The Last Jedi THE LAST JEDI - OST Album MUSIC Discussion (No Movie Spoilers)

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There's so much unreleased brassy goodness throughout the score, I'm sure there are more variations in the complete score.

 

Geez, how I already long for a Matessino expansion of this score. Incredible!

[Giftheck 1,030]

6 hours ago, rjamerson said:

I can't find my liner notes for TFA but the musician list for TLJ looks bigger than what I remember for TFA.

 

My copy of TFA doesn't have a musician list.

[Balahkay 629]

I'm probably one of the few who enjoys "The Cave" track.  I love Williams goes into a dark/moody/scary mode. I love the statement of Rey's theme, too.  I think this track could end up on the FYC with no problem.

 

:40 gives me POA vibes.

 

[FC4L 87]

On 12/15/2017 at 11:03 AM, Rick said:

And here's a YouTube playlist of the OST:

 

That's a GREAT way to fight piracy.... just give EVERYONE the album for FREE!

 

Holy crap studios are f-ing stupid.

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You do realise Disney/Williams would make money off streaming services due to the ads that play before the videos, right?

[Docteur Qui 1,575]

I've decided that the worst thing about the first 30 seconds of "The Fathiers" is that it doesn't go for longer. I challenge anyone to listen to it and not crack a smile.

[Chen G. 4,712]

So, has anyone identified any themes beyond the two from "The Rebellion is Reborn"?

 

I'm not talking about some generic gestures (e.g. that piccolo in the opening), but things that are clearly intended as leitmotives that represent something.

[Docteur Qui 1,575]

There's a buuuuunch of recurring motifs (especially action ones), not much in the way of longer themes though by the sounds of it. I think once we get the FYC and have more rewatches more we'll have more of an idea.

[Chen G. 4,712]

Again, I'm not talking some meaningless and generic gestures nor setpiece-specific material - proper leitmotives, be they long themes are short motives.

[Bilbo 3,868]

On 14/12/2017 at 4:58 PM, Jay said:

Maybe on the day it was recorded, they forgot to hit Ctrl-S

 

More like command + S. 

 

#pedantic

[DarthDementous 1,250]

what exactly is it about this score that makes it sound so much more like Star Wars to me than TFA?

is it the mix?

and I'm not talking about the returning material, the new stuff fits very snugly in the Star Wars lexicon in the way that still feels suprisingly flesh.

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The mix is a revelation compared to TFA. It fits right at home with the 3 prequels, which is simply how I identify that 'Star Wars sound' now.

 

I guess they were aping ANH with TFA's mix but, on top of everything else that film was lifting from ANH, the score didn't need to follow the same formula. I've done a total 180 on March of the Resistance since hearing it live and hearing the theme's new variations in TLJ. It just works for me now and feels right at home with anything in the OT. I always hated that dry recording in TFA, was an instant-skip for months (especially those obnoxious opening blasts).

 

Anyway, we had the experiment and now we can get back to normal programming. I hope IX is a continuation of TLJ's sound and style, though perhaps less reliant on older themes (we can now rule a few out) and more opportunities for choir/new material. And above all else, a little more cohesion to the editing would be welcome... oh shit, it's JJ Abrams.

[BloodBoal 7,541]

Trevorrow wasn't so bad, now, was he?

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Yes, he was.

[Chen G. 4,712]

I have an issue with the general prequel-vibe of this score. These scores and films are supposed to be enjoyed in the narrative order of the episodes, but now the eighth episode heavily calls back, of all the previous entries, to what is supposed to be the third episode? There are half a dozen spots where it nearly quotes prequel themes, the SATB choir is back (albeit briefly), the chu-daiko is back, the mix is similar, etc...

[BloodBoal 7,541]

12 minutes ago, crumbs said:

Yes, he was.

 

I was speaking purely in terms of music, obviously!

[Brundlefly 2,395]

6 hours ago, someonefun124 said:

I'm probably one of the few who enjoys "The Cave" track.  I love Williams goes into a dark/moody/scary mode. I love the statement of Rey's theme, too.  I think this track could end up on the FYC with no problem.

 

:40 gives me POA vibes.

