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The Force Awakens Disney Records OST


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4 minutes ago, BloodBoal said:

 

Yeah, but the difference is that what you want is easily obtainable.

Too difficult to make playslists from the LOOOOOOONNGGGGG albums. The composers should produce 30 minute albums to cater to the people who want only the most hummable passages from film scores.

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17 hours ago, E.T. and Elliot said:

Everyone wants the complete score, I want a shorter OST!

 

3 hours ago, BloodBoal said:

 

Yeah, but the difference is that what you want is easily obtainable.

 

Ritalin for his ADD? 

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There was a terrific performance of John Williams Star Wars Music last night at the Wonderful World of Disney special with William Ross conducting the orchestra including themes from The Force Awakens.

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This is probably embarrasingly late for me to mention, but I just realised that Kylo Ren's motif is derived from the flutes in the Imperial March. But I'm guessing this has been obvious to you all since the OST release, right? :blush: (I did a search on the forum but I couldn't find anything on this)

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Compare Kylo Ren's falling motif (4:20 on Jakku Attack) to the flutes in the Imperial March (at precisely 0:48, and later on in the strings)

 

 

 

While I was recently listening to TFA OST I remembered what Williams was saying about Kylo Ren's motif being an extension of Darth Vader's theme, and it suddenly clicked.

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6 hours ago, loert423 said:

Compare Kylo Ren's falling motif (4:20 on Jakku Attack) to the flutes in the Imperial March (at precisely 0:48, and later on in the strings)

 

While I was recently listening to TFA OST I remembered what Williams was saying about Kylo Ren's motif being an extension of Darth Vader's theme, and it suddenly clicked.

 

I've been trying to hear the similarity you're talking about, but I still don't quite hear it. 

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When I have time tomorrow I'll try to notate and play it, to make it clearer...

 

Basically, the Ren falling motif is a very slow version of the beginning of the third flute phrase (the one that stretches two bars). The pitches are not exactly the same, but the melodic contour definitely is.

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Excellent observations!! I also think the falling semitone and minor third structure has roots in Anakin's Theme itself (especially the B-part of the theme where it has the sequence of three falling lines followed by Vader's motif).

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On 2/29/2016 at 9:21 AM, Bowie said:

Excellent observations!! I also think the falling semitone and minor third structure has roots in Anakin's Theme itself (especially the B-part of the theme where it has the sequence of three falling lines followed by Vader's motif).

 

I'm not musically educated in the slightestest but I do hear a lot of Johnny "calling back" to a couple of prequel moments, more particularly Kylo Ren's theme being similar to the second half of "Anakin's Dark Deeds".

 

(Sorry if I'm late on this, I haven't been on the board in almost three months!)

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I also think that kylo ren passage has roots in ROTS. I heard it the 1st time I listened. it's 'anakin's dark deeds', or 'It cant be' final fanfare or the 'battle of the heroes' "fanfary" opening.

 

Now if the ROTS cues also have roots in the same passage of the imperial march it could be completely intentional.

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People have talked before about the musical similarities between Anakin's Dark Deeds and Kylo Ren's theme. I don't think the music is intended to be thematically linked. I think it's just JW writing Star Wars bad guy/dark side music. Both share a kind of declarative feeling, very loud, repetitive, forceful, and maybe a bit tragic in terms of association with the two characters. 

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It's intentional. That williams wanted some thematical connection with it, that is debatable.

 

It's one of the several small previous-SW-scores-passage snippets williams threw in the score to create nostalgia and 'this sounds like star wars' feelings in the audience

 

As the 'talk of podracing' quote is.

 

Probably Williams just wanted to create similar music to anakin's fall for kylo ren, not a straight quote. It's in the orchestration, fast trumpent fanfares (tripplets?)

 

 

 

 

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Main title an the attack on jakku 4:20-4:34

Anakin vs Obi-wan 0:03-0:22 (thet trumpet fanfare is used several times in the whole piece and the main melody is played by the same instruments as kylo's theme)
Battle of the heroes 0:00-0:27 The main melody of battle of the heroes is played by the trumpets makin it similar to the fanfares in Anakin vs obi wan and attack on jakku.

