Jump to content
Spider-Fal

Hans Zimmer's NO TIME TO DIE (2021)

Recommended Posts

1 hour ago, gkgyver said:

 

Please don't start that bs discussion again. The cover says Hans Zimmer. When major parts of the score are by other people, print "Music by Remote Control Pictures" or "Music by Hans Zimmer's Remote Control Pictures", but not "Music by Hans Zimmer". That's a class A lie. 

 

Who's listed in fine print in the booklet alongside the 9th violinist and 3rd orchestrator isn't "credit". 

 

So everyone in the industry is lying? Because every composer besides a handful uses ghostwriters and I don't see them all listing them on the front cover. I am ok with this as long as it applies to every composer in the industry.

 

Second, I think you need to stop spreading the lie that Zimmer doesn't share front cover credit. I posted this before, but just in the past 10 years, Zimmer has give front cover credit on 17 scores.

 

Megamind

Kung Fu Panda 2

The Dilemma

Winter's Tale

Son of God

The Amazing Spider-Man 2

Freeheld

The Little Prince

Woman in Gold

Batman v Superman

Hidden Figures

Planet Earth II

Blue Planet II

Seven Worlds, One Planet

The Boss Baby

Blade Runner 2049

Rebuilding Paradise

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Richard Penna said:

 

Without getting back into this debate again - yep. If a cover says 'Music by ABC', and 'ABC' hasn't scored the vast majority of the score, then the credit is innaccurate.

 

And before the RPC Defenders come piling in, that should apply to any composer. If it turned out that Batu Sener had composed 60% of CotW, I'd be unimpressed with Powell.

 

How do you know she didn't? What if Batu Sener composed 30% of the CoTW? What percent will you be impressed by? And how do you know anyway? And it is funny that you talked about Powell because Powell openly make light of the fact that he farms out cues to ghostwriters. 

 

Again, my problem with this is that I have never seen the same outrage apply to other composers besides Zimmer. I never seen Bear McCreary put "Music by Bear McCreary and Sparks and Shadows" on the front cover. Yet, I never read a single score review that criticize him for this. But I seen plenty that criticized Zimmer. I never read a single review that criticizes Brian Tyler. And somehow, Beltrami gets a free pass. When Zimmer brought on Mazzaro for No Time to Die, several users immediately pointed out that Giacchino didn't use any disclosed ghostwriters for Rogue One even though he was doing a rushed replacement score. But I hear crickets when Danny Elfman brought several people to help him finished Justice League. 

 

Again, it is great that you think front cover credit should apply to any composer, but if you truly believe that, then that should apply to 90% of the industry. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Rango, Pirates 4 and The Lone Ranger have him as the only composer credited, even though a bigger part of these scores were made by Geoff Zanelli. The Madagascar scores are the most controversial example, he is listed as a single composer but the majority of those score were composed by... a large team of people.

 

12 minutes ago, Mephariel said:

So everyone in the industry is lying? Because every composer besides a handful uses ghostwriters and I don't see them all listing them on the front cover. I am ok with this as long as it applies to every composer in the industry.

 

 

Williams doesn't use ghostwriters, and he managed to write almost 9 hours of Star Wars music over the last few years all by himself. Shore didn't used additional composers as well, and he wrote about 15 hours of Middle Earth music. Heck, Morricone used to write several scores every year, all of them by himself. Desplat, Giacchino, JNH, Horner, Goldsmith... none of them use/used additional composers.

 

It's Zimmer himself that prefers to approach what he scores as a team. Well, Zimmer and a handful of others, such as Beltrami. Powell has his own team as well, which is seriously disappointing to me (until this day I don't know if whether he or Batu Sener wrote Corellia Chase from Solo, hopefully the expanded edition of that score will help clarify that).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 minutes ago, PuhgreÞiviÞm said:

But which notes did Zimmer write? And who wrote the other notes?

 

Do you know that for all the other composers that uses ghostwriters? Which notes did Buck Sanders wrote for Beltrami? What about Franglen for James Horner? Which notes in Godzilla was written by Sparks and Shadows? What about Justice League with Elfman? 

