Howard Shore's The Battle of the Five Armies (Hobbit Part 3)

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Alan 689]

Well it seems we'll at least get a Rarities disc(s) with the book but we don't know how long the book will be or if they might have already been working on CR's. Maybe they'll just release everything closer together this time?

[Bilbo 3,709]

Is the Heroics of Legolas on the OST? The Mumakil bit from RotK that features in The Hunters in TDoS? I can't find it but it's in the film.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Barnald 365]

The first 40 seconds of Beyond Sorrow And Grief are the very definition of awesomeness.

Indeed, but do you not think the very beginning is microedited? It seems a little short to me. Kind of like how the opening to 'In the Shadow of the Mountain' was trimmed on the OST

Great news about the book. Given all the changes and inconsistencies with the score (especially after AUJ), this is going to be one very interesting work.

[Incanus 5,713]

Well it seems we'll at least get a Rarities disc(s) with the book but we don't know how long the book will be or if they might have already been working on CR's. Maybe they'll just release everything closer together this time?

Yeah, I think that's quite probable, even if we only get a book.

I think that if we do get CRs, there'll still be one year between each release, and they'll be released yet again during Christmas time. These are expensive products, and they know people wouldn't be able to afford all three if they'd release them over a year, or at least with closer release dates than the LOTR ones. If they release them around Christmas, they make for a perfect gift, and people who can't afford them can ask their relatives to buy the CRs for them for Christmas.

Producing the CRs takes time even if they have a well working template now after LotR. Each took about a year of compiling and research according to Doug. It would be odd if he wrote book based on the current editions of the soundtrack though. It would leave out much material from all over the place. And though Doug mentioned he is working on the Music of the Hobbit Films it doesn't mean it is going to be ready next week, will it?

The first 40 seconds of Beyond Sorrow And Grief are the very definition of awesomeness.

Indeed, but do you not think the very beginning is microedited? It seems a little short to me. Kind of like how the opening to 'In the Shadow of the Mountain' was trimmed on the OST

Great news about the book. Given all the changes and inconsistencies with the score (especially after AUJ), this is going to be one very interesting work.

I think they are not going to go into these changes too much in the book. The previous book didn't discuss them at all (the PDF Annotated Scores did have some discussion on the changes made during the production) but rather the definitive version of the scores featured on the CRs (although curiously Doug fails to mention this in the book entirely so you have to know your CRs to figure that out).

[Barnald 365]

It would obviously help if we had CRs first then...surely something is in the works?

I remember Doug saying Shore worked on choral versions of the Misty Mountains theme, but I don't know if the idea got beyond drafts/mock-ups. If something was attempted it would certainly be one for a potential Rarities Archive. Hopefully we'll get two discs this time!

[Bilbo 3,709]

I never got those PDFs. Disappointed to know there's info in there that I've missed!

Also, work on CR could already have been started.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Bilbo 3,709]

A king among men BB. A King among men.

[Incanus 5,713]

Producing the CRs takes time even if they have a well working template now after LotR. Each took about a year of compiling and research according to Doug. It would be odd if he wrote book based on the current editions of the soundtrack though.

That's not what I meant. I'm sure the book will be based on the complete scores.

And yes, that's another reason why I don't believe the CRs will be released with closer release dates this time around: it takes quite some time to put them together: write the liner notes, make the artwork, etc. If Doug is working on the book simultaneously, it sure is going to take some time. If we're lucky, and if they did already start working on it, then we might get the first one in December 2015 (though I still doubt that, even if I'd like to be wrong about that), then the next two in December 2016 and 2017. But I don't think they'll be released with only 6 months of interval between them.

And though Doug mentioned he is working on the Music of the Hobbit Films it doesn't mean it is going to be ready next week, will it?

I never said that was the case, but who knows, it could be released by the end of next year! Unlike LOTR, where the talks about the book most likely happened after the trilogy was finished, it's possible that this time around, they talked about that much sooner and Doug already started working on it for quite some time now, and only now is he allowed to say that he's working on it.

Now, I highly doubt it'll be released on December 2015, but I think that's it's a possibility not to discard.

I never got those PDFs. Disappointed to know there's info in there that I've missed!

There you go:

The Fellowship Of The Ring - The Annotated Score

The Two Towers - The Annotated Score

The Return Of The King - The Annotated Score

Agreed on all accounts BBoal. I was not implying you were making wrong assumptions at all, just adding my own musings to yours.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Incanus 5,713]

Cantankerous today are we?

