"Celebrating John Williams" concert (Gustavo Dudamel/LA Phil, Disney Concert Hall, January 24-27, 2019) - 2CD set available on March 15

[Jurassic Shark 12,070]

3 minutes ago, Steve said:

Yes, 3 seconds at 0:36 are not together. 

 

See, it was not that hard.

[Bellosh 3,418]

Just now, Jurassic Shark said:

 

Why can't you listen to the obvious example I provided from early in the track?

 

you go inside the cage?

 

the cage goes in the water...

 

you go in the water...

 

the shark's in the water.  our shark.

 

siiigh...

 

Farewell and adieu to you, fair Spanish ladies   

 

[Jurassic Shark 12,070]

3 minutes ago, Steve said:

Yes, 3 seconds at 0:36 are not together. And thereafter?

 

Then comes the flute, which, as Remco so eloquently said, fucks up.

[Steve 591]

Just now, Jurassic Shark said:

 

Then comes the flute, which Remco so eloquently said, fucks up.

 

Two "errors", that both last about 3 seconds. The track runs 5:03 minutes. Plenty of music to enjoy no?

[Jurassic Shark 12,070]

To paraphrase Disco Stu, the performance is

 

 

13 hours ago, Disco Stu said:

leaden and sluggish

[Steve 591]

2 minutes ago, Jurassic Shark said:

To paraphrase Disco Stu, the performance is

 

 

It's a matter of taste, no?

[Jurassic Shark 12,070]

Sure. Some like leaden and sluggish performances, while others don't.

[Steve 591]

1 minute ago, Jurassic Shark said:

Sure. Some like leaden and sluggish performances, while others don't.

 

It's the conductor who chooses the tempo. I guess at 87 WIlliams prefers laid-back tempi.

[Jurassic Shark 12,070]

20 hours ago, tmarps said:

Just my thoughts are that the Vienna Philharmonic are so unfamiliar with the pieces that slow and together (yes, together) was a better option than fast and the pieces completely fall apart and then with no way to get the orchestra back together. The Vienna Philharmonic’s lack of familiarity with the pieces was the main factor that constituted to the slower tempo choices, not Williams being “old”. In my opinion.

[Steve 591]

7 minutes ago, Jurassic Shark said:

20 hours ago, tmarps said:

Just my thoughts are that the Vienna Philharmonic are so unfamiliar with the pieces that slow and together (yes, together) was a better option than fast and the pieces completely fall apart and then with no way to get the orchestra back together. The Vienna Philharmonic’s lack of familiarity with the pieces was the main factor that constituted to the slower tempo choices, not Williams being “old”. In my opinion.

 

I don't think that's the case. If you listen to his 2018 Chicago Symphony Concert you will notice that the pieces are also conducted very slow. Imperial March and Jaws Suite are almost in identical tempo like in Vienna.

[bollemanneke 3,344]

Just listening to this again. Now THIS is how you do a live recording. So good.

[Gurkensalat 340]

After reading this discussion I listened to the Jaws Excerpt on the Dudamel and the Vienna CD to compare. Dudamel is faster which is nice at the beginning but sounds hurried when the strings come in. Also, the flute solo sounds very weak and mechanical. Yes, it is rhythmically faultless, but does not contribute much. In contrast the Vienna flutist tries to interpret his line musically, by not playing all notes exactly alike, but forming small phrases which makes it much more interesting to listen to. Unfortunately this leads to minor timing problems, but I am willing to pay that small price for the better interpretation. On the whole the sound on Dudamel is more sterile, studio-like while in Vienna you have more of the live feeling being in the room with the orchestra. You also hear more details in Vienna like the piano playing along with the basses at the beginning of the shark fugue. And the ending is much more impressive in the Vienna recording.

On the whole I like having the Dudamel recording as an interesting alternative and for the few exclusive tracks, but listening to the Vienna recording is still more satisfying musically for me, even on the CD which does not has optimal sound. 

 

[Jurassic Shark 12,070]

1 hour ago, Gurkensalat said:

In contrast the Vienna flutist tries to interpret his line musically, by not playing all notes exactly alike, but forming small phrases which makes it much more investing to listen to.

 

That's an interesting interpretation of a player struggling to keep up with the pace.

[Fabulin 3,511]

How about that?

[Gurkensalat 340]

48 minutes ago, Jurassic Shark said:

 

That's an interesting interpretation of a player struggling to keep up with the pace.

 

If you had read one sentence further you would have seen that I see this as the REASON for some struggling. 