 

You ever read a book written by 2 authors? Stephen King and Peter Straub wrote Black House together. Which words were written by each other? Do you know exactly which scenes were shot by the secondary director vs the main director? Do you know every scene that was done by a stunt double? 

 

What you are asking for is not realistic in most industry that has collaboration. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Mephariel said:

 

Do you know that for all the other composers that uses ghostwriters? Which notes did Buck Sanders wrote for Beltrami? What about Franglen for James Horner? Which notes in Godzilla was written by Sparks and Shadows? What about Justice League with Elfman? 

 

You ever read a book written by 2 authors? Stephen King and Peter Straub wrote Black House together. Which words were written by each other? Do you know exactly which scenes were shot by the secondary director vs the main director? Do you know every scene that was done by a stunt double? 

 

What you are asking for is not realistic in most industry that has collaboration. 

 

Oh, really, who do you have? Name one composer that ghostwrites for these guys! You name one composer that came out and wrote which notes in a Zimmer score. Go ahead! Think we have time.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, Edmilson said:

Rango, Pirates 4 and The Lone Ranger have him as the only composer credited, even though a bigger part of these scores were made by Geoff Zanelli. The Madagascar scores are the most controversial example, he is listed as a single composer but the majority of those score were composed by... a large team of people.

 

 

Williams doesn't use ghostwriters, and he managed to write almost 9 hours of Star Wars music over the last few years all by himself. Shore didn't used additional composers as well, and he wrote about 15 hours of Middle Earth music. Heck, Morricone used to write several scores every year, all of them by himself. Desplat, Giacchino, JNH, Horner, Goldsmith... none of them use/used additional composers.

 

It's Zimmer himself that prefers to approach what he scores as a team. Well, Zimmer and a handful of others, such as Beltrami. Powell has his own team as well, which is seriously disappointing to me (until this day I don't know if whether he or Batu Sener wrote Corellia Chase from Solo, hopefully the expanded edition of that score will help clarify that).

 

You really think only a handful of composers uses ghostwriters? Jonathan Broxton from UK Move Music Review basically said that he doesn't know a single composer who doesn't use ghostwriters. I don't know where to start if you think only a handful of composers uses ghostwriters. 

 

Can I get a source that the composers you listed has never used additional composers? James Newton Howard did The Dark Knight with Zimmer and a handful of others. Horner worked with Simon Franglen. There is nothing wrong with collaboration btw. That is part of music making. In song production, you have bands right?

 

Lastly, whether or not Zimmer should give more front cover credit can be debated. But Zimmer does give front cover credit often. That is my point. Again, you are criticizing someone that gave 17 front cover credit in the past 10 years, when I don't see the same outrage for Beltrami, Tyler, Powell, Bear McCreary, and a whole bunch of others.  

 

 

8 minutes ago, PuhgreÞiviÞm said:

 

Oh, really, who do you have? Name one composer that ghostwrites for these guys! You name one composer that came out and wrote which notes in a Zimmer score. Go ahead! Think we have time.

 

I have no idea that you are asking. Name one composer that ghostwrites for these guys? Are you serious? It is well known that Beltrami uses ghostwriters. Powell does too. 

 

Literally majority of the industry uses ghostwriters. And you won't know which composer write which note either.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, PuhgreÞiviÞm said:

Who composes the good bits and who composes the boring bits?

 

Ask the composers when you meet them...or go look up cue by cue credits on their website.

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think Zimmer gets more attention about this issue than other composers because he’s the one who made it the new normal. He Henry Forded the modern-day film score with his quasi-anonymized assembly line production. And these productions tend to lack the personality and character, the unique stamp of the individual composer, that only the most engaged listeners appreciate but that makes film score collection worthwhile.

 

It wouldn’t be so much a problem to me if it weren’t for the fact that he sucks all the oxygen out of the room. He (or his RCP protégés) nabs all the choicest films, muting talented composers like Kraemer or whoever might’ve scored Dune in an alternate world where a massive tentpole by an auteur director might have drawn the producers’ attention toward anyone other than the biggest name in scoring. 

