The DCU - DC Universe

[MaxMovieMan 268]

The DCEU looking back was such a clusterfuck. All of those movies until I’d say maybe James Gunn’s “Suicide Squad” were just awkward. I can’t watch them without cringing I don’t know what the writers and directors were on. Editors were definitely on acid. The MCU at least had good acting and writing so they are easy to watch and look past the thin plot. However I would say now even the MCU is going downhill. It’s not turning into the DCEU though it’s turning into the CWverse, which might be even worse.

3 hours ago, Mephariel said:

I would be much more excited if they scrapped the DCEU and instead focus on serious, auteur-driven films. Maybe that is what Gunn has in mind with the new universe, but I doubt it.

I’m burnt out on cinematic universes. I agree with the standalone movie route. I love James Gunn and everything he’s made comic book wise has been great (I’m sure GOTG 3 will be epic as well) but he’s going to get burnt out quick and to restart a cinematic universe this quickly is risky. Let’s give it time. The hype will build and then people will be ready because as of now at least for me I’m done with these shitty movies.

[mstrox 6,637]

I think DC should focus on good movies instead of A Universe. 

[crocodile 7,973]

In regards to Snyderverse vs Gunnverse news...

 

 

Karol

[Disco Stu 15,495]

5 minutes ago, crocodile said:

In regards to Snyderverse vs Gunnverse news...

 

 

[Nick1Ø66 4,687]

WB will probably figure out the DCEU about the time all the superhero phases in the superhero phase in cinema history has about phased itself out (which can't come a moment too soon). 

[Edmilson 7,367]

21 minutes ago, crocodile said:

In regards to Snyderverse vs Gunnverse news...

 

 

Karol

 

13 minutes ago, Disco Stu said:

 

 

 

Thanks! I saved both of those gifs to use in Star Wars threads 

[Disco Stu 15,495]

I'm certainly more hopeful about a DC cinematic universe captained by Gunn, just in terms of baseline enjoyability.

 

As someone who enjoys the odd artsy fartsy film and loves old Hollywood and all that, I feel like my demo is supposed to be "sick and tired of this oppressive hold the MCU has over the film industry," but I just like this crap, I dunno.

[Stark 306]

I think the best solution is the rework the end of The Flash to rewrite and remove things about the DCEU that need to change while keeping the good elements (like many actors).

[Edmilson 7,367]

11 minutes ago, Stark said:

remove things about the DCEU that need to change while keeping the good elements (like many actors).

Gunn has answered the THR article on Twitter, and his response is kinda similar to what you said. See the full thread below:

 

 

[MaxMovieMan 268]

I appreciate how honest and open James Gunn is on social media.

[Nick1Ø66 4,687]

3 hours ago, Disco Stu said:

As someone who enjoys the odd artsy fartsy film and loves old Hollywood and all that, I feel like my demo is supposed to be "sick and tired of this oppressive hold the MCU has over the film industry," but I just like this crap, I dunno.

 

The issue isn't the movies themselves. There's a place for all kinds of cinema (or there should be), including superhero movies.  

 

The issue is all the films, particularly ambitious genre films, that aren't getting made because superhero movies are sucking up all the resources & talent. There's only so many dollars to go around, so many slots for big, tent pole releases. It's going on over a decade now of massive lost opportunities...films we'll never see because it was just easier to make Ant Man and the Wasp.

 

 

[Edmilson 7,367]

A new report by Deadline detailing the current situation for a lot of DC's major actors and franchises, including Cavill, Gadot, Miller and Johnson. No word on Ben Affleck, though.

 

https://deadline.com/2022/12/dc-wonder-woman-james-gunn-man-of-steel-1235193778/

 

Man, the whole chaos at DC is much more entertaining to watch than 80% of their movies *Michael Jackson popcorn gif*

[Nick1Ø66 4,687]

On 29/10/2022 at 8:46 PM, rough cut said:

So Cavill had some extremely politically correct words about JW’s theme playing instead of HZ’s in Black Adam.

