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The Lion King (Jon Favreau)


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8 hours ago, Borodin said:

Nobody gives a shit about Rotten Tomatoes obviously. But this movie has 27.3% of IMDb users giving it a 10/10, which is usually the number I look at after a year. So we'll wait for that number to come down before I see it.

 

It’s ironic how you’re pummeling Rotten Tomatoes as a flawed gauge for calculating the critical consensus of a movie. Yet you’re always quoting IMDb stats, arguably a much more faulty system with even worse reviewers!

 

At least on RT the ratings are verifiable and I can trust the critics have at least seen the movie. 

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1 minute ago, Holko said:

If you're actually looking at the now hidden ratings, not the stupid yes/no tomatometer, maybe.

 

I've only just noticed that, but yeah: they're hiding the average score now.

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On 7/19/2019 at 12:22 PM, Luke Skywalker said:
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It's a thunderstorm where lighting cracks at times and and depicts mufasas drawlines. I thought it looked cool.

 

 

Compared to the original, that is VERY underwhelming.

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3 minutes ago, Gistech said:

 

I've only just noticed that, but yeah: they're hiding the average score now.

 

The average rating isn’t hidden; you can view it right under the tomato score. It’s always been like that. 

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2 minutes ago, John said:

 

 

The average rating isn’t hidden; you can view it right under the tomato score. It’s always been like that. 

 

You have to click 'more info' to see it now, whereas I'm sure before it was displayed underneath the tomato score by default.

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I saw this earlier today and feel ready to weigh in now. 

 

In short: the movie is a disappointment; a series of missed opportunities that make you wish they hadn’t bothered in the first place. Believe me when I say that I’m not hard to please when it comes to tentpole movies. They just need to entertain. And for two hours TLK 2019 barely rouses itself above a wildlife documentary level of excitement. I can count on one hand the number of scenes or moments that I found noteworthy of this new VR tech Favreau used.

 

Ignore the fact that the story beats are the same (which will be hard to do, actually, since it makes the movie completely predictable from start to end and only serves to give you the mental bandwidth to focus on the movie’s other problems). The main problem is the photorealism. Because they did such a good job inventing an African landscape, you stop marveling at it pretty quickly because it looks like they just shot on location for real. You’re not transported anywhere you aren’t already familiar with if you’ve ever seen a wildlife doc. You are easily convinced you’re looking at real life; it’s a computer magic that works so well, it vanishes from your consciousness. 

 

Except when you see anything that looks off, which happens frequently in this film. And each time it tends to yank you out of the transportive mode the movie wants you to be in. It’s like as if aliens kidnapped you without your knowing it and wanted to trick you into thinking you were never kidnapped at all by surrounding you with settings of what they think our world is supposed to look like. But the aliens get a bunch of things wrong, so your cognitive dissonance builds up and very quickly you realize you’re looking at a fancy fake and no amount of “real” can salvage the loss of that initial trust. 

 

In TLK ‘19, the wrongness is in things like predators and prey sitting side by side, animals riding other animals, the Sahara desert (for all intents and purposes) lying next to the jungle next to the veld, animals fighting each other viciously but you never see scrapes, bites or blood, etc. None of this is a problem when you know it’s not real, but this movie wants you to think it’s all real. When Scar takes over and the pride lands go to shit, in TLK ‘94 you know you’re looking at a pictorial metaphor and that’s ok because the whole premise is artificial and the movie knows you know it. In TLK ‘19, the pride lands look photorealistically ravaged, but because they look so real, all you think about is what in the world kind of real-life mechanism could real hyenas use to induce the wholesale change in the landscape that we see? Well, obviously there isn’t any. But we’re supposed to buy the pretense anyway.

 

You can’t have it both ways. Suspension of disbelief is impossible when the filmmaker decides that animals and landscapes are going to be so photorealistic and consistent with real-world physics and physiology that you can’t tell that you’re not looking at real life  — except when it’s convenient to totally disregard real life in order to, say, have animals speak English or organize their society like humans do or fight to the death without bleeding or have two incompatible biomes next to each other. The movie is two hours of Favreau trying to shove a square peg in a round hole, and despite my benefit of the doubt and best efforts to enjoy it for what it tries to be, I’m sorry, it simply doesn’t work.