 

It’s all moot anyway, though. The filmmaking process today is so jumbled and iterative that you need composers whose work can be chopped up into little bits and reassembled to fit the final cut 2 days before it goes to theaters without anyone being able to tell the difference. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
30 minutes ago, Bayesian said:

I think Zimmer gets more attention about this issue than other composers because he’s the one who made it the new normal. He Henry Forded the modern-day film score with his quasi-anonymized assembly line production. And these productions tend to lack the personality and character, the unique stamp of the individual composer, that only the most engaged listeners appreciate but that makes film score collection worthwhile.

 

It wouldn’t be so much a problem to me if it weren’t for the fact that he sucks all the oxygen out of the room. He (or his RCP protégés) nabs all the choicest films, muting talented composers like Kraemer or whoever might’ve scored Dune in an alternate world where a massive tentpole by an auteur director might have drawn the producers’ attention toward anyone other than the biggest name in scoring. 

 

It’s all moot anyway, though. The filmmaking process today is so jumbled and iterative that you need composers whose work can be chopped up into little bits and reassembled to fit the final cut 2 days before it goes to theaters without anyone being able to tell the difference. 

 

Well said!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Richard Penna said:

Zimmer's normalised the idea that you can get 6 composers to help you on a score, and still be the only one who gets cover credit.

 

Assistants have been helping composers put scores together since the old studio days. Zimmer is hardly the man who invented that.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
17 minutes ago, publicist said:

All of them did, or do...

 

I believe that Giacchino used to do that in his days as TV composer, when the deadline was short, so he relied on Chris Tilton, Chad Seiter, etc.

 

JNH used assistants on King Kong, but only because it was a rushed job. Other than that I never heard of him using additional composers.

 

Horner is complicated. He may have used Simon Franglen in Avatar/Titanic and I'm sure Don Davis wrote parts of Balto, but other than that, I don't think he used.

 

I've never heard something similar for Desplat either.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

People keep saying Desplat has used ghostwriters, but I've never seen evidence for that. He co-wrote Mr. Magorium in 2007 (and shared credit on the cover art), and I think that's it. I have, however, heard him in an interview say that he never uses ghostwriters.

 

I'm not one to usually side with @gkgyver, but he's absolutely right about the whataboutism problem that corrodes so many promising discussions. Comparing Zimmer's team-writing/solo (or occasional duo)-credit approach to the one time Elfman brought in a team and didn't give cover credit (JL) is textbook false equivalence that pushes the discussion into disputing the trees when the forest is the real topic.

 

Whether or not I'm right in saying that Zimmer is responsible for the team-writing approach in Hollywood today, he certainly is the one to profit most from it and to use it to the hilt. And it gives rise to what economists might consider an endogeneity problem -- filmmakers now turn to the formidable Team Zimmer to handle their scoring needs because they've been conditioned by breathless praise from Zimmer's fans to use the Zimmer sound after he spent 20 years conditioning people to like his sound and expect it everywhere.

 

Ultimately, the result has been, and appears doomed to continue to be, a film scoring approach that seems to barely concern itself with main or character themes, catchy melodies, or orchestral or harmonic color anymore. Instead, it just goes for ostinatos, loud-ass percussion, massed brass and strings, everything synth or treated through an algorithm, nothing in a major key, no thematic development worthy of the name, no counterpoint, no variability in the meter, no fun.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
18 minutes ago, MedigoScan said:

Thats a lot of big words.

Oh well, I've found plenty of the RCP music to be fun myself.

Maybe I exaggerated. Some of the POTC stuff is kinda fun, in a basic, no-thematic-development kind of way. Some material in Transformers is passably decent. There's going to be other examples in the RCP oeuvre, no doubt. But in the main, to mine own ears, Zimmer and RCP mostly compose loud wallpaper.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
49 minutes ago, Bayesian said:

People keep saying Desplat has used ghostwriters, but I've never seen evidence for that. He co-wrote Mr. Magorium in 2007 (and shared credit on the cover art), and I think that's it. I have, however, heard him in an interview say that he never uses ghostwriters.

