Fabulin 3,510 Posted March 21, 2020 Share Posted March 21, 2020 . Martinland and pete 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joni Wiljami 1,206 Posted March 21, 2020 Share Posted March 21, 2020 4 minutes ago, Fabulin said: Measures taken against the coronavirus, if kept for some time, will be one of the greatest blows classical orchestras have ever experienced. Indeed. And it is terrible. My orchestra shut everything down until the end of May. We are still doing some chamber music streams and Youtube concerts. Until the possible curfew. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crumbs 14,306 Posted March 21, 2020 Share Posted March 21, 2020 Devastating indeed, for so many musicians who rely on these bookings for a living. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom 4,650 Posted March 21, 2020 Share Posted March 21, 2020 It would be devastating if it were only orchestras being shut down. However, it is everything public. Musicians are in the same boat as 50% of the population at the moment. That's why in the US and others they are talking about monthly gov't checks until it is over and then (hopefully), things generally return to the way they were. The sky might be falling all everyone, but I don't think it is selectively falling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smeltington 1,436 Posted March 21, 2020 Share Posted March 21, 2020 Well, given that many orchestras already have financial troubles, it could affect them disproportionately. I'm sure most will survive but I wouldn't be surprised if, now or sometime in the future, some smaller cities will eventually lose their orchestras. But I think there will always be enough support for them in major cities. Here in Atlanta, the ASO is betting on being able to hold concerts in June. They postponed RotJ until then, and have sold tickets for new concerts to take place in June as well. Personally I think it's a bit optimistic but they probably want to A) pick reschedule dates to stop people from requesting refunds and B) collect any new income they can. Jurassic Shark 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post karelm 2,911 Posted March 21, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted March 21, 2020 11 hours ago, Fabulin said: Measures taken against the coronavirus, if kept for some time, will be one of the greatest blows classical orchestras have ever experienced. Remember how Big Bands fell because of a combination of expenses, personnel shortages during wartime, and a market drastically changed by longer records, and now are nothing more than a novelty? I fear that the already falling standards of training breadth and rehearsal time (if representatives like Anne-Sophie Mutter are to be believed) will be dwarfed by an even greater problem, because the limiting permissions to perform in public, limited inclinations of people to visit live performances (especially of older listeners), and ultimately a greatly diminished average income of musicians, will be met by more or less indifference of the governments, which will conside classical music - an elite interest - too luxurious to receive even more support. It might never recover from it, partially because the broader public will not notice the hit. @karelm what do you think of this? Orchestra budgets get about 20% from ticket sales. You'd be surprised to know that a huge bulk of their budget comes from philanthropists who believe in the arts and donate huge sums each year. There are very few of these people but they support the arts. For example, the legendary Philadelphia Orchestra (Leopold Stowkoski's old group), might have gotten the bulk of their revenue from four or five very rich philanthropists. Most of these are old people and when one died, that pretty much resulted in the orchestra's bankruptcy. They've bounced back but the NEA (National Endowment for the Arts) is very lean so the average income for orchestras (by the way, everything I'm talking about is just for US orchestras, other countries might do it very differently like some orchestras are part of the government and fully supported in some countries, some are completely private and only get income from the public): Tickets 21% Advertisements: 20% Philanthropic and Contributions: 18% Foundations: 13% Trustees: 11% Recordings, special events and projects: 10% Government and NEA: 7% So if we remove the rest of the season, the ticket revenue will be hit but maybe that is 1/3 of 21% or 7% fiscal impact but remember that a big part of this reduction also reduces their expenses. It's possible in a longer term recession, all these numbers are affected but based on the below article, the Arts are relatively resilient and bounce back because people see it as a benefit to the community. The benefit to the community is wide spread and demonstrable. For example the upper echelon orchestras aren't just about performing music but they have substantial educational footprints too which keeps high risk kids out of trouble. The LA Philharmonic has YOLA (Youth Orchestra Los Angeles) which is an El-Systema program for mostly underprivileged youths and they have branches in many schools. Many prominent orchestras have similar educational arms making their communal footprint much larger than just concerts. https://www.arts.gov/news/2020/during-economic-highs-and-lows-arts-are-key-segment-us-economy?fbclid=IwAR0zIIcZcdo9eOXGF7ojWbuI_6tUZQvx8SOO2G-J32TBA-St-31WwQ7d2ic KK, Fabulin, mrbellamy and 2 others 3 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fabulin 3,510 Posted March 21, 2020 Share Posted March 21, 2020 Thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,051 Posted March 21, 2020 Share Posted March 21, 2020 57 minutes ago, karelm said: You'd be surprised to know that a huge bulk of their budget comes from philanthropists who believe in the arts and donate huge sums each year. There are very few of these people but they support the arts. For example, the legendary Philadelphia Orchestra (Leopold Stowkoski's old group), might have gotten the bulk of their revenue from four or five very rich philanthropists. Most of these are old people and when one died, that pretty much resulted in the orchestra's bankruptcy. This is indeed done mostly in the USA, and as you indicate yourself it's not a system that gives the best stability. To me it seems to attract narcissistic, snobbish rich people who want their name associated with the high arts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karelm 2,911 Posted March 21, 2020 Share Posted March 21, 2020 14 minutes ago, Jurassic Shark said: This is indeed done mostly in the USA, and as you indicate yourself it's not a system that gives the best stability. To me it seems to attract narcissistic rich people who want their name associated with the high arts. You mean like how composers used to be employed by nobility? Or how Richard Wagner was funded by Ludwig II King of Bavaria? Or how Tchaikovsky was supported financially by Nadezhda von Meck? Or how Bach was employed by Duke Johann Ernst III? Or how Mozart's patron was Baron Gottfried van Swieten? Or how Stravinsky was patroned by Princess Maria Tenisheva? Sometimes artists transcend these narcissistic rich people and sometimes they actually do love the arts too but I get your point that arts and commerce makes bad bed fellows. Jurassic Shark and Martinland 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,051 Posted March 21, 2020 Share Posted March 21, 2020 8 minutes ago, karelm said: You mean like how composers used to be employed by nobility? Or how Richard Wagner was funded by Ludwig II King of Bavaria? Or how Tchaikovsky was supported financially by Nadezhda von Meck? Or how Bach was employed by Duke Johann Ernst III? Or how Mozart's patron was Baron Gottfried van Swieten? Or how Stravinsky was patroned by Princess Maria Tenisheva? Exactly. It's an archaic system that means the orchestra has to use valuable time on fundraising instead of their core tasks. It doesn't belong in an enlightened democracy. Btw, when it comes to Wagner and his patron, it was the former that was the narcissist. karelm 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toothless 963 Posted March 21, 2020 Share Posted March 21, 2020 I'm even more happy to have renewed my subscription to the Philharmonie de Paris. Jurassic Shark 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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