 

It's more a 'mood' rather than note by note.

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On February 28, 2016 at 3:38 PM, loert423 said:

Just for the record here's a more detailed analysis of what I was talking about (everything has been transposed to D minor for easier comparison):

 

Thank you very much for that analysis. I'm starting to hear the similarity now. I'm still not entirely sure whether it was intentional by Williams to have that connection, but I'd like to believe that it was, because if it was that is yet another incredibly genius thematic link from Williams. 

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  • 3 weeks later...

Yeah, there have been a smattering of posts and debates since December about the similarity between Kylo's "tragic" material and the repeating figures in "Anakin's Dark Deeds", including just above in this thread. 

 

Whether or not it was an intentional reference by Williams is probably not something that will ever be answered....some people are utterly convinced it was, others wave it off as coincidence and merely Williams' instincts taking him to a similar expression of darkness and tragedy. I got really excited when I first heard it and definitely thought it was intentional, but now I kinda side it with it probably being a lucky accident. But I mean, who knows. I don't think it really matters either way, the similarity's there and it's obviously very apt. I don't agree 100% with every aspect of that guy's analysis but I do think it's a great connection and I always think of it now.

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Yeah, I agree. I mean, he's said that he really just works from memory on these scores so I can imagine that as he was working on Kylo's scenes he had all those hours of Vader/Anakin material just kind of stewing around in his mind at various points. There are quotes that do feel like they would have to be deliberate, like the very distinctive final gesture of Imperial March making a cameo in Attack on Jakku Village. Others like this similarity with Anakin's Dark Deeds seem more subconscious, but it certainly evokes the right feeling.

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  • 3 weeks later...
  • 3 weeks later...

OK, I am way late to this discussion, I love the album, love the music but it is one of the worst mixed orchestral scores or symphonic album. When they recorded in Abbey Road they relied on the room mikes and you could hear all the color Williams wrote in his music. Here they have turned up the brass to such a degree and almost eliminated the woodwinds in the mix. Why? You lose all that gorgeous color we heard in the other scores and I believe this is why people were originally slapped back into "This is not Williams usual writing or score". If you listen carefully you can hear the woodwind flourishes and stabs and color, but it's so far back in the mix that it's hardly audible. Were they trying to go for a more modern sound? And by modern I mean incredibly boring monotone works that the other composers seem to only be able to deliver these days. Thankfully this is saved by Williams writing.

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The OST? I think it's great. The sound is much drier than the prequel OSTs and this score is definitely very brassy but it sounds great to me. I don't have any trouble hearing the woodwinds. Everything sounds very distinct. 

 

Edit: I don't recall the initial reaction being people thinking TFA didn't sound like JW. Maybe the initial reception was more negative than it is now, but I don't think people found the score to be un-JW in sound. 

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This recording sounds pretty good to me, for the most part. Nice clarity and punch, even if the woodwinds do get buried a bit in the louder passages. What really annoys me about this recording is the trumpets, though - I don't know if the fault lies with the writing, the room, the performers, Williams' direction, or some combination of all the above, but the trumpets never really "sing" the way I want them to. You never get that brilliant, heroic tone that's found throughout the other Star Wars scores (among many other great recordings). This problem isn't unique to this score, though - it started with KOTCS's tepid trumpets and hasn't gotten much better since. It's a pity...Williams used to get some really wonderful trumpet performances, even on scores when he didn't have the LSO or Maurice Murphy.

 

Otherwise, TFA sounds pretty good to me, if a little "small" at times. But TPM remains the gold standard for how a Star Wars score should be recorded and mixed, as far as I'm concerned.

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8 minutes ago, Datameister said:

But TPM remains the gold standard for how a Star Wars score should be recorded and mixed, as far as I'm concerned.

 

Is there a huge difference between how TPM was recorded and mixed, and AOTC?

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I think TPM sounds a little better, although I have a tough time putting my finger on just what changed. Both sound very good. I think TPM is perhaps a little wetter, achieving a wonderfully "big" sounds but without losing clarity. The horns also have a rather different sound in AOTC - not bad, but different, and I do prefer the way they sound in TPM.

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