THE POST - FILM Thread

[Disco Stu 15,495]

I predict TGP will quit the forum for good this time in disgust based on the countless posts that will be variations on "How can they give Zimmer the Oscar, that wasn't even music"

[Not Mr. Big 4,639]

13 minutes ago, BloodBoal said:

I vote for the guy with the exotic name!

Jan Zimmiams?

[BloodBoal 7,538]

That will do!

[Fancyarcher 350]

1 hour ago, KK said:

I'm sure The Post will rack up the most nominations this year, but go home with very little. It's too early to tell, but I might bet on Lady Bird as the real front-runner.

 

Three Billboards still has a strong chance too. I think Ladybird will win best supporting actress too.

[Brundlefly 2,385]

On 29.11.2017 at 10:49 AM, Disco Stu said:

I predict TGP will quit the forum for good this time in disgust based on the countless posts that will be variations on "How can they give Zimmer the Oscar, that wasn't even music"

The day Zimmer will have won more Oscars than Goldsmith is the day Trump will be degraded to the Academy's Enemy No 2!

[TheUlyssesian 2,473]

So the prestigious NY critics handed out their awards today but Spielberg's Oscar bait went home empty-handed.

 

Even though this is a group of trump hating liberal film journalists.

[A24 4,327]

Was it nominated? Who won?

[Romão 2,274]

I think they just award the winners, they don't do nominations

[A24 4,327]

But the possible reason why it didn't win is because the movie hasn't been released yet, right? 

[TheUlyssesian 2,473]

On 12/1/2017 at 4:16 AM, Alexcremers said:

Was it nominated? Who won?

 

NY critics awards do not have nominations. Lady Bird won Best Picture.

 

On 12/1/2017 at 4:34 AM, Alexcremers said:

But the possible reason why it didn't win is because the movie hasn't been released yet, right? 

 

No. They have seen it and it was eligible and they could vote for it.

 

LA film critics voted today - another super prestigious critics award and zilch for The Post again. Did not even place in the Top 5 of any category including Meryl Streep for Best Actress.

 

And these are even more liberal critics than NY critics.

 

I still feel the trump hate is going to power Post and Streep to Oscar wins.

[Disco Stu 15,495]

Official reviews are up!

 

 

 

 

http://www.metacritic.com/movie/the-post

 

Mostly positive but the mixed ones are coming for sure.

[Tom 4,640]

From the USA Today review: " The combination of the adventurous Spielbergian lens and a dynamite John Williams score jazzes up the most mundane newspaper conventions, from a copy editor striking words with a red pen to trucks rolling out with first editions. If only the same heroic anthems accompanied the writing of a movie review."

 

[Disco Stu 15,495]

Of course the writer doesn't use the verb "jazz" in the sense of the music being that genre.

 

I liked the writer who called Lincoln, Bridge of Spies, and The Post Spielberg's "Civics Trilogy."  It's my Star Wars trilogy in terms of excitement as a lame dad who loves history.

[Nick1Ø66 4,689]

LOL. Is that what they're calling it? Spielberg's "Civics Trilogy"?  What's next in the Spielberg Civics Expanded Universe? A mocap production of Schoolhouse Rock?

[Disco Stu 15,495]

I'll be first in line!

[Tom 4,640]

I read through the other reviews, only looking at score remarks.  A couple were negative, but I sense it is the kind of negative that fans of JW will enjoy. 

[Disco Stu 15,495]

Quote

the John Williams score isn’t as powerful as his other legendary pieces for the director

http://www.businessinsider.com/the-post-steven-spielberg-tom-hanks-meryl-streep-review-2017-12

(a negative review generally, not just of the score)

[Nick1Ø66 4,689]

I'd rather see Michael Bay do a civics movie.

 

MLK: THE RETURN. And this time, he's not turning the other cheek!

[Bor Gullet 7]

There seems to be a huge disconnect between the positive and negative reviews on RT. Weird.

[Disco Stu 15,495]

4 minutes ago, Bor Gullet said:

There seems to be a huge disconnect between the positive and negative reviews on RT. Weird.

