A New Hope vs. The Empire Strikes Back vs. Return of the Jedi

[Tallguy 3,386]

As the years go on it's actually harder to choose. It's Star Wars or The Empire Strikes Back. Everything else is a distant third at best. But I can't choose between them. So it's Star Wars AND The Empire Strikes Back.

 

I tend to lean to The Empire Strikes Back as a whole but there are lots of moments in Star Wars that outshine everything. The Swashbucklers, the Death Star Battle, hell the Main Title. People seem partial to that sunset thing. (Is that The Princess Appears or Lost R2?)

 

But then you have... Um... ALL of The Empire Strikes Back.

 

2 hours ago, Brundlefly said:

I listened to Return of the Jedi yesterday and had a shitload of fun with it. Almost forgot, how good it was. Of course, I'm referring to the 1993 Anthology program.

 

There is so much great Jabba music that is left off of the Anthology. Plus it doesn't have Alliance Assembly and whatever the end of Luke talking with Obi Wan is called. (I HATE the 1997 titles of almost everything.) OTOH the track splits are more reasonable and it's certainly a solid program.

 

And I don't know how or where I would present it, but I don't like the Tatooine Rendevous at the end of the main title on the '97.

 

I apparently don't have the ear to hate the sound of either of them.

[Datameister 2,042]

I missed this thread the first time around. Either that or I didn't bother posting because I knew I couldn't vote, because my answer to both questions is "not ROTJ." The other two are locked in an eternal struggle in my heart. SW edges out on the basis of maximum nostalgia; ESB edges out on my subjective impression of its objective quality. That's true for the films and the scores.

[Jurassic Shark 12,071]

Greatest highlights: SW & TESB

Most consistently good: TESB

[bored 309]

I'm one of the few who love ROTJ and Star Wars more or less the same. Films and scores. I have problems with both, and love the highlights from both, but the only film and score that I personally think has little to no problems, and is nothing but highlights, is The Empire Strikes Back. 

[QuartalHarmony 543]

Film:

ANH is the best film because it kickstarted an entire phenomenon from scratch whilst respecting all its influences and entertaining a generation like nothing ever had.

 

Empire is the best film because it makes you care about the characters and keeps you on the edge of your seat throughout. It also has one of the best twists in cinematic history.

 

Jedi is the best film because it ties up a trilogy, encompasses redemption, revenge and taking the higher path and shows Luke sacrificing a normal existence for the greater good. It also has a breathtaking space battle.

 

 

Score:

 

ANH is the best score because it’s like nothing else that came before and packs in so many original ideas it’s exhilarating.

 

Empire is the best score because it builds an even higher achievement on previous work that was already extraordinary and has a good claim to be the greatest Romantic film score ever. It also has the best villain’s theme ever, no contest.

 

Jedi is the best score because it takes the best of what came before (not least a trove of incredible leitmotifs that any other composer would give his/her left nut/tit for), adds to it and weaves it all together in way that still staggers yet sounds effortless.

 

 

Yeah, I think that about sums it up.

 

Mark

[Edmilson 7,436]

I think I'm one of the few people in the world that actually genuinely like Return of the Jedi. Maybe it's because, when I watched the OT, I already knew that SW and ESB were great, so they didn't surprised me in their greatness. With Jedi, however, I wasn't expecting anything outstanding, so when the movie turned out to be much better than I was hoping, I was thrilled and surprised.

[Schilkeman 963]

A New Hope is certainly "clean" in its relative simplicity, but Empire and Jedi sound more like John Williams, and less like John Williams by way of the temp track composers. I love all six of the Lucas Star Wars films, but Jedi has the most issues. The last third of the film saves it for me. It probably has the strongest ending of the lot, which is how it should be, I suppose.

[artguy360 1,843]

ANH is a wonderful breath of fresh air and has a great clarity and simplicity to it's orchestrations.

 

ESB is much denser and more complex. It is a perfect maturation of the Star Wars sound. It's also possibly the best film score of all time.

 

Following up ESB was always going to be an impossible task and unfortunately ROTJ is just a lesser film. The score is still very good but it doesn't reach the heights of ANH or ESB. Still, it is a mostly satisfying conclusion to the original trilogy, both musically and narratively.

 

As far as satisfying musical finales go, I think ROTS stands above ROTJ and TROS.

[Datameister 2,042]

4 hours ago, Edmilson said:

I think I'm one of the few people in the world that actually genuinely like Return of the Jedi. Maybe it's because, when I watched the OT, I already knew that SW and ESB were great, so they didn't surprised me in their greatness. With Jedi, however, I wasn't expecting anything outstanding, so when the movie turned out to be much better than I was hoping, I was thrilled and surprised.

 

I don't think it's a small number. Despite my answer to both poll questions being "not ROTJ," I do still love the score and really, really like the film. In fact, when I listen or watch, I usually enjoy it more than I expect. And it was easily my favorite as a kid.

 

But as an adult, I think ESB is just a really tough act to follow. Its lighting and cinematography are absolutely exquisite, and the acting and writing are the least stilted of all the Lucas episodes. ANH can't lay claim to any of that, but it's the only true standalone Star Wars story. Plus it's pure fun. Bad guys versus good guys in space. And nostalgia is a big factor too.

 

The fact that ROTJ ranks below both of these is no insult coming from me. While there are things I wish had been done differently, it's a great ending to the trilogy. And the score is top-notch Williams. Its predecessors just happen to be a little...topper-notch.

[bored 309]

Return of the Jedi does still have some of my favorite musical moments from the entirety of Star Wars. The final minute of "The Return of the Jedi", "The Death of Yoda", "The Final Duel", and "The Emperor's Death" have still not been topped by any other Star Wars score as far as I'm concerned. 

[michael_grig 472]

Sorry, but Princess Leia's Theme, The Return Home and The Princess Appears make it 100% clear. I only have to hear one of them and I'm bound to cry, get goosebumps and feel like I can take on the whole galaxy. ESB and ROTJ are musically exciting, but don't generate as much emotion as ANH.

[Tallguy 3,386]

2 minutes ago, Michael G. said:

ESB and ROTJ are musically exciting, but don't generate as much emotion as ANH.

 

Not even Yoda and the Force? Carbon Freeze Chamber?

 

(Ok, Leia's theme is tough to beat. And that's not even childhood nostalgia - I didn't start listening to that one on its own until I was in my 20's.)

[michael_grig 472]

But it must be noted that all 3 scores are among the best works by John Williams, and in film music in general. So this is a kind of nagging on a high level

[Chen G. 3,949]

Dunno, I feel that Star Wars is probably the best score: it doesn't rely on any one theme the way The Empire Strikes Back relies on The Imperial March, which gets to be a little much, and its the film that introduced Binary Sunset. But they're both such great scores, that I probably need to through them to decide.

 

Return of the Jedi is also a very fine score, although not quite up to par with the others, probably because the musical storytelling is forced into the same "episodic" mould that the film follows: there's little to unify the Jabba's place short-film score and the proper Return of the Jedi feature-film score.

 

The film discussion is much easier: The Empire Strikes Back is much, much better than either Star Wars or (especially) Return of the Jedi.