Thank you for providing the links to the annotated scores. I believe quite a few missed them when they were originally released on the soundtrack's website in 2005, 2006 and 2007.

[gkgyver 1,645]

Well it seems we'll at least get a Rarities disc(s) with the book but we don't know how long the book will be or if they might have already been working on CR's. Maybe they'll just release everything closer together this time?

Yeah, I think that's quite probable, even if we only get a book.

I think that if we do get CRs, there'll still be one year between each release, and they'll be released yet again during Christmas time. These are expensive products, and they know people wouldn't be able to afford all three if they'd release them over a year, or at least with closer release dates than the LOTR ones. If they release them around Christmas, they make for a perfect gift, and people who can't afford them can ask their relatives to buy the CRs for them for Christmas.

Remember Doug's tweet about a year of near-impossible to keep deadlines. Something bigger is in the works, may not just be the book, which I assume Doug worked on for quite a while now.

[Incanus 5,713]

Well it seems we'll at least get a Rarities disc(s) with the book but we don't know how long the book will be or if they might have already been working on CR's. Maybe they'll just release everything closer together this time?

Yeah, I think that's quite probable, even if we only get a book.

I think that if we do get CRs, there'll still be one year between each release, and they'll be released yet again during Christmas time. These are expensive products, and they know people wouldn't be able to afford all three if they'd release them over a year, or at least with closer release dates than the LOTR ones. If they release them around Christmas, they make for a perfect gift, and people who can't afford them can ask their relatives to buy the CRs for them for Christmas.

Remember Doug's tweet about a year of near-impossible to keep deadlines. Something bigger is in the works, may not just be the book, which I assume Doug worked on for quite a while now.

Well he is also working on the other book on the early days of film music. I wonder when it will be released as it will be no doubt fascinating stuff.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Bilbo 3,709]

Well it seems we'll at least get a Rarities disc(s) with the book but we don't know how long the book will be or if they might have already been working on CR's. Maybe they'll just release everything closer together this time?

Yeah, I think that's quite probable, even if we only get a book.

I think that if we do get CRs, there'll still be one year between each release, and they'll be released yet again during Christmas time. These are expensive products, and they know people wouldn't be able to afford all three if they'd release them over a year, or at least with closer release dates than the LOTR ones. If they release them around Christmas, they make for a perfect gift, and people who can't afford them can ask their relatives to buy the CRs for them for Christmas.

Remember Doug's tweet about a year of near-impossible to keep deadlines. Something bigger is in the works, may not just be the book, which I assume Doug worked on for quite a while now.

Well he is also working on the other book on the early days of film music. I wonder when it will be released as it will be no doubt fascinating stuff.

Same. I know next to nothing about that era of film music but I'd buy the book off the strength of his Lord of the Rings one.

[Barnald 365]

And there's also the book on the Star Wars prequels music!

A most pointless endeavour!

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Bilbo 3,709]

I probably would too. #StarWarsFanboy

[Jay 37,287]

Is the Heroics of Legolas on the OST? The Mumakil bit from RotK that features in The Hunters in TDoS? I can't find it but it's in the film.

Not on the OST

[Bilbo 3,709]

Is the Heroics of Legolas on the OST? The Mumakil bit from RotK that features in The Hunters in TDoS? I can't find it but it's in the film.

Not on the OST

Oh cool. It isn't as long as the version from DoS but it is there and underscores some of the Legolas fight. Or at least I thought I heard it anyway!

[Jay 37,287]

Is the music that plays over the film's title card on the OST?

Is it the Erebor theme at the end of Fire and Water?

[Bilbo 3,709]

Is the music that plays over the film's title card on the OST?

Is it the Erebor theme at the end of Fire and Water?

Answered this somewhere else I think. Fire and Water is the first thing we hear. The bit from 0:53 is what plays over The Hobbit and as far as I can remember we hear the Erebor theme over The Battle of Fire Armies title.

[Jay 37,287]

I knew it!

Btw, I think I found Bilbo's theme! Check out 4:04 to end of The Return Journey!

[Bilbo 3,709]

Oh by the way, I saw someone asking about a hint at the History of the Ring theme in one of the early tracks on the OST. You've probably worked it out by now but yes, there's a moment involving the ring early on and you get a brief hint at that theme.

