Now that we have the Complete JP from LLL, is the 20th anniversary JP completely redundant?

[Josh500 1,620]

Or should I say extinct? 😂 

 

What I mean is, after we got the JP collection from LLL, is there a reason to keep or listen to the 20th anniversary edition of JP at all? Obviously, I'm gonna keep the OST album of JP for its unique edits and its sentimental value.

 

 

 

PS Sorry if this has been asked before (as I'm pretty sure it has).

[Disco Stu 15,517]

Yes

[Brundlefly 2,401]

The OST is fine, but I can relinquish the 20th anniversary version, because those 4 tracks added to the end of the main program seem to be at the wrong place. Moreover "The Coming Storm" and "The History Lesson" are awkwardly edited. Let alone the inferior sound quality.

 

I've tried a few album-like edits of several tracks of the JP scores and there are musically far better options to connect those different cues.

[Josh500 1,620]

49 minutes ago, Brundlefly said:

The OST is fine, but I can relinquish the 20th anniversary version, because those 4 tracks added to the end of the main program seem to be at the wrong place. Moreover "The Coming Storm" and "The History Lesson" are awkwardly edited. Let alone the inferior sound quality.

 

I've tried a few album-like edits of several tracks of the JP scores and there are musically far better options to connect those different cues.

 

Exactly! This was my thought as well, but just wanted to make sure....

 

Obviously, I'm not gonna delete the master files of the 20th anniversary edition, but no need to keep them on my DAP, either. All I do these days is listen to the LLL edition. Man, they did everything right by that one!

[Xander Harris 9,256]

Now that we have the complete Lost World, all versions of Jurassic Park are pretty redundant.

[King Mark 3,911]

I always keep old versions in case a  track sounds better somehow on the old release.

 

Like with the Star Trek The Motion Picture 3 c.d. set, the End Credits sound better on the Sony 20th anniversary release

[Xander Harris 9,256]

Sony expanded versions are usually superior to the specialty label releases.

[Wojo 2,458]

I didn't buy the 20th anniversary edition because I was hoping for a better version. It came. 

[Josh500 1,620]

6 hours ago, Woj said:

I didn't buy the 20th anniversary edition because I was hoping for a better version. It came. 

 

I hesitated buying it too.

 

In the end, I did, because of The History Lesson (one of my favorite unreleased cues at the time) and because the 20th anniversary edition was released in High Resolution. 

[Jay 45,403]

There's nothing on the 20th that isn't on the LLL

[Brundlefly 2,401]

8 hours ago, Woj said:

I didn't buy the 20th anniversary edition because I was hoping for a better version. It came. 

Me too. But I didn't count on it that soon.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 11,938]

I didn't but it because i downloaded it illegally! So easy.

[Wojo 2,458]

Of course. 

[Pieter Boelen 1,032]

On 29/06/2017 at 2:12 AM, Brundlefly said:

've tried a few album-like edits of several tracks of the JP scores and there are musically far better options to connect those different cues.

Care to share what you did?

I'm very curious!

[Brundlefly 2,401]

If I knew how to upload WAVE files and whether it is does not transgress the forum rules. ( - does it?)

[Pieter Boelen 1,032]

Probably against forum rules.

You could also just write which tracks you joined together.

 

Eventually I'll want to make a "complete OST presentation" for myself.

But when I haven't the foggiest when I'll be able to find some time to do that...

[Brundlefly 2,401]

My experiment was not to create a complete OST presentation, but to create a totally new experience. For I connected or inserted cues in ways, that you do not expect to follow one after another. So I created 30 tracks, nearly consisting of the complete scores of JP and TLW. JP had 14 tracks and TLW 16. The only thing I haven't done yet is the order of the tracks for a proper listening experience, so I can just show you the tracks alphabetically:

 