 

I'm not one to usually side with @gkgyver, but he's absolutely right about the whataboutism problem that corrodes so many promising discussions. Comparing Zimmer's team-writing/solo (or occasional duo)-credit approach to the one time Elfman brought in a team and didn't give cover credit (JL) is textbook false equivalence that pushes the discussion into disputing the trees when the forest is the real topic.

 

Whether or not I'm right in saying that Zimmer is responsible for the team-writing approach in Hollywood today, he certainly is the one to profit most from it and to use it to the hilt. And it gives rise to what economists might consider an endogeneity problem -- filmmakers now turn to the formidable Team Zimmer to handle their scoring needs because they've been conditioned by breathless praise from Zimmer's fans to use the Zimmer sound after he spent 20 years conditioning people to like his sound and expect it everywhere.

 

Ultimately, the result has been, and appears doomed to continue to be, a film scoring approach that seems to barely concern itself with main or character themes, catchy melodies, or orchestral or harmonic color anymore. Instead, it just goes for ostinatos, loud-ass percussion, massed brass and strings, everything synth or treated through an algorithm, nothing in a major key, no thematic development worthy of the name, no counterpoint, no variability in the meter, no fun.

 

100% agreed. Zimmer is the one who benefits the most of this approach, since his team dominated the film music world. Every producer in Hollywood now wants "The Zimmer Sound", courtesy of the RC team.

 

And to the RC fans out there in this forum, I don't hate RC, and in fact I even consider some of their scores pretty good. What annoys me is that someone as mediocre as Lorne Balfe keep getting more and more scores simply because he can emulate the sound of someone else.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Even the least talented RCP composer is ten times better than Leonard Rosenman!😁

8 minutes ago, Edmilson said:

 

 

 

 

 

What annoys me is that someone as mediocre as Lorne Balfe keep getting more and more scores simply because he can emulate the sound of someone else.

Oh, and you think John Debney and Joel McNealy get hired for their unique compositional ' voice'?

 

😆

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
52 minutes ago, bruce marshall said:

Even the least talented RCP composer is ten times better than Leonard Rosenman!😁

Oh, and you think John Debney and Joel McNealy get hired for their unique compositional ' voice'?

 

😆

 

At least they have one. 

And both have proven that they can do other things. 

Those Remote Control people have yet to prove they're more than a Hans Zimmer chamber slave. 

 

There is a really fundamental error in comparing music written and overwritten by a dozen people, to the collaboration of making a film. 

 

With a film, you NEED different people with different fields of expertise to collaborate, to achieve a vision. 

You NEED a costume designer, you NEED an editor, you NEED a set designer, you NEED pure craftsmen, because none of those individuals can do all of those fields on their own because it's not their expertise. 

 

A musician has one field of expertise. One. No musician worth his salt - NONE - needs someone else to write a piece of music for him. Moreover, if you have any aspiration towards an artistic musical vision, you won't allow someone else to mess with your work, ever.

 

A film editor won't just go "hey, assistant number 3, want to have a crack at this film?" 

A film designer won't go "hey person X, I'll send you my designs over, you can have a go and paint them over". 

In fact, I'd bet if a designer did that, used one of person X's designs, slapped his name on it, and got an Oscar for it, there'd be lawsuits. 

 

Stop pretending Hans Zimmer is honest or justified in what he does. 

Have you ever seen one of those Roundtables Zimmer is part of? Not a single word about any of his ghostwriters. Not one. 

If there's one thing he's very good at, it's verbally jacking off. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My take on the crediting scheme is that ghostwriters, assistants, additional writers etc. are in support of and helping the main composer - all six of the Magnificent Six have to go through Zimmer and he probably supervised what they wrote.

The funny thing is how JWFan and others turn this into a conspiracy when the truth is closer to Zimmer sitting around with friends, giving them opportunities to collaborate and the last worry on their minds is a credit on the front cover.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, KK said:

All of those composers have used assistants in varying capacities in recent years, especially JNH and Gia.

 

It is a very commonly accepted practice in the industry. And all assistants have a clear understanding of their role and the non-disclosure that comes with it. It comes with the job.

 

It's us fans who romanticize the "artistry" of it. Films are delivered on such quick turnovers these days, that it's more and more impossible for individual composers to retain 100% creative control like JWFan likes to imagine.