[Glóin the Dark 1,219]

The bit from 0:53 is what plays over The Hobbit...

Yeah, that matches up exactly with the timings for An Unexpected Journey and The Desolation of Smaug. Somehow seems a shame to break the tradition of having the same theme for each title card in a series. I suppose it would have been an abrupt transition from traditional Shire music to the destruction of Laketown. He could have come up with some Smaug/Shire fusion, though!

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Bilbo 3,709]

The bit from 0:53 is what plays over The Hobbit...

Yeah, that matches up exactly with the timings for An Unexpected Journey and The Desolation of Smaug. Somehow seems a shame to break the tradition of having the same theme for each title card in a series. I suppose it would have been an abrupt transition from traditional Shire music to the destruction of Laketown. He could have come up with some Smaug/Shire fusion, though!

Yeah I know what you mean but The Shire theme really wouldn't have worked.

[gkgyver 1,645]

Is the Heroics of Legolas on the OST? The Mumakil bit from RotK that features in The Hunters in TDoS? I can't find it but it's in the film.

Not on the OST

Huh? The Legolas and Tauriel fight in Bard's house? That's on CD ...

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Bilbo 3,709]

Is the Heroics of Legolas on the OST? The Mumakil bit from RotK that features in The Hunters in TDoS? I can't find it but it's in the film.

Not on the OST

Huh? The Legolas and Tauriel fight in Bard's house? That's on CD ...

That "theme" is reprised in TBoFA and that isn't on the OST though.

[Incanus 5,713]

I just realized that there is a quasi-Hobbit material in Ironfoot. Shore spins a playful and quick variation on the Shire theme in the original version of the An Unexpected Party track (at around 2:24-) in AUJ (the film version was revised), which is reprised in a 4:00 into Ironfoot, now sombre and slow. Interesting little nod to the Hobbit music in this thematic suite.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Jay 37,287]

Yea yea yea, an I right about Bilbo's theme or not?

Funny how GK completely misread Bilbo's post.

[Incanus 5,713]

Shore spins a playful and quick variation on the Shire theme in the original version of the An Unexpected Party track (at around 2:24-) in AUJ, which is reprised in a 4:00 into Ironfoot, now sombre and slow.

So, does that mean that now, we can consider that melody at 2:24 in An Unexpected Party to be a theme or not?

It was always a variation on the Shire theme and since Bilbo's themes were superseded by Shire theme then it makes perfect sense!

Yea yea yea, an I right about Bilbo's theme or not?

Absolutely!

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Bilbo 3,709]

The Party like it's 3A 2099! theme.

[Incanus 5,713]

It was always a variation on the Shire theme and since Bilbo's themes were superceded by Shire theme then it makes perfect sense!

I don't care. How should we call it? A Party In The Shire motif? A Hobbity Party motif? The Party Beat Pattern?

All of them at once I suppose!

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Jay 37,287]

Yea yea yea, an I right about Bilbo's theme or not?

Absolutely!

Hooray! It doesn't disappear completely after all!

[Incanus 5,713]

I'll go with the Party Beat Pattern, in the future. I like that one. Sounds groovy.

Bring your Hobbit sized disco ball!

Yea yea yea, an I right about Bilbo's theme or not?

Absolutely!

Hooray! It doesn't disappear completely after all!

Well nothing is certain until Doug Adams sings. Could be another Bard and His Family variation.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Bilbo 3,709]

Why is Kili's hair the most disturbing thing in the picture for me?

Elrond though. That's believable.

[Incanus 5,713]

Yea yea yea, an I right about Bilbo's theme or not?

Absolutely!

Hooray! It doesn't disappear completely after all!

Check out The Darkest Hour 0:27-0:32 for another small hint of his theme.

[Jay 37,287]

Woah, really!?

hmmm, that's pretty ambiguous.

[Incanus 5,713]

Woah, really!?

hmmm, that's pretty ambiguous.

It sounds like the ending phrase of Bilbo's theme (0:52- in Dreaming of Bag End) but again Bard's Family might have usurped it.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Incanus 5,713]

Just wait to see the film: if it's replaced by the Shire theme there, then it's definitely Bilbo's theme!

Excellent deduction! First rate!

[Bilbo 3,709]

Ok, so Doug reckons the suite is original but it wasn't in place when he saw the film in October.