John Williams & the Vienna Philharmonic: January 18/19 2020

[Jurassic Shark 12,028]

1 minute ago, Steve said:

The best of both concerts would have made a perfect concert.

 

Are you implying that the album isn't a combination of both concerts?

[Steve 589]

24 minutes ago, Jurassic Shark said:

Do we know whether all pieces on the album are from the Sunday concert, or did they, like they ought to, choose the best performance?

The videos from the performances are all from sunday so it is most likely the sunday audio too. They overdubbed some mistakes that I remembered from sunday.

[Pawel P. 738]

Come on... Why do I have the impression that after the concerts everyone was delighted? This is a live recording - minor flaws are acceptable, and fortunately I hardly hear them. I don't mind the slower pace here and there, and even if the orchestra is a bit off the pace at the start of the Star Wars Main Title, it's not something that would bother me. The performances are fantastic, the sound is perfect, but knowing that these concerts gave Williams and people gathered at Musikverein great joy is priceless. Blu-ray gave me a lot of emotions that reminded me of what I felt during those two wonderful days in January. And I know that I will come back to this concert very often and always with great pleasure. Thank You John Williams, Thank you Wiener Philharmoniker. 

[Steve 589]

1 minute ago, Pawel P. said:

Come on... Why do I have the impression that after the concerts everyone was delighted? This is a live recording - minor flaws are acceptable, and fortunately I hardly hear them. I don't mind the slower pace here and there, and even if the orchestra is a bit off the pace at the start of the Star Wars Main Title, it's not something that would bother me. The performances are fantastic, the sound is perfect, but the awareness that these concerts have given Williams and the people gathered at Musikverein is priceless. Blu-ray gave me a lot of emotions that reminded me of what I felt during those two wonderful days in January. And I know that I will come back to this concert very often and always with great pleasure. Thank You John Williams, Thank you Wiener Philharmoniker. 

Well said. 100% agree. Everyone who wasn't there can't argue about that.

[Jurassic Shark 12,028]

I have the impression that those who attended the concert are more forgiving regarding the flubs, timing issues, and tempo issues. I guess that's just a normal human response towards something one loves.

[Pawel P. 738]

7 minutes ago, Steve said:

The videos from the performances are all from sunday so it is most likely the sunday audio too. They overdubbed some mistakes that I remembered from sunday.

 

No, part of the concert is from Saturday. I don't have time for a more detailed analysis now, but the concert is a combination of both days - you can see it perfectly thanks to the changing people in the seats in the audience.

[Dr. Rick 1,155]

Folks, unless I'm missing something, the CD release is not a live recording in front of the audience from either day.  The CD package itself states "John Williams in Vienna" and there is literally no applause anywhere on the CD.  I believe this recording was a separate session sans audience.

[Steve 589]

1 minute ago, Jurassic Shark said:

I have the impression that those who attended the concert are more forgiving regarding the flubs, timing issues, and tempo issues. I guess that's just a normal human response towards something one loves.

No. I noticed them in concert, too. And I especially took notice of it because I heard before that VPO could walk on water

Just now, Pawel P. said:

 

No, part of the concert is from Saturday. I don't have time for a more detailed analysis now, but the concert is a combination of both days - you can see it perfectly thanks to the changing people in the seats in the audience.

Nope I thought that before,too. Williams wore a blue tie on sunday and a grey tie on saturday. In the video it is all blue tie, except for his 1st speech. Some audience shots are from saturday. Performance is all from sunday, at least for the video.

[Matt S. 492]

6 minutes ago, ATXHusker said:

Folks, unless I'm missing something, the CD release is not a live recording in front of the audience from either day.  The CD package itself states "John Williams in Vienna" and there is literally no applause anywhere on the CD.  I believe this recording was a separate session sans audience.

 

It's easy enough to edit out the applause.  They performed a few pickup takes after the audience left the hall, perhaps to cover the starts and ends of pieces that had applause overlap, but other than that, this CD is from the live performances.

[Pawel P. 738]

7 minutes ago, Steve said:

No. I noticed them in concert, too. And I especially took notice of it because I heard before that VPO could walk on water

Nope I thought that before,too. Williams wore a blue tie on sunday and a grey tie on saturday. In the video it is all blue tie, except for his 1st speech. Some audience shots are from saturday. Performance is all from sunday, at least for the video.

 

Ok. Thanks for the clarification.