 

My verdict? 4 out of 10. My advice? Don’t bother with it in theaters. This movie is a swing and a miss in a very frustrating way.  

 

(And to think I didn’t even get to the other problems with this movie: the perfunctory transition of character’s emotional states, weak setups and payoffs in numerous scenes, the near total lack of spectacle (frankly, this is disgraceful considering that Favreau was directing with a virtual camera in a virtual world that imposed ZERO restrictions), the dark, depressing color palette, the lethargic pacing at the beginning... and a stampede that was unforgivably boring compared to the ‘94 original.)

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I've seen "I'm an easy person to please, but..." too many times to actually take it at face value.

 

I'm also the kind of guy that sees 'don't see this in theatres' and then does the exact opposite out of sheer curiosity and it seems that I'm far from the only one this type of statement has that kind of effect on.

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I don’t have a vendetta against this movie (or Disney for that matter; hell, I appear to be the only guy here who liked the new Dumbo). But I felt truly let down by this Lion King, even though I was ready to forgive its replica plot as long as the visuals—the one thing that 90% of the reason for this movie is hanging its hat on—could transport me. They did not.

 

The movie will still make a buttload of money this weekend and shatter a couple of records. I contributed to that, albeit as little as possible, so I guess I’m in no position to tell anyone not to see it in theaters. But at least I did what I could to temper people’s expectations going in. 

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I enjoyed it.  I understand what people didn’t enjoy here, not saying they’re wrong or the criticism isn’t valid.  But I couldn’t help but enjoy it the whole time.

 

To each their own!

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1 hour ago, John said:

Since when has it become illegal to be disappointed in a movie?

 

That's not what I'm saying. I'm saying that if you went in with unrealisticly-high expectations (IE this had better be as good as the original), disappointment is inevitable.

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On 7/19/2019 at 11:17 AM, Gistech said:

So my final rating is 7/10, though it's a higher 7 than I thought I would give it. Some muddy choices mean it misses some points and the transition from animated format to photorealistic means some of the character of the original is inevitably lost, but it's nowhere near as bad as critics say and I daresay it has some pretty powerful moments

 

12 hours ago, Bayesian said:

My verdict? 4 out of 10. My advice? Don’t bother with it in theaters. This movie is a swing and a miss in a very frustrating way. 

 

Anyone else?

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The film feels both too slow and rushed at the same time. It's "fine" and probably better than I expected but completely unnecessary. 

 

Karol

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I just saw The Lion King and it is phenomenal! The story is incredible and powerful. The characters are great. The music is amazing. The visuals are outstanding. 25 years later, and the 1994 animated masterpiece still gets to me, now more than ever.

 

If you did not realize it, I am referring to seeing the original 1994 animated classic.

 

 

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My expectations were really low and I only went because I have a limitless cinema membership and one of my mates wanted to go. It was "enjoyable" in the simplest terms and probably better than I thought. It was also probably one of the better pointless remake than many of the recent Disney attempts. But it felt redundant as well. And quite hollow. And unevenly paced too. Some of the pivotal moments felt too rushed while other moments in between felt too long.

 

Karol

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Maybe they will remake simba's pride too :p.

 

 

i would have liked if they had included some lionesses loyal to scar....because it was weird they seemed to appear from nowhere...

 

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Watched this Saturday evening with my family, which included my very picky Lion King enthusiastic mum.

The cinema was packed and there was a lot of excitement and applause going on.

We all thought the movie was pretty well done and it was certainly an evening well spent.

 

(Still... I like The Jungle Book better and am more looking forward to Mulan later on. And, apparently, TREASURE PLANET!!)

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On 7/21/2019 at 9:02 AM, Luke Skywalker said:

Maybe they will remake simba's pride too :p.

 

 

i would have liked if they had included some lionesses loyal to scar....because it was weird they seemed to appear from nowhere...

