The Force Awakens Rey's Theme – John Williams' Best Theme Yet?

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Don't be silly!

 

 

[Demodex 557]

Seriously. The only real theme from the OT it is better than is Leia's. 

[publicist 4,643]

Star Wars gulag sucks...

[Demodex 557]

1 hour ago, Stefancos said:

And Hedwigs

 

Oh, hell no. 

[Not Mr. Big 4,639]

8 minutes ago, Quintus said:

 

Without a shadow of doubt. Plus it's better than a host of Star Wars themes. Rey's Theme > Yoda's, Luke & Leia's, Cloud City's,  blah blah blah. 

Luke & Leia's for sure, but Yoda's theme is brilliant

[Quintus 5,399]

The theme has its place and is a major part of the musical canon, but I never really took to the melody much. 

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Its fine, but no Force Theme.

[Taikomochi 1,136]

I'll say, I find Yoda's Theme concert piece very underwhelming.  I don't mind it in the credits, though.

[Not Mr. Big 4,639]

The credits rendition of Yoda's Theme is brilliant!  

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

The sped up, peppy version in the end credits is my fav. And the rendition for the X-Wing out of the swamp scene

[Jay 37,283]

I couldn't possibly rank a theme I've known for 18 days against themes I've known for decades.

[publicist 4,643]

It never will even approach the cue that is 'The Early Days, Massapequa 1957'.

[Quintus 5,399]

10 minutes ago, Jay said:

I couldn't possibly rank a theme I've known for 18 days against themes I've known for decades.

 

You don't know very early on that one melody is more agreeable than another? It generally takes me seconds. 

[Jay 37,283]

"John Williams best theme yet" is a tall order.  No, I cannot possibly say that something I've known for 18 days can fit that huge milestone.

[Quintus 5,399]

Oh that? Sorry, I read you wrong. Yeah, that's a bit daft. 

 

But then again, it's not that difficult or insane, either. We like what we like.  I've known The Resistance March for a couple of weeks and I happily rate it over anything from Harry Potter, which I've known for a decade. 

[filmmusic 1,823]

3 hours ago, Stefancos said:

Does that surprise you?

Actually no.

 

 

[nightscape94 965]

Happy to see that Rey's theme has 1.2M hits on Spotify.  The people are loving it.

 

Certainly this is not his best theme ever, not even within Star Wars since The Force theme as well as Han/Princess are better, but it's an extremely good one.  I would rank it very high.

 

Luke/Leia would be ranked higher for me if it was used more than like twice in the entire span of the series.

[crumbs 14,300]

There's Episode 8 for that!

[Maestro 147]

A little more insight, perhaps, into Rey's theme (as well as Kylo Ren's theme... among other things):

http://projectorandorchestra.com/john-williams-on-the-force-awakens-and-the-legacy-of-star-wars/

“It’s an interesting challenge with her, because her theme doesn’t suggest a love theme in any way. It suggests an adventurer, a female adventurer, but with great strength. She’s a fighter, she’s infused with the Force, and it needed to be something that was strong but thoughtful. She’s a very young girl, but she’s a woman of diverse parts, and so there’s a maturity, I think, about the approach, melodically, to her that I hope will fit her. It seemed particularly challenging, both in the scavenger section in the beginning and in the trip to the island to find Luke in the end, where her theme is pretty fully realized with the orchestra. And it seemed to the right degree of strength and beauty for an adventuress.”

[Romão 2,274]

Great read, thank you for that

[karelm 2,903]

19 minutes ago, Maestro said:

A little more insight, perhaps, into Rey's theme (as well as Kylo Ren's theme... among other things):

http://projectorandorchestra.com/john-williams-on-the-force-awakens-and-the-legacy-of-star-wars/

“It’s an interesting challenge with her, because her theme doesn’t suggest a love theme in any way. It suggests an adventurer, a female adventurer, but with great strength. She’s a fighter, she’s infused with the Force, and it needed to be something that was strong but thoughtful. She’s a very young girl, but she’s a woman of diverse parts, and so there’s a maturity, I think, about the approach, melodically, to her that I hope will fit her. It seemed particularly challenging, both in the scavenger section in the beginning and in the trip to the island to find Luke in the end, where her theme is pretty fully realized with the orchestra. And it seemed to the right degree of strength and beauty for an adventuress.”

 

I particularly liked this: "But even Brahms greatly appreciated Johann Strauss, who one you could say was at the level of high art and the other one a level of popular art." as it is relevant to arguments I've had with some people.  Nice interview with interesting questions. 

[mrbellamy 6,272]

Still don't think this sounds like a man ready to drop this series!

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

7 minutes ago, mrbellamy said:

Still don't think this sounds like a man ready to drop this series!

 

THIS!

[Datameister 2,037]

Yep. If he's asked back and if there are no issues with his health or schedule, I'll bet you anything he'll return. This score was neither phoned in nor written as a grand farewell to the saga.

[Not Mr. Big 4,639]

1 minute ago, Datameister said:

Yep. If he's asked back and if there are no issues with his health or schedule, I'll bet you anything he'll return. This score was neither phoned in nor written as a grand farewell to the saga.

