Popular Post Taikomochi 1,136 Posted January 21, 2016 Popular Post Share Posted January 21, 2016 John Williams stole my car, and nobody believes me. Incanus, MikeH and A. A. Ron 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incanus 5,713 Posted January 21, 2016 Share Posted January 21, 2016 2 minutes ago, Taikomochi said: John Williams stole my car, and nobody believes me. When will his infernal "borrowing" spree end?!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Loert 2,510 Posted January 21, 2016 Popular Post Share Posted January 21, 2016 It's interesting to find influences in Williams' scores (that's why I like to linger around the "Williams's Most Plagiaristic Cues" thread), but to automatically say that that is a negative thing, or that Williams "stole" that fragment, is silly and premature. It's obvious that in the 200+ hours of film/TV music that Williams has written there will be some melodic fragments which sound similar to other fragments. I even saw someone on another forum go as far as call Williams a "fraud". Lol. What it comes down to is the "too good to be true" phenomenon, where people see that Williams consistently writes good, popular soundtracks, and feel like there is some underlying trick. But there is no trick - Williams is just a talented composer with a lot of experience under his belt (he composes every day!) and a vast knowledge of different types of musical repetoire. Sometimes some other melody might seep into his work...but this is nothing compared to Williams' (and any other good composer's) ability to weave musical material, develop it, contrast it, orchestrate it and sculpt it into an interesting piece of music. (Of course there is also the element of "patting one self on the back", where people like to point out similarities just because they feel good about the fact that they have a knowledge of classical repetoire that extends beyond Ride of the Valkyries and Turkish March. ) MikeH, Taikomochi, Scarpia and 2 others 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taikomochi 1,136 Posted January 21, 2016 Share Posted January 21, 2016 20 minutes ago, loert423 said: What it comes down to is the "too good to be true" phenomenon, where people see that Williams consistently writes good, popular soundtracks, and feel like there is some underlying trick. But there is no trick - Williams is just a talented composer with a lot of experience under his belt (he composes every day!) and a vast knowledge of different types of musical repetoire. Sometimes some other melody might seep into his work...but this is nothing compared to Williams' (and any other good composer's) ability to weave musical material, develop it, contrast it, orchestrate it and sculpt it into an interesting piece of music. You nailed it. I recently found a thread elsewhere on a music theory discussion forum inquiring about JW's musical legacy. They all concluded that Williams would have no legacy because "not a single bar of his music was groundbreaking" or some such shit, and how all of his music was Stravisnky or Wagner or so on, and that he did not have any concert music. It was very infuriating to read. Admittedly, Williams is a film composer before a classical composer, but to suggest that he would have no legacy and that all of his music was simply miming older greats is ridiculous! It seemed pretty evident most people discussing his music had probably only heard the original Star Wars scores. /fanboy gripe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karelm 2,903 Posted January 21, 2016 Share Posted January 21, 2016 25 minutes ago, Taikomochi said: You nailed it. I recently found a thread elsewhere on a music theory discussion forum inquiring about JW's musical legacy. They all concluded that Williams would have no legacy because "not a single bar of his music was groundbreaking" or some such shit, and how all of his music was Stravisnky or Wagner or so on, and that he did not have any concert music. It was very infuriating to read. Admittedly, Williams is a film composer before a classical composer, but to suggest that he would have no legacy and that all of his music was simply miming older greats is ridiculous! It seemed pretty evident most people discussing his music had probably only heard the original Star Wars scores. /fanboy gripe Arnold Schoenberg said: "If it is art, it is not for all, and if it is for all, it is not art." so the belief some elitists have is that popular music that is loved by many can't be art so by definition JW can't be art even when he writes in non-commercial setting. There are many composers who do inhabit both worlds but some prefer to have their work hated so they can say that proves it is art. Circular argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dixon Hill 4,233 Posted January 21, 2016 Share Posted January 21, 2016 25 minutes ago, Taikomochi said: You nailed it. I recently found a thread elsewhere on a music theory discussion forum inquiring about JW's musical legacy. They all concluded that Williams would have no legacy because "not a single bar of his music was groundbreaking" or some such shit, and how all of his music was Stravisnky or Wagner or so on, and that he did not have any concert music. It was very infuriating to read. Admittedly, Williams is a film composer before a classical composer, but to suggest that he would have no legacy and that all of his music was simply miming older greats is ridiculous! It seemed pretty evident most people discussing his music had probably only heard the original Star Wars scores. /fanboy gripe What forum? I'm prepared to lead a task force made up of select JWFan members to deal with the situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taikomochi 1,136 Posted January 21, 2016 Share Posted January 21, 2016 It was reddit. Stay away, for reddit is a wasteland. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dixon Hill 4,233 Posted January 21, 2016 Share Posted January 21, 2016 Indeed it is. As is most of the internet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nightscape94 965 Posted January 21, 2016 Share Posted January 21, 2016 It's never amazes me the separation between critics and musicians talking about Williams. There is a local critic who has badmouthed Williams at least 2 times in the last year every time my orchestra dared to perform one of his pieces. I'm sure his head will spin when they do his violin and cello concerti later this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marian Schedenig 8,177 Posted January 21, 2016 Share Posted January 21, 2016 The most memorable bit from Parsifal is the Dresden Amen anyway. And Wagner "stole" that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
armorb 9 Posted January 21, 2016 Share Posted January 21, 2016 Williams' compositions feature musicians.....playing instruments......JUST LIKE MAHLER!!! What a tool. crumbs 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
indy4 155 Posted January 22, 2016 Share Posted January 22, 2016 Hmm what is The Telegraph referring to here (spoiler alert)? http://www.telegraph.co.uk/film/what-to-watch/best-movie-soundtracks-star-wars/ Spoiler Even more remarkable is the way Williams places motifs in contexts you might not expect, to suggest subterranean links between things that on the surface seem separate. At the very end, when a character linked to the Force appears, we get a chilling whiff of the evil Empire’s theme. To say why would require a spoiler alert. Let’s just say it reminds us that in this story, the roots of good and evil intertwine. To suggest such a weighty thought in a few seconds of music is no mean feat. It proves the Force is certainly still with Williams, so the Oscar really ought to be a shoe-in. Oh I misread empire as emperor--nvmd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spoiler Even more remarkable is the way Williams places motifs in contexts you might not expect, to suggest subterranean links between things that on the surface seem separate. At the very end, when a character linked to the Force appears, we get a chilling whiff of the evil Empire’s theme. To say why would require a spoiler alert. Let’s just say it reminds us that in this story, the roots of good and evil intertwine. To suggest such a weighty thought in a few seconds of music is no mean feat. It proves the Force is certainly still with Williams, so the Oscar really ought to be a shoe-in.
Faleel 5,340 Posted January 22, 2016 Share Posted January 22, 2016 He is referring to The Jedi Steps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joni Wiljami 1,206 Posted January 23, 2016 Share Posted January 23, 2016 And that animal thingy is annoing here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crumbs 14,304 Posted January 23, 2016 Share Posted January 23, 2016 Yeah, he's referring to the brief Imperial March cameo as Spoiler Luke is revealed. It's a brilliant, brilliant musical moment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now