 

 

I was talking about this the other day. I really don't want them to remake Simba's Pride. If they do a sequel, I'd rather they take it in a new direction entirely.

 

Don't forget they forgot the hyenas as well in SP. They handwaved it with 'they ran off' but that explanation went out the window with the new TV series.

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  • 2 months later...

Elton John is bashing the new movie on an interview:

 

Quote

DJ: Have you seen the new Lion King film?

 

EJ: The new version of The Lion King was a huge disappointment to me, because I believe they messed the music up. Music was so much a part of the original and the music in the current film didn’t have the same impact. The magic and joy were lost. The soundtrack hasn’t had nearly the same impact in the charts that it had 25 years ago, when it was the bestselling album of the year. The new soundtrack fell out of the charts so quickly, despite the massive box-office success. I wish I’d been invited to the party more, but the creative vision for the film and its music was different this time around and I wasn’t really welcomed or treated with the same level of respect. That makes me extremely sad. I’m so happy that the right spirit for the music lives on with the Lion King stage musical.

 

https://www.gq-magazine.co.uk/culture/article/elton-john-interview

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The songs were terrible and ruined what are now classic and beloved clearly much superior songs from the original soundtrack. Of course, I don't know about "the charts." In this day and age where everyone just streams, what are "the charts"?

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Currently on the Google Play streaming service Top Albums chart for Soundtracks, the 1994 Lion King OST is number 19 and the 2019 remake is number 64.

 

Somehow the new Aladdin had more staying power

 

image.png

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57 minutes ago, Disco Stu said:

Translation: I didn't make as much money off this project as I'd hoped I would

 

Precisely my thoughts when I read it.

 

Also, Spider-Verse still on 1st place? I didn't realize Daniel Pemberton had that much fans!

 

I know it's the soundtrack album with the songs, not the score album, don't ruin the joke.

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51 minutes ago, Gruesome Son of a Bitch said:

The songs were terrible and ruined what are now classic and beloved clearly much superior songs from the original soundtrack. Of course, I don't know about "the charts." In this day and age where everyone just streams, what are "the charts"?

 

Oh, no huge disagreement there (I wouldn't say all the songs were terrible, but they didn't hold a candle to the originals).

 

47 minutes ago, Disco Stu said:

Currently on the Google Play streaming service Top Albums chart for Soundtracks, the 1994 Lion King OST is number 19 and the 2019 remake is number 64.

 

Somehow the new Aladdin had more staying power

 

image.png

 

Kind of a lame top 10, TBH. And I don't honestly know of many people using Google Play to get their music either, but... eh, that's just that one site - I bet if you looked on iTunes there would be different ones there too and TLK2019 wouldn't rate high there either.

 

I think that Disney interfered too much with every part of this film. It could have been something great had Favreau been given more of a free reign like he appears to have had on TJB. But Disney clearly saw the commercial and critical success of Beauty and the Beast and decided that all live action adaptations from that film forward had to adhere much more rigidly to the source material. There's even talk that Aladdin 2 will basically be a rehash of the direct-to-video The Return of Jafar, which makes me shudder to think about what they'll do if they decide to greenlight a sequel to this film - it will be all too easy for Disney to just say "you know that direct-to-video sequel? Do that."

 

Don't get me wrong: I liked this film, but I certainly didn't love it. A bit more of a push in the direction of the 'same story but completely retold through a new lens', and the removal of the in-film song numbers (I think they at least were trying to keep Be Prepared out but they were overruled and that's why it's the absolute worst song in the film), and this might have been a great film. As far as films of the season go, I gave Godzilla more watches and I haven't been a fan of that franchise as long as I have TLK.

 

(Ironically, for all the people who say that the animators and modelers were 'lazy' - the same company worked on TLK as Godzilla's effects and they did great with the Titan expressions there. Take from that what you will, but I think that feeds into the idea of Disney interfering at every single step)

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20 minutes ago, Gistech said:

I don't honestly know of many people using Google Play to get their music either

 

It's true.  I subscribe because it comes with ad-free Youtube included, but it's not a super popular streaming service.