 

On 29/10/2022 at 8:46 PM, rough cut said:

“John Williams’ theme song is obviously incredibly important to the character. It’s something which resonates with the character and everything time I think anyone in the world hears that, I think a large portion of the world who hears that will recognize it immediately as Superman and feel a certain way about it, and I do think it’s wonderful.”

 

“But at the same time, equally so, I think Hans Zimmer’s Man of Steel score was just as wonderful. I have incredibly powerful feelings about that because I remember watching the trailer, the first teasers come out, and I was sitting there with my friend and we were both so excited about it and the way the score plays. Both are incredibly powerful in their own way and both are just as iconic for the character. It was just such a pleasure to be back in the suit, whether it be John Williams or whether it be Hans Zimmer, they’re both extraordinary, extraordinary artists.”

 

Setting aside calling it a “theme song” by someone who should know better, I don't think he's being politically correct here, he's just sticking up for the music for his version of Superman. 

 

Which is appropriate and understandable, but IMO he wasn't as careful with his comments as I'm sure he thought he was, and took it a step too far. Saying how much he loves Zimmer's theme is fine, even thinking it should be the one used in DCEU films is a reasonable take. But saying it's "equal to" William's music is both misguided and unnecessary, if for no other reason than it invites comparison that won't be favourable to Zimmer.  But that's all just opinion, fair enough.

 

However, saying Zimmer's theme is just as "iconic" as JW's is flat out objectively wrong.

[A24 4,323]

To oversee matters, bring back Christopher Nolan!

[Disco Stu 15,495]

What the DC universe could do with less of is self-important pomposity.  No more Nolan, no more Snyder.  I don't want people who make comic flicks to feel like they're supposed to be weighty and important.  

 

What do we want?

 

STUPID MOVIES

 

When do we want them?

 

I dunno, whenever you can get them out.

[A24 4,323]

 

Sure, turn every comic book movie into a ridiculously Wonder Woman '84 and soon Scott, Spielberg, Tarantino and Scorsese will have what they want: The death of Marvel and DC. 

 

 

Let the Russo brothers oversee the DC universe!

[Disco Stu 15,495]

Now we're cookin'!

[Nick1Ø66 4,687]

If DC went down the road of snarky Marvel-style humour, it would just come across as a pale, less funny imitator, which is what it would be. Anyway, they've tried that, and it's mostly been embarrassing.

 

Not that there's anything wrong with the humour in Marvel flicks. At this point the films and shows are action-comedies, and the "comedy" element has been steadily increasing. And Marvel has done very well with that formula. There's clearly a place for it, but I do think there's something to be said for DC taking a different road, not the least of which is b/c their most iconic characters just aren't funny. 

[mstrox 6,637]

I don’t think you have to follow the “Marvel Formula” to make a fun movie.  If anything, DC has an opportunity to make more auteur-based movies, especially if they were to eschew the idea of one unified story (which isn’t too far fetched given things like The Batman and Joker lately).

[Disco Stu 15,495]

44 minutes ago, mstrox said:

 If anything, DC has an opportunity to make more auteur-based movies, especially if they were to eschew the idea of one unified story (which isn’t too far fetched given things like The Batman and Joker lately).

 

 

I would have said that making DC a playground for filmmakers is the most likely strategy, given Gunn's background.  I thought maybe he'd want to be the anti-Feige.  But with the (reported, but not official) dumping of Patty Jenkins' WW3, I'm not so sure.

 

[Goldfinger 59]

2 hours ago, AC1 said:

 

Sure, turn every comic book movie into a ridiculously Wonder Woman '84 and soon Scott, Spielberg, Tarantino and Scorsese will have what they want: The death of Marvel and DC. 

 

 

Let the Russo brothers oversee the DC universe!

 

After watching their two films after Endgame, especially The Gray Man, I think that bringing in the Russos would be a bad idea. They seem to only work best in the Marvel ecosystem where much of the film is laid out in preproduction by the Marvel crew. Their output since leaving Marvel has been very underwhelming which is the last thing DC needs right now.