I'm honestly having trouble imagining him working with Riann Johnson, whose musical sensibilities are far different than Spielberg's or even Abrams'

[Quintus 5,399]

I just need to hear that Jedi Steps theme come into play. Badly. 

 

It's his stealthiest greatest theme yet. 

[steb74 53]

Yeah it's funny how there were scenes in the movie that I couldn't stand but the scene for Jedi Steps literally stole the breath from my lungs.

The music, the imagery, the pacing was all so incredibly emotional and as the melody reached one of its endings and those brass chords come in with the behind reveal of a certain character, it sent shivers through my body.

Of course you knew instantly who it was going to be but as he turned and the melody continues in the horns, etc, the whole thing was chilling and haunting, a truly glorious moment for me personally, I still can't stop replaying it over and over in my head.

[Jay 37,283]

Rian Johnson may not be used to working with a John Williams type at all, but he knows he's being hired to make Kahleen Kennedy's next Star Wars film and I am sure would use Williams rather than force a more modern style composer, assuming Williams wants to do it.

 

Though he is writing the film too, he is more of a hired hand here than the situation he had on his early indie films. He doesn't have carte Blanche to do whatever he wants. He can easily be replaced like Josh Trank was.

[crumbs 14,300]

3 hours ago, Mr. Big said:

I'm honestly having trouble imagining him working with Riann Johnson, whose musical sensibilities are far different than Spielberg's or even Abrams'

I bet Potter fans couldn't comprehend how Cuaron's sensibilities could possibly fit Columbus's Potter world, much less compliment Williams' musical style, and look what happened. Both reinvented the wheel and made a perfect marriage (and comfortably the best Potter film of the 8).

 

I have complete faith in Johnson's film actually. I think he's the perfect fit for the middle film.

[Not Mr. Big 4,639]

1 minute ago, crumbs said:

I bet Potter fans couldn't comprehend how Cuaron's sensibilities could possibly fit Columbus's Potter world, much less compliment Williams' musical style, and look what happened. Both reinvented the wheel and made a perfect marriage (and comfortably the best Potter film of the 8).

 

I have complete faith in Johnson's film actually. I think he's the perfect fit for the middle film.

True.  Cuaron is probably the weirdest Williams collaborator.

[crumbs 14,300]

He definitely brought the best out of Williams and didn't seem to pull an Abrams with the score. I wonder how Williams would've scored the film if Cuaron had given him carte blanche.

[artguy360 1,843]

13 minutes ago, crumbs said:

He definitely brought the best out of Williams and didn't seem to pull an Abrams with the score. I wonder how Williams would've scored the film if Cuaron had given him carte blanche.

What does "pull an Abrams" mean? Whatever Abrams did, it resulted in a pretty great score.

[Damien F 1,742]

5 hours ago, Maestro said:

A little more insight, perhaps, into Rey's theme (as well as Kylo Ren's theme... among other things):

http://projectorandorchestra.com/john-williams-on-the-force-awakens-and-the-legacy-of-star-wars/

“It’s an interesting challenge with her, because her theme doesn’t suggest a love theme in any way. It suggests an adventurer, a female adventurer, but with great strength. She’s a fighter, she’s infused with the Force, and it needed to be something that was strong but thoughtful. She’s a very young girl, but she’s a woman of diverse parts, and so there’s a maturity, I think, about the approach, melodically, to her that I hope will fit her. It seemed particularly challenging, both in the scavenger section in the beginning and in the trip to the island to find Luke in the end, where her theme is pretty fully realized with the orchestra. And it seemed to the right degree of strength and beauty for an adventuress.”

 

That's a fantastic interview. I especially liked how he addressed the question about his age.

[Unlucky Bastard 7,782]

"The Adventures of Rey".

[Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488]

As I recall, the most badass rendition of Rey's Theme underscores the reveal of another character at the end of the movie.

[mrbellamy 6,272]

Has anybody actually broken down the relationship between Rey's Theme and The Jedi Steps? I recognize that they're similar and I know a lot of people have called it a hybrid of Rey and Luke's themes but I'm still not quite hearing the connection.

[skyy38 21]

On 1/4/2016 at 10:36 AM, publicist said:

It never will even approach the cue that is 'The Early Days, Massapequa 1957'.

Or "Present Day Snohomish!"

[nightscape94 965]

4 hours ago, Quintus said:

I just need to hear that Jedi Steps theme come into play. Badly. 

 

It's his stealthiest greatest theme yet. 

 

It's deceptive in that it sounds unassuming and simple but there's so much going on in its form and beauty that you almost can't believe how clever and effective it is.  Amazing music that I hope to high hell wasn't intended as an isolated in-scene-only theme.

 

3 hours ago, Jay said:

Rian Johnson may not be used to working with a John Williams type at all, but he knows he's being hired to make Kahleen Kennedy's next Star Wars film and I am sure would use Williams rather than force a more modern style composer, assuming Williams wants to do it.

 

No one says "no" to John Williams doing Star Wars except John Williams.

