Fabulin 3,511 Posted June 21, 2019 Share Posted June 21, 2019 . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oomoog the Ecstatic 314 Posted June 21, 2019 Share Posted June 21, 2019 People should at least splice their favorite scores into their favorite films, and have a humorous old time. The laziness is inexcusable! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,074 Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 5 hours ago, Koray Savas said: To even suggest that composers are releasing albums to make money... How much are his royalty checks, ya think? Capitalize means taking advantage of, duh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koray Savas 2,251 Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 22 minutes ago, Jurassic Shark said: Capitalize means taking advantage of, duh. So you think composers decide whether soundtrack albums are released or not? Not studios? That’s why Balfe released Ghost In The Shell right? To capitalize on album sales? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,074 Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 Again, I never said anything about sales. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 He's American. Its all about the sales over there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted June 22, 2019 Author Share Posted June 22, 2019 Dollar signs. Money! Gruesome Son of a Bitch 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koray Savas 2,251 Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 1 hour ago, Jurassic Shark said: Again, I never said anything about sales. So how else does a composer capitalize on releasing an album? It's not even their decision. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,074 Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 A possible album release is surely covered in the contract that the composer signed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koray Savas 2,251 Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 11 minutes ago, Jurassic Shark said: A possible album release is surely covered in the contract that the composer signed. So the reason that certain scores don't have album releases is because the composer didn't put it in their contract? How is something that is a possibility also a certainty? And you still haven't clarified what you mean by capitalizing on an album release non-monetarily. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,074 Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 I'm just saying I doubt they released the album against Balfe's wishes. If you were a composer and did something you're proud of, wouldn't you want your music to be released? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Parker 3,040 Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 41 minutes ago, Jurassic Shark said: I'm just saying I doubt they released the album against Balfe's wishes. If you were a composer and did something you're proud of, wouldn't you want your music to be released? I can't remember how much you talked about this during the Fallout, but are you saying that you see composers releasing long albums of their scores as an indication they're proud of their work, but upon criticism of the music as heard in said album, that the composer says in defense "Well, the music fit the film, so it did what it needed to do"? And you see this as disingenuous? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,074 Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 12 minutes ago, Nick Parker said: are you saying that you see composers releasing long albums of their scores as an indication they're proud of their work No, that he's happy with Fallout I have from various interviews he's done. 12 minutes ago, Nick Parker said: upon criticism of the music as heard in said album, that the composer says in defense "Well, the music fit the film, so it did what it needed to do"? And you see this as disingenuous? Indeed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oomoog the Ecstatic 314 Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 I've listened to tens-of-thousands of great film tracks made in low budget or VSTi that never earned real money and never were known about. The big names earning $ has nothing to do with their quality over anything in particular, but the redeeming quality of these composers' scores is a byproduct of them being professionally paid, allowing them more time, resources and feedback on how to sell the mainstream sound. It's the major names of the industry that are tightly integrated into another profession other than just musical craft. They're all about responding to expectation. It's similar to today's pop music not being better or worse than anything in particular, the only difference is it makes the commission and is specifically designed to. The more you discover amateur composers, the better off you'll be understanding the real science of the artistic process, even if it's a laboriously sophisticated hobby. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A24 4,333 Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 33 minutes ago, Borodin said: I've listened to tens-of-thousands of great film tracks That's a figure of speech, right? Fabulin 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oomoog the Ecstatic 314 Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 That figure of speech I meant to imply that many of them are great if not good. Many of them were never scored to films or games either, and it's an arduous task listening through low-quality films or music as part of the process. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arpy 4,145 Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 To go back to @The Original question, most critics and people judging a score do so through an album release. God knows how many Filmtracks reviews have been knocked down a few stars because of CC's disapproval, or ignorance of judging the album presentation over the score in context. I'm not sure how albums are released and to what extent a composer has over their presentation and content etc. but we know it's not as much (mostly) as they'd like. I take this as a sign that album presentations are the least reliable sources to judge a score on. You can throw around listenability as an issue but surely a composer is trying to make the score 'listenable' in its context first! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kasey Kockroach 2,344 Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 Does it really matter anymore? I almost never see modern films take advantage of their scores, instead just piling dialogue and loud sound effects on top of it to where you can barely make out any music. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,074 Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 Film as we knew it is dead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fabulin 3,511 Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 . The Illustrious Jerry and Kasey Kockroach 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,074 Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 2 minutes ago, Fabulin said: No-one is ever really gone. Except for all the masters that were stored in the Universal backlot... Fabulin 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor 7,504 Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 When I write reviews on celluloidtunes.no, I try to say a few things about both the music on its own, and how it works in context (if I've seen the film). I think that's most fair. But I agree with publicist in that once you release the music on album, it can be judged thereafter. Which makes careful album considerations all the more important. If I'm writing about films, it's a different ballgame, of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koray Savas 2,251 Posted June 23, 2019 Share Posted June 23, 2019 20 hours ago, Jurassic Shark said: I'm just saying I doubt they released the album against Balfe's wishes. If you were a composer and did something you're proud of, wouldn't you want your music to be released? So Balfe is an idiot for being proud of his work and wanting his fans to have access to it away from the film? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ollie 1,059 Posted June 23, 2019 Share Posted June 23, 2019 I listen to film music the way I would contemporary / classical music. I don’t need to associate it with the images on screen. I don’t even worry if I ever the see film or not. Jurassic Shark 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trent B 337 Posted June 23, 2019 Share Posted June 23, 2019 Judging by the topic....no it's their own personal preference. Some may hate a score but I'll actually like it and vice versa. As I said it's all matter of preference. Edit: When I listen to film scores especially ones I listen to a lot, in my mind I see the scenes when the music is playing IE: "Stealing The Enterprise". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caliburn 72 Posted June 24, 2019 Share Posted June 24, 2019 As a reviewer, I have not rated a single score. First of all, my rating would be personal: my 1 star would be someone else's 5 star and the other way around. A soundtrack like Dunkirk would be horrible for me to rate. I think that the music works in the movie, but the score by itself is just not a pleasant listening experience for me. I just prefer that the readers just read what I have to say about the score, and make up their one mind, if the score is interesting or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,074 Posted June 24, 2019 Share Posted June 24, 2019 1 hour ago, Caliburn said: As a reviewer, I have not rated a single score. You're not a very prolific reviewer then! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Penna 3,687 Posted June 24, 2019 Share Posted June 24, 2019 On 6/22/2019 at 6:16 AM, Koray Savas said: So the reason that certain scores don't have album releases is because the composer didn't put it in their contract? How is something that is a possibility also a certainty? And you still haven't clarified what you mean by capitalizing on an album release non-monetarily. Wow, this is an intricate, all singing all dancing performance here, to try to deflect away from the fact that your buddy wrote a score many people didn't like and won't acknowledge the criticisms of the score when released as music. Jurassic Shark 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caliburn 72 Posted June 24, 2019 Share Posted June 24, 2019 1 hour ago, Jurassic Shark said: You're not a very prolific reviewer then! There are not many reviewers in the Netherlands, I am good :-) I also think my opinion about the score counts, not just a random number or a star. Jurassic Shark 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,074 Posted June 24, 2019 Share Posted June 24, 2019 1 hour ago, Caliburn said: I also think my opinion about the score counts That's of course the most important! But I think most readers understand that a number rating is subjective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A24 4,333 Posted June 24, 2019 Share Posted June 24, 2019 6 hours ago, Caliburn said: As a reviewer, I have not rated a single score. First of all, my rating would be personal: my 1 star would be someone else's 5 star and the other way around. A soundtrack like Dunkirk would be horrible for me to rate. I think that the music works in the movie, but the score by itself is just not a pleasant listening experience for me. I just prefer that the readers just read what I have to say about the score, and make up their one mind, if the score is interesting or not. ***/**** Jurassic Shark 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeinAR 1,949 Posted June 24, 2019 Share Posted June 24, 2019 It clear from my John Williams thread that people are judging score differently. I do not think they are doing it wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,074 Posted June 24, 2019 Share Posted June 24, 2019 On 6/23/2019 at 4:22 AM, Koray Savas said: So Balfe is an idiot for being proud of his work and wanting his fans to have access to it away from the film? One day he's dismissing all criticism of the score in itself because it's only meant to work in context of the film. The next day an album release is announced and he eagerly defends the music on its own. Don't you see the double standard here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fabulin 3,511 Posted June 24, 2019 Share Posted June 24, 2019 . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koray Savas 2,251 Posted June 25, 2019 Share Posted June 25, 2019 14 hours ago, Richard Penna said: Wow, this is an intricate, all singing all dancing performance here, to try to deflect away from the fact that your buddy wrote a score many people didn't like and won't acknowledge the criticisms of the score when released as music. No, I’m trying to clarify his claims. Again, still no answer as to what the hell he meant about capitalizing on an album release non-monetarily. As if Balfe is maliciously taking advantage of consumers somehow. I haven’t even talked about how the score works in the film or stands on its own. And I didn’t know you can call people you’ve never spoke to a buddy. 