JURASSIC PARK

1. The Coming Storm (3:44) This is a track which sums up the whole threatening, "stormy" aspect of the score. It consists of four cues: Opening Titles, System Ready, The Encased Mosquito and The Coming Storm.
2. Dennis Steals the Embryo (5:04) The plain cue without edits. It is almost impossible to connect this cue to another one, due to its different style.
3. End Credits (8:03) The plain cue without edits.
4. Eye to Eye (5:20) Named after the OST track but not the same combination: To the Maintenance Shed is interrupted at 2:47 and the first 1:09 of The Falling Car is inserted. This has a surprising effect when you're used to the original cue. Additionally there is this "it is not over"-effect when To the Maintenance Shed sets in wih the percussion part.
5. Fatal Fault (4:17) This is The Saboteur, Race to the Dock and Incident at isla Nublar. So it starts threatening and leads into two orchestral outbursts.
6. The Great T-Rex Chase (2:26) This is The T-Rex Chase with an "extention" of the string chord which is actually You Bred Raptors?.
7. High Wire Stunts (6:06) High Wire Stunts, extended by the second half of The Falling Car.
8. The History Lesson (2:36) The History Lesson and Entrance of Mr. Hammond. I swaped the order of the 20th anniversary download, because I liked the euphoric moment of the latter cue at the end of the track.
9. Journey to the Island (8:55) The plain combination of the three cues without edits. It's just perfect as it is.
10. Lying in Wait (5:32) A combination of Jurassic Park Gate, Goat Bait and Hungry Raptor from 0:55. It starts with percussion and becomes more and more sinister until the end of The Hungry Raptor finishes the track with a brutal outburst.
11. A Night on a Tree (4:29) Remembering Petticoat Lane followed by My Friend, the Brachiosaurus as it was intended to overlap in the movie - beautiful.
12. The Raptor Attack and Finale (10:26) The complete finale music, put together: The Raptor Attack and T-Rex Rescue and FInale.
13. Raptor Eggs (3:25) Like the OST track with swapped order. When Live Finds a Way plays before Hatching Baby Raptor you just swap the order of threat and wonder. But the OST version is better.
14. The Triceratops (4:40) Ailing Triceratops and A Tree for My Bed. The tender melody of the triceratops is followed by an even more tender version of the Jurassic Park theme.

 

The only missing music of the score is Stalling Around and the first 0:55 of Hungry Raptor. But I have to admit, I think the edits of TLW worked far better than the edits of JP. If you want to create an own complete OST presentation you should just combine the shorter tracks.

[Brundlefly 2,401]

 

THE LOST WORLD

1. The Big Shot (4:51) Monster on the Loose and Ripples from 3:23 are combined to a very aggressive track.
2. Compy Attack (7:53) The Compys! leads into The Island's Voice. Both cues overlap for over 20 seconds, but they are both so quiet that you can hardly spot where the first cue ends and where the second begins.
3. Corporate Choppers and Raptors in the Grass (4:48) Corporate Helicopters and The Long Grass are bonded to a very percussion driven cue. There is a little pause between them that fits the rhythm.
4. Eddie to the Rescue (4:04) On the Glass without edits. No, I didn't connect it with Rescuing Sarah, because this cue cannot be combined with any other cue.
5. Hammond's Dream (6:42) These are the two main cues to quote the themes from the first film as an echo: Spilling Petrol and Finding Camp Jurassic. The percussion is now and then interrupted.
6. The Hunt (3:35) Like Rescuing Sarah this cue is too aggressive and unique to be combined with any other cue.
7. In the Trailer (3:45) This is In the Trailer with an extension which is actually Horning In. Again there is a short pause between both cues, as if it was intended.
8. InGens Plans (4:19) A very calm track. The end of Revealing the Plans can be perfectly connected with Heading North which continues the reserved tone of the former cue.
9. The Journey (6:33) To The Island is followed by Tranquilizer Dart. It marks the beginning and the end of the adventure and contains both main themes.
10. Ludlow Speaks (5:14) Another percussion driven track. Ludlow's Speech plays till 2:04 and leads into Reading the Map. The pause between the cues is as long as the pauses that occur in Ludlow's Speech from 2:00 to 2:19.
11. The Raptors Appear (6:15) The Raptors Appear and High Bar and Ceiling Tiles from 1:33 connected, so that the rhythm is constantly continued. This would have been a great OST track with an extended and more impressive highlight at the end of the track.
12. The Stegosaurus (5:29) The plain cue without edits.
13. Terror in San Diego (7:40) Visitor in San Diego cue without edits.
14. The Trek (6:58) Big Feet is like an introduction of The Trek, where the percussion sets in.
15. T-Rex in the Tent (6:58) The first 3:12 of Ripples lead into Ludlow's End. It's like an expanded version of the OST track that works better than the OST version, in my opinion.
16. Truck Stop (5:11) Rescuing Sarah without any edits and I already said why it is not edited. It is perfect as it is.

