LSH 1,091 Posted November 26, 2024 Share Posted November 26, 2024 At 25:20, Harry mentions using an Ethipoian voice sample from a “Spotify record”. In the John Powell thread, it was gleaned that Powell’s Endurance was credited. It must definitely be the same thing. Did Powell perhaps use the same sample? Curious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trope 973 Posted November 28, 2024 Share Posted November 28, 2024 Expanded edition of Gladiator II coming soon?! pete 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knight of Ren 1,130 Posted November 28, 2024 Share Posted November 28, 2024 Oh, that's unexpected! If it's true I think it would really benefit the score, as I feel there were some nice moments that should have been included instead of some of the more generic underscore cues that do nothing for me in the middle of the album. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor 8,817 Posted November 28, 2024 Share Posted November 28, 2024 I whittled it down to about 30 minutes, so an expansion beyond the already-long 70+ minutes sounds ludicrous. But yes, if any of those extra minutes contain better stuff than what was in the discarded 45 minutes, I might be open to shuffling things around a bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LSH 1,091 Posted November 28, 2024 Share Posted November 28, 2024 I honestly didn't notice anything missing, particularly during my second viewing when I was actively listening out for the score. All sounded a bit repetitive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edmilson 9,595 Posted November 28, 2024 Share Posted November 28, 2024 1 hour ago, LSH said: I honestly didn't notice anything missing, particularly during my second viewing when I was actively listening out for the score. All sounded a bit repetitive. When you listen to as many Harry Gregson-Williams bootlegs as I did you realize this is par for the course for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard P 4,414 Posted November 28, 2024 Share Posted November 28, 2024 From HGW that's about as uncharacteristic as some people here declaring love for a Zimmer score. He's indicated multiple times that he feels existing albums for a lot of his stuff is enough - he didn't think the first Narnia score needed expanding. It does of course indicate that he's very happy with what he produced, which is curious. To be fair, a lot of the atmosperic stuff is interesting - it's the lack of prominent themes and exceptionally generic action that works against it for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Who 998 Posted November 28, 2024 Share Posted November 28, 2024 I saw an interview about Gladiator 2 where HGW describes his philosophy that too big and emotional music is distracting to the viewer and that director sometimes have to tell him to go bigger etc. I think that this is a view he might have always had but which has influenced his scores a lot in the last couple of years. He used to write very emotional music and I am a big fan of his earlier work but in the last couple of years it hasn't engaged me outside of The Last Duel. I still have not listened to Gladiator II yet as I want to hear the score for the first time in the context of the film but based on the reactions it seems the score is on the mellow side which I really hope is not the case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard P 4,414 Posted November 28, 2024 Share Posted November 28, 2024 The Last Duel was very atmospheric too, but didn't have a lot (any?) of action that I remember. Maybe it is just that he doesn't like making his music too big and obvious nowadays, and it's rendered as a bit more noticeable for this score. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A24 4,666 Posted November 29, 2024 Share Posted November 29, 2024 https://faroutmagazine.co.uk/ridley-scott-accused-of-being-lazy-by-gladiator-ii-cinematographer/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 4,791 Posted November 29, 2024 Share Posted November 29, 2024 This is because he sets up multiple cameras. I have a hard time calling Ridley "lazy" in this regard when his eye for shot composition is so peerless and immaculate. Whatever could be said for the man's taste in scripts, his eye and his sense for the pulse of the edit are just about without parallel in the annals of cinema. I always thought some of Commodus' reactions during the first arena match in Gladiator were caught by another camera that Ridley didn't tell Joaquim was rolling. They're too spontaneous - and much too pricless - to have been a take: Goodness, what a great motion picture! Stark 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Princeling1987 26 Posted November 29, 2024 Share Posted November 29, 2024 HGW never topped his Sinbad score released 21 years ago. Nowadays, he seems to be so uninspired... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick1Ø66 6,082 Posted November 30, 2024 Share Posted November 30, 2024 15 hours ago, Chen G. said: I have a hard time calling Ridley "lazy" A difficulty apparently not shared by his long time cinematographer. That Commodus reaction is priceless. Spontaneous or not (I tend to think it is), it’s one of the best little moments in the movie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard P 4,414 Posted December 3, 2024 Share Posted December 3, 2024 Clem's verdicted is in, and it's 4 stars. His analysis is pretty interesting to read, even if he reminds us of Zimmer's "plagiarism" approximately 400 times during the review and bangs on about the wrong themes being reprised (!!!). The guy hates all things Zimmer and RCP so no surprise that he gave Zimmer 1 star less, but it's nonetheless amusing to read someone try to explain why HGW did a better job Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick1Ø66 6,082 Posted December 3, 2024 Share Posted December 3, 2024 When music from the original is repurposed in a thematically inappropriate way in a sequel or prequel, it's usually the fault of the director, not the composer. Clem knows this (or should). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meredith McKay 7,150 Posted December 3, 2024 Share Posted December 3, 2024 11 minutes ago, Nick1Ø66 said: When music from the original is repurposed in a thematically inappropriate way in a sequel or prequel, it's usually the fault of the director, not the composer. Clem knows this (or should). Obviously the Composer failed to completely jeopardize his job by telling the Director to shove it, and accept his cues with all the correct thematic usage. Clearly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Dimitrescu 9,170 Posted December 3, 2024 Share Posted December 3, 2024 Someone needs to call out Ridley Scott on his incompetence. Might as well be the composer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Mark 3,768 Posted December 4, 2024 Share Posted December 4, 2024 Saw this movie today. Extremely average film . I was entertained but didn't come out like I saw something great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edmilson 9,595 Posted December 4, 2024 Share Posted December 4, 2024 1 hour ago, Nick1Ø66 said: Clem knows this (or should He should but he is an ass. Can't stand that guy. Or his site, which I find headache inducing to read. badbu 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Who 998 Posted December 4, 2024 Share Posted December 4, 2024 Yeah Clem seems oddly unfamiliar with the realities of the film scoring process, despite having been writing about it for decades. His reviewing is so laughably biased that I stopped reading his site years ago but it’s funny that he’s apparently still posting these odd takes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard P 4,414 Posted December 4, 2024 Share Posted December 4, 2024 I occasionally peruse his reviews to see his discussions over what themes are used where (so I don't have to) but other than that, he's far too biased for his overall views on a score to be taken seriously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meredith McKay 7,150 Posted December 5, 2024 Share Posted December 5, 2024 FSM online interview: https://filmscoremonthly.com/fsmonline/story.cfm?maID=9400&issueID=243&page=1 A sampling of the interview: https://www.filmtracks.com/scoreboard/forum.cgi?read=137706#137706 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JB11sos 2 Posted December 14, 2024 Share Posted December 14, 2024 On 28/11/2024 at 12:07 PM, Richard P said: The Last Duel was very atmospheric too, but didn't have a lot (any?) of action that I remember. Maybe it is just that he doesn't like making his music too big and obvious nowadays, and it's rendered as a bit more noticeable for this score. Yes, HGW said in interviews that they made the decision (the only time they've made it, as far as I know) to not score any of the action scenes. I thought it was super effective in focusing emotional energy on the relationship triangle. On 05/12/2024 at 3:14 PM, Doo_liss said: FSM online interview: https://filmscoremonthly.com/fsmonline/story.cfm?maID=9400&issueID=243&page=1 A sampling of the interview: https://www.filmtracks.com/scoreboard/forum.cgi?read=137706#137706 I'm the interviewer! Suffice it to say that I enjoyed this score a great deal (more than most here, apparently). I disagree with CC's point about the "wrong theme" being used. The story is almost beat for beat following the same trajectory: the predominant theme is the protagonist being reunited with his family and what they represent, so it makes sense that they used the musical theme from the first movie about the protagonist longing to be reunited with his family and what they represent. That said, while I understand people's frustrations with CC's perceived biases, I still believe him to be one of the most insightful and thorough reviewers, especially when it comes to breaking down what's happening thematically cue by cue. LSH 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imperivm 206 Posted December 27, 2024 Share Posted December 27, 2024 On 28/11/2024 at 8:40 AM, Trope said: Expanded edition of Gladiator II coming soon?! Maybe Harry wasn't referring to this, but the other day Paramount posted a FYC with film versions and unreleased tracks on their website. Links and breakdown are here in the FYC thread! Trope 