Popular Post Alan 689 Posted December 1, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted December 1, 2018 23 minutes ago, redishere said: I’m slowly starting to get why some cues are not in chronological order. It's becoming clearer that this will be much more than a chronological playlist burned to CD, which POA with it's numerous short cues could be in danger of becoming in the wrong hands. MM's treatment of Close Encounters for LLL is what opened my eyes (ears?) to what was really important in these releases. I'm so excited to hear the complete POA score in its best possible presentation, without even thinking about the film too much. redishere, crumbs, bollemanneke and 3 others 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will 2,215 Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 Listening to the partial clean "Rescue of Sirius" from that podcast from a few weeks ago has finally made me realize how great a cue it is: I'm still not a huge fan of Buckbeak's theme (in any context), but the opening of this cue kicks some serious ass -- and I'm excited to hear the full clean version on the new set. This cue clearly foreshadowed the (imho) even better "Presses Roll" from The Post. Locrius and Alan 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post King Mark 3,631 Posted December 1, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted December 1, 2018 I also LOVE the extended transition between The Firebolt and End Credits Once, redishere, Will and 4 others 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post mahler3 478 Posted December 1, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted December 1, 2018 8 hours ago, redishere said: Yeah, sounded like there were two tracks playing the harp lullaby at the same time, but a fraction of second out of sync. This COS cue issue appeared to be similar! As Mike said, "heightened antenna!" 🙂 Yes, well spotted - I thought it was quite seamless for the Hedwig and Wondrous World overlays, but Fluffy was a bit trickier to sync up . Sorry about that, I just thought it appropriate to insert JW talking about the Children's Suite movements considering the subject matter. Here's the source material if anyone is interested: redishere, TSMefford, TownerFan and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redishere 697 Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 15 minutes ago, mahler3 said: As Mike said, "heightened antenna!" 🙂 Yes, well spotted - I thought it was quite seamless for the Hedwig and Wondrous World overlays, but Fluffy was a bit trickier to sync up . Sorry about that, I just thought it appropriate to insert JW talking about the Children's Suite movements considering the subject matter. Here's the source material if anyone is interested: No big deal, the interview and the music were so interesting that I completely forgot about that sync issue until now 😂 mahler3 and TSMefford 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mahler3 478 Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 Thanks! 🙂 TSMefford and redishere 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Space Pineapple Prod. 183 Posted December 2, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted December 2, 2018 Boy am I glad I found this thread! The discussion of the music from such knowledgeable people is always fascinating. bollemanneke, TSMefford, Jay and 2 others 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Josh500 1,615 Posted December 2, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted December 2, 2018 4 hours ago, King Mark said: I also LOVE the extended transition between The Firebolt and End Credits One of the many highlights on this set! bollemanneke, Will and TSMefford 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Josh500 1,615 Posted December 2, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted December 2, 2018 This has been mentioned like 300 times after this set was announced, but I still can't believe we're getting all these previously unreleased cues in perfect quality... One I cannot wait to listen to is this entire scene (scored from beginning to end!) in the Shrieking Shack that goes on for what? Like 15 minutes? Including PP's theme!!! redishere, Once, Molly Weasley and 2 others 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incanus 5,714 Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 Well if we are being accruate The Shrieking Shack is actually 6½ minutes of music if you are just speaking of the scene in the house itself. Including all the surrounding material it runs much longer of course. And it is awesome to finally hear it all on its own in its full glory. Once 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh500 1,615 Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 1 hour ago, Incanus said: Well if we are being accruate The Shrieking Shack is actually 6½ minutes of music if you are just speaking of the scene in the house itself. Including all the surrounding material it runs much longer of course. And it is awesome to finally hear it all on its own in its full glory. I didn't time it with a stopwatch. I just meant that's what it feels like... Because this scene is scored throughout, without a single interruption. It may be underscore for the most part, but the underscore in PoA is simply brilliant! I like the cheated and shrill brass, when the "betrayal" becomes clear and Hermione screams "I trusted you!": in the first video above at around 1:30. But yeah, with the surrounding music (entry and exit of the Shrieking Shack) it's apt to be around 15 to 25 minutes! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post mrbellamy 6,287 Posted December 2, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted December 2, 2018 On 11/29/2018 at 2:15 PM, mrbellamy said: This is my mock-up of the Remembering Mother (Lupin/Harry on bridge) alternate. The leaked sheet music also does indeed have different cues for Harry/Sirius looking at the castle and I believe Harry/Lupin in the forest that don’t feature the final Past theme. But again, no clues as to whether these were recorded. Gave a go at mocking these up too since it seems like they may not be on the set and I was curious to hear them. crumbs, Once and Holko 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holko 9,526 Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 Thanks for providing illustration, I will probably not weep for any of these 3 if they are not on the set. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4,643 Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 All three sound like the top melody went missing. Holko 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brundlefly 2,385 Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 OMG, the old Finale sound. Awful. There are new programs, like Finale 25, that have considerably improved over the last ten years, but you have to sell your home to be able to afford them. bollemanneke and mrbellamy 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incanus 5,714 Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 41 minutes ago, publicist said: All three sound like the top melody went missing. Agreed. Revisions with A Window to the Past theme were an obvious improvement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post redishere 697 Posted December 2, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted December 2, 2018 Yes, I think it’s clear by now that we’ll have both unused and alternate cues in this set. That unreleased Pettigrew motif we heard for Honeydukes is an example. Everything JW composed and recorded will be there, and they’re probably hidden into longer comprehensive tracks, so if those aforementioned alternates were not recorded, there’s nothing we can do about it, and more importantly, it doesn’t mean the set is not complete. I’m sure they wouldn’t go and record a few short cues after 14 years from the original recordings. I’m still confident there’ll be a lot of hidden surprises in this collection, though! Alan, TSMefford, Pieter Boelen and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Jay 37,363 Posted December 2, 2018 Author Popular Post Share Posted December 2, 2018 The harpsichord motif was tracked by the music editors into the Shrieking Shack scene, we've known that since the sheet music leak. bollemanneke, Once and TSMefford 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSMefford 1,509 Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 2 minutes ago, Jay said: The harpsichord motif was tracked by the music editors into the Shrieking Shack scene, we've known that since the sheet music leak. Sounds like I’ve got some fun editing to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh500 1,615 Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 10 minutes ago, Jay said: The harpsichord motif was tracked by the music editors into the Shrieking Shack scene, we've known that since the sheet music leak. But just the one at the beginning when they enter the Shack, right? Peter Pettigrew's theme heard several times during that scene, after he appears... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,363 Posted December 2, 2018 Author Share Posted December 2, 2018 And it's all tracked. bollemanneke 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh500 1,615 Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 20 minutes ago, Jay said: And it's all tracked. What does that mean, though? JW scored these scenes, and then later came up with this motif? Or that the producers asked JW later on to add something? But hopefully this motif is heard in all its glory on this set! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSMefford 1,509 Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 8 minutes ago, Josh500 said: What does that mean, though? JW scored these scenes, and then later came up with this motif? Or that the producers asked JW later on to add something? But hopefully this motif is heard in all its glory on this set! I doubt the tracked motif would appear on the set during the Confrontation Scene cue. I don’t think it was necessarily JW that placed it over the scene. More than likely music editors or even the post sound cue did pasted it in far after the scoring. It’s probably sourced from Reading the Map or one of the other Pettigrew cues. Once 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4,643 Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 Tbh, my dim recollection of the recent RAH concert revealed that as 'idée clef' (a fixed recurring motif repeated the same at certain story beats) more than a developed idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh500 1,615 Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 17 minutes ago, TSMefford said: I doubt the tracked motif would appear on the set during the Confrontation Scene cue. I don’t think it was necessarily JW that placed it over the scene. More than likely music editors or even the post sound cue did pasted it in far after the scoring. It’s probably sourced from Reading the Map or one of the other Pettigrew cues. Hmmm, one would think that, if JW had come up with this motif for Pettigrew from the start, he would have used it for the Shrieking Shack scene, which is one of the most prominent scenes featuring Pettigrew.... Unless, of course, it was initially just incidental music written for a Pettigrew scene and the producers or music editors decided to make it Pettigrew's theme. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Jay 37,363 Posted December 2, 2018 Author Popular Post Share Posted December 2, 2018 Of course JW composed the harpsichord motif, and of course he wrote it into many cues. He just didn't intend for it to be in the Shrieking Shack scene . The music editors put it there. Once, DJMcNiff, Molly Weasley and 2 others 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSMefford 1,509 Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 13 minutes ago, Josh500 said: Hmmm, one would think that, if JW had come up with this motif for Pettigrew from the start, he would have used it for the Shrieking Shack scene, which is one of the most prominent scenes featuring Pettigrew.... Unless, of course, it was initially just incidental music written for a Pettigrew scene and the producers or music editors decided to make it Pettigrew's theme. This happens sometimes. No big deal. And who knows, maybe it was intended to be tracked in and the editors could place it where they needed it. I could imagine this being a scene that changed edits a lot. But I highly doubt JW wrote the Pettigrew motif late in the game like you’re implying. 13 minutes ago, Jay said: If course JW composed the harpsichord motif, and of course he wrote it into many cues. He just didn't intend for it to be in the Shrieking Shack scene . They music editors put it there. Yes, this exactly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh500 1,615 Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 24 minutes ago, TSMefford said: But I highly doubt JW wrote the Pettigrew motif late in the game like you’re implying. I didn't imply that. I was merely asking whether that might be the reason why this motif was tracked where it seems logical it would show up in the first place.... 24 minutes ago, TSMefford said: And who knows, maybe it was intended to be tracked in and the editors could place it where they needed it. This strikes me as one possible explanation, yes. Maybe the liner notes will explain it in more detail... Hopefully! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skelly 261 Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 Everyone calls it the Pettigrew motif because that's what it was edited to be (it's even sloppily applied when he turns back into a rat near the end). I think Williams intended for it to be more representative of danger, or evil usage of magic. It's like a sinister version of the Nimbus 2000 theme. TSMefford 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redishere 697 Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 1 hour ago, Jay said: The harpsichord motif was tracked by the music editors into the Shrieking Shack scene, we've known that since the sheet music leak. Didn't know that: I didn't check the leaked sheet music! Anyway, I poorly explained myself; when I said: 3 hours ago, redishere said: I think it’s clear by now that we’ll have both unused and alternate cues in this set. That unreleased Pettigrew motif we heard for Honeydukes is an example. I was mainly referring to the cue we heard after the harpsichord motif (Map To Snow Scene). What I meant was, hearing that cue made me realize we'll have a lot of never-heard-before content in this set! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh500 1,615 Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 7 minutes ago, Skelly said: Everyone calls it the Pettigrew motif because that's what it was edited to be (it's even sloppily applied when he turns back into a rat near the end). I think Williams intended for it to be more representative of danger, or evil usage of magic. It's like a sinister version of the Nimbus 2000 theme. Interesting. Could be, yeah. But without that harpsichord motif in the Shrieking Shack, the score does seem a bit lacking, particularly toward the end of the scene. So either way it was probably the right decision to put that motif in there. bollemanneke 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post redishere 697 Posted December 2, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted December 2, 2018 8 minutes ago, Skelly said: Everyone calls it the Pettigrew motif because that's what it was edited to be (it's even sloppily applied when he turns back into a rat near the end). I think Williams intended for it to be more representative of danger, or evil usage of magic. It's like a sinister version of the Nimbus 2000 theme. I actually liked how in Art of the Score they explained the way Pettigrew's motif is a sort-of "reverse" version of Sirius' motif. That makes a lot of sense, since Sirius is seen as the villain at first (and before they mention Pettigrew, there's no trace of his motif). bollemanneke, Chewy, Once and 3 others 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Jay 37,363 Posted December 2, 2018 Author Popular Post