[Jurassic Shark 12,028]

13 minutes ago, Steve said:

No. I noticed them in concert, too.

 

I didn't say that you didn't take notice, but that you seem more forgiving.

[artguy360 1,843]

2 hours ago, bollemanneke said:

But it was always a slow piece, right?

Slow-ish, but the Luke in Exile parts in the OST version are a little more forceful, almost staccato but rapidly gaining speed. I guess that is what I would call punchy. This Vienna version sounds much warmer but also calmer.

[SteveMc 2,674]

1 hour ago, Disco Stu said:

 

I completely agree!  I just couldn't pass up the opportunity to tease @Steve, who I will admit I only just realized isn't @SteveMc.....oops.

 

I agree with whoever above said that "Rebellion is Reborn" was too slow.  Rose's theme sounded like it was in slow motion.

[bruce marshall 1,315]

1 hour ago, Matt S. said:

 

It's easy enough to edit out the applause.  They performed a few pickup takes after the audience left the hall, perhaps to cover the starts and ends of pieces that had applause overlap, but other than that, this CD is from the live performances.

Concert audiences are incapable of being quiet .

They have a psychological defect that causes them to cough if they hear an audience member cough.😵.it becomes a " chain reaction"

I don't understand this phenomom. I have sat through. 3 is hour Philip Glass opera without even clearing my throught!

[MaxTheHouseelf 324]

3 minutes ago, Steve said:

The best of both concerts would have made a perfect concert. The release is still fantastic. I can live with 2-3 tempo uncertainties and the generally slower tempo. The tempos were slow on both days by the way.

 

I agree. I find some of the comments here a bit hilarious. Most of the tracks are fantastic performances with a phenomenal sound. The mix is superior to anything I've heard, (especially compared to the cruel Dudamel album) and very well balanced. I see no point nagging on every opportunity where someone in the orchestra might've been a milisecond late or whatever. Some of the things mentioned here is beyond fair and serious criticism. These were two live performances with a top orchestra which never played most of Williams music before, not recording sessions with various opportunities for correction. Rehearsal time might indeed have been a bit short with 3 rehearsals for 19 pieces?!!

I guess nobody in the audience cared about little mistakes, I certainly didn't. The audience, orchestra and Williams seemed to have tremendous fun, it could not have been better. On top, we now have some great recordings to choose from.

 

The brass timing in the beginning of Star Wars is indeed a bit unlucky, considering this is probably Williams most well known piece, but otherwise, I like this performance very much. The blockade runner section is superior to anything from LSO or else IMO, the slower tempo makes these chords sound so grand and powerful, like an army marching. The brass section was breathtaking. Devils Dance is fantastic (the best of all pieces featuring ASM), Luke and Leia amazing, same with Adventures on Earth, Jurassic Park... I prefer the Boston Pops version of Flight to Neverland. Not sure about Rebellion is Reborn, I guess if you're used to the OST, then this sounds a bit strange.

 

Overall, I find this album very enjoyable and we were so lucky that this once-in-a-lifetime event has been recorded and filmed, right before god damn Coronavirus hit Europe.

[Tom 4,634]

5 hours ago, artguy360 said:

I'm curious, what for you is revealed or made better about the piece with this performance? For me the slower tempo takes the punch out of it.

I think the grandness of Rose's theme.  For me, the exile theme/s serve not so much as a punch but as a varied counterpoint adding to the majesty of Rose's theme. The Vienna performance gave the piece a classical elegance I had not previously noticed.  

[Jurassic Shark 12,028]

7 hours ago, Disco Stu said:

 

I completely agree!  I just couldn't pass up the opportunity to tease @Steve, who I will admit I only just realized isn't @SteveMc.....oops.

 

I agree with whoever above said that "Rebellion is Reborn" was too slow.  Rose's theme sounded like it was in slow motion.

 

It's probably just one of Steve's auxiliary accounts.

[Biodome 714]

I don't know what you're all going on about. This is absolutely and unquestionably the best live recording of a John Williams concert in the history of John Williams concerts. Who cares if they mess up a couple of seconds of the Star Wars Main Title if they immediately make up for it by playing the best rendition of the theme ever. I would consider most of the pieces in this album to be the best recordings, some of them even more emotionally moving than the clean, studio-recorded OST versions. God, how amazing the Flight to Neverland, Close Encounters, E.T., The Rebellion is Reborn, and The Imperial March performances are! There are simply no equals to those!