 

It's why Rotten Tomatoes sucks.  Metacritic takes into account the degree to which critics liked or disliked a movie and is superior.

 

Making no distinction between "I kinda liked this" and "Best movie ever made!" is beyond stupid.

[Quintus 5,399]

2 hours ago, Tom said:

From the USA Today review: " The combination of the adventurous Spielbergian lens and a dynamite John Williams score jazzes up the most mundane newspaper conventions, from a copy editor striking words with a red pen to trucks rolling out with first editions. If only the same heroic anthems accompanied the writing of a movie review."

 

 

Yes! It sounds like my Asteroid Field style set piece will happen after all. 

[Fancyarcher 350]

And now it's up to 77% on RT's, and a top critics ratings at 100% after seven reviews. I'm guessing the first batch of negative reviews were from a bunch of nobodies. It's why RT's kinda sucks honestly. 

[Quintus 5,399]

Sometimes the nobodies are the one's who got it right. 

[Nick1Ø66 4,689]

Especially if those "nobodies" aren't professional journalists, who might enjoy seeing their profession lionised by the world's most famous director.

[Fancyarcher 350]

Well if they really are "nobodies", then how could we tell? The plot thickens. 

[BloodBoal 7,538]

Just don't look at scores on sites like these and just watch the film to make your own opinion?

[Jay 37,322]

That's certainly what I plan on doing

[Not Mr. Big 4,639]

5 hours ago, Tom said:

From the USA Today review: " The combination of the adventurous Spielbergian lens and a dynamite John Williams score jazzes up the most mundane newspaper conventions, from a copy editor striking words with a red pen to trucks rolling out with first editions. If only the same heroic anthems accompanied the writing of a movie review."

 

I'm guessing that's the 

Spoiler

fugual preparation music Jim Ware spoke of?

Either way, sounds very exciting 

[Disco Stu 15,495]

7 minutes ago, BloodBoal said:

Just don't look at scores on sites like these and just watch the film to make your own opinion?

 

I can read reviews and see the film to form my own opinion.  I feel like what you imagine people read reviews for isn't what I read reviews for.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

I'm not talking about simply reading reviews. I'm talking about checking scores on sites, comparing them, trying to figure out which one is the most accurate...

[Disco Stu 15,495]

Oh yeah that's silly, the idea that any one review is "right" about a movie.

[publicist 4,643]

'Racing Times' for film fans.

[TheUlyssesian 2,473]

Reviews

 

a few overly sentimental third-act scenes ... make extra use of John Williams’ immediate score

 

Another excellent score comes to us from John Williams

 

The story is adequately dramatic without ... John Williams's overpowering score, thank you very much.

 

Most of Spielberg’s crew have worked with him for a number of years, including the legendary John Williams. The composer, working under a time crunch, comes through with another top-notch score–this one feels restrained but comes through in a strong way when needed.

 

John Williams' score is quite good.

 

The combination of the adventurous Spielbergian lens and a dynamite John Williams score jazzes up the most mundane newspaper conventions, from a copy editor striking words with a red pen to trucks rolling out with first editions. If only the same heroic anthems accompanied the writing of a movie review.

 

John Williams’ horn-heavy score (creating either tension or heroic awe, as needed)

 

Spielberg can’t help but turn The Post into a “message movie.” He rises to our current moment on stilts, with a megaphone and a swelling John Williams score.

 

the notable score was provided by the legendary John Williams

[Quintus 5,399]

Horns? Noble horns?? 

[Tom 4,640]

Here is the one from the Wash Post: "And, as he so often does, the director tacks on an extra ending for the benefit of the cheap seats that always come first in his calculations, subtlety be damned. And subtlety is damned, for eternity, in John Williams’s shamelessly manipulative score."

Okay, here is a thought: movie making, and probably all story telling, is essentially manipulative.  It is designed to get us to feel certain things and think certain things, or at least think about certain things.  Why get upset when the score "says" the same damn thing as the movie itself?  I mean, her review itself is manipulative in telling us what to think about the movie and score.  

