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Anyone here succumbed to 4K Ultra HD Blu-ray?


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Do you own or plan to acquire a UHD Blu-ray capable home cinema system?  

96 members have voted

  1. 1. Do you own or plan to acquire a UHD Blu-ray capable home cinema system?

    • Yes, I do
    • No, 1080p Blu-ray is good enough.
    • No, I'll miss my 3D Blu-ray too much.
    • No, I've only got 720p capability and it looks mighty fine.
    • No, DVD rulez!
    • No, I'm still rocking a Laserdisc player!
    • No, VHS will return (just look at vinyl)!
    • What's UHD Blu-ray?


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4 hours ago, crocodile said:

Watched 1917 three times on the new disc. It is a perfect transfer. I didn't need to watch the film that many times for the sake of it but the 4K disc (and standard one too) also features two splendid commentary tracks - one by Sam Mendes and another one by Roger Deakins. Both very generous and informative and there is very little overlap in content. Mendes talks about the inspirtation, facts, wiritng and actors. whereas Deakins goes into great detail about camera equipment, lensesn rigs, lighting...basically telling you how they shot the entire film from start to finish. It's a goldmine if you're into this sort of thing. Fans of the cinematographer's work should really check it out (I'm talking to you @Marian Schedenig and @Koray Savas).

 

Karol

I actually just purchased this myself the other day. I missed it in theaters so I’m excited to give it a spin. Also picked up Knives Out. 

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11 minutes ago, Koray Savas said:

I actually just purchased this myself the other day. I missed it in theaters so I’m excited to give it a spin. Also picked up Knives Out. 

That is another terrific disc with great informative set of extras. :)

 

Karol

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5 hours ago, crocodile said:

Fans of the cinematographer's work should really check it out (I'm talking to you @Marian Schedenig and @Koray Savas).

 

Oh, it's definitely on my list. I wanted to see it at the theatre, but missed it. Currently, I'm waiting for Amazon (my main source for Blu-rays) to start shipping films regularly again (at least the German Amazon stopped shipping most films themselves at the beginning of the COVID crisis, meaning you only had 3rd party shippers with extra shipping costs to choose from).

 

(And the same goes for Knives Out)

 

1 hour ago, Chen G. said:

Digital camera never actually resolve their stated resolution. The footage has to undergo filtering for colour and aliasing, and is typically within 76-80% of the stated value. So a 4K RED One actually resolves around 3.2K. You'd therefore need to shoot at 5K to get images that will actually resolve a full 4K.

 

But if we're talking aliasing, don't you also have to take the target resolution into account? Obviously, a perfect 4K source could be mapped to a 4K target, but I expect a 4.1K source or a 3.9K target would require extensive aliasing (to prevent heavy moiré effects if nothing else), thus reducing the effective resolution. I'd expect a similar problem as with the Nyquist frequency in audio sampling, meaning that for all practical purposes, a 4K target will never be able to resolve a non-native 4K image anyway?

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That's what I'm saying, there's an optical low-pass filtering to prevent aliasing, plus a Bayer filter, both of which conspire to make the actual resolving power within 76-80% of the camera's resolution (more on some newer cameras), so a 4K digital camera resolves 3.2K, a 5K camera resolves 4K, etc.

 

Its also why you have to oversample film when you scan it for UHD: 35mm film resolves around 3K, so you scan it at anywhere from 4K to 8K and then downres it back to get rid of aliasing. In large film formats you also have to take the optical limitations of the lens and possible judder in the camera system into account.

 

So to get true 4K you need the source to be either a 5K digital camera or VistaVision (or larger). If one were being pedantic, one would say that on the film side of thing, true 4K comprises of 4K's worth of picture information rather than grains, in which case an even bigger format would be necessary.

 

I should add, this is all true for stills: when you run the film at 24fps, the percieved,  temporal resolving power increases because our eyes average information across several adjecant frames at any given time. Its an effect that's more pronounced in faster filmstocks (where its estimated to nearly double the percieved resolving power) than it is with slower or larger formats or with digital, and it also depends on movement in the frame.

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21 minutes ago, Chen G. said:

If one were being pedantic, one would say that on the film side of thing, true 4K comprises of 4K's worth of picture information rather than grains, in which case an even bigger format would be necessary.

