Minority Report vs. War of the Worlds

[Unlucky Bastard 7,782]

I heard they're tranthgender...

[Josh500 1,615]

8 hours ago, Romão said:

Everybody Runs! would be included in any list of my favorite JW tracks. It's one my favorite action tracks ever

 

I've always thought so.... And this track made me initially fall in love with the entire MR score. This scene is mind-blowingly and fantastically well scored, indeed! Gets your heart pumping like crazy... 

 

 

[Thor 7,451]

10 hours ago, Dixon Hill said:

 

Have you ever met an opinion that originated outside of your own brain that you didn't think was bizarre?

 

Very rarely.

 

I like everything about these two titles, at the tailend of Williams' last golden period: Love the films, love the scores, love the OST presentations. As the Lego saying goes: "Everything is awesome!"

[Jurassic Shark 12,008]

21 hours ago, mstrox said:

It's been over 10 years now, but if I recall correctly, my problem with WOTW wasn't the happy ending, but rather the abruptness of the ending.  It goes from scary menacing setpiece to scary menacing setpiece to scary menacing setpiece to scary menacing setpiece to sneezy aliens lose out of nowhere in one very quick scene.

 

But it's totally realistic (and I can confirm it since I have a cold right now).

 

13 hours ago, crocodile said:

Both albums are quite odd. What was Williams thinking when he combined all those short nondescript cues into this 10-minute Escape from the Basket in War of the Worlds? It makes no dramatic sense and kills the last section of the album.

 

Agreed.

[Oomoog the Ecstatic 314]

The Minority Report movie didn't really intrigue as much as War of the Worlds tbh. Ok concept, but poor atmosphere and execution.

[Brundlefly 2,385]

12 hours ago, Thor said:

Ha, ha...I hear ya! Some bizarre opinions here.

Honestly, you are the last guy to laugh about bizarre opinions here. By the way, that Spielberg is no Scorsese regarding consequence (and not just stylistical consequence) is not just a personal opinion.

1 hour ago, Borodin said:

The Minority Report movie didn't really intrigue as much as War of the Worlds tbh. Ok concept, but poor atmosphere and execution.

Poor atmosphere and poor execution? I feel like many people mix up Spielberg's strenghts and weaknesses.

[Thor 7,451]

32 minutes ago, Brundlefly said:

Honestly, you are the last guy to laugh about bizarre opinions here. By the way, that Spielberg is no Scorsese regarding consequence (and not just stylistical consequence) is not just a personal opinion.

 

Of course it is, and it's a rubbish, bizarre opinion. In what way is Spielberg not consistent in the way he approaches style in any given movie? He's one of our foremost auteurs, both stylistically and thematically.

[Unlucky Bastard 7,782]

He's alright I guess.

[Smeltington 1,436]

He's still talented but he's spinning his wheels.

[Jay 37,249]

On 10/8/2019 at 4:48 AM, Josh500 said:

Yes, I've done this one before, I remember,

 

WOTW had more fans 2 years ago it seems

 

http://www.jwfan.com/forums/index.php?/topic/27617-minority-report-vs-war-of-the-worlds

[Disco Stu 15,495]

2 minutes ago, Jay said:

 

WOTW had more fans 2 years ago it seems

 

http://www.jwfan.com/forums/index.php?/topic/27617-minority-report-vs-war-of-the-worlds

 

Too bad that poll is anonymous so we can't see if anyone changed.

 

At least I'm on record in both threads with the same opinion!

[Jay 37,249]

That old poll is anonymous to you?  When I click I can see who voted what

[Disco Stu 15,495]

1 minute ago, Jay said:

That old poll is anonymous to you?  When I click I can see who voted what

 

Moderator's privilege!

[Jay 37,249]

Huh.  Weird.

[Jurassic Shark 12,008]

That's the second time you've discovered this is a moderator privilege in like a year.

[Jay 37,249]

The site doesn't even tell me it's anonymous. Lazy software writers. 

[Brundlefly 2,385]

3 hours ago, Thor said:

Of course it is, and it's a rubbish, bizarre opinion. In what way is Spielberg not consistent in the way he approaches style in any given movie? He's one of our foremost auteurs, both stylistically and thematically.

I'm not saying his style is not distinct, but especially Schindler's List and War of the Worlds show that he never gets fully beyond his pleasant Hollywood-approach, which is sometimes really sad, because it's just one last step he never dares to do. There's a difference between distinction, consequence and consistence.

[Jurassic Shark 12,008]

Nobody understands what your complaint is about.

[Thor 7,451]

19 minutes ago, Brundlefly said:

I'm not saying his style is not distinct, but especially Schindler's List and War of the Worlds show that he never gets fully beyond his pleasant Hollywood-approach, which is sometimes really sad, because it's just one last step he never dares to do. There's a difference between distinction, consequence and consistence.