 

[TheUlyssesian 2,473]

Williams can be manipulative but never in an oppressive heavy-handed way. His music is still extraordinarily sophisticated and nuanced to be considered hammering the audience over the head.

 

Some people think Schindler's List is calculated for maximum waterworks by audiences but it is much to elegant too be considered that.

 

I personally think Gia tries too hard a lot of the times. Williams has a much lighter tough.

[Tom 4,640]

Maybe that is the answer.  The reviewers think their standards of critical taste precludes them from being moved by film music.  So when Williams does it to them, they feel violated and act out.  

[Cerebral Cortex 3,357]

"I'm not crying, you're crying!"

[Will 2,215]

A nice clip ... but no music:

 

 

[publicist 4,643]

On 7.12.2017 at 8:56 PM, Tom said:

Okay, here is a thought: movie making, and probably all story telling, is essentially manipulative.  It is designed to get us to feel certain things and think certain things, or at least think about certain things. 

 

Sweeping generalizations are bullshit regardless of which side utters them. Hollywood movies have been targeted since the old MGM days for often using cheap tactics to push certain buttons. Mind you, there are good button-pushers that often are result of good artistry on all sides involved, there are medium-successful ones, i. e. when the score has to work overtime to make lacking scenes work and there are the bad and ugly ones, where no one involved made an effort to even hide it.

I haven't seen 'The Post', obviously, but i guess it will follow established Spielberg/Williams patterns and will not seem overly offensive in that context, but given that 'Lincoln' drew not nearly as much vitriol it is very likely that the movie itself is not successful and the music stands out for exactly that reason. Ill-deserved 'rousing' finishes have been quite a frequent Spielberg problem since the late 90's.

[crumbs 14,305]

So this opens in Australia on January 11, even earlier than America's wide release. Wonder if it's worth holding out from listening to the soundtrack until then? It could be the last new John Williams score until Episode IX!

[toothless 963]

Just saw that the film opens in France February 28

[publicist 4,643]

In most european countries, actually.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

That's because they know Europeans don't care about the freedom of the press.

[Jurassic Shark 12,033]

10 minutes ago, BloodBoal said:

That's because they know Europeans don't care about the freedom of the press.

 

Or maybe because our freedom of press is not as threatened as in Trumpland...

[BloodBoal 7,538]

Let me guess: you read that in the press?

[Jurassic Shark 12,033]

2 minutes ago, BloodBoal said:

Let me guess: you read that in the press?

 

I have it from Trump's tweets

[Tom 4,640]

5 hours ago, publicist said:

 

Sweeping generalizations are bullshit regardless of which side utters them. Hollywood movies have been targeted since the old MGM days for often using cheap tactics to push certain buttons. Mind you, there are good button-pushers that often are result of good artistry on all sides involved, there are medium-successful ones, i. e. when the score has to work overtime to make lacking scenes work and there are the bad and ugly ones, where no one involved made an effort to even hide it.

I haven't seen 'The Post', obviously, but i guess it will follow established Spielberg/Williams patterns and will not seem overly offensive in that context, but given that 'Lincoln' drew not nearly as much vitriol it is very likely that the movie itself is not successful and the music stands out for exactly that reason. Ill-deserved 'rousing' finishes have been quite a frequent Spielberg problem since the late 90's.

Interesting.  Could it be that many so-called "over-scored" movies are due to the score being better than the film itself?  that would explain many Williams's and Goldsmith scores that seem out of place, though they would have not been had the film been better.  (prequels come to mind).  That really handicaps a composer: write down to the level of the film.  If an actor did that, he would be criticized by the critics as phoning it in.   

[publicist 4,643]

That is certainly not a pre-requisite. In 'The Post's case probably because Spielberg uses Williams as he often does as a crutch for his 'messages' - creating scenes that could play either way but asking the composer (Tommy Newman in case of 'Bridge of Spies') to pour on the 'inspirational' strings and horns to give it the necessary spin. That's a different story than, say, Goldsmith beefing up 'Hollow Man', which will not leap at you in the same way. One problem is that every second Edward Zwick, Ron Howard et al. movie essentially works the same way and it often feels clichéd.

[Jay 37,322]

Here are two clips from the film