 

1:35 is the highlight of this cue. And I don't agree with the people saying it's the least interesting track of this OST.

[Holko 10,396]

Who the hell would say that?

[Bilbo 3,868]

1 hour ago, Chen G. said:

I have an issue with the general prequel-vibe of this score. These scores and films are supposed to be enjoyed in the narrative order of the episodes, but now the eighth episode heavily calls back, of all the previous entries, to what is supposed to be the third episode? There are half a dozen spots where it nearly quotes prequel themes, the SATB choir is back (albeit briefly), the chu-daiko is back, the mix is similar, etc...

 

Can you give a list of all the prequel quotes?

[JohnnyD 1,330]

One of the many things I like about the Maestro's score is the new concert piece, "The Rebellion Is Reborn." It combines Rose's theme, the Ahch-To Island motif, and the Rey and Luke student/teacher motif into a singular idea. It weaves them together showing that Rose's passionate spirit, combined with the knowledge of the Force, as well as everything Rey learns from Luke, form to create a singular idea, hence the name of the piece. Incredible.

[Joni Wiljami 1,212]

7 hours ago, someonefun124 said:

I'm probably one of the few who enjoys "The Cave" track.  I love Williams goes into a dark/moody/scary mode. I love the statement of Rey's theme, too.  I think this track could end up on the FYC with no problem.

 

:40 gives me POA vibes.

 

 

I have always loved JW in that mode.

I have no idea what is wrong with the people here, I need to find a new fan forum.

[BloodBoal 7,541]

Yeah, people with an opinion different than yours. What's wrong with them??

[Remco 688]

2 hours ago, Chen G. said:

I have an issue with the general prequel-vibe of this score. These scores and films are supposed to be enjoyed in the narrative order of the episodes, but now the eighth episode heavily calls back, of all the previous entries, to what is supposed to be the third episode? There are half a dozen spots where it nearly quotes prequel themes, the SATB choir is back (albeit briefly), the chu-daiko is back, the mix is similar, etc...

 

Can't believe you're bringing this up. Didn't you complain in many posts that Williams had lost his touch of writing music that was more complex, grand, or well... perhaps more 'prequel-esque'? And that it sounded too different to the London recordings? 

If anything, I find it tasteful that for the second movie in the trilogy, he briefly brought back the drums and choir to support the final act that was more dramatic than the one in TFA.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,445]

The brass in this score is absolutely fantastic. 

[publicist 4,647]

50 minutes ago, hornist said:

I have no idea what is wrong with the people here, I need to find a new fan forum.

 

That empty promise stands since years now.

[BloodBoal 7,541]

"One day! One day, I swear! But maybe not today..."

[Chen G. 4,712]

43 minutes ago, Remco said:

Can't believe you're bringing this up. Didn't you complain in many posts that Williams had lost his touch of writing music that was more complex, grand, or well... perhaps more 'prequel-esque'? And that it sounded too different to the London recordings? 

If anything, I find it tasteful that for the second movie in the trilogy, he briefly brought back the drums and choir to support the final act that was more dramatic than the one in TFA.

 

That's not it. So much of the material itself sounds like near-quotes of themes from Revenge of the Sith. Its clear to me that Johnson really liked that score, and temp-tracked his film with it, and became so enamored with his temp-track that he made Williams follow it very closely. Since there is no thematic reason for this episode to, well, errr, "rhyme" with episode 3 of all films, it doesn't ring entirely true for me.

 

As far as the quality of the sound, yes its a more grandiose and dramatic score and its better off for it. Its actually a presence in the film, which is refreshing, but Johnson's temp-track love and a shortage of new thematic material drags it down for me.

[Joni Wiljami 1,212]

25 minutes ago, publicist said:

 

That empty promise stands since years now.

 

Even You will miss me, my dear.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,445]

I agree there is a lot of ROTS in there, in the way old themes are rather bluntly stated. The overuse of the Force Theme, the heavy reliance of motific or rhytmic underscore over long thematic developments. 

 

It's scoring a much more exciting film though.