 

That was my point. Or rather, the other way round: For any source of significantly high resolution that's not *exactly* 4K, a 4K transfer will produce aliasing and moiré patterns, and the antialiasing necessary to gloss over these will lower the effective resolution to less than 4K. Regardless of whether the resource was digital or analogue, you won't be able to resolve an effective, steady 4K from any source. Rather the best you can do will be something akin to what you get with wave sampling and the Nyquist frequency. Meaning that, unless I'm missing something, you'll never get an effective 4K resolution on a digital 4K target format, except when the image is hand drawn in digital 4K.

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Yep, although again the files produced by the camera could still be 4K files, but if you were to shoot a chart, it won't resolve 4K and if it were made to (by removing the filters), it would be littered with moire.

 

A 5K RED Epic produces moire-free 4K images, though, and I believe a 6K scan of good VistaVision footage resolves just over 4K (including grains).

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I understand that anti-aliasing filters affect the resolution (though many claim they don't see the difference with or without) but Bayer sensors (almost every sensor in the world) aren't 4K (or whatever) because of their Bayer filter (the way they arrange colors)?!

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The way the Bayer filter is constructed, you're not getting the same resolution on all three colours: it has 50% of the photosites filtered green and 25% filtered red and blue each. So, as long as you're shooting colour, the full resolution is unattainable, although some cameras manage to extract as much as 85% of the camera's stated resolution. It depends on the footage, too.

 

The same happens with the colour layers in film: the red always has the least resolving power, which is why red colours or scenes lit in red tend to look softer. Green is sharpest on film, hence green screens.

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I pre-ordered this today. Looks very comprehensive. But the price! 😱

 

DAWN_OF_THE_DEAD_3D_BD_SLIPCASE_PACK_V2_

 

Also got this on pre-order:

 

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And Jaws, War of the Worlds and The Invisible Man.

 

Karol

 

 

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1 minute ago, Alexcremers said:

 

All this ... for Flash Gordon?! Seems a little disproportionate. 

Says a man who lives in a world in which Star Wars exists. ;)

 

Karol

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2 minutes ago, crocodile said:

Says a man who lives in a world in which Star Wars exists. ;)

 

Karol

 

Okay, but Star Wars is big business with potentially a gazillion customers. 

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Jaws 4K review

 

https://thedigitalbits.com/item/jaws-45th-4k-uhd

 

This extract is from the Blu-ray.com review:

 

Music remains largely the property of the front channels but does amplify as John Williams' iconic notes become more forceful; the scene in chapter five when Brody witnesses the shark attack being one of the best, and earliest, examples of the score's powerful presentation, crescendoing with greater stretch and surround integration. It's a treat; never have the notes sounded so full, the low end so positive and complimentary, the engagement so sure and balanced.

 

https://www.blu-ray.com/movies/Jaws-4K-Blu-ray/265299/#Review

 

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Jaws has some weird audio anomalies, including very obvious ADR. But two parts specifically always sounded messed up to me.

 

"I'm all by myself out there." - Line actually skips 

"This is what happens." - Line comes out of nowhere 

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Unless its an obvious flaw, like a piece of music missing, I don’t notice these things.

 

Sometimes, that makes me wonder if I should sell my TV and hifi setup and just stick to mono presentations on a 4:3.

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6 hours ago, Jay said:

The new one from 2020?  We watched that, it was very good!

Yes. You know I am an extra feature nut and it apparently has some good ones. Plus there are several nods to the original that were fun for a film enthusiast 

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4 hours ago, Alexcremers said:

 

Haven't seen it or even heard that much about it. What makes it so remarkable?

Bless you. Read this thread again starting from this post. 😆

 

The film itself is fine.

 

Karol

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This morning on the drive to work I noticed the drive-in movie theater a few towns over from us is back open again, and they are showing a double feature of The Invisible Man and The Hunt, which I thought was cool because they were the first movies kind of shuffled off to VOD when the pandemic started

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23 hours ago, crocodile said:

Guess I know what I'm doing tonight!

 

IMG_20200603_080758.jpg

 

Ooh both HDR10+ and Dolby Vision!

 

IMG_20200603_080853.jpg

 

Karol

 

Nice!

 

Did you get the booklet? Is it nice?

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No, I wouldn't waste money on that. It's almost twice the price and there is no extra content on the discs themselves.

 

Karol

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