 

They need to start incorporating characters of varying backgrounds other than the standard bland superhero.  A Justice League Dark featuring Zatanna and Constantine is a good start, and I'm sure Gunn, who has experience elevating lesser known characters, will jump at the opportunity to have DC be different than Marvel and not come off as a pale and moody imitation.

 

[Mephariel 451]

On 09/12/2022 at 4:14 AM, Nick1Ø66 said:

 

 

Setting aside calling it a “theme song” by someone who should know better, I don't think he's being politically correct here, he's just sticking up for the music for his version of Superman. 

 

Which is appropriate and understandable, but IMO he wasn't as careful with his comments as I'm sure he thought he was, and took it a step too far. Saying how much he loves Zimmer's theme is fine, even thinking it should be the one used in DCEU films is a reasonable take. But saying it's "equal to" William's music is both misguided and unnecessary, if for no other reason than it invites comparison that won't be favourable to Zimmer.  But that's all just opinion, fair enough.

 

However, saying Zimmer's theme is just as "iconic" as JW's is flat out objectively wrong.

 

Not sure how his opinion is "misguided." He said they are both equally wonderful, not necessarily the are equal in quality in direct comparison. He also never said Zimmer's theme is just as iconic as JW, he said they are both iconic to the character.

[Edmilson 7,367]

Patty Jenkins about the cancellation of Wonder Woman 3:

 

 

[Edmilson 7,367]

Jesus Christ, I don't even know where to begin...

 

New ‘Superman’ Pic In The Works With James Gunn Penning, Henry Cavill Not To Star; Ben Affleck In Talks To Helm A Future DC Pic

 

Henry Cavill Confirms Exit As Superman: “My Turn To Wear The Cape Has Passed”

[mstrox 6,637]

Sounds like they’re washing the bad taste of the last decade out of DC’s mouth for good.

[Disco Stu 15,495]

Oh I hope that’s right, I have been waiting for them to finally boot Cavill out for years and years. A bad Superman, time to try again.

[Andy 4,070]

I like it. The shakeup is needed. The stink of Snyder still clings and casts a long shadow.  Nuke it all, I say. 
 

The article says they want a young actor.  Maybe a Superboy film? Cavill is almost 40. Too old to begin a new series.  Tough break for a likable actor, but they had the right actor with the wrong filmmakers. 

 

 

Or perhaps they saw Indy 5 and decided it’s time for Christopher Reeve to return to the role. 

[Edmilson 7,367]

What a clown show DC has become...

 

Cavill exits The Witcher to go back to being Superman, only to be fired two months later. 

 

Gunn writing Superman by himself is not good news. Firstly, his brand of off-color humour  doesn't really combine with the Superman mythos. And really, ANOTHER ORIGIN STORY MOVIE? Haven't we got enough of those? 

 

On the positive side, at the very least their upcoming DC universe will be focused on Superman, unlike the disastrous idea by Hamada and the gang to have a DC franchise without Clark Kent and Bruce Wayne.

[mstrox 6,637]

The article says it won’t be an origin story.

[Disco Stu 15,495]

8 minutes ago, Andy said:

Or perhaps they saw Indy 5 and decided it’s time for Christopher Reeve to return to the role. 

 

They’ll cast Brandon Routh again but then deepfake his face to be Christopher Reeve

[JNHFan2000 2,938]

Cavill didn't really leave The Witcher jus for Superman. He left because he amd his managememt felt that he was a 'movie star' now, so he shouldn't make anymore series.

 

Which is dumb, because he's perfect as Geralt.

[A24 4,323]

I stopped watching The Witcher somewhere during Season 2 so it doesn't really matter to me. Whether he is Supes, the Witcher or Sherlock Holmes, his performances never seem to make much of an impression on me. I actually like him the most in The Tudors (a TV series no one here has seen).

