Terrence Malick's A HIDDEN LIFE (2019) - Score by James Newton Howard

[Edmilson 7,393]

I've been listening to the score a lot today, and liking it more and more than when I listened on the first time.

 

This track is full of hidden pleasures for JNH fans, like the Lady in the Water-like piano from 2:23 to 3:26. I love when he uses the piano like this on his scores (A Fateful Meeting from King Kong, Snow White from Snow White and the Huntsman):

 

 

And the final 3 minutes, which have a heartbreakingly beautiful cello solo, followed by some string writing full of JNH awesomeness:

 

 

[Koray Savas 2,251]

Seeing Terrence Malick Films Through His Use Of Music. His Composers Share What They Know

 

Quotes from Morricone, Zimmer, Horner, and Howard. 

[Jurassic Shark 12,030]

How did they manage to interview Horner?

[Disco Stu 15,495]

[Jurassic Shark 12,030]

I was thinking the same thing.

[Edmilson 7,393]

Thanks for calling me, guys, I couldn't stand Shostakovich complaining on my head about me stealing from him or whatever. I'll make a formal complain to Saint Peter if he doesn't stop bothering me!

[Thor 7,471]

1 hour ago, Jurassic Shark said:

How did they manage to interview Horner?

 

It's taken from the (kinda legendary) interview with Daniel Schweiger years ago.

[Richard Penna 3,672]

That Schweiger interview is up there with Herrmann's Unvarnished Chat in great composer interviews. (well, both suffer from sycophantic interviewers, especially Herrmann's, but the responses are legendary)

 

You really get a sense of how excited and passionate he was to make a great movie, but Malick's bizarre editing ruined it.

 

If there's one thing Malick's composers create from the experience, it's great concept albums. The Thin Red Line is among my favourite score albums, The New World is almost like a Horner modern classical album, and A Hidden Life is also a wonderful listening experience. I couldn't care less how any of them work in their films.

[Edmilson 7,393]

1 hour ago, Richard Penna said:

If there's one thing Malick's composers create from the experience, it's great concept albums. The Thin Red Line is among my favourite score albums, The New World is almost like a Horner modern classical album, and A Hidden Life is also a wonderful listening experience. I couldn't care less how any of them work in their films.

 

I agree that the albums are great, but even with that the music also works wonderfully on the movies as well. I watched Days of Heaven, TTRL and The New World (the 170 minute director's cut) and in all of them the original music was very proeminent, and was great on the context of the movies. And as far as I've read about A Hidden Life, that's also true about JNH's score.

 

Haven't watched the Hannah Townsend scored movies, but apparently the only one who got almost completly shunned was Desplat on The Tree of Life.

[Koray Savas 2,251]

3 hours ago, Richard Penna said:

If there's one thing Malick's composers create from the experience, it's great concept albums. The Thin Red Line is among my favourite score albums, The New World is almost like a Horner modern classical album, and A Hidden Life is also a wonderful listening experience. I couldn't care less how any of them work in their films.

Malick is one of the only directors that truly tells his stories through images and sounds. I think the reason why his composers create such masterworks is because of the canvas the films provide. I agree that all those albums are fantastic in their own right. 

[Thor 7,471]

8 hours ago, Edmilson said:

 

I agree that the albums are great, but even with that the music also works wonderfully on the movies as well. I watched Days of Heaven, TTRL and The New World (the 170 minute director's cut) and in all of them the original music was very proeminent, and was great on the context of the movies. And as far as I've read about A Hidden Life, that's also true about JNH's score.

 

Yes, it is. It's the most prominent use of original score since THE NEW WORLD. It's no secret anymore that this is my favourite score of 2019, and I'lll go into more detail in my podcast on the best scores of 2019, to be published (in English) soon.

