Black Friday 2019 JW prediction poll

[Disco Stu 15,495]

It’s more light irony than full-on silliness of the other examples mentioned

[publicist 4,643]

We absolutely should include 'Hook-Napped'!!

[mrbellamy 6,272]

On 11/26/2019 at 7:42 PM, Edmilson said:

Was George Lucas single by the time of the making of KOTCS?

 

He was dating his now-wife, they got engaged/married in 2013.

[Luke Skywalker 1,792]

Ok, so compys ate dieter at daylight. Does that count as dinner?

[Bellosh 3,389]

Could it be War Horse with that leak that recently came out?

[Holko 9,499]

Post-2005, so no.

[Bellosh 3,389]

Could you explain?  They don't handle scores post 2005?

[bollemanneke 3,337]

Licence fee shit.

[Holko 9,499]

Sometime in 2005 there was a change so now the musicians who played on scores post-change get more money from sells and reissues and stuff, but the reality is that this buffs up licensing fees so high that these small labels could never realistically afford them so nobody gets any money. Lawyers are weird.

[Bellosh 3,389]

1 minute ago, Holko said:

Sometime in 2005 there was a change so now the musicians who played on scores post-change get more money from sells and reissues and stuff, but the reality is that this buffs up licensing fees so high that these small labels could never realistically afford them so nobody gets any money. Lawyers are weird.

 

No kidding.  Huh, well that's interesting.  Appreciate the answer.

[filmmusic 1,823]

So, is it in 12 hours from now?

[Edmilson 7,392]

So maybe War of the Worlds escaped, but not Memories of a Geisha and Munich, huh?

 

It's unfortunate that the decision was applied immediately, and not for, say, scores released post 2006 or 2007. Some scores from late 2005 could really use an expansion, not only the JW ones but also HGW's Chronicles of Narnia, JNH's King Kong and Doyle's Goblet of Fire.

[filmmusic 1,823]

3 minutes ago, Edmilson said:

So maybe War of the Worlds escaped, but not Memories of a Geisha and Munich, huh?

 

 

Let's hope they leak like War Horse.

I'd love a complete Memoirs of a Geisha.

[crocodile 7,984]

8 minutes ago, filmmusic said:

So, is it in 12 hours from now?

Yeah.

 

5 minutes ago, Edmilson said:

Goblet of Fire.

That was recorded in London so the rule doesn't apply.

 

Karol

[bollemanneke 3,337]

I'd be very interested to see what LLL does with GOF.

[crocodile 7,984]

Just now, bollemanneke said:

I'd be very interested to see what LLL does with GOF.

I would be very interested in this too, especially after hearing the score live earlier this month.

 

Karol

[Holko 9,499]

Me too! The leaked sessions are very much damaged.

[Bilbo 3,709]

Goblet of Fire would be amazing this year! I’d really like that.

[Edmilson 7,392]

8 minutes ago, crocodile said:

That was recorded in London so the rule doesn't apply.

 

 

Cool! 

 

And also: oh, fuck, if JW had recorded his post-2005 scores on London, then there wouldn't be a problem. Specially the Star Wars ones, the other he would probably have recorded on the US anyway.

 

Although a Star Wars box would came out by Disney, and they would have no problem on paying the fees.

[bollemanneke 3,337]

38 minutes ago, Holko said:

Me too! The leaked sessions are very much damaged.

And incomplete.

[Bespin 8,480]

So it leaked, I have the privilege to announce you that we'll get the expansion of....

 

THE TERMINAL!

 

Only one person voted for that title, ah ah ah.

[Chewy 2,376]

I'm ready for it!

 

[Smaug The Iron 510]

15 hours ago, crocodile said:

That was recorded in London so the rule doesn't apply.

So the licensing fees are only in the USA? 

[crocodile 7,984]

7 minutes ago, Smaug the iron said:

So the licensing fees are only in the USA? 

Yes, one of the reasons why so many studios record abroad. I think it costs more to record it but you pay musicians only once.

 

Karol

[crumbs 14,301]

Amusing that none of the 3 JW scores released on BF were even options in the poll.

[1977 1,743]

On 10/2/2019 at 7:08 PM, JTWfan77 said:

Other = The Towering Inferno

 at least got one right

[Edmilson 7,392]

No Sugarland Express, JW is still not ready to authorize a new release of this.

[Bespin 8,480]

19 hours ago, Bespin said:

So it leaked, I have the privilege to announce you that we'll get the expansion of....

 

THE TERMINAL!

 

Only one person voted for that title, ah ah ah.

 

[Bellosh 3,389]

Hey who knows, maybe it'll be a Tom Hanks Boxset next year including: The Terminal, Catch Me If You Can and The Post

[Jurassic Shark 12,030]

Or a DiCaprio box.

[Edmilson 7,392]

Nah, the only movie scored by JW he did was CMIYC.

 

Maybe a Leo DiCaprio/Scorsese/Howard Shore box set, containing the complete scores for Gangs of New York, The Aviator and The Departed?

[Brundlefly 2,385]

9 hours ago, crocodile said:

Yes, one of the reasons why so many studios record abroad. I think it costs more to record it but you pay musicians only once.

You can even measure by the lenght of Varese Sarabande's original soundtracks, where Jerry Goldsmith recorded his scores.

30 min. = USA

50 min. = GB

[A. A. Ron 1,738]

5 hours ago, Edmilson said:

Nah, the only movie scored by JW he did was CMIYC.