[crocodile 8,606]

1 hour ago, Stefancos said:

I agree there is a lot of ROTS in there, in the way old themes are rather bluntly stated. The overuse of the Force Theme, the heavy reliance of motific or rhytmic underscore over long thematic developments. 

 

It's scoring a much more exciting film though.

In ROTS Williams was saying goodbye to SW in this one he's saying goodbye to a certain SW era. So it sort of makes sense.

 

Karol

[bespinGPT 8,852]

So far, what are the Concert suites of this new OST, "The Rebellion is Reborn"... only?

[ocelot 554]

On 12/16/2017 at 6:03 AM, Denise Bryson said:

Listened to the OST. Haven't seen the movie yet. Lacks some of the wow moments that TFA had. Falls back on repeating old tropes, and quotes older films almost verbatim. Seems to lack an identifying quality that characterises it, like TFA had Rey's theme, ROTS had Battle of the Heroes, AOTC had ATS, TPM had DotF and Anakin's Theme, etc. But what does TLJ have?

 

Overall, it's amazing orchestral music, but feels, I dunno, more like textured wallpaper than its more highlight-heavy predecessors? Maybe I shouldn't look forward to these scores so much in the future. And if reactions to the film are anything to go by, maybe Williams ought to hang it up and let someone else take on the next one. Maybe Hans Zimmer could have a turn.

Are you totally insane?! You want a samples and synth drum score? In Star Wars?

[Jay 39,754]

7 minutes ago, Bespin said:

So far, what are the Concert suites of this new OST, "The Rebellion is Reborn"... only?

 

Yes.

[bespinGPT 8,852]

It's thin. 

 

I wonder what John Williams will decide to conduct in his next concerts. 

[Tom 5,148]

Not too much to wonder about, if you are speaking about VIII.  The only Hal Leonard piece the Rebellion is Reborn.  I was hoping for more pieces, but the piece itself is fantastic.  Seamlessly weaving together three separate musical ideas, complexly orchestrated, and ending on a full-blown hopeful note.  I mentioned this elsewhere, but I think it is better than AtS and BotH, the two other "one-piece only from a new SW score" selections.  

[BTR1701 60]

14 minutes ago, Bespin said:

It's thin. 

 

I wonder what John Williams will decide to conduct in his next concerts. 

 

He doesn't only do concert arrangements. He did "Indy's First Adventure" and "Battle in the Snow" at two different Hollywood Bowl concerts.

[ocelot 554]

15 minutes ago, Bespin said:

It's thin. 

 

I wonder what John Williams will decide to conduct in his next concerts. 

He might write a new concert arrangement or has done so already by now, or he just does the rebellion is reborn.

[Jurassic Shark 13,359]

31 minutes ago, Bespin said:

So far, what are the Concert versions cues of this new OST, "The Rebellion is Reborn" only?

 

I'm not convinced that's 100% a concert version.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,445]

It has a concert ending

[Chen G. 4,712]

It is a concert arrangement, but I bet its edited from material written for the underscore, rather than having been composed and recorded for the album or end-credits in the way of Williams previous suites.

[Nick Parker 3,047]

Yeah, it's very possible we could get an "Irina's Theme" situation here. 

[Jurassic Shark 13,359]

18 minutes ago, Stefancos said:

It has a concert ending

 

Indeed.

[Balahkay 629]

I was foolishly holding out hope that Williams wrote other concert arrangements that he didn't want included on the OST,

[crocodile 8,606]

20 minutes ago, Nick Parker said:

Yeah, it's very possible we could get an "Irina's Theme" situation here. 

I was thinking that.

 

Karol

[Docteur Qui 1,575]

9 hours ago, Chen G. said:

Again, I'm not talking some meaningless and generic gestures nor setpiece-specific material - proper leitmotives, be they long themes are short motives.

 

Again, there's a bunch of recurring motifs that cross the boundaries between set-pieces, scattered all around the OST. Calling them generic gestures doesn't mean they don't exist. I don't know what they represent yet as I've only seen the movie once but it's obvious they hold some meaning.

 

It's a lot like TFA which also had a bunch of micro-motifs that were used sparingly but had specific association (the map motif, Finn's theme, First Order motif etc.)

