Steven Spielberg’s West Side Story (2021)

[A24 4,326]

8 hours ago, Bespin said:

MARIAAAAAAAAAAAAA! MARIAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!

 

I loved that as a kid. That and America ... Which kid didn't, eh? Maybe it's because of my mother, she was a huge fan of the movie and the music, she even had the classical version with Kiri Te Kanawa and José Carreras (which I did not like).

 

But the trailer doesn't scream 'personal stamp' to me, or at least, not an interesting stamp, nor am I eager to hear the songs again. Enough is enough ... 

[Jay 37,287]

I just realized this project was first announced in 2014! Some funny posts on page 1 here 

 

On 05/03/2014 at 5:26 PM, Thor said:

This won't happen, I'm sure of it.

But Williams is a master arranger, so I'm sure he would have done a fine job with Bernstein's material.

 

[crumbs 14,300]

On 06/03/2014 at 7:44 AM, mrbellamy said:

Hopefully he's not stupid enough to go through with this.

 

Well, I've got bad news for you!

[Brundlefly 2,385]

22 hours ago, crumbs said:

Montezuma was the last project I was genuinely excited about Spielberg doing. Naturally he abandoned it (wasn't Zaillian writing the script? What a waste!) 

 

The guy hasn't challenged himself since Munich. That was his last truly great film. I can appreciate the technical mastery of the films that followed but Munich was the last time it felt like he had something meaningful to say.

 

Clearly the personal blowback he got for that film hurt him because he's refused to leave his comfort zone ever since. Other than War Horse, has he even left the US to shoot a movie since 2005?

I absolutely agree. After all, Spielberg is kind of a coward. He could just do whatever he wants at this point in his career. So what is holding him back? Not to be able to make a living due to a financial and critical backlash? Come on.

[Not Mr. Big 4,639]

12 minutes ago, Brundlefly said:

I absolutely agree. After all, Spielberg is kind of a coward. He could just do whatever he wants at this point in his career. So what is holding him back? Not to be able to make a living due to a financial and critical backlash? Come on.

Maybe he just wasn't feeling those projects?

[Disco Stu 15,495]

As always, these Spielberg conversations are so far from my experience I don't really find the discussion worth having, but they're also what every Spielberg thread becomes.  I get tired of reading the same opinions from the same people.  On that note, here's my oft-stated opinion I post every time: Lincoln and Bridge of Spies are great, inspired films with a lot to say to me personally.

 

Also calling him a coward is some rank bullshit.

[crumbs 14,300]

1 hour ago, Brundlefly said:

I absolutely agree. After all, Spielberg is kind of a coward. He could just do whatever he wants at this point in his career. So what is holding him back? Not to be able to make a living due to a financial and critical backlash? Come on.

 

He could be carving out an interesting new direction as a filmmaker, in the same way Scorsese has. He already evolved his approach in the 80s with his move towards serious dramatic works, but he's stuck in this rut of alternating between mediocre "popcorn" movies and Hallmark Channel-esque procedural dramas.

 

He's really embraced Grandpa-Spielberg. He's surprisingly risk-averse for a guy with enough money to fund basically any project he could conceive. His films are still technically competent of course, but feel a bit soulless these days.

 

On reflection, Shia was probably right with his comments after KOCS. Spielberg is less a filmmaker than he is a businessman now; a well-oiled conveyor belt with less of the art and improvisation that defined his earlier success.

 

The more I've seen of Mangold's Indy, the happier I am that Spielberg walked away and handed the series to someone with more passion for the subject matter.

[GerateWohl 4,333]

28 minutes ago, Brundlefly said:

I absolutely agree. After all, Spielberg is kind of a coward. He could just do whatever he wants at this point in his career. So what is holding him back? Not to be able to make a living due to a financial and critical backlash? Come on.

I believe, that nothing is holding him back and he is exactly doing what he wants.

[Disco Stu 15,495]

Perhaps it is Crumbs who is stuck in a rut and should carve out an interesting new direction (preferably out of this thread).

[Jurassic Shark 12,028]

After the specialty labels stopped shipping to Aussieland he's been gradually losing it.

[Jay 37,287]

Just now, Jurassic Shark said:

loosing it.

 

losing it, not loosing it.

[Jurassic Shark 12,028]

15 minutes ago, Jay said:

 

losing it, not loosing it.