 

Exactly. People need to stop thinking the industry doesn't use assistants. Alfred Newman did it way back in the days.

5 hours ago, Bayesian said:

People keep saying Desplat has used ghostwriters, but I've never seen evidence for that. He co-wrote Mr. Magorium in 2007 (and shared credit on the cover art), and I think that's it. I have, however, heard him in an interview say that he never uses ghostwriters.

 

I'm not one to usually side with @gkgyver, but he's absolutely right about the whataboutism problem that corrodes so many promising discussions. Comparing Zimmer's team-writing/solo (or occasional duo)-credit approach to the one time Elfman brought in a team and didn't give cover credit (JL) is textbook false equivalence that pushes the discussion into disputing the trees when the forest is the real topic.

 

Whether or not I'm right in saying that Zimmer is responsible for the team-writing approach in Hollywood today, he certainly is the one to profit most from it and to use it to the hilt. And it gives rise to what economists might consider an endogeneity problem -- filmmakers now turn to the formidable Team Zimmer to handle their scoring needs because they've been conditioned by breathless praise from Zimmer's fans to use the Zimmer sound after he spent 20 years conditioning people to like his sound and expect it everywhere.

 

Ultimately, the result has been, and appears doomed to continue to be, a film scoring approach that seems to barely concern itself with main or character themes, catchy melodies, or orchestral or harmonic color anymore. Instead, it just goes for ostinatos, loud-ass percussion, massed brass and strings, everything synth or treated through an algorithm, nothing in a major key, no thematic development worthy of the name, no counterpoint, no variability in the meter, no fun.

 

I am sorry, but there is a difference between your perception and reality. Transformers 1-5, The Da Vinci Code, POTC, Tron Legacy, Mully, Kung Fu Panda 1-3, The Boss Baby, Blue Planet II, Solo, Man of Steel, Wonder Woman, Aquaman, Mortal Engines, Maleficent, Game of Thrones, The Lone Ranger, etc. etc. all have melodies and multiple themes. If anything, the weakness of RCP is the underscore. Jablonsky for example can do a mean melody, but he can't write a B section to save his life.

 

Tyler, Doyle, Giacchino, Mothersbaugh, Debney, Bates (along with a couple of RCP composers), etc. combined for like 23 Marvel films and arguably the only memorable theme that came out of the entire franchise is Silvestri's Avengers theme. RCP is hardly the bulleye for killing catchy melodies and themes.

 

And if you think Elfman only used assistants one time, I don't know what to tell you. As recently as 2019, he worked with Chris Bacon and TJ Lindgren for Man in Black: International. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
37 minutes ago, Mephariel said:

 

Exactly. People need to stop thinking the industry doesn't use assistants. Alfred Newman did it way back in the days.

 

I am sorry, but there is a difference between your perception and reality. Transformers 1-5, The Da Vinci Code, POTC, Tron Legacy, Mully, Kung Fu Panda 1-3, The Boss Baby, Blue Planet II, Solo, Man of Steel, Wonder Woman, Aquaman, Mortal Engines, Maleficent, Game of Thrones, The Lone Ranger, etc. etc. all have melodies and multiple themes. If anything, the weakness of RCP is the underscore. Jablonsky for example can do a mean melody, but he can't write a B section to save his life.

 

Tyler, Doyle, Giacchino, Mothersbaugh, Debney, Bates (along with a couple of RCP composers), etc. combined for like 23 Marvel films and arguably the only memorable theme that came out of the entire franchise is Silvestri's Avengers theme. RCP is hardly the bulleye for killing catchy melodies and themes.

 

And if you think Elfman only used assistants one time, I don't know what to tell you. As recently as 2019, he worked with Chris Bacon and TJ Lindgren for Man in Black: International. 


what an odd grouping of composers and scores. Some of these are not like the rest.

 

For example JNH at his best is a very sophisticated writer. He’s not in the same category as RCP.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, TheUlyssesian said:


what an odd grouping of composers and scores. Some of these are not like the rest.

