Sharkissimo 1,973 Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 When people are talking about the parallel to the Darth Plaguieus chorale in ROTS, do they mean the second half of Snoke's theme, the bit harmonized in thirds? Db/E->C/Eb->D/F#->C/Eb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dixon Hill 4,233 Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 No clue. Maybe I'm being daft but I don't hear that chorale or anything more than incidental resemblances anywhere, and if anyone would, it'd be me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crumbs 14,305 Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 4 hours ago, Sharky said: When people are talking about the parallel to the Darth Plaguieus chorale in ROTS, do they mean the second half of Snoke's theme, the bit harmonized in thirds? Db/E->C/Eb->D/F#->C/Eb. I think it's just the overall similarity in texture. Most people expected The Emperor's Theme V2.0 for Snoke, but it ended up more reminiscent of the nondescript deep male chorus at the start of Palpatine's Teachings. As far as I know, no one's ever pressed Williams about this specific moment in ROTS, and what the short motif starting at 0:20 represents: Is it specifically for Plageuis? A more general 'Seduction of the Sith' theme? I did notice a vague similarity of this passage to an eerily similar scene in ROTJ where the Emperor seduces Luke with the dark side, but most here considered it unintentional. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leeallen01 2,134 Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 For me it was the whole Spoiler giant thing. Of course I was hoping to all hope that he was a hologram, so when he disappeared there was a sigh of relief that he was. But after the whole realism of the first act being such great practical effects and all based on grounding it in reality, to then have a giant CGI character in your face made it too jarring for me. I was hoping Snoke would be Serkis himself, so when he was revealed as performance capture character in production, I was already disappointed before seeing it, then when I saw Snoke I didn't understand what they were trying to accomplish. His design is boring and unoriginal, very similar to the Gollum/Voldemort look of villains today, and he's completely humanoid. Serkis could have EASILY played it with a bit of make-up. Either cast a physical actor to play him or make him so crazy looking that it has to be CGI. Don't just cast a brilliant physical and emotional actor, for him to them play a bland, seated, human looking villain. Sloppy idea. Even Maz could have been a puppet. Yoda spoke, emoted, and drew us in more as a puppet than he ever did as CGI. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 Maz was an outstanding CGI design Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crumbs 14,305 Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 I found Maz and Snoke distractingly out of place. I didn't feel Lupita or Serkis' performances came through at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 Lupita was OK i guess. Though i have never seen her in anything so its hard to judge. I can kinda see Serkis in the "Bring her to me" moment. Quite Gollum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crumbs 14,305 Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 Lupita was stunningly good in 12 Years A Slave. If ever someone deserved the accolades for a performance, it was her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Datameister 2,037 Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 From a visual effects standpoint, both characters were disappointing departures from the practical-effects-only philosophy Abrams kept talking about. Same goes for Simon Peggs' CG face. Just doesn't look real. Puppetry, prosthetics, and animatronics may have some real limitations in what they can do, and they may cost a lot of time and effort and money, but at least you invariably end up with something that looks real, like it was physically there on the set. leeallen01 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 Modern audiences prefer CGI because something created on a computer gives them comfort that they're watching something that was made for their generation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 Maz looked very real. Check the superb rendering of her eyelids once she takes her glasses off. ILM obviously studied facial and skin features of elderly people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,323 Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 Maz looked super real. Snoke looked super fake. CGI is a tool like any other that can be used well or poorly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 2 minutes ago, Jay said: Max looked super real. Snoke looked super fake. Thank you! As a character Maz wasnt anything interesting, but the CGI was top notch. Snoke....I will reserve final judgement till he see the actual character instead of a hologram of him. But right now I'm not impressed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488 Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 There was no reason to make Snoke an uncanny valley CGI motion capture thing since he was a humanoid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Datameister 2,037 Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 51 minutes ago, Jay said: Maz looked super real. Snoke looked super fake. CGI is a tool like any other that can be used well or poorly. I would at least agree that Maz looked better than Snoke. But I could never fully believe that she was an actual physical being who was there in the same environment as the characters. That's just really tough to accomplish with an organic humanoid being. Davy Jones is one of the very few instances I've found convincing. You're absolutely right that CG is nothing more than a tool. I've seen a lot of fantastic uses of it, even just within this film. But when it comes to creating animals with appearance and (especially) motion that are indistinguishable from the real thing...well, our brains are unfortunately really good at picking up on even the most subtle differences. We have billions of years of evolution to thank for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,323 Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 Yup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andreas 112 Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 Like the movie. Wait 2 years to see more :-) Andreas Smeltington 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leeallen01 2,134 Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 I think the only CGI character I've seen that interacted with real actors perfectly, and that I didn't care one bit about being CGI, was Paul the alien. Flawless design, flawless effects, flawless integration into the real world, and the comedic writing combined with Seth Rogen giving him a personality, I was totally convinced. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Not Mr. Big 4,639 Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 4 minutes ago, leeallen01 said: I think the only CGI character I've seen that interacted with real actors perfectly, and that I didn't care one bit about being CGI, was Paul the alien. Flawless design, flawless effects, flawless integration into the real world, and the comedic writing combined with Seth Rogen giving him a personality, I was totally convinced. If only Williams had scored that film as originally intended... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leeallen01 2,134 Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 9 minutes ago, Mr. Big said: If only Williams had scored that film as originally intended... Arnold does a kick ass tribute to Williams in the finale. I mean come on Hollywoodland! He wrote this for a comedy film about a stoner alien named Paul. Arnold is so underutilised that it hurts my mind palace. Someone needs to get him back into big fantasy and sci-fi films asap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karelm 2,903 Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 33 minutes ago, leeallen01 said: Arnold does a kick ass tribute to Williams in the finale. I mean come on Hollywoodland! He wrote this for a comedy film about a stoner alien named Paul. Arnold is so underutilised that it hurts my mind palace. Someone needs to get him back into big fantasy and sci-fi films asap. Hey, that was good. What do you guys think of Aaron Zigman's Escape from Planet Earth? Very Williamsy: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leeallen01 2,134 Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 Very fun. Nice piece. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Not Mr. Big 4,639 Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 Great music from a great film Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taikomochi 1,136 Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 So,I have a general question for everyone: Are there microedits that bother anyone? It seems like there are quite a few microedits, but are there any that people are actually put off by, either because of good material missing or the edits themselves being jarring? I haven't found any that I thought actually disrupted the flow of the music. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bespin 8,480 Posted January 11, 2016 Share Posted January 11, 2016 Everybody thinks Sknoke is Plagueis because of the music. Last week, I listened a soundtrack of John Williams, not a Star Wars one, and there was a similar cue with male voices. It seems a recurrent pattern or a trick John Williams already used after or before ROTS for a threatening effect. But I don't recall in which soundtrack I heard that cue, maybe "War of Worlds"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Datameister 2,037 Posted January 11, 2016 Share Posted January 11, 2016 3 hours ago, Taikomochi said: So,I have a general question for everyone: Are there microedits that bother anyone? It seems like there are quite a few microedits, but are there any that people are actually put off by, either because of good material missing or the edits themselves being jarring? I haven't found any that I thought actually disrupted the flow of the music. There's one edit - at least I think it's an edit - that sounds very jarring to me. It's near the beginning of "The Ways of the Force", right before the unused statement of the Force theme. I don't know what they would have edited out there, since it matches up with the film, but it doesn't sound right. A detailed comparison with the FYC reveals a multitude of so-called microedits, none of which omit anything truly essential, but I still prefer the full-length original cues. Or at least, as close as we can currently get to them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taikomochi 1,136 Posted January 11, 2016 Share Posted January 11, 2016 Just now, Datameister said: There's one edit - at least I think it's an edit - that sounds very jarring to me. It's near the beginning of "The Ways of the Force", right before the unused statement of the Force theme. I don't know what they would have edited out there, since it matches up with the film, but it doesn't sound right. I agree that that one does sound awkward, but since I don't see where any material could have been edited out, I suppose it doesn't bother me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BTR1701 59 Posted January 11, 2016 Share Posted January 11, 2016 On 12/16/2015 at 5:55 AM, Stefancos said: It's such a pity this wasnt done by the LSO. You can hear the incompetent oafs in Hollywood stuggling to play this. Some of them sound like they dont even have thumbs! Don't be ridiculous. The studio musicians in Hollywood are some of the best in the world. Not many professional symphony orchestra players could do what they do on a regular basis. Many cues/scores are sight-read and recorded on the first take with no rehearsal. On the other hand, even the vaunted London Symphony has had its screw-ups. There are so many split notes in the French horns in New Hope's "TIE Fighter Attack", I'm amazed to this day that Williams let that take stand without doing it again. And at 3:57 in Last Crusade's "Belly of the Steel Beast", the trumpets are so flat in makes me cringe every time I hear it. Every performance of every score has it's minor flubs, no matter the orchestra playing it. People aren't computers and don't deliver perfect performances. Thank god. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted January 11, 2016 Share Posted January 11, 2016 Irony newbie...sarcasm, irony and hyperbole! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BTR1701 59 Posted January 11, 2016 Share Posted January 11, 2016 Just now, Stefancos said: Irony newbie...sarcasm, irony and hyperbole! Newbie? LOL! Whatever, dude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted January 11, 2016 Share Posted January 11, 2016 From my POV, yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BTR1701 59 Posted January 11, 2016 Share Posted January 11, 2016 Just now, Stefancos said: From my POV, yes. There's a lesson in there somewhere for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted January 11, 2016 Share Posted January 11, 2016 Which is? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leeallen01 2,134 Posted January 11, 2016 Share Posted January 11, 2016 You should have known the newbies were plotting to take over! From my point of view the veterans are evil! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,399 Posted January 11, 2016 Share Posted January 11, 2016 19 hours ago, Jay said: Maz looked super real. Snoke looked super fake. And yet I quite enjoyed Snoke really. Just goes to show that bad writing is even worse than bad CGI. S'pose it means bad writing will always be the absolute worst. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted January 11, 2016 Share Posted January 11, 2016 YOU WERE THOSE CHOSEN ONE! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leeallen01 2,134 Posted January 11, 2016 Share Posted January 11, 2016 It sounds to me that 0:29 - 0:39 in 'Rey Meets BB-8' is reprised at 0:08 - 0:22 in 'Follow Me.' First one is innocent, second is more emotional. But both scenes involve BB-8. Could be his little theme? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Not Mr. Big 4,639 Posted January 12, 2016 Share Posted January 12, 2016 This might be a stretch but I'm hearing Kylo Ren's theme at 2:59-3:06 of Main Title & Attack on Jakku Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrbellamy 6,272 Posted January 12, 2016 Share Posted January 12, 2016 Good call. It just skips the second note of his motif but yep, I hear it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scarpia 132 Posted January 12, 2016 Share Posted January 12, 2016 6 hours ago, Mr. Big said: This might be a stretch but I'm hearing Kylo Ren's theme at 2:59-3:06 of Main Title & Attack on Jakku Yes, you're right. It's like a calmer distortion of the theme, based on its main line, but changing the notes conveniently to create the appropriate mood. Williams does this same distortion in the "happy fanfare" in Farewell and the Trip, where he uses the introduction motif of Rey's Theme, but altering the notes as he sees fit. The more we find out about these little details, the greater is my consideration for this excellent score. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arpy 4,145 Posted January 13, 2016 Share Posted January 13, 2016 Anyone else hear Finn's Action Theme resembling this portion of the opening of Empire Strikes Back? 3:52 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gurkensalat 339 Posted January 13, 2016 Share Posted January 13, 2016 I am wondering how this soundtrack would have been released in 1983, in the times of 40 something soundtrack albums. Perhaps something like: Side A Main Title and the Attack on the Jakku Village (6:25) Rey's Theme (3:11) March of the Resistance (2:35) Snoke (2:03) I Can Fly Anything (3:11) The Starkiller (1:51) Han and Leia (4:41) Side B Scherzo for X-Wings (2:32) Torn Apart (4:19) Kylo Ren Arrives at the Battle (2:01) The Ways of the Force (3:15) Farewell And The Trip (4:55) The Jedi Steps and Finale (8:51) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted January 13, 2016 Share Posted January 13, 2016 I'd toss out Snoke. Zzzzzzzz! My preferred 42 minute list is: 1. Main Title and the Attack on the Jakku Village 2. Rey's Theme 3. March of the Resistance 4. The Falcon 5. The Starkiller 6. Han and Leia 7. Scherzo for X-Wings 8. The Ways of the Force 9. Farewell and the Trip 10. The Jedi Steps and Finale Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Quintus 5,399 Posted January 13, 2016 Popular Post Share Posted January 13, 2016 I always skip Han and Leia. I'm not keen on the melody any more. crumbs, aviazn and WilliamHorne97 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthDementous 1,059 Posted January 13, 2016 Share Posted January 13, 2016 9 minutes ago, Quintus said: I always skip Han and Leia. I'm not keen on the melody any more. The best parts are in the FYC track 'Finn and Poe Re-United' anyway Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gurkensalat 339 Posted January 13, 2016 Share Posted January 13, 2016 To clarify: I did not make a list of the best tracks, but tried to imagine how an album of this length might have been produced. As we know, not always the best tracks are included, because of other considerations like variety etc., but also reprise of known themes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incanus 5,713 Posted January 13, 2016 Share Posted January 13, 2016 59 minutes ago, Drax said: I'd toss out Snoke. Zzzzzzzz! My preferred 42 minute list is: 1. Main Title and the Attack on the Jakku Village 2. Rey's Theme 3. March of the Resistance 4. The Falcon 5. The Starkiller 6. Han and Leia 7. Scherzo for X-Wings 8. The Ways of the Force 9. Farewell and the Trip 10. The Jedi Steps and Finale The 77 minute original soundtrack album is the way John Williams intended this music to be heard! How dare you to undermine his efforts by producing some 40+ minute programme!! Please respect the intentions of the composer! crumbs and Taikomochi 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giftheck 916 Posted January 13, 2016 Share Posted January 13, 2016 Yeah, who do you think you are? Varese Sarabande? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted January 13, 2016 Share Posted January 13, 2016 51 minutes ago, Gistech said: Yeah, who do you think you are? Varese Sarabande? Well I could shave it down to 30 minutes. 55 minutes ago, Incanus said: The 77 minute original soundtrack album is the way John Williams intended this music to be heard! How dare you to undermine his efforts by producing some 40+ minute programme!! Please respect the intentions of the composer! As opposed to everyone else who wants the composer's intended album length expanded to complete and chronological?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crumbs 14,305 Posted January 13, 2016 Share Posted January 13, 2016 8 minutes ago, Drax said: As opposed to everyone else who wants the composer's intended album length expanded to complete and chronological?! Well, that scenario is totally different because we know better than John Williams does, but only when it comes to complete scores! Incanus 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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