 

You can all go nitpicking the pieces if you want, of course, who am I to stop you, but for me, this is the most precious musical memory of the 25 years of my life, and I can't thank John Williams and Wiener Philharmoniker enough for making it accessible on demand in every possible format, so that I can re-experience it whenever I desire.

[Jurassic Shark 12,028]

Wasn't the Lockhart album a live recording? That's much better.

[Biodome 714]

10 minutes ago, Jurassic Shark said:

Wasn't the Lockhart album a live recording? That's much better.

I appreciate the rarely performed pieces they chose there, but no, the album doesn't come close to the grandeur of the Vienna concert recording.

[Jurassic Shark 12,028]

Grandeur doesn't mean better quality.

[Biodome 714]

19 minutes ago, Jurassic Shark said:

Grandeur doesn't mean better quality.

 

What I am looking for in an album, is, first and foremost, the subjective experience. The technical stuff does matter, but so does the emotion with which the orchestra plays, the timbre of each instrument, and how well it resonates within the hall, and, let's face it, for classical concerts, there is no better acoustic environment in the world than the Großer Saal.

 

I don't listen to these kinds of albums with the score in my hands, meticulously checking if all the notes match up. I listen to these albums lying on the couch, with eyes closed, and volume turned up, so it feels like I am there. This album is able to bring me to tears, which rarely happens with other recordings. Of course, the fact that I was there plays a big part in that as well. As I said, it's a subjective experience; I don't feel the need to take the role of an examiner.

[Jurassic Shark 12,028]

Having attended hundreds of concerts with "lesser" orchestras, of both standard repertoire and of film music, many of the JW Vienna performances come across as unusually sloppy.

[Biodome 714]

15 minutes ago, Jurassic Shark said:

Having attended hundreds of concerts with "lesser" orchestras, of both standard repertoire and of film music, many of the JW Vienna performances come across as unusually sloppy.

 

Haha, try attending a concert in Italy. You won't believe how "sloppily" they tend to play in the technical sense. Yet, somehow, many of the best live classical recordings, in particular operas, come from there!

[Steve 589]

41 minutes ago, Jurassic Shark said:

Having attended hundreds of concerts with "lesser" orchestras, of both standard repertoire and of film music, many of the JW Vienna performances come across as unusually sloppy.

I'm sure that if you would hear these "lesser" concerts recorded professionally they would sound lesser

55 minutes ago, Biodome said:

let's face it, for classical concerts, there is no better acoustic environment in the world than the Großer Saal

Absolutely agree! 

[Jurassic Shark 12,028]

34 minutes ago, Steve said:

I'm sure that if you would hear these "lesser" concerts recorded professionally they would sound lesser

 

I often do, but the recording doesn't make the timing of the orchestra any better or worse.

[rough cut 1,714]

2 hours ago, Biodome said:

I don't know what you're all going on about. This is absolutely and unquestionably the best live recording of a John Williams concert in the history of John Williams concerts. Who cares if they mess up a couple of seconds of the Star Wars Main Title if they immediately make up for it by playing the best rendition of the theme ever. I would consider most of the pieces in this album to be the best recordings, some of them even more emotionally moving than the clean, studio-recorded OST versions. God, how amazing the Flight to Neverland, Close Encounters, E.T., The Rebellion is Reborn, and The Imperial March performances are! There are simply no equals to those!

 

You can all go nitpicking the pieces if you want, of course, who am I to stop you, but for me, this is the most precious musical memory of the 25 years of my life, and I can't thank John Williams and Wiener Philharmoniker enough for making it accessible on demand in every possible format, so that I can re-experience it whenever I desire.

 

Well said, I agree with every word.

[Jurassic Shark 12,028]

2 hours ago, Biodome said:

This is absolutely and unquestionably the best live recording of a John Williams concert in the history of John Williams concerts.

 

Well, it's the only peformance that's been professionally recorded for release on album.

 

1 hour ago, Biodome said:

I don't listen to these kinds of albums with the score in my hands, meticulously checking if all the notes match up.

 

You don't need a score in your hands if you've got ears.

 

1 hour ago, Biodome said:

Of course, the fact that I was there plays a big part in that as well.

 

I don't doubt that.

 

44 minutes ago, Biodome said:

 

Haha, try attending a concert in Italy. You won't believe how "sloppily" they tend to play in the technical sense. Yet, somehow, many of the best live classical recordings, in particular operas, come from there!

