Disco Stu 15,495 Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 The Rise of Skywalker score might not be eligible for the Best Original Score Oscar as the Academy is going to keep the November 15th submission deadline they used last year. http://filmmusicreporter.com/2019/04/24/academy-confirms-return-of-short-lists-in-music-categories/ So, like, December releases will only be eligible if they're willing to give the Academy an FYC by 11/15? That's stupid. The Illustrious Jerry, Bayesian and _deleted_ 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,359 Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 Interesting! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holko 9,526 Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 Shouldn't it be able to be considered for an award the next year then in a logical world? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Stu 15,495 Posted April 24, 2019 Author Share Posted April 24, 2019 4 minutes ago, Holko said: Shouldn't it be able to be considered for an award the next year then in a logical world? Nope, and only the music branch sets this deadline. So the film would qualify for all the other awards just fine. It's real dumb. It's all still hypothetical, they might find a workaround. I just can't see Lucasfilm risking anything getting out by giving the music branch TROS music a month early. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erik Woods 555 Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 I'm sure they'll make an exception for Williams... but how is this fair to films that are released AFTER Nov 15. Why's the Academy punishing films that come out in the last month and a half? Makes ZERO sense. -Erik- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balahkay 627 Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 Will the film even be in the can by November 15? JJ could still be tweaking it and Williams could still be recording music. I don't see Disney showing the film to whoever needs to see it over a month in advance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crumbs 14,314 Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 What was the submission deadline for TLJ in 2017? That score released December 15th and there's no evidence of Disney distributing an FYC before then. As for TROS, it could easily still be recording by mid-November... TBH I expect the music branch already has its nomination reserved. We know the caliber of writing it will feature and the momentousness of the occasion. It's comfortably the most anticipated film score of the year, certainly the highest profile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Illustrious Jerry 3,356 Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 Chances of JJ kindly gifting us with an isolated score on the Blu-Ray release? Will Disney screw up the promotional album a la Solo? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Stu 15,495 Posted April 24, 2019 Author Share Posted April 24, 2019 2 minutes ago, The Illustrious Jerry said: Chances of JJ kindly gifting us with an isolated score on the Blu-Ray release? I wish the iso score was on the Last Jedi blu ray! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fabulin 3,511 Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Illustrious Jerry 3,356 Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 11 hours ago, Disco Stu said: I wish the iso score was on the Last Jedi blu ray! Yeah, but in any attainable form would be appreciated too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Penna 3,687 Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 I agree that the rule is stupid, but when it comes to assuming they'll make an exception 'because it's Williams' (and before anyone's heard a note).... that's also stupid. There's a certain milestone in it being JW's last SW score and there would be a chance the academy would give it to him in the same way they gave RotK a clean sweep as an overall reward. My choice so far this year? HTTYD 3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 5 minutes ago, Richard Penna said: There's a certain milestone in it being JW's last SW score But didnt MM state that Williams hasnt ruled out doing another SW score after Ep 9? In @TownerFan's recent interview with him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crumbs 14,314 Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 Might seem a long bow to draw but maybe the music department have no interest in giving him a nomination because they're campaigning for him to receive a special lifetime award in recognition of his completion of the 9 SW saga scores, hence not worrying about the score's likely ineligibility? We can dream! Seems odd otherwise because the music wing has to know this is one of the most important/anticipated scores of the year, and as close to a shoe-in nomination (by April) as there is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,074 Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 I doubt JW will ever get another regular Oscar. Too many of those eligible to vote are too young to appreciate his style. They rather want Hanz and his clones. TheUlyssesian and Fabulin 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crumbs 14,314 Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 Fortunately the music department has taste and determines the nominations, so maybe they've come to the same conclusion? JW's been nominated at least 20 times since his last win to no avail. From memory, 2008 (KOTCS) is the only time since Schindler's List where JW hasn't been nominated in a year he composed a film score. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,949 Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 50 minutes ago, crumbs said: they're campaigning for him to receive a special lifetime award in recognition of his completion of the 9 SW saga scores I would hope so! No-one else in the core creative/production team on this series stuck with it as Williams had. It went through multiple writers, directors and producers, through editors and cinematographers - even a distribution company. But only one composer. I could think of other candidates worthy of such an award, but Williams is most certainly deserving of it. Ricard and crumbs 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,074 Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 2 minutes ago, Chen G. said: I could think of other candidates worthy of such an award, but Williams is most certainly deserving of it. I hope you're not referring to Howie Shore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,949 Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 I am. Its a similar body of work, in terms of volume. But that much more intricate and internally unified. But like I said, Williams - in his own right - deserves such an award and than some. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,074 Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 20 minutes ago, Chen G. said: But that much more intricate LOL! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post TheUlyssesian 2,478 Posted April 25, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted April 25, 2019 18 hours ago, Disco Stu said: The Rise of Skywalker score might not be eligible for the Best Original Score Oscar as the Academy is going to keep the November 15th submission deadline they used last year. http://filmmusicreporter.com/2019/04/24/academy-confirms-return-of-short-lists-in-music-categories/ So, like, December releases will only be eligible if they're willing to give the Academy an FYC by 11/15? That's stupid. 13 hours ago, crumbs said: What was the submission deadline for TLJ in 2017? That score released December 15th and there's no evidence of Disney distributing an FYC before then. As for TROS, it could easily still be recording by mid-November... TBH I expect the music branch already has its nomination reserved. We know the caliber of writing it will feature and the momentousness of the occasion. It's comfortably the most anticipated film score of the year, certainly the highest profile. It will be nominated. Here are the relevant sections of the rules - Quote Submission forms must be signed by all submitting writers and must be accompanied by a complete final music cue sheet listing all music cues. Original Score submissions must further be accompanied by a completed “Music Breakdown Form” (provided by the Academy) which categorizes the film’s total minutes of the following: - Original score (music composed as underscore for this specific film) - Original songs (songs composed for this specific film) - Source music (music used to emulate an on-screen or off-screen source, i.e., a radio or an on-screen performance) - Licensed and/or pre-existing music used as underscore (i.e., classical music or songs used as score) - The above categories must also be represented by their individual percentage of the film’s total music. The composer’s on-screen credit and submission form, as well as the actual cue sheet for the music as used in the film and supplied by the film company, shall be used by the Music Branch Executive Committee to help determine the eligibility of the score. Submissions may be made prior to the film’s Los Angeles County qualifying run, but must be made no later than 60 days after such opening, or by 5 p.m. PT on November 15, 2019, whichever comes first. New submissions will not be accepted beyond this date, however for existing submissions an extension to December 1 may be granted at the Academy’s discretion only for the purposes of delivery of supplemental materials such as final cue sheets. The submission consists of only the paperwork and the list of cues. That will be ready by Nov 15. Even if it's not ready, you can submit the paperwork and submit the list of cues by Dec 1. An FYC album is NOT a requirement, it is only optional and studios put these out to further a score's chances. The music branch academy members are primarily encouraged to judge the music as heard in the film. So yeah, it will be nominated. But it almost certainly will not win. Jurassic Shark, Fabulin, Chen G. and 3 others 5 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crumbs 14,314 Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 Good research there! Yes, we can assume the nomination is banked at this point. That would make the SW ST only the second trilogy of scores JW has been nominated for each entry, after the original trilogy. Chen G. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Not Mr. Big 4,639 Posted April 25, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted April 25, 2019 2 hours ago, Jurassic Shark said: I doubt JW will ever get another regular Oscar. Too many of those eligible to vote are too young to appreciate his style. They rather want Hanz and his clones. I don't know, there's been a major resurgence in "John Williams appreciation" in recent years. I remember in 2012 when the Lincoln trailer came out and there was a (moronic) IMDB post begging Williams to retire. And there was the previous year with the fairly mixed critical response to War Horse. Since the new Star Wars films, people have been far more appreciative of Williams's continued output. Chen G., The Illustrious Jerry, crumbs and 2 others 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cerebral Cortex 3,357 Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 4 hours ago, crumbs said: Good research there! Yes, we can assume the nomination is banked at this point. That would make the SW ST only the second trilogy of scores JW has been nominated for each entry, after the original trilogy. That damned Crystal Skull had to go and break his Indy trilogy streak. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balahkay 627 Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 3 hours ago, TheUlyssesian said: So yeah, it will be nominated. But it almost certainly will not win. Why do you say that? Fabulin 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,074 Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 Based on previous experience? JWs win-to-nomination ratio for the Osacar is quite low. Fabulin 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheUlyssesian 2,478 Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 58 minutes ago, Balahkay said: Why do you say that? Only 2 sequel scores have ever won the Best Score Oscar - LOTR 3 and Godfather 2. What's the common attribute between them? Both also won Best Picture. So unless Star Wars 9 is a best picture favorite or something, its score is not going to win the best score Oscar. Chen G. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KK 3,307 Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 Indeed. It will get nominated, but it never had a chance of winning. Lincoln was probably the closest chance he had in the last 10 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,074 Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 RotK won an Oscar?!? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheUlyssesian 2,478 Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 4 minutes ago, KK said: Indeed. It will get nominated, but it never had a chance of winning. Lincoln was probably the closest chance he had in the last 10 years. I think more than Lincoln he had a real shot with TFA. I think but for that preposterous Morricone stunt that they pulled off, Williams would have won. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A. A. Ron 1,742 Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 16 minutes ago, Jurassic Shark said: RotK won an Oscar?!? The film won eleven of them. Jurassic Shark 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fabulin 3,511 Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 5 hours ago, Jurassic Shark said: I doubt JW will ever get another regular Oscar. Too many of those eligible to vote are too young to appreciate his style. They rather want Hanz and his clones. Most have seen too many winters. Or too few! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrbellamy 6,286 Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 2 hours ago, TheUlyssesian said: I think more than Lincoln he had a real shot with TFA. I think but for that preposterous Morricone stunt that they pulled off, Williams would have won. It’s relative, though, Danna and Morricone both felt like shoo-ins. Memoirs was really the last time I think we could safely say he was mere votes away. I think there’s a world where he wins for this but it would have to be pretty unanimous that it’s the best of the three, for starters. Everybody already takes it for granted that the music will be really good and make them cry, which would get him the nomination. That’s already a high bar and it’s the bare minimum that people expect from him. The fact that everyone will know it’s his last Star Wars (many will think it’s his last score, period) is a double-edged sword because on one hand people will be predisposed to loving it, anyway, but it also sets up certain expectations...the music has actually not been one of the major talking points of these new movies and I think he would have to steal a lion’s share of attention from Billy Dee, The Emperor and God knows what else people will be ranting and raving about with this thing. There’s gotta be a major groundswell of “It’s time to give John Williams another damn Oscar” talk and instant multi-million DisneyVevo hits to indicate that people are really feeling it on this one. Cerebral Cortex and Will 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJan 8 Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 5 hours ago, TheUlyssesian said: It will be nominated. Here are the relevant sections of the rules - The submission consists of only the paperwork and the list of cues. That will be ready by Nov 15. Even if it's not ready, you can submit the paperwork and submit the list of cues by Dec 1. An FYC album is NOT a requirement, it is only optional and studios put these out to further a score's chances. The music branch academy members are primarily encouraged to judge the music as heard in the film. So yeah, it will be nominated. But it almost certainly will not win. Think you're missing the main point of the article. In order for it to be nominated, Disney has to show the movie to Academy music branch members BEFORE they vote for the short list, they're certainly not going to send out screeners (for obvious piracy concerns) and it seems a bit of stretch to think that they will hold screenings just for that group early enough (prior to the movie's world premiere) to qualify, TFA did not screen to anybody until the Monday before release and TLJ not until Saturday before release, and if you look at the date when the short list was announced last year, it seems highly questionable that voting members have seen the movie by that time. But who knows, maybe they will find a way around all that, but the concerns are definitely more than justified. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheUlyssesian 2,478 Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 1 hour ago, DJan said: Think you're missing the main point of the article. In order for it to be nominated, Disney has to show the movie to Academy music branch members BEFORE they vote for the short list, they're certainly not going to send out screeners (for obvious piracy concerns) and it seems a bit of stretch to think that they will hold screenings just for that group early enough (prior to the movie's world premiere) to qualify, TFA did not screen to anybody until the Monday before release and TLJ not until Saturday before release, and if you look at the date when the short list was announced last year, it seems highly questionable that voting members have seen the movie by that time. But who knows, maybe they will find a way around all that, but the concerns are definitely more than justified. There is NO requirement to send the movie to the academy. The rules I posted are verbatim from the academy's website. It is honestly not even required to see a movie to vote for it. The Academy works on an honor system. Plenty of people vote for things they haven't seen. You don't even NEED to send screeners to Academy members. It is all very discretionary. All you are describing is part of the Oscar campaign. An Oscar campaign is different from an Oscar submission. You can very well submit a movie to the Academy and NOT do a campaign. About 300 movies yearly submit to the academy and only about 80 or so mount campaigns because it is expensive. So again - campaigns and submissions are different. Williams could submit the paperwork and be done with it. Nov 15 is the paperwork submission deadline. The voting begins much later! And trust me, before voting begins, Disney will make sure that the academy members have seen the film. Ricard 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJan 8 Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 8 minutes ago, TheUlyssesian said: There is NO requirement to send the movie to the academy. The rules I posted are verbatim from the academy's website. It is honestly not even required to see a movie to vote for it. The Academy works on an honor system. Plenty of people vote for things they haven't seen. You don't even NEED to send screeners to Academy members. It is all very discretionary. All you are describing is part of the Oscar campaign. An Oscar campaign is different from an Oscar submission. You can very well submit a movie to the Academy and NOT do a campaign. About 300 movies yearly submit to the academy and only about 80 or so mount campaigns because it is expensive. So again - campaigns and submissions are different. Williams could submit the paperwork and be done with it. Nov 15 is the paperwork submission deadline. The voting begins much later! And trust me, before voting begins, Disney will make sure that the academy members have seen the film. It IS a requirement for Academy members to have a chance to see the movie prior to voting, it even says so in the rules and wouldn't make any sense otherwise. No one has said anything about the need for a campaign, I would actually argue that Disney's priority will be to protect the film as long as possible (and not screen it early) over a chance for a nomination in a crafts category. I guess we will have to see what happens, but it seems clear that the score either won't qualify or that Disney will have to make very special and unusual arrangements to make this happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheUlyssesian 2,478 Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 1 hour ago, DJan said: 1 hour ago, DJan said: It IS a requirement for Academy members to have a chance to see the movie prior to voting, it even says so in the rules and wouldn't make any sense otherwise. No one has said anything about the need for a campaign, I would actually argue that Disney's priority will be to protect the film as long as possible (and not screen it early) over a chance for a nomination in a crafts category. I guess we will have to see what happens, but it seems clear that the score either won't qualify or that Disney will have to make very special and unusual arrangements to make this happen. You are conflating the two deadlines. The submission deadline for the paperwork is Nov 15. The voting for the nominations begins Jan 2 and ends Jan 7. I can absolutely assure that you do NOT have to see a movie to vote for it. That is unenforceable. The nomination voting form has 5 blanks where you have to enter the names of the movies you are voting for. There is absolutely no verification that you have seen a movie or not. How on earth will the academy verify for 8000 members spread around the globe as to whether they have seen a film or not? That's absurd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJan 8 Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 1 minute ago, TheUlyssesian said: You are conflating the two deadlines. The submission deadline for the paperwork is Nov 15. The voting for the nominations begins Jan 2 and ends Jan 7. I can absolutely assure that you do NOT have to see a movie to vote for it. That is unenforceable. The nomination voting form has 5 blanks where you have to enter the names of the movies you are voting for. There is absolutely no verification that you have seen a movie or not. How on earth will the academy verify for 8000 members spread around the globe as to whether they have seen a film or not? That's absurd. Seems like you're missing the point. Voting for the short list is happening in early December and it needs to be happen then because of the actual nomination phase in January you're talking about. In order for the score to get shortlisted, Disney need to give voting Academy music branch members very early access to the film, which is all that article and myself are questioning. Of course, the Academy can't control if a member is voting on something they haven't seen, but if they can't possibly hear a score in context of the movie, there is no way for it to get shortlisted in December and ultimately nominated in January. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex 2,835 Posted April 26, 2019 Share Posted April 26, 2019 After all this, HZ will probably win again for The Lion King 1977 and Mr. Who 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TownerFan 4,983 Posted April 26, 2019 Share Posted April 26, 2019 9 hours ago, DJan said: Seems like you're missing the point. Voting for the short list is happening in early December and it needs to be happen then because of the actual nomination phase in January you're talking about. In order for the score to get shortlisted, Disney need to give voting Academy music branch members very early access to the film, which is all that article and myself are questioning. Of course, the Academy can't control if a member is voting on something they haven't seen, but if they can't possibly hear a score in context of the movie, there is no way for it to get shortlisted in December and ultimately nominated in January. There's no way Disney will screen the film a month earlier just to grant an eventual Best Score nomination. Aside from the likely fact JJ will tinker with the film until the last minute (and like what happened for VII, he could ask JW to rescore scenes very late in the game), the Mouse and Bad Robot won't risk any kind of leak, especially considering what's at stake here. Of course they could be already working to have the film premiered before their usual timing (TFA and TLJ premiered around 10-8 days before theatrical release), but let's be honest: box office is much more important than awards for a film like this. Ricard 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Jurassic Shark 12,074 Posted April 26, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted April 26, 2019 1 hour ago, Alex said: After all this, HZ will probably win again for The Lion King It probably won't be eligible because it'll be a copy of his other score... wait, if they were enforcing that rule, he would never be nominated! crumbs, The Illustrious Jerry, Remco and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex 2,835 Posted April 26, 2019 Share Posted April 26, 2019 2 hours ago, Jurassic Shark said: It probably won't be eligible because it'll be a copy of his other score... wait, if they were enforcing that rule, he would never be nominated! Uh oh, you've only gone and said it. You're on your own now, pal! Jurassic Shark 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,074 Posted April 26, 2019 Share Posted April 26, 2019 20 minutes ago, Alex said: Uh oh, you've only gone and said it. You're on your own now, pal! Cue TGP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joni Wiljami 1,206 Posted April 26, 2019 Share Posted April 26, 2019 Who? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DominicCobb 194 Posted May 1, 2019 Share Posted May 1, 2019 I don’t think a win is impossible, depending on the competition and quality of the score. If Disney decides to make a big deal of it, the fact that this is his last SW score and he hasn’t won in 26 years could be compelling narratives for voters. Will and Larry O 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balahkay 627 Posted May 1, 2019 Share Posted May 1, 2019 And his age as well. I mean, it worked for Morricone. Granted, he also had the “bridesmaid but never a bride” thing going for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Larry O 115 Posted May 1, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted May 1, 2019 If this is his last Star Wars film - and possibly his last film, period, who knows - he's definitely getting a nomination. The Academy is nowhere near as strict an organization as you might think. The fact Vice got a nomination for Best Picture is perfect evidence of this - it spoke directly to the idea that people don't watch the stuff they nominate so long as you can sell them on the APPEARANCE of prestige. It's not even a secret that most people put it on their ballot without having actually seen it first. As already said upthread - there's nothing that says people have to see what they're voting on, either at the nomination OR the final voting stage. And even if there was - people lie. It's Hollywood. 75% of its members are paid to literally do just that. John Williams will get nominated for his last Star Wars score, and even if he turns in something Attack of the Clones-tier, it's still possible he'll get the win as a career recognition. It's maybe not PROBABLE, and it's really hard to say one way or the other since nobody's actually heard any of it yet. But I think it's basically fait accompli that he's getting one last nomination for Rise of Skywalker. Will, The Illustrious Jerry, Jurassic Shark and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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