 

OK, so you're not really talking about consistency, but a reluctance to go all-out arthouse? Well, there's truth to that, but the art of Spielberg is communicated through a Hollywood lens. All of his themes and stylistic traits are firm within. I consider that a quality in itself. Not all directors need to be experimental Jean-Luc Godards or "edgy" Gaspar Noës or whatever.

[Chewy 2,372]

1 hour ago, Jay said:

That old poll is anonymous to you?  When I click I can see who voted what

I can see too

[Disco Stu 15,495]

Somebody changed it!  It was anonymous an hour ago!

[Jay 37,249]

Yea I just changed it when I got back from lunch

[The Five Tones 302]

MR, film and score. I love the Epilogue from WotW, and the *idea* of the remake of foundational sci-fi and JW at possibly his most monochromatic (which he said MR was) and abstract, but I rarely revisit the OST otherwise. MR felt like a film you had a conversation or two after watching, WotW was fun though not particularly original or memorable. And yeah, they didn't even try to rethink the ending. No offense to anyone who grew up with the films; they came out when I was in my mid 30s and I have no nostalgia about them (especially Tom Cruise).

[Tom 4,630]

2 hours ago, The Five Tones said:

MR, film and score. I love the Epilogue from WotW, and the *idea* of the remake of foundational sci-fi and JW at possibly his most monochromatic (which he said MR was) and abstract, but I rarely revisit the OST otherwise. MR felt like a film you had a conversation or two after watching, WotW was fun though not particularly original or memorable. And yeah, they didn't even try to rethink the ending. No offense to anyone who grew up with the films; they came out when I was in my mid 30s and I have no nostalgia about them (especially Tom Cruise).

We already had the rethought ending with Independence Day.  

[Not Mr. Big 4,639]

How is Minority Report monochromatic?  

[Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488]

I'm saying it. WOTW feels too post-9/11 dark and disturbing.

[Josh500 1,615]

6 hours ago, Jay said:

 

WOTW had more fans 2 years ago it seems

 

http://www.jwfan.com/forums/index.php?/topic/27617-minority-report-vs-war-of-the-worlds

 

Or conversely, MR has more fans now....

[Unlucky Bastard 7,782]

I hate all that high pitch squealing in WOTW.

[Oomoog the Ecstatic 314]

12 hours ago, Brundlefly said:

Poor atmosphere and poor execution? I feel like many people mix up Spielberg's strenghts and weaknesses.

 

I kind of understand what you're saying. I haven't seen War of the Worlds in a while so I don't remember it as well, but I just know Minority Report left me much to be desired. I can't say what atmosphere Spielberg was going for, but I do think Tom Cruise in this kind of role doesn't seem serious enough or believable. Too action-focused, while War of the Worlds seems more adventurous and thematic, and Cruise and perhaps Spielberg fits that niche better. Can't underrate Cruise for that niche at this time--need to rewatch.

[The Five Tones 302]

5 hours ago, Tom said:

We already had the rethought ending with Independence Day.  

Which ending scooped Arthur C. Clarke prior to the publication of 3001: A Final Odyssey.

 

5 hours ago, Not Mr. Big said:

How is Minority Report monochromatic?  

That is a general quality feeling - there are plenty of exceptions that reference the classic JW Americana and of course older avant-garde like CE3K (which makes it more sepia tone?!) It avoids tonality more broadly than any of his other scores, and only resolves to a plangent minor ending. Of course, there is really classical minor key tonality underpinning all of it, but constantly modulating and darkened with chromatic-leaning material and heavy orchestration. (If anything, it needs an expansion just to reimage those beautiful low register performances.) It does have a bit of Sith-like brooding natural minor, which is never resolved either. I like monochromatic, if this is it, but I inevitably crave the brighter colours of A New Beginning, the more soothing/aching Sean's Theme, or the siren-like singing of MR (if such touches fit the subject and mood of whatever film). Yeah, WotW was definitely America dealing with some heavy stuff.

[Edmilson 7,367]

For movie, Minority Report, but for the score, I actually prefer WotW. 

 

Also, I really can't explain why, but Sean's Theme reminded me of what James Horner used to write for smaller scale drama movies. Maybe both composers drew inspiration for a similar source?

[Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488]

3 hours ago, Thekthithm said:

I hate all that high pitch squealing in WOTW.

 

Yeah. It's very irritating.

[Josh500 1,615]

3 hours ago, Edmilson said:

Also, I really can't explain why, but Sean's Theme reminded me of what James Horner used to write for smaller scale drama movies.

 

Like which ones? Examples? 

 

 

[Jurassic Shark 12,008]

Braveheart.