[artguy360 1,908]

5 hours ago, JohnnyD said:

One of the many things I like about the Maestro's score is the new concert piece, "The Rebellion Is Reborn." It combines Rose's theme, the Ahch-To Island motif, and the Rey and Luke student/teacher motif into a singular idea. It weaves them together showing that Rose's passionate spirit, combined with the knowledge of the Force, as well as everything Rey learns from Luke, form to create a singular idea, hence the name of the piece. Incredible.

What's the difference between the island motif and they student/teacher motif?

 

Also is there nothing of Holdo or new Resistance material in there? I'm trying to understand all of The Rebellion is Reborn but I still don't love it. I don't like the combination of motifs or the general structure. 

[Chen G. 4,712]

15 minutes ago, Docteur Qui said:

 

Again, there's a bunch of recurring motifs that cross the boundaries between set-pieces, scattered all around the OST. Calling them generic gestures doesn't mean they don't exist. I don't know what they represent yet as I've only seen the movie once but it's obvious they hold some meaning.

 

It's a lot like TFA which also had a bunch of micro-motifs that were used sparingly but had specific association (the map motif, Finn's theme, First Order motif etc.)

 

Not every gesture in a Williams score (or a Wagner one, for that matter) is supposed to hold some meaning, and if it doesn't hold meaning, its not a leitmotif. A prime example from this score is the woodwind line following the opening crawl. Its recurring from the original Star Wars. But does it really mean anything to the story? well, not really, no. Therefore, its not a leitmotif.

 

The "map motif" you refer to is another example, where the recurring gesture is not a narrative device but a stylistic device applied by Williams to denote mystery: here, the mystery of Luke's whereabouts. Again, not a leitmotif.

 

Within those perhaps more "academic" criteria, I don't think there are more than a handful of new leitmotives to this work, but there's got to be more than just the two themes from "The Rebellion is Reborn", I'm sure.

[KK 3,308]

On 12/16/2017 at 11:22 PM, crocodile said:

It's very much like Danny Elfman's Justice League in that respect. Just ever changing tempi and different ideas colliding with each other with very little consequence. Maybe it's just best to leave all films to Zimmer's and Junkie XL's as they can just cover up all the creases with warm blanker of their sound design?

 

Karol

 

Indeed. All well written, energetic stuff, but sometimes it just plays off as wallpaper. It's like Williams was addressing only the most functional beats of the film's action and energy. Maybe the staggered sessions affects his writing process in this regard, at this age?

[Jurassic Shark 13,359]

1 hour ago, Tom said:

Not too much to wonder about, if you are speaking about VIII.  The only Hal Leonard piece the Rebellion is Reborn.  I was hoping for more pieces, but the piece itself is fantastic.  Seamlessly weaving together three separate musical ideas, complexly orchestrated, and ending on a full-blown hopeful note.  I mentioned this elsewhere, but I think it is better than AtS and BotH, the two other "one-piece only from a new SW score" selections.  

 

In my opinion AtS is the best theme and concert arrangement since the original trilogy. The movie doesn't match the quality of the theme, though...

[ocelot 554]

Didn't Williams write things before seeing the film? I remember seeing somewhere that Rian wanted to edit the film TO the music. So many things must have been written first. Maybe that is why some of the action music seems choppy in terms of rhythm to some of you. IE: Williams didn't address the tempo changes but wrote pieces and they were edited later or scenes written around them and edited to them and music then also edited to fit different scenes in that fight. OMG, I think I just confused myself. You know what I mean!

 

I am going to see the The Last Jedi tonight. Spent yesterday and today watching Rogue One through to The Force Awakens. Lord that Rogue One score goes nowhere real fast. Mind you he (Gia) hardly had time to write but he seriously has no clue how to modulate, some great ideas, but they sort of just plonk onto the ground with a thud, Dear Lord, and there was a tie fighter attack moment where he could have used TIE FIGHTER ATTACK, gggrrrrrr. Sometimes I do not know why composers who follow Williams do not use every theme and motif he wrote for that certain franchise. It's right there for you, lol. Some lovely slow musical moments that really highlight the emotion though, I'll give him that. OK, back on topic, rant over....