Share Posted December 2, 2018 It's certainly up for personal interpretation, but after working on the set I personally came to think of it as more of a general danger / mystery motif as well. Williams really only wrote it into Discussing Black, Map To Snow Scene/Up The Stairs, and Reading The Map (that's Mr Weasely talking to Harry, Harry using the map to sneak into Hogsmeade, and Harry using the map to try to find Peter Pettigrew respectively). It getting tracked into the Shrieking Shack sequence (The Confrontation Scene), when Pettigrew turns back into a rat (The Werewolf Scene), and the end credits montage made it feel more like a personal motif. In addition to Williams not intending it to be used in The Confrontation Scene or The Werewolf Scene, it's notably not used in The Mention of Petigrew - the cue where Harry tells Lupin he saw Pettigrew on the Maurader's Map - either (intended or final film). bollemanneke, DJMcNiff, The Illustrious Jerry and 7 others 7 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incanus 5,714 Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 8 minutes ago, redishere said: I actually liked how in Art of the Score they explained the way Pettigrew's motif is a sort-of "reverse" version of Sirius' motif. That makes a lot of sense, since Sirius is seen as the villain at first (and before they mention Pettigrew, there's no trace of his motif). Yeah that was an interesting observation (one of many in that show). 2 minutes ago, Jay said: It's certainly up for personal interpretation, but after working on the set I personally came to think of it as more of a general danger / mystery motif as well. Williams really only wrote it into Discussing Black, Map To Snow Scene/Up The Stairs, and Reading The Map (that's Mr Weasely talking to Harry, Harry using the map to sneak into Hogsmeade, and Harry using the map to try to find Peter Pettigrew respectively). The music editors tracking it into the Shrieking Shack sequence and the end credits made it feel more like a personal motif . Another good example of how music editing can actually be used give these musical motifs enhanced meaning outside the original intentions of the composer by applying them systematically to represent something in the film. TSMefford and crumbs 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Jay 37,363 Posted December 2, 2018 Author Popular Post Share Posted December 2, 2018 16 minutes ago, redishere said: I actually liked how in Art of the Score they explained the way Pettigrew's motif is a sort-of "reverse" version of Sirius' motif. That makes a lot of sense, since Sirius is seen as the villain at first (and before they mention Pettigrew, there's no trace of his motif). That's really interesting. I should listen to this show. The Illustrious Jerry, TSMefford, crumbs and 2 others 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Skelly 261 Posted December 2, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted December 2, 2018 9 minutes ago, Jay said: nor when Pettigrew turns back into a rat during The Werewolf Scene. Oh, but it is! (Unless you meant as originally written.) Holko, bollemanneke and TSMefford 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh500 1,615 Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 @Skelly Maybe that was tracked as well? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skelly 261 Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 Yeah, it was. It's so barely audible though that I doubt most people hear it in the first place... kind of a weird choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh500 1,615 Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 Yeah, that cue is on OST album, but of course it's not there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,363 Posted December 2, 2018 Author Share Posted December 2, 2018 Thanks for that reminder Skelly, I'll edit my post to make things more precise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSMefford 1,509 Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 1 hour ago, Josh500 said: Interesting. Could be, yeah. But without that harpsichord motif in the Shrieking Shack, the score does seem a bit lacking, particularly toward the end of the scene. So either way it was probably the right decision to put that motif in there. Just checked the film. That segment is definitely "Reading the Map" tracked in. Doesn't sound hard to replicate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brundlefly 2,385 Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 1 hour ago, Jay said: Williams really only wrote it into Discussing Black, Map To Snow Scene/Up The Stairs, and Reading The Map (that's Mr Weasely talking to Harry, Harry using the map to sneak into Hogsmeade, and Harry using the map to try to find Peter Pettigrew respectively). Based on that fact, I'd rather call it the "Sneaking Motif". It's either connected to a sneaking danger or to Harry sneaking somewhere. TSMefford and The Illustrious Jerry 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh500 1,615 Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 24 minutes ago, Brundlefly said: Based on that fact, I'd rather call it the "Sneaking Motif". It's either connected to a sneaking danger or to Harry sneaking somewhere. The question is, though, do we want to call this theme by a name based on the original intentions of Williams, or based on the way it eventually ended up being used