 

Maybe a Leo DiCaprio/Scorsese/Howard Shore box set, containing the complete scores for Gangs of New York, The Aviator and The Departed?

Shore would release those expansions on his own label.

[Dr. Rick 1,155]

12 hours ago, crumbs said:

Amusing that none of the 3 JW scores released on BF were even options in the poll.

They were under “Other”. 😜

[Jay 37,287]

On 11/28/2019 at 1:16 PM, Holko said:

Post-2005, so no.

 

On 11/28/2019 at 1:20 PM, Bellosh said:

Could you explain?  They don't handle scores post 2005?

 

On 11/28/2019 at 1:30 PM, bollemanneke said:

Licence fee shit.

 

On 11/28/2019 at 1:31 PM, Holko said:

Sometime in 2005 there was a change so now the musicians who played on scores post-change get more money from sells and reissues and stuff, but the reality is that this buffs up licensing fees so high that these small labels could never realistically afford them so nobody gets any money. Lawyers are weird.

 

On 11/28/2019 at 1:33 PM, Bellosh said:

 

No kidding.  Huh, well that's interesting.  Appreciate the answer.

 

 

 

Mike Matessino has provided me with a more detailed explanation of this that I can share:

 

Quote

For AFM recordings made before July 3, 2005, NO reuse needs to be paid to the musicians at all, provided a) that it’s for a physical format release with a 5000 unit maximum, and b) that the musicians list is published, preferably in the packaging. For recordings made after that date, whatever the musicians were paid to record the score for the film has to be paid to them again, 100%. That’s why it’s called “reuse”. They were paid to play music for sync purposes, but an album is a new use.

 

So, hypothetically, if 120 people were paid $360,000 to record the music for the film (musicians, orchestrators, copyists, at an average of $3K a person), then a label would have to pay that exact same amount to AFM in order to put out an expanded album. That makes it impossible to consider even before you get to licensing, publishing, production and manufacturing.

 

The 2005 date was established in 2015 and applied to recordings going back 10 years prior, but unfortunately it was not a “sliding” date as it really should have been.

 

Mike

 

[Jurassic Shark 12,030]

Thanks for the detailed explanation, Jay. But that's really fucked up!

[Disco Stu 15,495]

Is this something that *could* be renegotiated?  For instance, to make it a rolling 10 year period?

[Jurassic Shark 12,030]

Everything's possible.

[bollemanneke 3,337]

Thank you, Jay! Any chance you could tell us if this year's BF batch contained the two Sony Music titles?

[1977 1,743]

2 minutes ago, bollemanneke said:

Thank you, Jay! Any chance you could tell us if this year's BF batch contained the two Sony Music titles?

 

It didn't. MGM / Sony Pictures / UMG / Universal Studios / Geffen / TCF / Warner Music / Paramount / CBS. No Sony Music. Which is good.

[bollemanneke 3,337]

I whole-heartedly agree!

[1977 1,743]

Regarding the AFM thing, how did Varese manage to release 3 DEs of NuTrek that were recorded after 2005?

[Jurassic Shark 12,030]

Recorded outside of the USA?

[1977 1,743]

18 minutes ago, Jurassic Shark said:

Recorded outside of the USA?

 

I don't think so.

 

"It was performed by the Hollywood Studio Symphony and Page LA Studio Voices at the Sony Scoring Stage in Culver City, California."

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_Trek_(soundtrack)

[Jay 37,287]

Good question. Maybe Varese simply paid the pricey fees? Maybe Giacchino pulled strings to negotiate a different fee? Who knows, and Varese will never tell us. 

[Bayesian 1,359]

This additional insight would appear to put the last nail in the coffin regarding any hopes for score expansions beyond WOTW. At least ROTS made the cut, so the prequel box set is still in play. 
 

Silver lining: Until AFM’s lawyers come to their senses and revise the terms, the specialty labels’ focus will be on mining the back catalog, and that’s not a bad thing. Plenty of JW there to expand.

[1977 1,743]

So when does the Black Friday 2020 JW prediction poll open?

[crumbs 14,301]

1 hour ago, Bayesian said:

This additional insight would appear to put the last nail in the coffin regarding any hopes for score expansions beyond WOTW. At least ROTS made the cut, so the prequel box set is still in play. 

 

Scores recorded outside LA aren't affected by this issue, so even if ROTS were a post-2005 score there would be no issue expanding it.

 

The 3 sequel trilogy scores will incur heavy fees to expand though, as they were all LA recordings.. and when you consider how extensive the ST sessions have been, and the volume of music recorded, the total cost to record these scores would far exceed any of JW's other post-2005 scores (but hopefully waved through as loose change by Disney).

 

The real shame here is the lack of a sliding date, which locks scores to these fees regardless of time passed (so much for thinking +10 or +20 years meant a fee reduction). So these scores are effectively off-limits to small labels forever now.

[bollemanneke 3,337]

For now, yes.

[crumbs 14,301]

I guess there's some hope for shorter scores like Lincoln or The Post, scores theoretically recorded much faster than, say, Tintin (thus lower musician costs). That said, no label is going to sell the 5000 copies of an expanded The Post needed to break even.

 

It's absurd that any expansion results in these exorbitant fees regardless of how much unreleased music is included. So The Post might only have 5 minutes of new music, while The Force Awakens has 100 minutes, but they'll charge the same fee (just on a different scale).

 

I wonder if that's why some studios release 2CD versions at the same time as normal releases, because it's not subject to the fees you'll pay expanding it years later (if it's considered part of the "initial" release)?