 

Meanwhile, if you want to read a bit about Malick and his use of music, I wrote this article around the time of TREE OF LIFE. It's in Norwegian, but you can Google Translate if interested: https://montages.no/2011/09/tree-of-life-og-malicks-musikalske-montasjer/

[KK 3,307]

I always scratch my head a bit at the The New World vitriol. Horner's score is extraordinarily present in the film, even if every album cue doesn't make it, it's clearly a distinct part of the film's sonic stamp, unlike Desplat and Townshend, whose work was much more filtered out of the final products.

[publicist 4,643]

Malick kept the stuff which was't overly sweet or melodramatic, which must have enraged Horner. 

[Jurassic Shark 12,030]

Hehe.

[Richard Penna 3,672]

21 minutes ago, KK said:

I always scratch my head a bit at the The New World vitriol. Horner's score is extraordinarily present in the film, even if every album cue doesn't make it, it's clearly a distinct part of the film's sonic stamp

 

I haven't,seen it, but I would largely expect that if I watched it and liked a bit of music, it either wouldn't be on the album, or would be in some alternate version or mix.

 

I love the song with Hayley Westenra's song too - it beautifully incorporates Horner's theme with wonderful lyrics. There's an instrumental cover here which highlights Horner's intricate piano work.

[Edmilson 7,393]

5 hours ago, Thor said:

 

Yes, it is. It's the most prominent use of original score since THE NEW WORLD. It's no secret anymore that this is my favourite score of 2019, and I'lll go into more detail in my podcast on the best scores of 2019, to be published (in English) soon.

 

Meanwhile, if you want to read a bit about Malick and his use of music, I wrote this article around the time of TREE OF LIFE. It's in Norwegian, but you can Google Translate if interested: https://montages.no/2011/09/tree-of-life-og-malicks-musikalske-montasjer/

 

Thanks!

 

1 hour ago, publicist said:

Malick kept the stuff which was't overly sweet or melodramatic, which must have enraged Horner. 

 

That's what I've thought as well. Most Horner tracks used on the movie are more subdued, like Journey Upriver, An Apparition in the Fields or Rolfe Proposes. The more melodramatic tracks, like Forbidden Corn, were only used on its most intimate parts.

 

That's what made Horner pissed, he was probably wanting to score another Braveheart, for which he could write a For the Love of a Princess-like love theme, but Malick's romances aren't overtly melodramatic, including on the musical part, just look at Days of Heaven.

[Thor 7,471]

4 hours ago, Edmilson said:

That's what made Horner pissed, he was probably wanting to score another Braveheart, for which he could write a For the Love of a Princess-like love theme, but Malick's romances aren't overtly melodramatic, including on the musical part, just look at Days of Heaven.

 

Almost, but not exactly.

 

This relates to what Horner said in the Schweiger interview. That interview was interesting on at least two levels -- one, to hear an uncensored Horner dig into the Hollywood elite with unashamed honesty, which was VERY refreshing at the time (this was in the days before Ricky Gervais and the Golden Globes). Two, a 'break of illusions', as it clearly exposed Horner's limitations as a composer. At some point, he says that THE NEW WORLD could have been a "great love story like TITANIC". This is very telling of Horner and his association with Hollywood and more traditional forms of storytelling. He simply couldn't wrap his head around Malick's more alternative form of storytelling, where the director -- as the ultimate auteur -- picks and inserts musical cues as he sees fit. Malick is an extremely "organic" director, which seeps down to his use of music, the seamless flow/blend of voice-over, classical music and original music as waves crashing on a beach. In the end, Malick's musical vision in THE NEW WORLD was brilliant; and the Horner soundtrack a wonderful concept album too (despite the silly 'bird chirping' in the beginning), but there is no doubt that there was a clash of mindsets when the two collaborated on the film.

 

In A HIDDEN LIFE, this doesn't seem to be the case. I'm sure JNH has heard all the stories about Malick, and went into the project with that in mind. It would be VERY interesting to hear his thoughts on this collaboration at some point. But here, he comes out of it "alive" (no pun intended). His compositions seem to be placed and played out exactly as the composer intended.

 

On a personal note, I had actually intended to ask Horner about the Malick collaboration (and the danger motif!) when I got the chance to interview him in 2013, but I was cut short by the organizers. A shame, in retrospect.