 

Spotify doesn't have charts by genre as far as I can tell.  I dunno about Apple Music.

 

20 minutes ago, Gistech said:

the people who say that the animators and modelers were 'lazy'

 

I don't think lazy is the right word.  It was obviously a lot of work.  More the old "they were so preoccupied with whether they could, they didn't stop to think if they should" adage.

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  • 1 month later...

During the Comic Con Experience on São Paulo, some interesting details were shared. Basically, every single of frame of the movie would take 60 hours to render, so, Disney used 15.000 computers at the same time. On a single computer, the movie would take 9 thousand years to be finished!

 

Here (in portuguese):

 

https://jovemnerd.com.br/nerdbunker/o-rei-leao-cada-quadro-do-novo-filme-demorava-60-horas-para-renderizar/

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  • 1 month later...

After last saturday’s Academy VFX bake-off with five out of 10 contenders, The Lion King has become the frontrunner for the race for the Best Visual Effects Oscar, according to IndieWire:

 

Quote

Frontrunners
“Avengers: Endgame”
“Gemini Man”
“The Irishman”
“The Lion King”
“Star Wars: The Rise of Skywalker”

 

Contenders
“Alita: Battle Angel”
“1917”
“Captain Marvel”
“Cats”
“Terminator: Dark Fate”

 

https://www.indiewire.com/2020/01/the-lion-king-cats-oscar-vfx-bake-off-1202200632/

 

TROS has some good effects and visuals as well, but I really wished to see Endgame winning, even if it is to compensate for Infinity War depressingly loosing the award last year. But I dunno, Endgame is less "showy" in its effects than IW, and the Academy won't resist on giving the award to the recreation of the African Savanna and animals on TLK.

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  • 5 weeks later...

Jon Favreau tried to train some real animals to act on the movie before deciding to make it all digital :lol:

 

<figcaption class='imgFCap'>A male baboon carries a lion cub in a tree in Kruger National Park (Kurt Schultz via AP)</figcaption>

Resultado de imagem para the lion king rafiki holding simba"

 

https://www.breakingnews.ie/world/baboon-grooms-lion-cub-in-south-africas-kruger-national-park-979705.html

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  • 7 months later...

Who wants moooooooooooooore?

 

https://deadline.com/2020/09/the-lion-king-sequel-barry-jenkins-moonlight-director-disney-1234586787/

 

(The only thing that might get me to see this one is if it promises a new, well-thought-out story - and even then my only curiosity is who's going to do the music on this one?)

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I'd love to hear a Zimmer score for the sequel - one that maybe follows the tone of its predecessor but also covers significantly different ground, new themes, etc. (i.e. not just the same score, which is always a fear here).

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Why? Whhhyy?

 

There goes my respect for Jenkins...

 

50 minutes ago, Disco Stu said:

Moonlight is near the bottom of my ranking of recent BP winners that's for sure.

 

Moonlight is a lovely film!

 

Zimmer will probably score this one. And it will probably be another "team effort".

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13 minutes ago, Edmilson said:

Jenkins already has his composer, Nicholas Britell. I wonder if Disney would let him use Britell, instead of Zimmer.

 

Please... Disney wouldn't even let Favreau drop Be Prepared, and Favreau's favourite composer (Debney) got pushed aside for Zimmer. I fully expect them to offer this to Zimmer.

 

54 minutes ago, PuhgreÞiviÞm said:

Simba's Pride.

 

Apparently not. Apparently it's not even going to be a sequel, it's going to be a prequel focusing on the time of Mufasa and Scar in their younger years. TBH, my younger self always was intrigued by how Scar became evil. Then again, I'm a sucker for villain backstories, so...

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Intriguing weird choice. I wouldn't lose respect for Jenkins over this, though. This is clearly him trying to do a studio project so he can get some of that sweet Disney cash to fund for own projects. That's just how the film industry works these days. I more depressed that Disney is making Lion King live-action sequel period, even though it was obviously inevitable, because of how much money it made. 

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