Jay 37,326 Posted August 29, 2021 Share Posted August 29, 2021 Talk about whatever you want, just put it in a spoiler-block so people who want to go see a film without being spoiled won't accidentally get spoiled Marian Schedenig 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Positivatee 327 Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 The first book was published in 1965. If you haven't read it by now, that's your problem. The events of the second half of the book would be captured in a screenplay yet to be written. The spoiler argument does not apply. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naïve Old Fart 9,509 Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 8 hours ago, Nick1Ø66 said: ...would it be ok to talk spoilers in the Spielberg West Side Story thread? I doubt that WEST SIDE STORY contains any homosexual floating fat men, so...yes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HunterTech 987 Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 3 hours ago, Positivatee said: The first book was published in 1965. If you haven't read it by now, that's your problem. The events of the second half of the book would be captured in a screenplay yet to be written. The spoiler argument does not apply. Except it does if the film is supposed to be one's first exposure to the story. This movie is meant to serve multiple audiences, not just fans of the book. It'd be a great waste of resources and time if this was purely for a small portion of the movie going crowd that might hate the changes anyway. Chen G. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naïve Old Fart 9,509 Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 Hopefully, people will watch the film and think: "Gee, this is great. I'll buy the novel". It's probably far too early, but...if DUNE is a success, are there plans to film DUNE MESSIAH, and CHILDREN OF DUNE? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badbu 123 Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 https://www.indiewire.com/2021/08/denis-villenueve-optimistic-dune-2-gets-made-1234658549/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naïve Old Fart 9,509 Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 Oops! Wait 'till people find out what happens to Paul's son. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick1Ø66 4,689 Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 13 minutes ago, Naïve Old Fart said: Oops! Wait 'till people find out what happens to Paul's son. The sad fate of Ringo Atredies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,946 Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 5 hours ago, Naïve Old Fart said: Hopefully, people will watch the film and think: "Gee, this is great. I'll buy the novel". Sir David Lean once said that a succesfull film adaptation would render people incapable of getting past the first 200 pages of the source material, so... Good adaptations are always made primarily for people who never have - and never will - read the source material. They're not just glorified advertisements for books. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick1Ø66 4,689 Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 19 minutes ago, Chen G. said: Good adaptations are always made primarily for people who never have - and never will - read the source material. They're not just glorified advertisements for books. Well, yes. No one should have to read the book to appreciate and understand the film. That goes without saying. They're two different mediums. That doesn't mean a good adaptation can't, and even should, inspire thoughtful viewers to seek out the source material (as presumably happened with you and Lord of the Rings). Quote Sir David Lean once said that a succesfull film adaptation would render people incapable of getting past the first 200 pages of the source material, so... Lean made some of the greatest films of all time, including two of my personal top-10 favourites. But if he said this he's an idiot and probably should have read more. Just because David Lean said it doesn't make it gospel. There have been lots of movies that have inspired me to read the book, and I'm glad I did. Chen G. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,946 Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 11 minutes ago, Nick1Ø66 said: Lean made some of the greatest films of all time Not only that, virtually ALL of his films are adaptations. He said that when he thinks about subjects for a film, the first thing he does is "go into book shops." And yes, its not gospel but I do think its very reductive to look at a film adaptation as a glorified advertisment for the book. Lord knows people have been compelled to read books thanks to adaptations (from memory, book sales increase by %1000 percent when The Lord of the Rings trilogy was released) but I do think its an accurate statement (which is taken verbatim from Rings treatment, by the way) to say that a good adaptation is not only made for people who never have read the book, but who never will. 11 minutes ago, Nick1Ø66 said: as presumably happened with you and Lord of the Rings I honestly can't remember which came first. For sure I had the books before I watched the film. As to whether or how much of it I read prior to that, I can't recall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick1Ø66 4,689 Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 48 minutes ago, Chen G. said: And yes, its not gospel but I do think its very reductive to look at a film adaptation as a glorified advertisment for the book. Well that's true. But I think the only people who look at books that way are publishers hoping to move novels with tie-in covers. 