[Richard Penna 3,672]

The bird chirping is nice and atmospheric - I think it works on The New World.

 

It certainly seems that JNH went into the project knowing exactly what would happen, and happy for some of his music to be needle-dropped as Malick saw fit. I guess Horner and those before him went into their projects expecting a normal process.

[publicist 4,643]

Horner must have been either extremely naive or egotistical when he took that assignment. Malick was no unknown commodity back then, especially to an industry-wizened pro like JH.

[Richard Penna 3,672]

Horner had no ego shortage...

[Thor 7,471]

That may be true (my own experience was that he was very humble and shy), but 'ego' doesn't really have anything to do with the shenanigans on THE NEW WORLD. It's all about a collision of mindsets.

[Edmilson 7,393]

Indeed. Tbh, Horner does sound a little "innocent" when he says The New World could have been a great love story like Titanic - not in terms of scope, of course (no studio would ever give Malick the insane amount of money Cameron received for Titanic), but in terms of movie styles.

 

Titanic is, in a gross simplification, a blockbuster movie. An excellent one (in my opinion, better than almost all of Hollywood blockbusters these days), but still, a blockbuster, a movie that had to make an insane box office and attract the biggest crowd possible to the theaters. The New World is a Terrence Malick movie, a far more experimental and infinitely less direct than Cameron on his approach.

 

Hadn't Horner watched the previous Malick movies before signing in on doing TNW? Or he just knew that an Academy Award winning director was looking for a composer for an epic romance movie based on the story of Pocahontas and John Smith, and signed on, expecting to do a movie like Titanic, Braveheart, Legends of the Fall, etc?

 

Zimmer, JNH and even Desplat were much more mindful of the situation they went in when they did their Malick movies. They knew that just because they wrote cue 1M1, it wouldn't be exactly the first cue on the final cut of the movie. 

 

Morricone's only request to Malick is that one cue of his were kept intact (the Fire scene, if I'm not mistaken). Zimmer wrote TTRL before filming, so he ended up writing over 5 hours of material that Malick could use as he pleased on the movie. JNH recorded 40 minutes of score according to Burligame, some of which were scene specific cues and some was material that Malick could use when he saw fit. It wasn't easy, but they (specially Zimmer, Howard and Desplat, who were more accostumated to Hollywood) knew it was going to be different than the usual.

 

Horner, on the other hand, seemed to have been a little more innocent when approaching Malick, thinking that his score would be kept intact, just as he wrote it. And he seemed to be really mad when the music on the final cut of the movie isn't exactly what he thought in first place (i.e. Aliens).

[Richard Penna 3,672]

44 minutes ago, Thor said:

That may be true (my own experience was that he was very humble and shy), but 'ego' doesn't really have anything to do with the shenanigans on THE NEW WORLD. It's all about a collision of mindsets.

 

I think an ego comes out to some extent in the Schweiger interview, but I agree that that's not what caused issues on TNW - he seems to have just not appreciated what Malick was going to do with the music. Although he does also comment that Malick's strange editing made the writing process itself difficult, so it may be a that a combination of 'innocence' to Malick's process and an (at one point) unscorable film made this the worst experience for a composer of all his films.

[Edmilson 7,393]

Maybe if Horner did like Zimmer and recorded a lot of music for Malick uses as he pleases on the movie, it wouldn't have been such a demoralising, soul crushing experience for him. But I don't think he would score a movie like this.

[Thor 7,471]

Actually, Zimmer had a troublesome experience too. A friend of mine over on Maintitles asked Zimmer about this collaboration; more specifically if he wanted to work with him again, to which Zimmer responded "Not if we are to remain friends". So clearly Zimmer had a difficult time too. Fortunately, the end result was brilliant here too -- THE THIN RED LINE is a masterpiece -- but it speaks to the consistent difficulty of Hollywood composers to adher to Malick's 'alternative' vision.

 

I would have loved for Malick to work with a composer like Goldenthal. He can provide the 'beauty' he so desires, but at the same time be open to more artsy approachces to filmmaking.