 

Here we have more music that is missing: Fire at Camp, Up in a Basket, Ripples from 3:12 to 3:23, High Bar and Ceiling Tiles until 1:33, The Wrecked Ship and the Jurassic Park Theme (End Credits). I had to exclude a few cues, as I wanted to limit the whole thing to a 90 minutes listening experience.

[Pieter Boelen 1,032]

That's some creative stuff there!

Thanks a lot.

[ymenard 67]

Aren't some of the 20th anniversary takes actually different takes from the LLL complete release? (but almost impossible to hear the difference)

[Jay 45,403]

Yes.

[Tydirium 1,561]

Does anyone here actually prefer the 20th anniversary track "The Coming Storm" over the LLL track "The Falling Car and the T-Rex Chase"? Or does everyone use the LLL track for when they want to hear "The T-Rex Chase"? I'm debating as to which I personally like best; the OST version of "Incident at Isla Nublar" is my always go-to due to the awesome inclusion of "The Falling Car", but then that makes the LLL track later kind of redundant, at least if compiling a playlist or something... Part of me kind of wishes "The T-Rex Chase" had been released as its own track.

[Holko 11,953]

Just listen to the LLL. I've never heard any other versions and the only way I can imagine someone having problems with it is if they're too used to the OST. Incident (fv) dies off on its own and Encased Mosquito plays its darkness off really well to lead us into lighter territory, no need to milk it with gratuitous action. And the middle of the score, the low point it's been building towards (race to the dock, falling car, t-rex chase), is already short enough with the T-Rex scene having no score, cutting it in half would really take its edge off, it wouldn't be an ample enough payoff to all the buildup that we'd need more time to recover from it (tree for my bed, petticoat lane, brachiosaurus, life finds a way) than how long it is.

[Xander Harris 9,256]

21 hours ago, Tydirium said:

Does anyone here actually prefer the 20th anniversary track "The Coming Storm" over the LLL track "The Falling Car and the T-Rex Chase"? Or does everyone use the LLL track for when they want to hear "The T-Rex Chase"? I'm debating as to which I personally like best; the OST version of "Incident at Isla Nublar" is my always go-to due to the awesome inclusion of "The Falling Car", but then that makes the LLL track later kind of redundant, at least if compiling a playlist or something... Part of me kind of wishes "The T-Rex Chase" had been released as its own track.

 

The anniversary bonus tracks aside from cartoon temp score fit right in with the original album. Incident at Isla Nublar film version has a totally jarring anticlimactic ending and the falling car music is an odd short track combined with Trex chase. Yes, it works better as arranged by JW for the album.

[Richard P 5,145]

I wrestled with this last year - the way JW combined tracks for the anniversary set is masterful, but my C&C brain wouldn't let me keep it that way.

 

I therefore have two playlists - one is the C&C LLL set with a few tweaks, and the other is the anniversary set with the missing couple of tracks inserted at sensible points.

[Bellosh 4,494]

Wish this would come back in-stock.  I unfortunately missed out on it. 

[wowbobwow 70]

On 1/30/2020 at 11:11 AM, Bellosh said:

Wish this would come back in-stock.  I unfortunately missed out on it. 

 

Same here.  I would even be fine just purchasing the album digitally but I understand that all the handshaking that needs to happen even to print the limited release I'm sure is a convoluted process.

[Holko 11,953]

Nothing wrong with not giving your action away in the first real track, especially with how damn frontheavy the score already is with Journey To The Island.

[wowbobwow 70]

For me, the original album release is up there with LOTR:FOTR as a near perfect assembly of the material and functions super well in that format.  I haven't heard the complete recordings, but I probably would prefer the listening experience of the soundtrack album if my relationship with the FOTR CR is anything to go by.  It's great that all this Jurassic Park music is now released. 

[Jurassic Shark 16,158]

1 hour ago, wowbobwow said:

but I probably would prefer the listening experience of the soundtrack album if my relationship with the FOTR CR is anything to go by.

 

That's much more repetitive than the complete JP score.