[bollemanneke 3,344]

2 hours ago, Gurkensalat said:

After reading this discussion I listened to the Jaws Excerpt on the Dudamel and the Vienna CD to compare. Dudamel is faster which is nice at the beginning but sounds hurried when the strings come in. Also, the flute solo sounds very weak and mechanical. Yes, it is rhythmically faultless, but does not contribute much. In contrast the Vienna flutist tries to interpret his line musically, by not playing all notes exactly alike, but forming small phrases which makes it much more interesting to listen to. Unfortunately this leads to minor timing problems, but I am willing to pay that small price for the better interpretation. On the whole the sound on Dudamel is more sterile, studio-like while in Vienna you have more of the live feeling being in the room with the orchestra. You also hear more details in Vienna like the piano playing along with the basses at the beginning of the shark fugue. And the ending is much more impressive in the Vienna recording.

On the whole I like having the Dudamel recording as an interesting alternative and for the few exclusive tracks, but listening to the Vienna recording is still more satisfying musically for me, even on the CD which does not has optimal sound. 

 

This is indeed a very interesting interpretation, but I'll agree to disagree with most of it.

[Jurassic Shark 12,070]

37 minutes ago, Gurkensalat said:

 

If you had read one sentence further you would have seen that I see this as the REASON for some struggling. 

 

This explanation is what I was commenting on, and I don't buy it.

[Gurkensalat 340]

It is quite usual for some of the better conductors of classical music to give such freedom in the spirit of interpretation. This is for example the reason I like Carlo Maria Giulini‘s recordings better then e.g. some by Solti or Karajan. Guilini takes the time to allow such small freedoms that enrich the interpretation, and sacrifices absolute mechanical tempo accuracy for it. You may prefer a less flexible approach in interpretation, perhaps because you are used to it by modern American orchestra standards and especially film score recordings, but you can‘t deny that there is that kind of mostly European tradition in conducting. I think anybody with good knowledge of the conductors of the past and there approaches will recognize it here. 

[Jurassic Shark 12,070]

I'm used to European orchestras and conductors, and I'd still say that's a flutist struggling keeping up with the pace, regardless of the reason.

[Gurkensalat 340]

20 minutes ago, Jurassic Shark said:

I'm used to European orchestras and conductors, and I'd still say that's a flutist struggling keeping up with the pace, regardless of the reason.

I do not disagree, but see it in another context. But this is offtopic now, I will not continue this particular conversation here.

[Jay 37,353]

I opened up my physical CD edition and listened to it last week.  I had forgotten that they mixed out the audience applause between each piece, which honestly was a bit of a turn-off; It's a live concert, re-create the experience of being there on the album, please!  But on the other hand, it means we now have a completely clean recording of the selections, which has its own benefits.

 

I think there music on this album falls into 3 categories for me.  First are pieces I've heard a million times, so don't get much out of hearing again here (Close Encounters, Star Wars, Harry Potter, Jurassic Park, Raiders March, Superman March, ET)

 

Second is music that while I've heard it a million times, is performed so well here, I really enjoyed having this rendition (Olympic Fanfare and Theme, Out To Sea and Shark Cage Fugue, Theme from Schindler's List, Flight To Neverland)

 

And finally is the music that hasn't been played to death, all of which sounds great here (Marion's Theme, Scherzo for Motorcycle and Orchestra revised, Sayuri's Theme, Adagio from The Force Awakens)

 

Those last pieces alone make the album purchase worth it.  Of course, for any new fan of Williams, the entire album is a real treasure, as its full of so many of his greatest hits.  Overall, a very successful concert I'd say

 

 

About the physical edition's booklet, there are 6 photos inside the booklet: Williams and Dudamel hugging at the concert (this picture is great!), Williams and Dudamel posing with a piano, Dudamel conducting at the concert, headshots of Simone Porter (soloist on Theme from Schindler's List) and Robert deMaine (soloist on Sayuri's Theme), and a nice picture of the Disney Concert Hall.

The rest is all text, including listing every musician who played, the track list, the publishing credits, etc, plus two sets of liner notes.  First is the two page "Celebrating John Williams" by Jon Burlingame, and next is a two-pager about Dudamel and the LA Phil that does not say who wrote it. Burlingame's notes are the usual excellent work, explaining Williams' history with the LA Phil and his history as a performer for the public in general with a nice quote from Williams.  The other notes are just informational.

 

Overall, this a really nice album with a nice booklet, glad I bought it!

[bollemanneke 3,344]

Revisited part of disc 1 today. I must say it's really strange but also refreshing to hear this after having been so familiar with the Vienna and Berlin programs. Still really like the performances most of the time and I LOVE that organ in the Olympic Fanfare.

[Jurassic Shark 12,070]

Too bad the acoustics is somewhat obscuring the details. 

[bollemanneke 3,344]

I actually love that. I prefer full undetailed sound. Most of the time.

[Jurassic Shark 12,070]

Because of your hearing issues?

[bollemanneke 3,344]

No, I've always preferred that kind of sound.