[publicist 4,643]

Imho it's plain and simple: Horner was willing to work for Malick, but only on his own terms, that is big plush Hollywood narrative mush. For whatever reason he was unwilling to provide the more general 'state-of-mind' quasi concert pieces Malick clearly wanted. Which is strange, because he did that effortlessly for 'Iris' a few years prior (one of his best post-80's scores, really).

[Edmilson 7,393]

I would love a Thomas Newman Malick score. It would be the perfect opportunity for him to write his atmospheric piano and synth music (Any Other Name, Brooks Was Here, Danger of Hell, April, Nemo Egg, etc.,)  and at the same time to return for his lush, romantic music of the 90s/early 2000s: Whisper of a Thrill from Meet Joe Black, The Great Work Begins from Angels in America, The Vast Continent from The Horse Whisperer, etc.

 

It's the score of my dreams now that JNH already did his Malick movie, lol.

 

Also, why not a John Williams Malick score? That would be interesting as well, including for Williams himself. I don't think he is used to score this kind of experimental cinema Malick does, at least not over the last decades, so it would be a great opportunity for him.

[Thor 7,471]

2 hours ago, Edmilson said:

Also, why not a John Williams Malick score? That would be interesting as well, including for Williams himself. I don't think he is used to score this kind of experimental cinema Malick does, at least not over the last decades, so it would be a great opportunity for him.

 

Except that stylistically, it wouldn't be very experimental. There is no new IMAGES to be had from a Williams/Malick collaboration, for example. It would be far more tonal. It would only be different in its application.

[Will 2,215]

Finally was able to see this film this weekend. And... wow. It might be my favorite I've seen this year (although admittedly I haven't seen all too many). Absolutely gorgeous cinematography (as usual with Malick), plus beautiful and thought-provoking dialogue and voice-overs. Just a beautiful, beautiful piece of art. It's definitely a little hard to sit through, at nearly three hours, but it's worth it. I wasn't quite crying at the end, but I had tears welling in my eyes (I also did near the end of Song to Song). This film is subtly moving -- Malick mostly stays away from the cheap emotional tricks you often get in war love stories. This film is also filled with allegories and symbols, both to the Bible and to the modern day, which is part of what made it so rich to watch, for me. Indeed, I watched a about 2/3 of the film for a second time just last night to experience it again. There are some symbolic features of the film that can be interpreted in several different ways -- that ambiguity makes this film very rich, at least to someone closely acquainted with the Bible and the present American political and religious scene. 

 

The musical choices are excellent, and this film introduced me to a couple moving classical pieces I'd never heard before. Additionally, JNH's score complements the film very well, and, mercifully, is not completely replaced by tracked classical selections -- rather, they work in tandem. 

 

I am utterly perplexed at how this film did not garner even one Oscar nomination in any category. 

[Edmilson 7,393]

2 hours ago, Will said:

Additionally, JNH's score complements the film very well, and, mercifully, is not completely replaced by tracked classical selections -- rather, they work in tandem. 

 

Despite Horner whining, I don't think a score for a Malick movie was ever almost completely unused in favor of classical selections, the only exception being Desplat on Tree of Life. But on Days of Heaven, The Tree Red Line, New World and, for what you people are saying, on A Hidden Life, the scores were able to support the movie without being tossed aside. There's lots of original music in his movies, maybe not in the way their composers intended to, but still.

 

I haven't watched the movies he did with Hannah Townshend, so I don't know how intact her scores are on the movies.

[Koray Savas 2,251]

4 hours ago, Edmilson said:

I haven't watched the movies he did with Hannah Townshend, so I don't know how intact her scores are on the movies.

You keep incorrectly typing his name, it’s: Hanan Townshend. 

[Edmilson 7,393]

3 minutes ago, Koray Savas said:

You keep incorrectly typing his name, it’s: Hanan Townshend. 

 

Gee, thanks. I always read his name as Hannah, so I thought he was a woman.