[Tydirium 1,561]

On 1/30/2020 at 2:34 AM, Gruesome Son of a Bitch said:

 

The anniversary bonus tracks aside from cartoon temp score fit right in with the original album. Incident at Isla Nublar film version has a totally jarring anticlimactic ending and the falling car music is an odd short track combined with Trex chase. Yes, it works better as arranged by JW for the album.

 

This is the conclusion I've come to, as well. I love "The Falling Car" as presented on the OST, but I don't really like it as the opening for a track. I also find that the T-Rex music works so much better when there hasn't already been action material earlier in the track. So yeah, the OST version is going to be my go-to for that from now on.

 

On 1/29/2020 at 5:49 AM, Holko said:

Just listen to the LLL. I've never heard any other versions and the only way I can imagine someone having problems with it is if they're too used to the OST. Incident (fv) dies off on its own and Encased Mosquito plays its darkness off really well to lead us into lighter territory, no need to milk it with gratuitous action. And the middle of the score, the low point it's been building towards (race to the dock, falling car, t-rex chase), is already short enough with the T-Rex scene having no score, cutting it in half would really take its edge off, it wouldn't be an ample enough payoff to all the buildup that we'd need more time to recover from it (tree for my bed, petticoat lane, brachiosaurus, life finds a way) than how long it is.

 

You've never listened to the OST...? And lol, just because something works fine on the LLL doesn't mean the OST can't be better. I'm not arguing with anything you're saying, but there is merit in JW's OST arrangements.

[Jurassic Shark 16,158]

The 20th anniversary edition wasn't on CD, so it doesn't really exist.

[Holko 11,953]

8 minutes ago, Tydirium said:

You've never listened to the OST...?

No, why would I when I have the real thing? I haven't heard a lot of JW's OSTs even for scores I like, and I definitely dislike a majority of the ones I have heard compared to the actual scores.

[Tydirium 1,561]

"The real thing"? Implying that the OST somehow isn't? JW puts a lot of time and effort into his album presentations; it's fine to dislike some of them but to act like they are somehow not legitimate versions of the music is... idk. There are plenty of cases where I prefer the actual score version to the OST version, as well—but JP is an exception in a few cases. And those cases are worth listening to at least once. It's 2020 and the movie came out in 1993; sorry, but why would you not have ever heard the JP OST by now? That sort of blows my mind.

 

11 minutes ago, Jurassic Shark said:

The 20th anniversary edition wasn't on CD, so it doesn't really exist.

 

It's available in CD-quality and high-res FLAC online.

[Jurassic Shark 16,158]

3 minutes ago, Tydirium said:

it's fine to dislike some of them but to act like they are somehow not legitimate versions of the music is... ignorant.

 

Fixed!

 

Post of the day, btw!

[mstrox 7,333]

The OST is still my preferred JP listening experience.

[Jurassic Shark 16,158]

Mine as well. It's one of his most perfect OSTs, along with Jaws and E.T..

[Holko 11,953]

10 minutes ago, Tydirium said:

"The real thing"? Implying that the OST somehow isn't? JW puts a lot of time and effort into his album presentations; it's fine to dislike some of them but to act like they are somehow not legitimate versions of the music is... idk. There are plenty of cases where I prefer the actual score version to the OST version, as well—but JP is an exception in a few cases. And those cases are worth listening to at least once. It's 2020 and the movie came out in 1993; sorry, but why would you not have ever heard the JP OST by now? That sort of blows my mind.

 

It's very simple: JW writes the score. That's the score. The real thing. The actual thing.

Then he takes his axe and cucks up narrative, structure, thematic development, sometimes excluding crucial portions crafts a "listening experience", which is factually and objectively a secondary later product created from the original, sometimes not even properly representing it.

 

I don't think I've even seen JP until 2011-2013 or so, and only in the past 2 years have I grown to love it; I haven't listened to the score outside the concert piece until one day I saw there was a legitimate complete release available. I still didn't buy it until the last week before it went OOP because I loved TLW on it, but didn't quite grow to love JP yet, that only happened mid-last year.

[Tydirium 1,561]

That's like saying Stravinsky's "Firebird Suite" (or any ballet suite for that matter) is an invalid piece of music, because it's not the complete ballet. Gimme a break. Composers have always taken selections from their work for more condensed listening experiences. It is still valid, because it is by the composer. You can dislike it or find it inferior, all you want, but to toss it out for the sole reason that it's condensed, is a bit over the top.