 

Italian orchestras indeed often come across as second rate, but it helps to have played the operas a thousand times before.

[Steve 589]

@Jurassic Shark I'm sorry that these Vienna recordings are so painful to listen to for you. Maybe the VPO could apologize for playing so sloppy 

[Jurassic Shark 12,028]

I'm just expressing my personal opinion about the album, and people always have different views. For some reason you seem incapable of handling disagreement about any topic on this board. 

 

9 minutes ago, Steve said:

Maybe the VPO could apologize for playing so sloppy

 

They really should release a disclaimer.

[bruce marshall 1,315]

1 hour ago, Jurassic Shark said:

Having attended hundreds of concerts with "lesser" orchestras,....

" Hundreds"?

Wow!

Are u an usher?

😆

[Jurassic Shark 12,028]

I have a concert subscription.

 

Btw, they're out of stock of your medicine.

[bruce marshall 1,315]

Sorry to hear that.

What's it for, arthritis, dementia, incontinence?

[Steve 589]

5 minutes ago, Jurassic Shark said:

I have a subscription.

For which orchestra?

18 minutes ago, Jurassic Shark said:

I'm just expressing my personal opinion about the album, and people always have different views. For some reason you seem incapable of handling disagreement about any topic on this board.

I'm absolutely fine with different opinions. However, I'm not fine with overly critical beancounting.

[Jurassic Shark 12,028]

4 minutes ago, Steve said:

For which orchestra?

 

My local orchestra, of course. It may not be a big name orchestra, but it's well-funded and of high artistic quality.

 

 

[bruce marshall 1,315]

😡

[Jurassic Shark 12,028]

8 minutes ago, Steve said:

I'm absolutely fine with different opinions. However, I'm not fine with overly critical beancounting.

 

To some people, good timing is a very important factor in a performance. For others, it's not that important. What you describe as overly critical is just a difference of opinion regarding what's important.

 

9 minutes ago, bruce marshall said:

Sorry to hear that.

What's it for, arthritis, dementia, incontinence?

 

You tell me.

[Steve 589]

3 minutes ago, Jurassic Shark said:

 

To some people, good timing is a very important factor in a performance. For others, it's not that important. What you describe as overly critical is just a difference of opinion regarding what's important.

It is the generalisation that annoys me and much is simply not true. You act as if the Rolling Stones performed these concerts. The orchestra was mostly together very well.

[Jurassic Shark 12,028]

The Rolling Stones usually plays with better timing.

 

2 minutes ago, Steve said:

It is the generalisation that annoys me. You act as if the Rolling Stones performed these concerts. The orchestra was mostly together very well.

 

I've pointed out that not all tracks are bad and my main complaint is with Jaws, as I've said before.

[Steve 589]

Lets rest this case. You have your opinion, I have mine.

 

I prefer to enjoy this Blueray with its handful of (performance) flaws.

[Bellosh 3,385]

The Suite from Jaws is my favorite piece on this.  I know that may seem lame, but whatever.  It's always been one of my favorite concert pieces by JW, and this just solidifies it.  It's perfect.

[Jurassic Shark 12,028]

Really?

[Bellosh 3,385]

Yes.  I love it.

[Jurassic Shark 12,028]

I'm just too disturbed by the struggling fluting to fully enjoy it.

[Bellosh 3,385]

3 minutes ago, Jurassic Shark said:

I'm just too disturbed by the struggling fluting to fully enjoy it.

 

See, in the true essence of ignorance is bliss, I, someone who does not have a musically trained ear, can listen to these without any of these problems you speak of!  

[Jurassic Shark 12,028]

Just now, Bellosh said:

 

See, in the true essence of ignorance is bliss, I, someone who does not have a musically trained ear, can listen to these without any of these problems you speak of!  

 

I'm sure you'll notice it sooner or later!

[Steve 589]

30 minutes ago, Jurassic Shark said:

 

I'm sure you'll notice it sooner or later!

Btw whats your musical education?

[Jurassic Shark 12,028]

I'm John Williams.

[bollemanneke 3,337]

4 hours ago, Jurassic Shark said:

Wasn't the Lockhart album a live recording? That's much better.

Yes. And Lockhart understood how a march is supposed to be played.

[Bellosh 3,385]

1 hour ago, Jurassic Shark said:

The Rolling Stones

 

wrong thread, the Marty Scorsese thread is that way ---------->