child actors who can both act convincingly and commit to 8+ years would be a nightmare - something the films struggled with enough is it is. But I'd have loved it if a gifted showrunner got the chance to do something like that.

 

The best parts of the books aren't the complicated plots or whodunnits (though they are occasionally appealing); it's the everyday stuff; seeing the students in class, learning new spells, exploring the grounds, world-building stuff. A longer form of storytelling could really lean into those aspects. It's the reason the FB franchise has fallen so flat; it's full of boring characters, overly complicated plots and fan-servicey cameos/references, and the wizarding world as it has been portrayed since OotP just doesn't feel like any fun. Spells aren't really spells; characters just use wands as guns or shields and it feels like watching a video game. 

 

I look forward to a Lucas-esque reacquisition of the brand, but I'm not holding my breath on that, if there's one thing JKR has shown the world it's how much of a tight grip she has on her IP. At the very least, expand with some ambition and imagination. An animated prequel series set during the founding of Hogwarts produced by Cuarón or Terry Gilliam would be a dream.

[mrbellamy 6,275]

Animated would probably be the way to go if someone wanted to redo the whole series. Easier on kid actors. Idk who really needs to see the whole thing attempted live-action again. 

 

I always thought the obvious prequel idea would have just been to take the backstory in the books that never made it into the movies and just do some miniseries event. Hogwarts Founders, Dumbledore/Grindelwald, Tom Riddle, Marauders, First Wizard War up to Harry. 

[Holko 9,516]

2 hours ago, Docteur Qui said:

and the wizarding world as it has been portrayed since OotP just doesn't feel like any fun.

That's why Yates baffles me. Sure he might be easy to work with but he completely neutered and watered down the brand.

[Edmilson 7,426]

53 minutes ago, mrbellamy said:

always thought the obvious prequel idea would have just been to take the backstory in the books that never made it into the movies and just do some miniseries event. Hogwarts Founders, Dumbledore/Grindelwald, Tom Riddle, Marauders, First Wizard War up to Harry

I'd love an animated series about the First Wizarding World War, the rise of Voldemort and the formation of the Order of the Phoenix, Clone Wars-style. Or maybe one about the foundation of Hogwarts.

 

There's a lot of cool ideas for the franchise, but unfortunately JK Rowling is not George Lucas and she'll keep the franchise always within her grasp.

[GerateWohl 4,350]

6 hours ago, TheUlyssesian said:

He was never respected. This is how a top critic assessed his mis-en-scene for the first film

But didn't he discover America?

[Alex 2,835]

This is an interesting video I watched on David Yates. It’s interesting to see how uninspiring and average his directing is, even compared to Columbus.