[Holko 11,953]

Did I say it's invalid? I said I personally don't give a shit about reductions when I have the whole thing and like it.

[Tydirium 1,561]

You said it's not "the real thing".

[mstrox 7,333]

The scale starts with Thor and ends with Holko and we all fall somewhere in between.

 

I like the full Star Wars trilogy better than the OSTs, and I like Rosewood better complete (with the choral pieces mixed back in).  Most of the time, it's the OSTs for me.

[Holko 11,953]

So? There's one single actual Jurassic Park score, and two reduced versions crafted from it. (in this one case, not even alternates come into the picture)

1 minute ago, mstrox said:

The scale starts with Thor and ends with Holko

I like Monsignor's OST a lot better than the film score! AotC, too! Maybe even TFA!

[Jurassic Shark 16,158]

4 minutes ago, mstrox said:

 

I like the full Star Wars trilogy better than the OSTs, and I like Rosewood better complete (with the choral pieces mixed back in).  Most of the time, it's the OSTs for me.

 

I prefer Rosewood incomplete. Entirety incomplete.

 

4 minutes ago, mstrox said:

The scale starts with Thor and ends with Holko and we all fall somewhere in between.

 

Yeah, he's no better than Thor, which he seems to love mocking for his stubborn opinions.

[Tydirium 1,561]

@Holko, has it ever occurred to you that maybe one reason JW has been so resistant to scores getting complete releases is because he... likes, maybe even prefers his OST listening experiences? Just because a composer writes a score to fit a film, does not mean they don't wish things were different if simply presented as a piece of music for good listening.

 

Heck, what's to say that some of JW's OST versions don't feature his original intentions, but that he later had to move those portions to different parts of the film due to scene editing? And there are of course also cases of OSTs including music that was not even included in the film, period; should that stuff not be on the album simply because it's not "the real thing"?

[Jurassic Shark 16,158]

3 minutes ago, Tydirium said:

@Holko, has it ever occurred to you that maybe one reason JW has been so resistant to scores getting complete releases is because he... likes, maybe even prefers his OST listening experiences? Just because a composer writes a score to fit a film, does not mean they don't wish things were different if simply presented as a piece of music for good listening.

 

Heck, what's to say that some of JW's OST versions don't feature his original intentions, but that he later had to move those portions to different parts of the film due to scene editing? And there are also cases of OSTs including music that was not even included in the film, period; should that stuff not be on the album simply because it's not "the real thing"?

 

Just give up, man. Completists don't respect the composer's right to decide when it comes to their own art.

[Holko 11,953]

5 minutes ago, Tydirium said:

@Holko, has it ever occurred to you that maybe one reason JW has been so resistant to scores getting complete releases is because he... likes, maybe even prefers his OST listening experiences?

Has it ever occured to you that I don't have to like his butcherings jut because he does? Or that now that a competent person is doing the expansions, he agrees to the vast majority of them being released?

 

5 minutes ago, Tydirium said:

And there are of course also cases of OSTs including music that was not even included in the film, period; should that stuff not be on the album simply because it's not "the real thing"?

Where did I say the "real thing" is the version the music editors already butchered to shit? I did even mention alternates can cloud the picture, but that doesn't come into play for JP.

[wowbobwow 70]

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion.  I think it's pretty awesome we can debate about different releases of a soundtrack!

[Tydirium 1,561]

17 minutes ago, Holko said:

Has it ever occured to you that I don't have to like his butcherings jut because he does? Or that now that a competent person is doing the expansions, he agrees to the vast majority of them being released?

 

But you haven't even listened to the JP OST. So how can you speak with any authority on this subject when it comes to this score? You haven't even heard it to know whether you like/dislike "his butcherings" (bit of a harsh way to put it).

 

17 minutes ago, Holko said:

Where did I say the "real thing" is the version the music editors already butchered to shit? I did even mention alternates can cloud the picture, but that doesn't come into play for JP.

 

Fair point. So I guess by your logic, hearing a film's OST is more valid than seeing the film performed live-to-picture. Right? Since the OST is 100% the composer's choice as to what is included, whereas the movie isn't.

[Jay 45,403]

49 minutes ago, Tydirium said:

JW puts a lot of time and effort into his album presentations

 

Do you know this for a fact?