 

1 hour ago, Mr. Big said:

True.  Cuaron is probably the weirdest Williams collaborator.

 

And Williams loved working with him.

[Datameister 2,037]

1 hour ago, mrbellamy said:

Has anybody actually broken down the relationship between Rey's Theme and The Jedi Steps? I recognize that they're similar and I know a lot of people have called it a hybrid of Rey and Luke's themes but I'm still not quite hearing the connection.

 

First I'm hearing of this. For what it's worth, I can't find melodic, harmonic, structural, or rhythmic similarities that are strong enough to be noteworthy. I mean, both are in 4/4 and in a minor key, but that's about it.

 

That being said, I'm realizing now that the Jedi Steps theme does bear some resemblance to an inverted version of Luke's theme in a minor key. It's not exact, but the perfect-fifth leap followed by stepwise motion in the opposite direction could have been intentional. Very interesting!

[mrbellamy 6,272]

On 12/27/2015 at 0:47 PM, karelm said:

I consider Rey's theme to be structurally similar to "Hymn to the Fallen" from Saving Private Ryan.  The melody isn't very clear at first until you get your hands around the structure.  Otherwise you might think "was that the melody"?

 

0:00 to 0:34 Intro: Flutes and tuned percussion playing the accompaniment figure.

0:35 to 0:42 A Theme first statement (Antecedent)

0:43 to 0:47 A Theme repeated (Consequent)

0:48 to 1:02 B theme (contrasting)

1:02 to 1:22 Bridge with harmonic development and modulation (bridge becomes a sequence that culminates with a bolder/grander/fuller restatement of the theme at...

1:22 to 1:41 A theme restatement with Horns (bold and powerful but not ominous)

1:42 A Theme with fortissimo string octaves theme (richer) and expanded with more repeats and call & response building to a more excited version of the bridge.  Bridge culminates in the grandest thematic statement at...

2:14 biggest version of the A theme with counter melodies, expansions, variations, and a brass choral leading to 2:41

2:42 to the end: Coda that revisits opening material.

 

So by 2:14 we've heard that A theme multiple times with the motific hook heard a few times to implant it in our heads.  

 

One of JW's hallmarks is his finely crafted bridges.  To many composers, the bridge is an afterthought but like ET and other vintage themes of his, the bridge is a very integral part of his melodic contours.  There is more to this one track than meets the eye and in passing, it might not have registered as quickly as some of the others do.  In short, I'm a big fan of this theme and it took some time for me to catch what was actually the theme versus the accompaniment, or the B theme, bridge, expansion, etc. It is sophisticated and that is why I think it rewards repeated listening.  Once you get what's going on, it's brilliant!

 

I was thinking a little bit about this piece's somewhat odd structure and I noticed somebody on a YouTube comment who said they weren't even sure what the theme was. So I took my own crack at it in more "layman's terms" to try and clear it up. Karelm's post helped me a lot...does this make sense to you guys?

 

Basically I see the theme as being split into 3 parts -- Beginning, Middle, and End -- and they get progressively bigger and go a slightly different direction each time. The Beginning and Middle are separated by a Bridge. John Williams also partners the theme with two "little" themes (A and B) that keep repeating and are used for the Intro, Bridge, and Outro. 

 

0:00 to 0:32 - INTRO (Little Theme A, Little Theme B, Little A)

0:33 to 0:59 - REY'S THEME, BEGINNING 

1:00 to 1:39 - BRIDGE (Little B starts in horns, climbs up with flutes, hits a short dramatic version of Rey's Theme in horns, climbs down with flutes)

1:40 to 2:12 - REY'S THEME, MIDDLE (with Little A jumping in at 1:55)

2:13 to 2:38 - REY'S THEME, END 

2:39 to 3:11 - OUTRO (Little B, Little A)

[skyy38 21]

On 1/4/2016 at 8:20 AM, filmmusic said:

I'm looking at the question and would like a clarification:

When we say "Best theme yet" we mean from all the film music Williams has ever written?

Or just the Force Awakens score?

If the first is true, then there are 15 people that believe Rey's theme is the best theme ever written by Williams leaving behind the themes from Schindler's List, E.T., Jurassic park, Indiana Jones, Superman, Harry Potter, Empire Strikes Back, Born on the 4th of July, Empire of the Sun, A.I. etc. etc.?

How about "Best Theme To Date?"

"Ever" and  "...Of All Time" are just grossly over-used.

[Quintus 5,399]

The BEST theme in THE history of HUMANKIND. 

[crocodile 7,983]

Or any kind, for that matter!

 

Karol

[Demodex 557]

You're delirious. 

[Quintus 5,399]

Well, he's always been a bit camp. 

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Both of you are simple bedazzled by Rey's Theme.

[Quintus 5,399]

It's fabulous. 

[pixie_twinkle 48]

No. Not even close. 

[BLUMENKOHL 1,068]

So reading that Williams interview...apparently "revivified" is a word.

[Dixon Hill 4,232]

I'm all for making up new words if 1) there's a need and 2) it's etymologically obvious what the meaning is.