 

Fixed before your OCD detected it.

[crumbs 14,300]

3 minutes ago, Disco Stu said:

Perhaps it is Crumbs who is stuck in a rut and should carve out an interesting new direction (preferably out of this thread).

 

What's with the rude comment?

 

Am I not allowed to express my opinion here? I'm not insulting the guy, just posting my thoughts about his career over the last two decades (in the thread for his latest movie, which seems a logical place to discuss such a topic).

 

At least I'm not insulting anyone with a different opinion.

[Disco Stu 15,495]

Well I'm considering changing my username to Ad Hominem Stu

[Jay 37,287]

Differences of opinion are welcome on JWFan, and the opinions being shared here are certainly relevant to the thread they're in.

Personal attacks are not allowed under the rules.

[Brundlefly 2,385]

Why is @Jurassic Shark, the guy that is not impressed by Dune, angry at my comment about Spielberg getting dull?

[Jurassic Shark 12,028]

I'm not angry, I'm just saying the film looks promising.

[mstrox 6,647]

Just clicked into this thread for the first time in a while, saw the trailer, and my eyes glazed over a bit reading the rest.  My opinions:  trailer looks pretty good, The Fabelmans is still a dumb as shit name for a movie, and those of you who generally don’t enjoy musicals need to let joy and love wash over your hearts!!

[Jay 37,287]

I've tried watching musicals, over and over again, seen probably 10-20 of them.  They're just not for me.  And that's fine.

[Naïve Old Fart 9,496]

5 minutes ago, Jay said:

I've tried watching musicals, over and over again, seen probably 10-20 of them.  They're just not for me.  And that's fine.

 

10 minutes ago, mstrox said:

...those of you who generally don’t enjoy musicals need to let joy and love wash over your hearts!!

See, Jay? Yes, yes, to mstrox, you listen!

[Jay 37,287]

I have plenty of joy and love in my life

[mstrox 6,647]

But is it washing over your hearts?

[Jurassic Shark 12,028]

He's got more than one heart? In that case he should have it checked.

[Marian Schedenig 8,172]

[Brónach 1,301]

5 hours ago, mstrox said:

 those of you who generally don’t enjoy musicals need to let joy and love wash over your hearts!!

 

I liked Moana. I guess "fantasy adventure" sells the musical to me lol

[Jay 37,287]

I like that one!

[Naïve Old Fart 9,496]

 

1 hour ago, Jay said:

I like that one!

[Jay 37,287]

Corey Stoll Prepared for ‘West Side Story’ by Watching 1961 Original and Then Forgetting All About It

 

Rachel Zegler & Ariana DeBose interview

[Jay 37,287]

Spielberg appears in this new video talking about the movie, and there's a shot of Dudamel conducting, and you can hear "America"

 

 

 

also you can see the film has been rated pg13 for "some strong violence, strong language, thematic content, suggestive material, and brief smoking"

 

I had no idea what the MPAA meant by "thematic content", turns out there's a wikipedia page for it

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thematic_elements

[JNHFan2000 2,944]

I'm quite excited for this.

I'm really looking forward so a high quality recording of Bernstein's music.

Guess it's a long shot to hope for and album with instrumental versions of the songs.

 

Still think studios should release songs instrumental albums more often

[Jurassic Shark 12,028]

2 minutes ago, JNHFan2000 said:

I'm really looking forward so a high quality recording of Bernstein's music.

 

There's already many high quality recordings of this music.

[Marian Schedenig 8,172]

4 minutes ago, JNHFan2000 said:

Guess it's a long shot to hope for and album with instrumental versions of the songs.

Still think studios should release songs instrumental albums more often

 

But that's not what was written. You'd have to rearrange the songs to work as non-songs. And to an extend Bernstein did that, there are plenty recordings of his Dances from West Side Story.

 

1 minute ago, Jurassic Shark said:

There's already many high quality recordings of this music.

 

Really, many? Of the musical?

[Jurassic Shark 12,028]

Yes.

[Richard Penna 3,670]

1 hour ago, Marian Schedenig said:

But that's not what was written. You'd have to rearrange the songs to work as non-songs. And to an extend Bernstein did that, there are plenty recordings of his Dances from West Side Story.