 

[Naïve Old Fart 9,488]

Of course I've seen THE TUDORS, yer numpty! How could I not see anything with Sam Neill? 

[Mr. Who 919]

1 hour ago, JNHFan2000 said:

Cavill didn't really leave The Witcher jus for Superman. He left because he amd his managememt felt that he was a 'movie star' now, so he shouldn't make anymore series.

 

Which is dumb, because he's perfect as Geralt.

I haven’t seen the Witcher but apparently he is a big fan of the source material and the show writers actively dislike the source material and Cavill didn’t like the direction in which the show was going.

[Edmilson 7,367]

With Cavill gone, The Rock is probably gone too. 

 

He spent over a decade trying to do his Black Adam movie and, when it finally got released, it was just before Gunn and Safran took over and decided to start everything from scratch, which made its post-credits scene essentially useless.

 

This would be tragic if it wasn't hilarious.

[Jay 37,249]

6 hours ago, Mr. Who said:

apparently he is a big fan of the source material and the show writers actively dislike the source material and Cavill didn’t like the direction in which the show was going.

 

This was my understanding as well

[Yavar Moradi 2,576]

That’s entirely fan speculation though. Cavill himself has not said anything to that effect, let’s be clear.

 

Yavar

[A24 4,323]

It is a bit sad for Cavill though. He was so happy to be back as Supes and he told the whole world about it. It would be the same if your boss tells you you're up for promotion only to hear the position went to someone else. Surely you Marvelites can relate to that? 

[Not Mr. Big 4,639]

It's time to move on from the Snyder films.  Snyder fans are so stuck in the past.  

[Disco Stu 15,495]

So… is Guardians 3 finished or…. ?

[Romão 2,274]

Cavill was never a good Superman, IMHO. I don't really know how to put it, but it's like his eyes don't show intelligence. He looks dumb, somehow

[mstrox 6,637]

Yeah, somehow

[Andy 4,070]

He looked tough, but lifeless.  For a character depicted as breaking the fourth wall with a wink, Cavill lacked that eye twinkle. 

[Naïve Old Fart 9,488]

On 08/12/2022 at 11:34 PM, Edmilson said:

A new report by Deadline detailing the current situation for a lot of DC's major actors and franchises, including Cavill, Gadot, Miller and Johnson. No word on Ben Affleck, though.

 

https://deadline.com/2022/12/dc-wonder-woman-james-gunn-man-of-steel-1235193778/

 

Man, the whole chaos at DC is much more entertaining to watch than 80% of their movies *Michael Jackson popcorn gif*

[A24 4,323]

4 hours ago, Andy said:

He looked tough, but lifeless.  For a character depicted as breaking the fourth wall with a wink, Cavill lacked that eye twinkle. 

 

Be patient, Andy. Soon they'll be able to deepfake Christopher Reeve and everything will be alright again.

[Edmilson 7,367]

Oh gosh, the whole situation at DC would be tragic if it wasn't hysterical.

 

An insider told THR that Cavill was out because, in the end, he was just "a pawn in Dwayne’s failed attempt to control a piece of DC”. 

 

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/movies/movie-news/why-henry-cavill-is-no-longer-superman-1235283791/

 

The Rock wanted to get in the lucrative superhero world at all costs and tried to use Superman for that, but in the end his movie took so long to get into the theaters that, when it finally happened, DC announced Gunn a few days later. It didn't help that Black Adam had poor critics and box office (it will gross less worldwide than Eternals).

[Edmilson 7,367]

 

Dwayne Johnson Says ‘Black Adam’ Won’t Be Part Of DC’s New First Chapter

 

 

 

[Naïve Old Fart 9,488]

"...long-awaited...", is it.

Fuck's sake.

[A24 4,323]

Marvelites and Disney worshippers just want to see DC die. Better yet, they want Disney to buy DC. 

[Naïve Old Fart 9,488]

Hmm. That means they'd have to buy Warner Bros.

Can't see that happening, but, then again...