8 hours ago, Jurassic Shark said: One day he's dismissing all criticism of the score in itself because it's only meant to work in context of the film. The next day an album release is announced and he eagerly defends the music on its own. Don't you see the double standard here? Eagerly defends how? Y’all are just assuming that the fact that an album release exists he is contradicting himself and making millions of dollars in the process. Composers do not control album releases or make much money off of them. Plain and simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,074 Posted June 25, 2019 Share Posted June 25, 2019 4 hours ago, Koray Savas said: Eagerly defends how? Y’all are just assuming that the fact that an album release exists he is contradicting himself and making millions of dollars in the process. Composers do not control album releases or make much money off of them. Plain and simple. I read and listened to interviews with Balfe about the score. 4 hours ago, Koray Savas said: And I didn’t know you can call people you’ve never spoke to a buddy. I believe he's being sarcastic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,074 Posted June 25, 2019 Share Posted June 25, 2019 8 hours ago, Fabulin said: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Penna 3,687 Posted June 25, 2019 Share Posted June 25, 2019 9 hours ago, Koray Savas said: Eagerly defends how? Y’all are just assuming that the fact that an album release exists he is contradicting himself and making millions of dollars in the process. Composers do not control album releases or make much money off of them. Plain and simple. Right... a release that is co-produced by Balfe, from a label producer who routinely respects composer wishes. Definitely no control whatsoever over the album release process there.... (I don't think I ever mentioned money - I see it as an exposure thing) Whatever your reason is for trying to protect the reputation of this score, the double standard is there. Jurassic Shark 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,074 Posted June 25, 2019 Share Posted June 25, 2019 43 minutes ago, Richard Penna said: I don't think I ever mentioned money - I see it as an exposure thing Exactly! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caliburn 72 Posted June 25, 2019 Share Posted June 25, 2019 About Fallout. I did not wanted to review the score, because I did not like it as a stand alone album. I prefer to spend time on scores that I do like. But I also heard the "it works in the movie" argument, so I decided after seeing the movie to review it: https://soundtrackworld.com/2018/08/mission-impossible-fallout-lorne-balfe/ He responded to me on twitter that he likes crazy bongos. So I asked for an interview, which I almost got :-) My invitation for that interview still stands! There is so much to discuss about that score. Jurassic Shark 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted June 25, 2019 Author Share Posted June 25, 2019 I like the bad guy motif in that score. Koray Savas 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,074 Posted June 25, 2019 Share Posted June 25, 2019 Balfe's got his own motif? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caliburn 72 Posted June 26, 2019 Share Posted June 26, 2019 On 6/25/2019 at 2:41 PM, The Original said: I like the bad guy motif in that score. I couple of notes on a piano is not enough to carry a complete score for me, I am afraid ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted June 26, 2019 Author Share Posted June 26, 2019 Yeah but still it was pretty catchy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,074 Posted June 26, 2019 Share Posted June 26, 2019 1 hour ago, The Original said: Yeah but still it was pretty catchy. Balfe, is that you? On 6/25/2019 at 2:38 PM, Caliburn said: About Fallout. I did not wanted to review the score, because I did not like it as a stand alone album. I prefer to spend time on scores that I do like. But I also heard the "it works in the movie" argument, so I decided after seeing the movie to review it: https://soundtrackworld.com/2018/08/mission-impossible-fallout-lorne-balfe/ That's a great review! How many stars would you give? Caliburn 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caliburn 72 Posted June 26, 2019 Share Posted June 26, 2019 38 minutes ago, Jurassic Shark said: That's a great review! How many stars would you give? More than the Dark Phoenix score that I am reviewing at the moment. (Did I say that out load?) Jurassic Shark 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koray Savas 2,251 Posted June 28, 2019 Share Posted June 28, 2019 On 6/25/2019 at 7:19 AM, Richard Penna said: Right... a release that is co-produced by Balfe, from a label producer who routinely respects composer wishes. Definitely no control whatsoever over the album release process there.... (I don't think I ever mentioned money - I see it as an exposure thing) Whatever your reason is for trying to protect the reputation of this score, the double standard is there. My point is that the album would exist whether he wanted it to or not. Film scores to major Hollywood motion pictures get album releases. The reputation of this score is that the director, producers, and fans love it. It’s the small minority of film music fans on two message boards that despise it. I have nothing to protect. Expect the next two films to have his name on them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,074 Posted June 28, 2019 Share Posted June 28, 2019 Fans? In the review Thor just posted on celluloidtunes.no, it's stated that the user rating on Hans Zimmer's fan site is 2 out of 5. I wouldn't call that love... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koray Savas 2,251 Posted June 28, 2019 Share Posted June 28, 2019 I made the distinction between fans and film music fans. The normal movie going public don’t post on film music message boards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,074 Posted June 28, 2019 Share Posted June 28, 2019 I don't think film fans that are not film music fans would go to Hans Zimmer's fan site to rate albums. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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