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SCORE: Star Trek Nemesis (Deluxe Edition)


BLUMENKOHL
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An interesting way to look at this score Blume. Thank you for sharing your thoughts. :)

And it is fascinating what decade of life experiences can do to your perception of music or work of art. I am constantly making this observation.

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And it is fascinating what decade of life experiences can do to your perception of music or work of art. I am constantly making this observation.

Yep.

It just shows how much your mental "baggage" can bring to the music listening experience.

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Good review. :) I will agree the OST was a crap listening experience, the boot made it a lot better but even then was not complete.

It's good to finally hear this score in pristine format and even the additional's it comes with it.

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Any viewing and listening experience is subject to the receivers interpretation. Blume's is as valid as anyone's. I agree with him that there is a subtle rage to this score.

I reckon it's not really about rage, but disappointment and regret. The score is dark and bitter - anything people's favourite Star Treks aren't. The music seems like a distant ghostly shade of something that was once optimistic and comforting. No wonder so few listeners like it. By the way, I agree with Blume on how it feels. That's the best (worst?) thing about it. But I find it difficult to speculate on what the Goldsmith's frame of mind was. I mean, neither Timeline nor Looney Tunes feel like that. Maybe it's the synergy between composer's mind state and film's themes... Could be.

Karol

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I thought the score fit the tone of the film fine. Shinzon's theme fit his character perfectly. Also the Romulan's were considered "dark and cold" especially with most of their architecture being in gray color. I think there was one episode of DS9...can't remember which one and who it was that mentioned about Romulus being gray, just like the Romulan heart.

Maybe too that's what the producer wanted for the score.

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Any viewing and listening experience is subject to the receivers interpretation. Blume's is as valid as anyone's. I agree with him that there is a subtle rage to this score.

I reckon it's not really about rage, but disappointment and regret. The score is dark and bitter - anything people's favourite Star Treks aren't. The music seems like a distant ghostly shade of something that was once optimistic and comforting. No wonder so few listeners like it. By the way, I agree with Blume on how it feels. That's the best (worst?) thing about it. But I find it difficult to speculate on what the Goldsmith's frame of mind was. I mean, neither Timeline nor Looney Tunes feel like that. Maybe it's the synergy between composer's mind state and film's themes... Could be.

Karol

Oh absolutely. I think it would be a gross oversimplification to say every minute of Goldsmith's post-cancer life and therefore every minute spent writing Nemesis was bitter. Even cancer patients have ups and downs. In fact from my own experiences with co-workers and my own mother, I would say it's a hallmark of the disease: the roller coaster ride nature of it. But the downs to be very down, and they gently seep to every other part of life.

I think it serendipitous that Nemesis ended up on Goldsmith's plate when it did. The film, as average as it was, I think provided an opportunity for Jerry to write more of himself and his life into the music than he normally would.

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I thought the score fit the tone of the film fine. Shinzon's theme fit his character perfectly. Also the Romulan's were considered "dark and cold" especially with most of their architecture being in gray color. I think there was one episode of DS9...can't remember which one and who it was that mentioned about Romulus being gray, just like the Romulan heart.

Maybe too that's what the producer wanted for the score.

Oh it certainly does fit the tone. It's just that people who liked, say, the swashbuckling Wrath of Khan or any of the other Goldsmith efforts for the series... well, they were in for a disappointment. Most people simply don't like moody music, simple as that.

The film, as average as it was, I think provided an opportunity for Jerry to write more of himself and his life into the music than he normally would.

As I said, it is possible.

Karol

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I'm also a deep believer in the idea that that in artistic fields, major and traumatic life events have dramatic impact on output.

For example, I don't think it's a coincidence that there's a demarcation between John Williams of pre-1975 and post-1975. Conventional thought is that the great John Wiliams we know today was born because of Jaws.

I don't think it was Jaws. I think the death of his wife deeply affected him. And he shaped those emotions into something really amazing with his output from then on. From a purely artistic perspective, that life event provided him with profound burst of emotional development that he has used since.

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Interesting, never thought of that. Williams' career shift, that is.

I generally try not to draw such parallels myself, but these kinds of things are bound to happen anyway. It's an artistic medium after all and to create something of any value you need some sort of backbone, sure.

Karol

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Sad part is, like Steef said, I don't think we'll ever really know.

But as unempirical as the process is, that's the story that my brain chooses to create and believe with the small bits of evidence in front of it. ;)

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Well, as long as the music makes you feel and respond, then it means Goldsmith has done something right. :)

Should we take a moment and point out Conrad Pope orchestrated this one? ;)

Karol

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But Stefan... Blume's emotional review, The Hobbit hysteria, John Williams, the considerably reinvigorated post-2005 Horner, The Matrix sequels scores and their considerable following, even Alex Cremers' love for Alexandre Desplat.

All those things have one thing in common.... one person, to be precise.

Can't you see?

Karol

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Maybe over time with the complete release this score might change people's minds. I remember reading not only here on JWFAN but FSM that a lot of people didn't like Star Trek IV's score (some still don't) but a lot of people changed their minds when the complete version was released.

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Ah, but the mix of the Nemesis bootleg is vastly different from that of the Varese deluxe edition. The added prominence of the synths and percussion did wonders for my opinion of the score.

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I should elaborate that I didn't particularly enjoy the complete score UNTIL the Varese edition came out.

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  • 5 months later...

I'm also a deep believer in the idea that that in artistic fields, major and traumatic life events have dramatic impact on output.

For example, I don't think it's a coincidence that there's a demarcation between John Williams of pre-1975 and post-1975. Conventional thought is that the great John Wiliams we know today was born because of Jaws.

I don't think it was Jaws. I think the death of his wife deeply affected him. And he shaped those emotions into something really amazing with his output from then on. From a purely artistic perspective, that life event provided him with profound burst of emotional development that he has used since.

Looks like it's speculation no more!

I told you! I'm the man's shrink! ;)

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I'm also a deep believer in the idea that that in artistic fields, major and traumatic life events have dramatic impact on output.

For example, I don't think it's a coincidence that there's a demarcation between John Williams of pre-1975 and post-1975. Conventional thought is that the great John Wiliams we know today was born because of Jaws.

I don't think it was Jaws. I think the death of his wife deeply affected him. And he shaped those emotions into something really amazing with his output from then on. From a purely artistic perspective, that life event provided him with profound burst of emotional development that he has used since.

Looks like it's speculation no more!

I told you! I'm the man's shrink! ;)

It is striking how spot on you were. John Williams practically used the exact same language in describing the before/after.

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I think the action music from Odds and Ends is some of Goldsmith's coolest. Ironic considering what it underscored, but it just goes to show how great he was, even when composing for pure shit. He basically did this kind of thing for all of his Trek scores from V on. He'd create a relatively simplistic theme for the villains and construe (?) it in various ways throughout the score, at some point (or several) having the orchestra (typically emphasis on brass) play the shit out of it. Examples: Pick it Up, Shields Down, The Drones Attack.

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  • 2 weeks later...

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