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John Williams: Unpopular Opinions

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6 minutes ago, TGP said:

Hmm. Trying to decide if I want to do this obvious debate.  Steve McQueen seems a reasonable bloke, but I just don't know if I have the energy even so.  

I'm a bit low on energy myself, so if  there is a debate to be had it would be an even contest.

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32 minutes ago, Steve McQueen said:

Williams is the last living legend of film music.  It only makes sense for critics to shower him with praise now, something they didn't always do.

But, the fact is, Williams is the greatest living composer of orchestral music in the world.  Certainly there are many luminaries in contemporary classical music, and some talented figures in modern film scoring.  But, the hard truth is this: modern classical music is stiff and elitist, even at its most progressive, and modern film music is banal and repetitive.

Williams, even on a bad day, writes music that is better because it remains vibrant, accessible and technically advanced.  Art is not only for artists.  The consummate artist shares his soul with the world, arranging his message in a form that endures.      

 

We'll just have to train someone to be similar.

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Well, much of it is a gift.  But, the gift must be used to its fullest.  We must point the way to the example of John Williams as something worth emulating and studying, strengths and flaws.

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I don't need another John Williams. I dig the one we've got just fine. I resent the notion that we need a successor or that so-and-so is the "next _______". If I wanted to become a cartoon director, I wouldn't aspire to become the next Tex Avery, I'd want to be the first, well, me!

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6 hours ago, Steve McQueen said:

Williams, even on a bad day, writes music that is better because it remains vibrant, accessible and technically advanced.

 

It's great if you really think that, but I think that just comes down to taste - Williams' style aligns very well with your musical ear.

 

I have cues by other composers that mean 10x more to me than many Williams cues. This idea of permanent vibrancy and accessibility is just rubbish. Actually, I listened to the single Johann Johansson cue I have (a track called Pods) the other day, and that did more for me than most cues in Star Wars do.

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19 hours ago, Oswin Pond said:

I'm glad I found another HP3 lover :wub:

This is really not difficult on this forum. Most people here adore it and want an expanded release of it more than anything else.

 

18 hours ago, Philippe Roaché said:

Williams' best score is The Lost World.

It's not necessarily his best, but it's also my favourite.

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I remember it was a common complaint back when the score was new, but I always appreciated that Lost World rarely used the JP theme compared to the original (or how much Don Davis practically spams it in JP3), mainly saving it for a brief bit at the beginning and then fully unleashed at the end (Giacchino did a similar thing with JW). It makes the theme more appreciated, something to subconsciously look forward to. 

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6 minutes ago, kaseykockroach said:

I remember it was a common complaint back when the score was new, but I always appreciated that Lost World rarely used the JP theme compared to the original (or how much Don Davis practically spams it in JP3), mainly saving it for a brief bit at the beginning and then fully unleashed at the end (Giacchino did a similar thing with JW). It makes the theme more appreciated, something to subconsciously look forward to. 

 

Quite true.

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14 minutes ago, Not Mr. Big said:

Munich > Memoirs of a Geisha

 

I think not.

Both fine scores, though.  I find Munich to be rather underappreciated. The cello suite from Memoirs, however, should be an international concert staple.

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The Jedi Steps and Finale is so awesome. How did he go from hitting the notes again like that and putting a smile on all of our faces to slapping together an autopilot score like TLJ? It should have been better. It could have been.

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At 86, I'm sure Williams is feeling fatigue regardless of the project but he obviously still enjoys working and is dedicated to his work.  He wrote over 2.5 hours of above average music for a mostly lousy movie, that shows true dedication and spirit right there.

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2 hours ago, someonefun124 said:

He wrote over 2.5 hours of above average music for a mostly lousy movie, that shows true dedication and spirit right there.

 

But TLJ wasn't "mostly lousy"... if that's the movie you're referring to?

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9 minutes ago, Not Mr. Big said:

It was only partly lousy!

 

With that part being the whole Canto Bight subplot... really, it was the only part of the movie that I really disliked, along with some instances of awkward and forced humor.

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11 minutes ago, JohnSolo said:

 

With that part being the whole Canto Bight subplot... really, it was the only part of the movie that I really disliked, along with some instances of awkward and forced humor.

No that was the best part of the movie.  The Falthiers is classic Williams.

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26 minutes ago, Philippe Roaché said:

Modern audiences need lengthier films so they have time to periodically check their phones during boring pointless scenes.

Where I come from there are no Tommy texters.

1 hour ago, Denise Bryson said:

So Hollywood has forgotten how to edit its own movies?

Hi Denise,

Do you remember that long argument on another thread about how TLJ was too long and how Canto Bight was pointless. I'm sorry to say that I cannot remember your opinion, but I seemed to think that you indeed thought that it stretched the film in an unnecessary  way. 

Yours truly

Jerry

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1 hour ago, Jerry said:

Where I come from there are no Tommy texters.

Hi Denise,

Do you remember that long argument on another thread about how TLJ was too long and how Canto Bight was pointless. I'm sorry to say that I cannot remember your opinion, but I seemed to think that you indeed thought that it stretched the film in an unnecessary  way. 

Yours truly

Jerry

 

I still haven't seen TLJ, but I happen to agree with Philippe above regarding texters. It may be intentional by design to write and edit films with dead patches to allow audiences to tweet about what they're watching so they don't miss anything consequential while they do. This ensures the film remains "viral" and as relevant on social media tracking for as long as possible.

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On 28. Februar 2018 at 2:32 AM, someonefun124 said:

I would say the quality of both is equal. They’re both excellent scores and compliment each other wonderfully.

 

Because much of it is the exact same.

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3 hours ago, Denise Bryson said:

I still haven't seen TLJ, but I happen to agree with Philippe above regarding texters. It may be intentional by design to write and edit films with dead patches to allow audiences to tweet about what they're watching so they don't miss anything consequential while they do. This ensures the film remains "viral" and as relevant on social media tracking for as long as possible.

This would be the death of cinema and the of the texters, when I'm at the cinema, too.

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4 hours ago, Denise Bryson said:

I still haven't seen TLJ, but I happen to agree with Philippe above regarding texters. It may be intentional by design to write and edit films with dead patches to allow audiences to tweet about what they're watching so they don't miss anything consequential while they do. This ensures the film remains "viral" and as relevant on social media tracking for as long as possible.

 

Movies got unbearably long in the 90's, long before the advent of SMS, forget about social media apps.

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Just now, publicist said:

 

Movies got unbearably long in the 90's, long before the advent of SMS, forget about social media apps.

 

It's nothing to do with their length, it's the intentional dead spots in modern blockbuster movies that provide a window for social media users to pull their phone out and tweet about the movie.

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