Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488 Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 Yeah, I don't get that either. But his generation likes suppressing stuff. Maybe he thinks the OSTs are like a Russian plot or something. Deacon Blues and Unlucky Bastard 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faleel 5,340 Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 45 minutes ago, The Big Man said: The difference is Thor is fine with other people listening to C&C as long as he doesn't have to. But Holko wants to suppress OSTs so that nobody else will ever be able to hear them. He wants the labels to stop selling expansions and start selling complete unreleased scores only.... Holko 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arpy 4,145 Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 There wouldn't be any of this OST vs. C&C crap if the damn studios/composers just invested the time and money to release the whole score upfront in the first place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted November 2, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted November 2, 2020 25 minutes ago, Arpy said: There wouldn't be any of this OST vs. C&C crap if the damn studios/composers just invested the time and money to release the whole score upfront in the first place. Why would a composer necessarily want to do that? They obviously have a different idea of how their music should be represented outside the constraints of the film itself. And for that, I don't blame them. To a composer, they probably want their bare music to be experienced as a concert symphony as opposed to an archival reference item for zealous enthusiasts. bruce marshall, Jurassic Shark and 1977 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faleel 5,340 Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 Some composers are dissapointed in everything they write soo.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 35 minutes ago, Spider-Fal said: Some composers are dissapointed in everything they write soo.. Not everything, obviously... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488 Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 1 hour ago, Spider-Fal said: Some composers are dissapointed in everything they write soo.. Only JW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Manakin Skywalker 4,891 Posted November 2, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted November 2, 2020 The entire reason album presentation for films exist is because of the technological and budgetary limitations of the early-to-mid 1900's. Record labels and/or film studios were usually unwilling to release any more than one hour of music, whether the composer wanted all of their music to be released or not, to the point where it's become one of those unnecessary cultural traditions that people have become needlessly complicit with. It's a concept that needs to go in my opinion. We have the ability to release full scores these days, and if the composer feels they want to release those full scores, they should have the freedom to do so. I imagine most composers want all of their music to be released, but the studios won't let them out of the sake of tradition and wanting to spend the least amount of money they possibly can. It usually has nothing to do with the composer's intent, as some people here would wrongly have you believe. It all comes down to corporate greediness and the complicitness of some fans. In some cases, it might be the composer's wishes to release a condensed presentation, and those are the only cases I'm somewhat okay with. CGCJ, Fabulin, Holko and 2 others 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crumbs 14,301 Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 I wonder if he was unhappy releasing such a short ROTJ album. Would've thought he had the clout to go for a double LP if he so desired. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faleel 5,340 Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 47 minutes ago, Gruesome Son of a Bitch said: Only JW Heh. Riiiiight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 Many scores have too many redundancies and boring bits to work in C&C form as a commercial product. Composers know their music better than we do, so I trust their judgement. 1977 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holko 9,499 Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 6 hours ago, The Big Man said: The difference is Thor is fine with other people listening to C&C as long as he doesn't have to. But Holko wants to suppress OSTs so that nobody else will ever be able to hear them. They've been out for 40 fucking years and reissued so many times, once even the proper actual album masters that the guy admitted he owns in multiple formats, I just don't want the eventual finally for the first time normally properly done releases to be bogged down by them too because they have no proper unique material or any clever combinations and I think they are terrible incoherent messes. I look through my expansions andc an make an excuse for each included OST (even if it's "eh, disc 2 had space for it anyway, why not I guess), and can't really make any excuses why the ones that don't incluse them should have. And I can't think of any real good excuse to include the SW ones either. I've never seen a good comparison about how the album mixes differ, but Mike could use some of it as inspiration when doing the mixes from the multitracks from scratch if something's buried in one but not the other. Once again you just disingenuously spew false assumptions about what people think just to make your point. Go fuck yourself. Chewy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted November 2, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted November 2, 2020 36 minutes ago, Holko said: Go fuck yourself. Hurling abuse at people with a different perspective. Sad! Gruesome Son of a Bitch, Brando and rough cut 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holko 9,499 Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 3 hours ago, Manakin Skywalker said: The entire reason album presentation for films exist is because of the technological and budgetary limitations of the early-to-mid 1900's. Record labels and/or film studios were usually unwilling to release any more than one hour of music, whether the composer wanted all of their music to be released or not, to the point where it's become