[Josh500 1,615]

Yeah, and "Sean's Theme" actually also reminds me of the tender, heart-aching scenes of Aliens... 

[Edmilson 7,367]

5 hours ago, Josh500 said:

Like which ones? Examples? 

 

 

Stuff like Dad or Bicentennial Man...

 

It's not like Williams was actively trying to copy Horner (he probably haven't listened a Horner score at all), and in fact it might be nothing but a feeling. 

[The Five Tones 302]

It's almost like a slow movement from a Rachmaninoff piano concerto, or in that vein. (Actually, I wish he would compose a romantic piano concerto, no shade against the Scherzo of 2014, but something more like Sean or Over the Moon or Sabrina. Low probability, though.)

[Thor 7,451]

3 hours ago, The Five Tones said:

It's almost like a slow movement from a Rachmaninoff piano concerto, or in that vein. (Actually, I wish he would compose a romantic piano concerto, no shade against the Scherzo of 2014, but something more like Sean or Over the Moon or Sabrina. Low probability, though.)

 

Yes, that's what I first expected when Williams' "Conversations" was announced. Finally a chance for Williams to compose a LYRICAL piece for his main instrument (since none of us have ever heard the piano sonata). But both that and the scherzo proved to be something far more gritty and dissonant.

[Jurassic Shark 12,008]

I doubt the sonata is very lyrical in character, considering the time in which it was written.

[publicist 4,643]

5 hours ago, Edmilson said:

 

Stuff like Dad or Bicentennial Man...

 

It's not like Williams was actively trying to copy Horner (he probably haven't listened a Horner score at all), and in fact it might be nothing but a feeling. 

 

I don't see any connection. The MR stuff is close to Mahler, the 5th to be precise. Horner touched on Mahler's adagio style from time to time in Enemy at the Gates, but it's nothing close to his musical vocabulary.

 

Here from 02:35 onwards, especially from the four minute mark you hear a lot of the impassioned doubled strings JW likes to emulate in his more adagio-like material.

 

 

[Thor 7,451]

2 hours ago, Jurassic Shark said:

I doubt the sonata is very lyrical in character, considering the time in which it was written.

 

No, probably not. Probably 'beefed up' with lots of modernism to impress the UCLA examiners.

[Josh500 1,615]

13 hours ago, publicist said:

 

I don't see any connection. The MR stuff is close to Mahler, the 5th to be precise. 

 

Here from 02:35 onwards, especially from the four minute mark you hear a lot of the impassioned doubled strings JW likes to emulate in his more adagio-like material.

 

 

 

Fascinating, but which cues exactly does this supposed to sound like? "A New Beginning" and "Sean's Theme"? 

 

I don't hear any particular similarly to speak of. The orchestration might be similar, but this type of orchestration is not uncommon. 

[publicist 4,643]

It is not uncommon because a lot of composers like Mahler, not because they stumbled over the same type of harmonic language by accident. In MR you hear it fleetingly in 'A New Beginning', it's much more overt in Revenge of the Sith (The Immolation), Munich, Schindler etc. 

[The Five Tones 302]

One can see how Mahler would have an impact on JW's style. Certainly Bernstein, whom JW has often paid tribute to, was busy bringing Mahler's symphonies to a broader audience during JW's early career, which could be a possible intermediary influence. I can also imagine JW taking notes on the heavy use of Mahler in Death in Venice (the 1971 film), vis a vis music/history/mythology as intertext, on the score as embodiment, bordering on the diegetic. Often the impression is fleeting, in a stew of numerous late Romantic / early modernist composer influences (not to mention JW's mentors).

[Joni Wiljami 1,206]

On 10/10/2019 at 9:11 PM, publicist said:

 

I don't see any connection. The MR stuff is close to Mahler, the 5th to be precise. Horner touched on Mahler's adagio style from time to time in Enemy at the Gates, but it's nothing close to his musical vocabulary.

 

Here from 02:35 onwards, especially from the four minute mark you hear a lot of the impassioned doubled strings JW likes to emulate in his more adagio-like material.

 

 

 

I don't hear it. 

 

But I can hear that Mahler's 5th symphony is taken from Hans Rott. 

[Josh500 1,615]

18 hours ago, hornist said:

I don't hear it. 

 

Same here. 

[Josh500 1,615]

Now that MR is complete, I realize my most coveted complete score from LLL would probably be WotW (except for the Star Wars prequels)!

[Unlucky Bastard 7,782]

Screw that. I want a Heartbeeps re-release.

[Josh500 1,615]

2 hours ago, Thekthithm said:

Screw that. I want a Heartbeeps re-release.

 

I own Heartbeeps. I've only listened to it once so far, on the day it arrived. 

[King Mark 3,624]

I listen to it once in a while. It's pretty good