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post WampaRat 1,401 Posted December 30, 2024 Popular Post Share Posted December 30, 2024 Shared this in the custom covers thread. Here’s an alternate cover I made. This score has grown on me. It didn’t have the immediate power anthem punchiness that made Zimmer’s work a classic. But after seeing the film and listening to interviews with Gregson-Williams, theres a good amount to enjoy. I can now dig it on its own terms. I made a custom edit including bits from the FYC that runs a brisk 55 minutes. Kingdom of Heaven will always be number one in his trilogy of Scott-produced historical epics, followed by The Last Duel (for me). I’d rank this as a solid 3 place. (Im not including his work on Exodus Gods/Kings because…I don’t care lol) Bofur01, Edmilson and Trope 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edmilson 9,595 Posted December 30, 2024 Share Posted December 30, 2024 Yeah, I also gained a new appreciation for the score once I saw the movie. Doing a HGW marathon a few weeks ago also helped lol. Anyway, does anyone have a playlist combining the OST + FYC? Which tracks with completely unreleased music does the FYC has? Bofur01 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WampaRat 1,401 Posted December 30, 2024 Share Posted December 30, 2024 From my skimming of the FYC there were about 6 or so cues that were completely unique to that promo. Roman Money The Coup Plot Acacius Speech Naval Battle I was not Afraid Lucias and The Doctor Those were the ones that stood out to me at least. Other FYC tracks have different mixes than the OST. Some instruments or vocals that pop up. So its pretty different overall. Depending on how familiar you are with the OST. I added the section from the film version of "War.Real War"/"Echoes In Eternity" where the choir intones that sliding downward theme for Macronis(?) at 6:20-End. Edmilson 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LSH 1,091 Posted December 31, 2024 Share Posted December 31, 2024 4 hours ago, Edmilson said: Doing a HGW marathon Are you done with that now? I was enjoying your snippet reviews. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLUMENKOHL 1,086 Posted December 31, 2024 Share Posted December 31, 2024 CGI sucks so bad these days. The water battle in the coliseum was a disaster. Good movie. Not as good as the first, not as crisp. But its heart was in the right place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edmilson 9,595 Posted December 31, 2024 Share Posted December 31, 2024 13 hours ago, LSH said: Are you done with that now? I was enjoying your snippet reviews. I had to make a pause because by the time I was getting to the mid-2010s I was kinda tired of HGW. Getting through his millionth crime thriller score was such a pain. So I made a pause for the holidays, where I could catch on with the John Powell scores of this years, the label releases (Spiderman 2, Jurassic Park 3, Out of Africa, the Bonds) and some interesting stuff also released recently, like The Wild Robot and yes, Gladiator 2. In fact, it was his Glad 2 that motivated me to procceed. I intend to do that early next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naïve Old Fart 10,854 Posted December 31, 2024 Share Posted December 31, 2024 2 hours ago, BLUMENKOHL said: CGI sucks so bad these days. I've often wondered why modern CGI, with all of its advancements, looks like dog poo, but why the dinosaurs in JURASSIC PARK, which is 32 years (!) old next June, are considered to be not only among the finest examples of CGI done right, but are also regarded as among the very best visual effects ever committed to film. Bayesian 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mephariel 508 Posted December 31, 2024 Share Posted December 31, 2024 The movie was a mess. The score didn't make an impact in any of the scenes. Scott seriously think this is one of the best films he has done? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edmilson 9,595 Posted December 31, 2024 Share Posted December 31, 2024 10 minutes ago, Naïve Old Fart said: JURASSIC PARK, which is 31 years (!) old next June Actually, JP will be completing 32 years old next year. It's almost the same age as me! I was a one month old baby when it came out. On a related note, it'll be also the 10th anniversary of Jurassic World About the CGI, I think we have the impression that today's CGI looks inferior than of old movies because current blockbusters rely too much on CGI. Recent movies have way more VFX shots, characters and scenes and this combined with a punishing deadline set by the studios indicate that they don't have the necessary time to polish everything. In comparison, older movies knew CGI was imperfect so they had to work around those imperfections. And the result was much better, see Davy Jones in Pirates 2, the dinos in JP and almost anything in the LOTR movies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Dimitrescu 9,170 Posted December 31, 2024 Share Posted December 31, 2024 The CGI bits in JP look computery. But the animatronic shots still look great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor 8,817 Posted December 31, 2024 Share Posted December 31, 2024 20 hours ago, WampaRat said: Shared this in the custom covers thread. Here’s an alternate cover I made. This score has grown on me. It didn’t have the immediate power anthem punchiness that made Zimmer’s work a classic. But after seeing the film and listening to interviews with Gregson-Williams, theres a good amount to enjoy. I can now dig it on its own terms. I made a custom edit including bits from the FYC that runs a brisk 55 minutes. Kingdom of Heaven will always be number one in his trilogy of Scott-produced historical epics, followed by The Last Duel (for me). I’d rank this as a solid 3 place. (Im not including his work on Exodus Gods/Kings because…I don’t care lol) I'm impressed you got 55 minutes out of it. My playlist is about half an hour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 13,875 Posted December 31, 2024 Share Posted December 31, 2024 GladiaTwor GladiaThor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naïve Old Fart 10,854 Posted December 31, 2024 Share Posted December 31, 2024 Oops! Thanks, @Edmilson! You're right. 32 years. Ammended. Edmilson 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 13,875 Posted December 31, 2024 Share Posted December 31, 2024 1 hour ago, Edmilson said: I was a one month old baby when it came out. What were your initial reactions to it? 1 hour ago, Edmilson said: About the CGI, I think we have the impression that today's CGI looks inferior than of old movies because current blockbusters rely too much on CGI. Recent movies have way more VFX shots, characters and scenes and this combined with a punishing deadline set by the studios indicate that they don't have the necessary time to polish everything. In comparison, older movies knew CGI was imperfect so they had to work around those imperfections. And the result was much better, see Davy Jones in Pirates 2, the dinos in JP and almost anything in the LOTR movies. Well said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WampaRat 1,401 Posted December 31, 2024 Share Posted December 31, 2024 1 hour ago, Thor said: I'm impressed you got 55 minutes out of it. My playlist is about half an hour. Yeah. I can see how a lot of it could seem dull (drones, choppy ostinato that have been old hat since 2002) And yet…I dunno. The recording is so beautiful. And again listening to HGWs interviews help me appreciate it a bit more. Guess I was just in the mood for it. HGW is capable of writing more exquisite long-lined themes (see Narnia or KoH or The Martian even)I suspect he knew Ridley would chop up his work so why bother? I dunno. If it’s more textural/rhythmic than it won’t be so jarring in the edit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 4,791 Posted December 31, 2024 Share Posted December 31, 2024 3 hours ago, Naïve Old Fart said: I've often wondered why modern CGI, with all of its advancements, looks like dog poo, but why the dinosaurs in JURASSIC PARK, which is 32 years (!) old next June, are considered to be not only among the finest examples of CGI done right, but are also regarded as among the very best visual effects ever committed to film. First off, there's some selective memory going on: there are definitely CGI shots in Jurassic Park that look soft and less-than-convincing: I'm thinking especially the gallimimi. The stuff that looks good is mostly the animatronic stuff. Also, in the early days of CGI we were more forgiving of something that looked fairly naturalistic but nevertheless painterly. Now we're in a world of CGI that aims for photorealism outright and that's good, but within that photorealistic idiom we're more likely to find flaws. Stark and Naïve Old Fart 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naïve Old Fart 10,854 Posted December 31, 2024 Share Posted December 31, 2024 You're right, of course, @Chen G.. There is a kind of rose-coloured spectacled looking over one's shoulder, at JURASSIC PARK. It still has a very important place in the history of visual effects, however, being the first film where CGIs were front and center, instead of just an (important) embellishment, in, say THE ABYSS, or T2. I don't think that anyone would argue that the visual effects in the Jurassic World films are inferior to the original, but JURASSIC PARK was the first time that dinosaurs were not represented by either stop-motion animation, or full-sized puppets, instead, being created (almost) entirely inside a computer. I guess that, as time went on, audiences became more sophisticated and wanted, as you point out, photorealism to the extent that they could not tell where the hardware ended, and the software began. To quote The Doctor: "Mankind has moved on, and so have the diseases." Where it will end, I've no idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edmilson 9,595 Posted December 31, 2024 Share Posted December 31, 2024 5 hours ago, Jurassic Shark said: What were your initial reactions to it? Probably shit my diapers, cried and sleeping lol. But seriously, I kinda wish I was an older child at that point. Jurassic Park and Disney's Aladdin both came out during mid-1993 around these parts. Imagine going to the theaters during your vacation to watch one of the most iconic movies in history AND one of Disney's greatest animated movies? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor 8,817 Posted January 1 Share Posted January 1 55 minutes ago, Edmilson said: Probably shit my diapers, cried and sleeping lol. But seriously, I kinda wish I was an older child at that point. Jurassic Park and Disney's Aladdin both came out during mid-1993 around these parts. Imagine going to the theaters during your vacation to watch one of the most iconic movies in history AND one of Disney's greatest animated movies? I did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Guernsey 2,873 Posted January 1 Share Posted January 1 8 hours ago, Edmilson said: Probably shit my diapers, cried and sleeping lol. But seriously, I kinda wish I was an older child at that point. Jurassic Park and Disney's Aladdin both came out during mid-1993 around these parts. Imagine going to the theaters during your vacation to watch one of the most iconic movies in history AND one of Disney's greatest animated movies? As I’ve mentioned before, Jurassic Park was my first ever soundtrack which I bought after having loved the music watching the film. Which I also loved. I definitely got Aladdin and saw it at the cinema but have no special recollection of either, much though I love Alan Menken and the magic of 90s Disney movies. For JP, I still think the fx hold up amazingly well today. I mean, you can fairly easily spot which shots are animatronic and which are CGI but only after a few viewings. Nothing really sticks out when you’re swept up in a first viewing (I would hope). There’s still a couple of CGI shots that I don’t think would look better today, in particular the first couple of full length shot of the T-Rex as it walks between the stranded cars after escaping from its enclosure. Relationship simple, but it looks astonishing and beautiful, also scary as hell because it’s so real. The fact that it still broadly acts like an animal rather than a movie monster only adds to the realism. It isn’t out to get the human characters as such, it’s just peckish and looking for snacks… Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 40,598 Posted January 1 Share Posted January 1 @BLUMENKOHL's back? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLUMENKOHL 1,086 Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 Both of these shots show CGI and show glaring CGI problems. So, why do most people say the one on the left looks good, but the one on the right looks really fake? I'll give an answer later. GerateWohl 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,516 Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 The brachiosaurus in that particular shot has looked bad for many years, it dates the CGI technology used in the film more than any other single shot in the movie. There are a couple of other ropey CG shots in the runtime, but that one is the worst. But I think the dinosaur still looks pretty good in the big rearing up tree chomp shot up just after, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Edmilson 9,595 Posted January 2 Popular Post Share Posted January 2 34 minutes ago, BLUMENKOHL said: So, why do most people say the one on the left looks good, but the one on the right looks really fake? Because no one here is a child in 2024 and thus Gladiator II isn't a formative movie for any of us, unlike Jurassic Park? Chen G., Bayesian and enderdrag64 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naïve Old Fart 10,854 Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 23 hours ago, Jay said: @BLUMENKOHL's back? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post BLUMENKOHL 1,086 Posted January 2 Popular Post Share Posted January 2 The problem is twofold: 1. Digital color grading fucks with what your brain is expecting on a sunny day (full dynamic range, vibrant colors). This is the yellow/green/bronze piss filter most directors are applying to everything now. 2. Lack of tactical degradation of CGI outputs to obscure problems in the CGI. In the olden days you had a lot of limitations (texture size, number of polygons, etc.) so you had to be clever in how to obscure these limitations. Noise, blurs, etc. These had the added side effect of blending well with film. Now there's fewer obvious limitations and also scheduling deadlines mean no one has time to blend things together properly. To hyperbolically illustrate, imagine the coliseum scene in Gladiator 2 taken to an extreme of what your eyes would see. This is more in line with the 1960s when everything was maybe even too vibrant because people wanted to show off technicolor. Even though it looks more "cartoony" it's still more inline with what your brain expects on a bright sunny day, so it looks more like you can reach out and touch it. IMO in the bottom, I can feel the sun beating down on the deck of the ship on the left. In the top one my brain is confused. Is it raining? Is it sunny? It feels plastic. Imperivm, Naïve Old Fart, enderdrag64 and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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