48 minutes ago, Chen G. said: but I do think its an accurate statement... to say that a good adaptation is not only made for people who never have read the book, but who never will. Well again yes, but we all agree on that. But since we all also agree that literature and film are two completely different mediums, with different goals, it's a little specious to suggest (as Lean seems to do) that if you've seen the movie there's no reason to read the book. That's either suggesting that the book has nothing to offer over the film, or that the source material is poorly written. Anyone who has read Doctor Zhivago (which I presume Lean is referring to) can tell you that neither is the case, and in fact reading it is a completely different experience, in every way vs seeing the film. One is a masterpiece of cinema, the other a masterpiece of literature. Crikey even a book like The Hunger Games (where a lot of Katniss's dialogue is internal) has a lot to offer over the film. This goes doubly for a book as dense as Dune. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,326 Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 Again nobody suggested not being able to say whatever you want to say, the request was to use the spoiler-block feature when doing so. It's easy to use. Tallguy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,946 Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 16 minutes ago, Nick1Ø66 said: Anyone who has read Doctor Zhivago (which I presume Lean is referring to) No, he was referring to an adaptation of Nostromo that he was working on at the time and didn't finish. His point was that the movie will have streamlined the first 200 pages to the extent that audiences will then find it difficult to get through them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick1Ø66 4,689 Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 13 minutes ago, Jay said: Again nobody suggested not being able to say whatever you want to say, the request was to use the spoiler-block feature when doing so. It's easy to use. Jay I don't even think we're talking about that right now. The conversation has moved on to the value of adaptations vs. the books they're based on. Do keep up! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naïve Old Fart 9,509 Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 32 minutes ago, Chen G. said: No, he was referring to an adaptation of Nostromo that he was working on at the time and didn't finish. His point was that the movie will have streamlined the first 200 pages to the extent that audiences will then find it difficult to get through them. Hee, hee. Lean and NOSTROMO? Talk about not finishing the book Nick1Ø66 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick1Ø66 4,689 Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 46 minutes ago, Chen G. said: No, he was referring to an adaptation of Nostromo that he was working on at the time and didn't finish. His point was that the movie will have streamlined the first 200 pages to the extent that audiences will then find it difficult to get through them. "If the film is a success most of those who go out and buy the book will give up long before page 200. This is exactly what happened to Seven Pillars Of Wisdom, Doctor Zhivago and, to a lesser extent, Passage To India." -Sir David Lean That's all pretty interesting, given that it's Lean's films that inspired me to read all three of those books! And in the case of Zhivago, multiple times. Pretty presumptuous on his part, don't you think? Presumably Lean read these books and thought enough of them to want to adapt them. I mean, if you're going to suggest a book is superfluous to the film, at least go after easier targets than Pasternak and Forster! There's a difference between saying that you shouldn't need have read the book to appreciate a good adaptation (which, again, everyone agrees with) and saying the film makes reading the book moot. I mean, do you agree with what Lean said? 1 hour ago, Chen G. said: I honestly can't remember which came first. For sure I had the books before I watched the film. As to whether or how much of it I read prior to that, I can't recall. Oh OK. I thought you had mentioned once you saw the films first (not that there's anything wrong with that, lots of films have inspired me to read the books). In any event, it's interesting, as most people have pretty vivid memories of the first time they read those books. They tend to make an impression. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,326 Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 New IMAX poster Romão 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edmilson 7,398 Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 Is this the first PG-13 movie Villeneuve directed? I guess Blade Runner 2049 was R-Rated, but I could be wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,326 Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 Blade Runner 2049 was R, as was Incendies, Prisoners, Enemy, and Sicario Arrival was PG13 Edmilson 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A24 4,328 Posted August 30, 2021 Author Share Posted August 30, 2021 You had to be 18 in Russia. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick1Ø66 4,689 Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 9 minutes ago, AC1 said: You had to be 18 in Russia. Are you in Russia? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A24 4,328 Posted August 30, 2021 Author Share Posted August 30, 2021 No, but who knows, we might have some Russian JW fans here ... BTW, in Germany you had to be 12. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,946 Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 2 hours ago, Nick1Ø66 said: Pretty presumptuous on his part, don't you think? Lean could be a very presumptious man, after all... And don't forget this is coming from the man who adapted (many would say definitively) Dickens. Virtually ALL of his filmography is made-up of adaptations. 2 hours ago, Naïve Old Fart said: Hee, hee. Lean and NOSTROMO? Talk about not finishing the book He was pushing eighty when he started working on it. I don't think anyone really expected him to actually make it: they were just humouring an old man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick1Ø66 4,689 Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 22 minutes ago, AC1 said: No, but who knows, we might have some Russian JW fans here ... BTW, in Germany you had to be 12. On Arrakis you have to be 1,500 to see Dune. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naïve Old Fart 9,509 Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 On Arrakis, only 10,191 people saw Lynch's Dune. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marian Schedenig 8,183 Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 5 hours ago, Chen G. said: Good adaptations are always made primarily for people who never have - and never will - read the source material. They're not just glorified advertisements for books. As a fan of many books, and as someone who usually prefers to read the book first, I'm fond of films that are made (also) for fans of the books. If a film manages to satisfy those who already know the book, that's certainly a sign that it's more than an advertisement for it. Romão and Nick1Ø66 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romão 2,274 Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 Truth be told, Lynch's Dune was cryptic and yet enticing enough to peek behind the curtain and made me absolutely want to read the book. That desire might've not been as strong had the movie been a stronger adaptation of the novel. So I kinda get what Lean was saying, although I can really wholeheartedly agree. The world the Lynch's Dune movie promised (more than it delivered) was just too fascinating Marian Schedenig and blondheim 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zeo5 3 Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 3 hours ago, AC1 said: No, but who knows, we might have some Russian JW fans here ... I'm from Russia, and i will go to cinema on 16 september! A24 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blondheim 1,157 Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 On 8/26/2021 at 10:59 AM, JoeinAR said: I'd still enjoy watching a machine driven film than ever see blue velvet again. I lit a candle and said a prayer for you. Wait, Dennis Hopper's here... now it's dark. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeinAR 1,949 Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 48 minutes ago, blondheim said: I lit a candle and said a prayer for you. Wait, Dennis Hopper's here... now it's dark. Dennis Hopper was a terrible horrible actor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blondheim 1,157 Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 14 minutes ago, JoeinAR said: Dennis Hopper was a terrible horrible actor. Dennis Hopper was a legend. Dennis Hopper is a legend. #NeverForget Thor and JoeinAR 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Stu 15,495 Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 He was good in Hoosiers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeinAR 1,949 Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 He was just bad. I agree with rod serling, he takes you out of the story Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick1Ø66 4,689 Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 3 hours ago, JoeinAR said: Dennis Hopper was a terrible horrible actor. So he was terrible at being horrible? Doesn’t that make him at least sort of OK? JoeinAR 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor 7,478 Posted August 31, 2021 Share Posted August 31, 2021 11 hours ago, blondheim said: Dennis Hopper was a legend. Dennis Hopper is a legend. #NeverForget Indeed. Great actor. Pretty good artist too. And with enough charisma to blow out the screen! He is missed. blondheim 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naïve Old Fart 9,509 Posted August 31, 2021 Share Posted August 31, 2021 For all his Sturm und Drang acting (APOCALYPSE NOW; WATERWORLD; SPEED; BLUE VELVET), his role in HOOSIERS might just be his most affecting performance. He was much better than people think. Tallguy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A24 4,328 Posted August 31, 2021 Author Share Posted August 31, 2021 Hopper is self-aware and over-the-top. That's why he gets cast for. Nicolas Cage is also very much like that but I do think Cage is the better actor (his twin role in Adaptation is downright great). Nick1Ø66 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick1Ø66 4,689 Posted August 31, 2021 Share Posted August 31, 2021 13 hours ago, blondheim said: Dennis Hopper was a legend. Dennis Hopper is a legend. #NeverForget Who? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blondheim 1,157 Posted August 31, 2021 Share Posted August 31, 2021 9 hours ago, Thor said: Indeed. Great actor. Pretty good artist too. And with enough charisma to blow out the screen! He is missed. Yes, he was an under-rated director, too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JNHFan2000 2,944 Posted September 1, 2021 Share Posted September 1, 2021 Got my tickets badbu 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,326 Posted September 2, 2021 Share Posted September 2, 2021 New Vanity Fair article includes a clip from the film https://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood/2021/09/dune-clip-timothee-chalamet-josh-brolin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,946 Posted September 3, 2021 Share Posted September 3, 2021 Early reviews range from quite positive (but not overflowing with praise a-la Blade Runner 2049) to lukewarm. More in the "quite postive" camp: https://gizmodo.com/dune-is-the-jaw-dropping-sci-fi-epic-youve-been-waiting-1847598991 https://www.lepoint.fr/pop-culture/exclusif-cinema-on-a-vu-le-nouveau-dune-03-09-2021-2441446_2920.php More in the "lukewarm" camp: https://www.usatoday.com/story/entertainment/movies/2021/09/03/dune-review-denis-villeneuve-oscar-isaac-timothee-chalamet/5692511001/ https://www.msn.com/en-gb/entertainment/movies/dune-review-an-ambitious-yet-frustrating-adaptation/ar-AAO4pmk The Guardian does sing its praises, though. Edmilson and Nick1Ø66 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glóin the Dark 1,220 Posted September 3, 2021 Share Posted September 3, 2021 Early reviews range from ecstatic (Brooks, Collin, Loughrey, Travis) to damning (Ehrlich), with the majority closer to the former end of the scale. Chen G. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,946 Posted September 3, 2021 Share Posted September 3, 2021 Nice to see more glowing reviews coming in. But then, glowing reviews didn't help Blade Runner 2049 too much. But here's for hoping! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glóin the Dark 1,220 Posted September 3, 2021 Share Posted September 3, 2021 Normally I'm not particularly interested in the commercial success of a film, but I guess if this one's good I'm going to want Part 2 to get made. Fingers crossed! Edited to add an errant "not". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edmilson 7,398 Posted September 3, 2021 Share Posted September 3, 2021 This movie NEEDS good reviews if it wants to succeed at the box office. A mixed or outright terrible reaction will crush its chances to be a hit. These days, if you aren't a comic book movie or Star Wars, you must get rave reviews to get people interested in paying to watch it. And, like @Chen G., sometimes not even this is enough. Chen G. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick1Ø66 4,689 Posted September 3, 2021 Share Posted September 3, 2021 A lot of the reviews I'm seeing say the world building is great, but that Villeneuve doesn't quite nail the story. I hope this isn't the case. One annoying thing you see pop up all the time in the sci-fi/fantasy genre, whether it's film or literature, is when the creator spends a lot of time world building at the expense of the story. The world building doesn't mean much if the story isn't there. But It's early, and I live in hope. Chen G. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,946 Posted September 3, 2021 Share Posted September 3, 2021 11 minutes ago, Nick1Ø66 said: A lot of the reviews I'm seeing say the world building is great, but that Villeneuve doesn't quite nail the story. Yeah, but then the term "world-building" had become amorphous to the extent that its hard to tell what people are referring to when they're talking about it. Some reviews also mention that fairly light on action until a way's into the runtime, which is exactly what deterred a lot of viewers with Blade Runner 2049, I think. Granted, some of my favourite movies make you wait for (and therefore prize) the action, but its a fine line to walk. We shall see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick1Ø66 4,689 Posted September 3, 2021 Share Posted September 3, 2021 Yeah I'm fine without a lot of action early on, I like build up. But to audiences expecting the next Star Wars or a Marvel like experience? I don't know... Chen G. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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