 

Unless I'm understanding wrongly, people wanting instrumental versions are not wanting some version with the vocals replaced by something else, but versions that are literally the same recording but with the vocals removed. I'd love to hear them more often.

 

I think the demand shown in the various Disney Legacy threads shows the demand, come to think of it. The Toy Story songs work really well with Newman's vocals removed - a testament to his orchestrations.

[Marian Schedenig 8,172]

21 minutes ago, Richard Penna said:

Unless I'm understanding wrongly, people wanting instrumental versions are not wanting some version with the vocals replaced by something else, but versions that are literally the same recording but with the vocals removed. I'd love to hear them more often.

 

We have that on the Home Alone 2 expansion. It doesn't work. It's an interesting behind the scenes look at the instrumental part of the composition, but the orchestration gets thinner whenever the choir comes in, so the most prominent parts are strangely underpowered in the "instrumental" (rather: voice-less) edit. It's a testament to Williams' orchestrations that they treat the choir as part of a whole, and don't just paste it over a self-contained orchestral arrangement.

[Richard Penna 3,670]

The issue of it being thinner when the choir comes in, I don't see as an issue at all actually. As you say, it's a window into the composition process.

 

Either way, everyone wins if they're included, and individuals don't listen to the ones they don't like.

[scallenger 481]

On 23/09/2021 at 6:04 AM, Jay said:

I've tried watching musicals, over and over again, seen probably 10-20 of them.  They're just not for me.  And that's fine.

 

Then do I have the musical for YOU! It's essentially Invasion of the Body Snatchers as a musical comedy. But it's also a musical about a guy who doesn't like musicals! Because, it is called:

 

 

[TheUlyssesian 2,473]

Is it me or are the accents really cartoonish - even though they cast right?

 

Were the actors directed to satirize their accents?

[A24 4,326]

[mrbellamy 6,272]

That's actually a pretty cool poster 

[A24 4,326]

Yes, it is.

[Jurassic Shark 12,028]

16 hours ago, TheUlyssesian said:

Is it me or are the accents really cartoonish - even though they cast right?

 

Were the actors directed to satirize their accents?

 

Political post!

[Jay 37,287]

There's actually two new posters, they form a pair:

 

 

 

Also, if anybody remembers the discussion about the old poster and how it only listed 7 producers, Spielberg, Kushner, and all the guys responsible for the original musical, this one adds a ton of new credits.  Elgort gets top billing, with Zegler getting the "and introducing" credit - crazy to think she was 16 when Spielberg cast her, and 20 now

 

But what's really bizarre to me is that David Newman isn't credited at all for his new arrangements of the underscore, only Dudamel gets a credit for conducting.  Do the producers of this movie think Dudamel has more marketing value than Newman?

[Marian Schedenig 8,172]

21 minutes ago, Jay said:

But what's really bizarre to me is that David Newman isn't credited at all for her new arrangements of the underscore

 

Has David Newman transitioned now?

[Jay 37,287]

Typo fixed

[crumbs 14,300]

48 minutes ago, Jay said:

But what's really bizarre to me is that David Newman isn't credited at all for his new arrangements of the underscore, only Dudamel gets a credit for conducting.  Do the producers of this movie think Dudamel has more marketing value than Newman?

 

From memory Williams usually gets top billing after the cast on Spielberg posters, so I guess Dudamel takes his spot.

 

Still, that sucks for Newman. I'm sure all this stuff is negotiated in advance but surely the arranger should be credited in addition to the conductor? Newman's workload would be so much more significant than Dudamel's on this project, surely?

[Jurassic Shark 12,028]

Didn't Spielberg want to stay close to the original musical arrangements?

[Kühni 485]

.

[Jay 37,287]

16 minutes ago, Jurassic Shark said:

Didn't Spielberg want to stay close to the original musical arrangements?

 

The songs are certainly going to be the same arrangements as always, but the earlier reports was that David Newman was adapting the melodies of those songs for underscore cues to go between the songs, like what Williams did (and won an Oscar for), for Fiddler on the Roof

 

 

11 minutes ago, Kühni said:

Why's Bernstein credited twice? Double the royalties?

 

It's one credit for writing the music that's in this movie, and another credit for writing the music for the original play that the movie is based on

[Marian Schedenig 8,172]

Didn't Newman say that his role in this was rather minimal, because they didn't change much? I.e. more of an orchestrator job than "creative" arranging?