 

For example JNH at his best is a very sophisticated writer. He’s not in the same category as RCP.

 

Agreed actually. JNH is one of the very best composers technically and the ability to execute. I can't say the same for a lot of RCP composers. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Mephariel said:

 

Exactly. People need to stop thinking the industry doesn't use assistants. Alfred Newman did it way back in the days.

 

I am sorry, but there is a difference between your perception and reality. Transformers 1-5, The Da Vinci Code, POTC, Tron Legacy, Mully, Kung Fu Panda 1-3, The Boss Baby, Blue Planet II, Solo, Man of Steel, Wonder Woman, Aquaman, Mortal Engines, Maleficent, Game of Thrones, The Lone Ranger, etc. etc. all have melodies and multiple themes. If anything, the weakness of RCP is the underscore. Jablonsky for example can do a mean melody, but he can't write a B section to save his life.

 

Tyler, Doyle, Giacchino, Mothersbaugh, Debney, Bates (along with a couple of RCP composers), etc. combined for like 23 Marvel films and arguably the only memorable theme that came out of the entire franchise is Silvestri's Avengers theme. RCP is hardly the bulleye for killing catchy melodies and themes.

 

And if you think Elfman only used assistants one time, I don't know what to tell you. As recently as 2019, he worked with Chris Bacon and TJ Lindgren for Man in Black: International. 

I'm willing to eat crow when the facts warrant it. But I think it's important to make sure we're all defining things the same way. For example, I wouldn't consider JNH or John Powell as RCP. Even if they spent some time in Zimmer's factory, they both long ago made a separate name for themselves and have no meaningful relationship to RCP now. Da Vinci code, I'll grant you that one. (Sherlock too, for that matter.) But Tron legacy?? That was daft punk! 

 

Although I have to refute your Marvel straw man (I never said RCP were the only ones guilty of the transgressions I listed), you're right that across almost two dozen films, not much MCU music stands out melodically or thematically. Actually, that just makes the whole situation more depressing: the Disney/Marvel lineup of non-RCP composers has been no more or less successful than RCP at writing memorable movie music. Between the two groups, that's a pretty big chunk of the present-day film composer firmament.

 

On Elfman, I also must fact-check ya: I mentioned JL as the only time he didn't credit his co-composers. Whether I'm correct about that or not, bringing up MIB: International, which credits both Elfman and Bacon, is a false equivalence.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@gkgyver 

Quote

 

A musician has one field of expertise. One. No musician worth his salt - NONE - needs someone else to write a piece of music for him. Moreover, if you have any aspiration towards an artistic musical vision, you won't allow someone else to mess with your work, ever.

This isn't how it works in almost any artistic field, especially in film production. It's a highly collaborative environment where the collective knowledge is used to benefit the whole team. I've had interactions with directors, editors, production designers, actors all with the benefit of having my work fit to their needs. When you're working on producing something creative, the work is the most important thing, how it's made is secondary to that endeavor. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Jeez guys, this is like talking to Grandpa and how his old pocket watch is better than a smartphone.

 

What many here genuinely don't seem to get is that *modern* composers, be it Elfman, JNH, Powell or Desplat, of course owe a lot to many little helpers in the background, at least in big projects that require more than a piano solo. It's no major offense, it's just what it is.

 

And of course the less desirable things, like mundane suspense cues or mood spheres etc., are the first things you farm out (instead of...uhoh...the main thematic identity) - Horner's early to mid 90's work is ghostwriting heaven, you can plainly see it in the number of scores he did and if you listen to the scores. Certain orchestrational knacks in them also turn up in Robin Hood, Warriors of Virtue, and several others. Well...so what (for what it's worth, after 1995, much of his work became more monochrome and less colourful because he phased that practice out).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, bruce marshall said:

Yeah! I'm anti-FASCIST.

why aren't YOU?

 

Their name has no relation to what they actually do, which is burn down ma and pa shops and beat up old ladies in the streets.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 minutes ago, PuhgreÞiviÞm said:

 

Their name has no relation to what they actually do, which is burn down ma and pa shops and beat up old ladies in the streets.

I'd..id..idi...

"It's for you"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...