one of those unnecessary cultural traditions that people have become needlessly complicit with. It's a concept that needs to go in my opinion. We have the ability to release full scores these days, and if the composer feels they want to release those full scores, they should have the freedom to do so. I imagine most composers want all of their music to be released, but the studios won't let them out of the sake of tradition and wanting to spend the least amount of money they possibly can. It usually has nothing to do with the composer's intent, as some people here would wrongly have you believe. It all comes down to corporate greediness and the complicitness of some fans. In some cases, it might be the composer's wishes to release a condensed presentation, and those are the only cases I'm somewhat okay with. From the stuff I've listened to, not many complete film scores feature the wildly badly changing moods and tempos and all that to follow scene changes and whatnot that many people always complain about - if the composer knows what they're doing, the transition will feel right and warranted and will fit, or deliberately a messy fun back-and-forth. Many of these messy OSTs like ESB and TPM and the Indys mashing unfitting cues together with bad transitions, alternating between moods in a feeble attempt to try and keep even the lowest form of attention deficit listener's attention, shoving very differently written concert cues into the first couple tracks to satisfy another form who just want dat one cool song from da moovi, fit that description much better. I have to think on some level all that being the norm and the only available standalone release for decades contributed somewhat to that perception/conclusion/judgment. 41 minutes ago, The Big Man said: Hurling abuse at people with a different perspective. Sad! hurlling abuse at someone who decides what I think and derides me for it Chewy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 15 minutes ago, Holko said: hurlling abuse at someone who decides what I think and derides me for it With judgements like: 16 minutes ago, Holko said: feeble attempt to try and keep the lowest form of attention deficit listener's attention, shoving very differently written concert cues into the first couple tracks to satisfy another form who just want dat one cool song from da moovi, fit that description much better. ...ya ain't helping your cause. Arpy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,287 Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 Holko, you're allowed to express your own opinions all your want and say how they differ from other people's opinions, but you can't tell other forum members to go fuck themselves. Please familiarize yourself with the forum rules before posting again. Thanks! https://www.jwfan.com/forums/index.php?/topic/20175-forum-rules-please-read-before-posting/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Jurassic Shark 12,030 Posted November 2, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted November 2, 2020 He clearly meant it as a compliment! Smeltington, A. A. Ron and crlbrg 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holko 9,499 Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 47 minutes ago, Jay said: Holko, you're allowed to express your own opinions all your want and say how they differ from other people's opinions, but you can't tell other forum members to go fuck themselves. Please familiarize yourself with the forum rules before posting again. Thanks! https://www.jwfan.com/forums/index.php?/topic/20175-forum-rules-please-read-before-posting/ Oh but Drax is just allowed to purposefully misphrase and misrepresent and straight out make up others' statements and opinions and when called out for it, play the victim as if he's the reasonable one over and over again? You didn't say anything here but you do now when I've included reasoning behind it too? Unlucky Bastard and Chewy 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,287 Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 How about you both talk about music without insulting anybody else when doing so? And how about no members ever tell other members to go fuck themselves? That's all I ask. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488 Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 They're excellent albums, including ROTJ. I tend to listen to the Charles Gerhardt versions if I want to listen to the SW soundtracks. Unlucky Bastard 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 They're shorter and more digestible. Chewy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1977 1,743 Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 I prefer the single LP TESB assembly to the 2 LP set. I suppose the fact that it's all I had for the first 10 years (until I got the Gerhardt) has something to do with it. I choose the Anthology over the 2 LP sequence when I want a more substantial listen. I wonder what a single LP sequence of SW would have looked like? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,030 Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 28 minutes ago, JTWfan77 said: I wonder what a single LP sequence of SW would have looked like? Just cut out the boring stuff. Manakin Skywalker and 1977 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted November 3, 2020 Share Posted November 3, 2020 After listening to the 2015 masters... whoa, these are so damn dynamic. And so I opened them up in Audition to have a look, and, wow! This is how film scores and music in general should look in a waveform. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chewy 2,379 Posted November 3, 2020 Share Posted November 3, 2020 3 hours ago, The Big Man said: This is how film scores and music in general should look in a waveform. Look yes, sound no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crumbs 14,301 Posted November 3, 2020 Share Posted November 3, 2020 From a technical perspective, there's nothing wrong with the 2015 album masters. Just a matter of personal preference whether you prefer the Neal album mixes for SW/ESB or the Tomlinson film mixes, I guess. I'd say most prefer the latter? Jurassic Shark 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted November 3, 2020 Share Posted November 3, 2020 43 minutes ago, Chewy said: Look yes, sound no. It sounds great! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Jay 37,287 Posted November 3, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted November 3, 2020 Those remasters were like the only good thing Sony ever did with their license to sell Star Wars music Manakin Skywalker, A. A. Ron and crumbs 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted November 3, 2020 Share Posted November 3, 2020 They should have put them on CDs so that people could have a more permanent copy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manakin Skywalker 4,891 Posted November 3, 2020 Share Posted November 3, 2020 Digital is permanent as long as you don't delete the files. Chewy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A. A. Ron 1,739 Posted November 3, 2020 Share Posted November 3, 2020 Yeah, if anything digital is more permanent than CDs, which may rot after a decade or two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,030 Posted November 3, 2020 Share Posted November 3, 2020 CDs are digital. They're just a storage medium. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bespin 8,480 Posted November 3, 2020 Share Posted November 3, 2020 34 minutes ago, Jurassic Shark said: CDs are digital. They're just a storage medium. I think he wanted to say we don't have proper CD covers when it's digital only! Jurassic Shark 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manakin Skywalker 4,891 Posted November 3, 2020 Share Posted November 3, 2020 Most digital lossless sites include PDF's of the raw cover art, at least in my experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted November 3, 2020 Share Posted November 3, 2020 3 hours ago, A. A. Ron said: Yeah, if anything digital is more permanent than CDs, which may rot after a decade or two. Mine haven't. And I have CDs manufactured from as early as 1982. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
igger6 894 Posted November 3, 2020 Share Posted November 3, 2020 @The Big Man, can you elaborate on your adulation for those waveforms? I'm a waveform neophyte, and I'm curious what makes those indicative of particularly good...mixing? Mastering? I don't even know enough to know which term to use. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A. A. Ron 1,739 Posted November 4, 2020 Share Posted November 4, 2020 3 hours ago, The Big Man said: Mine haven't. And I have CDs manufactured from as early as 1982. And they might not for many more years, but it's still possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted November 4, 2020 Share Posted November 4, 2020 3 hours ago, igger6 said: @The Big Man, can you elaborate on your adulation for those waveforms? I'm a waveform neophyte, and I'm curious what makes those indicative of particularly good...mixing? Mastering? I don't even know enough to know which term to use. The ratio of the peaks/transients to quieter bits is fairly wide, so those louder bits have more punch when they hit. This tends to make music more fun and interactive. And the 2015 masters achieve this without falling into the trap that many remasters fall into where peaks reach clipping levels. Regardless of how these were mixed, and I know people here are divided on the album mixes, the mastering job on these is very, very good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manakin Skywalker 4,891 Posted November 4, 2020 Share Posted November 4, 2020 @The Big Man what, you don't like your waveforms looking like this? Holko 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted November 4, 2020 Share Posted November 4, 2020 5 minutes ago, Manakin Skywalker said: @The Big Man what, you don't like your waveforms looking like this? Ughhhhhhhh farrrrk 🤢🤮 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faleel 5,340 Posted November 4, 2020 Share Posted November 4, 2020 29 minutes ago, Manakin Skywalker said: @The Big Man what, you don't like your waveforms looking like this? Clone Wars? Manakin Skywalker 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Chewy 2,379 Posted November 19, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted November 19, 2020 Back of the cover of the ESB LP release coming tomorrow. I don't know who designed this, but it's really a disaster. The track titles are not even correctly balanced, just like the audio, where all the stuff is on the left channel. Holko, Brundlefly, crumbs and 3 others 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Holko 9,499 Posted November 19, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted November 19, 2020 It's a genius secret protest by the designer intern against the quality of the content! crumbs, Brando, Jay and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruce marshall 1,315 Posted November 19, 2020 Share Posted November 19, 2020 Another release of ESB? What is unique to this one? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,030 Posted November 19, 2020 Share Posted November 19, 2020 I didn't know Shawn Murphy also does cover designs! Chewy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chewy 2,379 Posted November 19, 2020 Share Posted November 19, 2020 1 minute ago, bruce marshall said: Another release of ESB? What is unique to this one? First vinyl release of the 2018 demastered version. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,287 Posted November 19, 2020 Share Posted November 19, 2020 2 minutes ago, bruce marshall said: Another release of ESB? What is unique to this one? This is John Williams's 1980 OST LP program, newly rebuilt by Shawn Murphy in 2018 from a new transfer of the old elements, now appearing on vinyl for the firs time. Disney Records already released this to CD as well as all digital platforms in 2018 bruce marshall 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smeltington 1,436 Posted November 19, 2020 Share Posted November 19, 2020 Jay, reading your description you would think this is an exciting release... I feel like you should qualify it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,287 Posted November 19, 2020 Share Posted November 19, 2020 Addendum: It is universally agreed that Shawn Murphy's 2018 remasters are inferior to the original releases of the OST albums. Smeltington and Disco Stu 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crumbs 14,301 Posted November 19, 2020 Share Posted November 19, 2020 That's certainly a nice euphemism. Good grief the layout on that back cover is horrible. Can we please get some competent designers at Disney one day? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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