in the film (with or without the approval of Williams, although I tend to think it's the former). It was tracked in many scenes, sure, but it could have happened with the approval of Williams, or more, it might have been an idea and afterthought by Williams himself! We just don't know. I'm sure opinions differ. For the time being, I think I'm gonna continue calling it "Pettigrew's theme"! At least, until we know more. Pieter Boelen 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSMefford 1,509 Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 3 minutes ago, Josh500 said: The question is, though, do we want to call this theme by a name based on the original intentions of Williams, or based on the way it eventually ended up being used in the film (with or without the approval of Williams, although I tend to think it's the former). It was tracked in many scenes, sure, but it could have happened with the approval of Williams, or more, it might have been an idea and afterthought by Williams himself! We just don't know. I'm sure opinions differ. For the time being, I think I'm gonna continue calling it "Pettigrew's theme"! At least, until we know more. I'm sure the booklet might say something about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bollemanneke 3,348 Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 Do composers generally approve/know about tracking? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Pineapple Prod. 183 Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 4 hours ago, TSMefford said: Sounds like I’ve got some fun editing to do. That's exactly what I thought to myself when I read that comment. TSMefford 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post TSMefford 1,509 Posted December 2, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted December 2, 2018 8 minutes ago, bollemanneke said: Do composers generally approve/know about tracking? It would seem to be the case. They had that planned list for CoS. I can think of other examples as well. In Thomas Newman's score for Lemony Snicket's A Series of Unfortunate Events he actually wrote music to bridge some tracked pieces in a pick-up session. See "An Unpleasant Incident Involving A Train" in the film vs. the OST. The film version is an utter hack job from like 2-4 different cues, but in the middle there's a new little pick-up Newman wrote to smooth things over and accent some moments on picture. So, yes, composers can and do approve tracking. I'm sure it's not all the time though. I've had a piece of mine get swapped out in the last minute of the film's post-production. Horrid decision in my opinion, but it happens. I wish they had told me though. I could've made it work with some pick-ups much better than how they ended up doing it. Once, redishere, Taikomochi and 3 others 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post redishere 697 Posted December 2, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted December 2, 2018 4 minutes ago, bollemanneke said: Do composers generally approve/know about tracking? That's an interesting question! As a composer for independent movies, I honestly don't know how to feel about tracking. Sure, it may help a scene flow better, but it overall seems lazy to rely on cues that aren't written for a specific scene. But yeah, it happens. crumbs, TSMefford, Alan and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSMefford 1,509 Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 9 minutes ago, redishere said: That's an interesting question! As a composer for independent movies, I honestly don't know how to feel about tracking. Sure, it may help a scene flow better, but it overall seems lazy to rely on cues that aren't written for a specific scene. But yeah, it happens. Oh yeah. Everyone has different philosophies. I'm totally cool with tracking (as someone who does Editing as well as composing), but I prefer to be involved and help make sure it sounds good. That way if I need to write an overlay or a new opening or something, then I can and it'll help the flow (unlike the above example I gave in my previous post). If I'm involved I can also see if the Director needs a different intention or something for that moment and maybe revise something (if time allows). I always prefer to write something new, but time is time. If there's no time, then go ahead and track it. So sometimes it's lazy, but sometimes it can be useful if there's some last minute changes that will ultimately help the film. redishere and Alan 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Pineapple Prod. 183 Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 16 minutes ago, bollemanneke said: Do composers generally approve/know about tracking? I'd imagine so. The first half and very end of "A Tug on the Line" in Jaws is a combination of several chords separated by about 5 seconds of silence. It looks to me as though it was written so that the editors could place those chords wherever they fit in the scene. Correct me if I'm wrong, I am far from an expert on the subject and it very well may have been intended to play exactly as it does. Also, I compose music for trailers and in that business tracking is what you want because the more places your music can go the more you get paid and the more you can put on your resumé. Will and TSMefford 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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